I think we were told not to be salty recently. Opinions are fine, but we are not free of these cons to be said against anything we may spurt out.
Sure, happens a lot I suppose. a musician on a street playing for money. passer bys toss in whatever change they have in their pocket.
But a musician at least thanks you, here you are dismissed with a "goodbye then". 
It would be more accurate of an analogy if you tossed the musician some money, then came back the next day and bitched at them for not playing the same song as when you donated, endlessly barraging them with complaints and comments about how the old song was so much better.But a musician at least thanks you, here you are dismissed with a "goodbye then".
This is precisely what is called "criticising a work", even if it hurts you, and it exists in all fields of art. Ask about Cyberpunk 2077, for example. Another thing is that the author does not know how to accept criticism.
Another thing is that the author does not know how to accept criticism.Criticism is pretty useless to developers unless it's constructive. Telling someone over and over to go back to what they were doing before (in spite of them explaining all the reasons why that's a bad idea ad nauseam) does not fall into this catagory. To say nothing of you openly calling them lazy or con artists.This is precisely what is called "criticising a work", even if it hurts you, and it exists in all fields of art. Ask about Cyberpunk 2077, for example.
Also not sure why you're bringing up cyberpunk, the lauch of that game had nothing to do with lack of feedback. That mess is entirely down to publisher deadlines and the knowledge that AAA games don't have to be finished at launch, since the masses will preorder big releases regardless and you can just finish them with patches.
- Sep 19, 2017
- 222
- 474
The 3D was an experiment we wanted to try which was brought on by one of our teammembers learning (in record time) 3D modeling. He did god tier work, which would have been great *IF* we could get the environments to feel right with the characters themselves.
See the issue we encountered was that we were getting 'paper mario' vibes from the 2D characters on the 3D background. If we could have fixed that in a reasonable amount of time, we would have carried on with the 3D environments, simply because of how mechanically liberating it is to have 3D.
It means we could have massive exploration in the game, full open world, much more complex gameplay/platforming which would ultimately have been more fun. It would also have taken a massive load off of Kuja's shoulders of drawing backgrounds.
Unfortunately, we couldn't shake that Paper Mario feel, so we gave up. There are some problems with the 2D models we recognize at the moment, which we will fix (Specifically the backwards movement, some of the animations for the angles look a bit odd), but we are sticking to 2D now.
That said, we didn't lose progress with the 3D experiment, because we converted the 3D environment to 2D. (And it looks really good now)
Pretty much.
I have accepted much criticism. Perhaps you conflate "Not bending to my personal demands" as not accepting criticism.This is precisely what is called "criticising a work", even if it hurts you, and it exists in all fields of art. Ask about Cyberpunk 2077, for example.
Indeed. I take personal insult with being called a con artist, since I earn almost nothing from this project. I do it for art's sake, so does Kuja, so does much of our team.
I will say, Cyberpunk was a really enjoyable experience. Even if it was a buggy mess.
I still maintain that 2D is a much better idea, even if the 3D would've worked out and made things easier, it's very hard to do it right. 3D game platforming is harder to pull off because of needing to control the camera and 3D just never seems to be able to capture the appeal of a beautifully-sculpted 2D landscape. 3D just feels more "artificial," if that makes sense for a video game.
- Sep 19, 2017
- 222
- 474
The camera would have been fixed, still, so no camera rotation. It would have just made depth and size much easier, and allow for more detailed backgrounds due to the ability to generate prefab backgrounds. But yes, most people are happy we went back to 2D.
The criticism here was initially constructive, so much so that months before the first demo it was clearly stated that "3D is not going to work". Despite that, they went ahead so that, months later, we went back to what was initially known to work, 2D.
You won't have heard me call them scammers. What's more, I think I've been one of the few who have put more effort to emphasise (even with designs) the strengths of the previous game that should be applied in this, which was initially said here to be the SAME GAME.
And so far the direction it's heading after almost two years of development is that the only thing it resembles the previous game is an attempt to make it resemble the previous game, as a vague excuse to create a new game called LOK RE without being too noticeable that it's no longer the previous Legend of Krystal.
As for Cyberpunk, it's the same case as what happened with No Mans Sky, it's not what was promised at the beginning and why it has to be getting patches and patches and patches and patches (at least for free) to be able to deliver that initial experience. If you can't at least accept that the latter is a reality, you're honestly never going to agree with me, even though you know perfectly well that these latest games have brought controversy to the world of videogames.
And yes, sorry for my broken English. Maybe that's why I'm misunderstood or make my aptitude sound different. But if someone who speaks such bad English has enjoyed Legend of Krystal Rebirth to the point of being so impulsive, it says a lot about the previous game's work.
No personal demands, friend, are calls for attention to what you supposedly you promised on the first day.
Last edited:
It took me a bit of understanding, but I got to where I can consistently cook three meals. I'll put salt and pepper on my eggs anyway, I don't care they do nothing
- Jul 27, 2017
- 345
- 262
I for one was a bit bummed out, while the prototype was a whole lot of jank i do know the potential of working in a 3d space vs 2d, had you tried to just recreate the village i think the response would have been better, then it wouldn't have felt like you started over almost from scratch (i know how much time those characters take to make having some experience with Spline but your average joe won't).
As for Paper Mario, personally i'd try a fairly low fov camera straight from the side with no tilt or rotation in any direction to avoid the Paper Mario look, distance and height i'm not too sure about but i'd experiment i guess, and then work the scenes around that perspective, nothing i've actually tried myself though so i can't guarantee it actually gets rid of the paper mario look, might have to do some dev magic like stuff angled in weird way to suit the perspective.
To be fair, you are sometimes hard to deal with - which i don't mean particular bad since i share most of your views. It just feels like a never ending circle if you keep discussing things that they clearly refused for whatever reasons, even if you're right and i would agree with you - our opinion doesn't really matter, and voicing it over and over again is exhausting.
First on criticism, the image you have from yourself and what image others have of you, is clearly different - thats normal. I won't deny your perception, but i would go so far that criticism from here is neither appreciatet or welcome, but thats my image from you in terms of your posts here.
And while i agree with you that Cyberpunk was enjoyable for me too (on pc), i saw how bad it was on a PS and on another pc (which was far better than mine). The funny thing is that you had a good time with cyberpunk and a problem with TLoU2, which wasn't a buggy mess... but that's just another little rant from my side.
To get back on topic, how is the state of the game? It has been a while since the last update, or did i miss something like the upgrade via launcher? Was this amount of ground work worth the wait and will it speed up further releases, or are there some new obstacles that slowed things down?
Just missing something new from my greatest hope in terms of H-Games
- Jan 29, 2019
- 167
- 460
Well, Cyberpunk was a step towards new things, a different genre that could combine very complicated world as narratevly so as art- and gameplay-wise. The amount of potential that this game has is insane, yet the executed part is somewhat mediocre and unfortunately doesn't live up to what was promised. AI, repetitvness, "open world" and technical state upon release varie from meh down to unacceptable. Yet gameplay itself was entertaining, art-wise is gorgeous, sound and music are amazing and story having its ups and downs imo holds pretty good. World itself from the writing is really cool. When combining all of the features you could get a certain amount of enjoyment from the game even with all of the problems that it has - it's still quite an enjoyable experience if everything works correctly.
Last of Us2 though is an excercise in repetitiveness with a director's head being stuck deep in his ass. Almost to no new mechanics, very limited and invariable gameplay, which felt old in the Last of Us 1 already. Very poor narrative, hectic-manipulative story that made no sense, ruined characters and brought nothing new to the table. Personally for me music also wasn't anything chilling, some choices even made me cringe ("If I were to lose you" song made me cringe out of this world at the start).
Art direction though is flawless, acting from Troy Baker and others - awesome. Game is one of the few who can brag about its numerous options and adjustments that allow various people with disabilities to play it. Plus the game was pretty well polished and in order to find any glitches and bugs you would have to look for them and challenge presented systems.
The problem is, The Last of Us as a franchise that bases its success on a story, while everything else just adds upon it, making it a good game for those who dig the story. Last of Us 2 didn't make similar choices, it decided to be bold, brave and ridiculous. Unfortunately main story which was supposed to be the foundation for everything else doesn't hold it, thus plowing the game down the sewer, which is a shame, because there is an insane amount of talent being put in it.
Even though I disagree with majority of choices that MightyAltroll, did and does, I can aboslutely understand why he would praise Cyberpunk, while ridiculing TLoU2.
p.s. I don't really make any points here, but if I were presented with a choice I would better have more Cyberpunks in the future, rather than The last of Uses.
- Sep 19, 2017
- 222
- 474
I'd love to experiment on it, but it'll take far too long. We're making good progress now. We can't afford to go back.
Because most criticism here is useless to me. It is almost exclusively complaining about how the old model was better, or demanding we magically go back to finish the old version. When I see constructive and useful feedback, I take it and pass it along to the team.
There have actually been a number of times in this thread where I've taken feedback, and we've implemented it for the future.
I don't care if TLOU2 was polished more than a diamond cock, the story and characters were garbage. Cyberpunk, for all of its bugs, actually has what TLOU2 doesn't.
We currently have a bit of a blockage with animations, but it is being cleared up. We have the entire village done in terms of environments, now it is simply a matter of populating it and remaking the old sex scenes. Then we'll move on to the federation ship.
Currently, animation wise, we're working on Vanlen's sex scenes (With some minor changes)
Well, im eager to see these to be honest, but forgive me for beeing me - since there isn't anything released, i stand correct. The moment i see something, i will be wrong. And the self-image and the one others have from you is a psychological thing, like me instantly thinking "The only critic must have come from those with unwavering optimism", while another might actually believe it. Both are right, because both exist.
That is still an opinion on writing decisions (which i don't share), just like i can't understand how people say in the first game there was a good ending (yeah fucking over humanitiy and going against everything a loved one believes for own selfish reasons... well fuck humanity, the last thing is more important). And by all love for Cyberpunk, i finished the game during christmas to new year 3 times - to what was told before, that was really bad. TLoU2 never promised such things as responsive dialogue to your actions, and while having a good and fun core story it left too much to be desired. Hell Dragon Age had storywise more replay value, maybe even DA2. Still CP is a good game, but i never touched it since and i have no intentions to do so, maybe after a DLC. But before we drift away - i just picked TLoU2 because i know it annoys you, its controversy and i have my own things i like. Although i have to give credits to Phantas pointing out the toned down gameplay for movement/controller cripples that like story more than gameplay - guilty to that
Now that's more or less good to hear. Does it include Meiris mate (was it Sek, it's been a while) or the spying on the barmaid?
When you say federation ship, do you mean the Intro like the old version (which only teased something in text, than skipped time and jumped ahead to the planet surface) or like more like a visit back after some time on the planet?
And forgive me for the probably most hated question, is there a timeframe when to expect the next release, do you think you guys will drop something regardless of progression after some time or after reaching a certain goal like most old scenes/whole plot lines like Vanlen beeing done?
- Sep 19, 2017
- 222
- 474
I don't expect you to believe me. We will demonstrate as we release. We would have released by now but were hit by some unforeseen problems, which we are resolving. Either way, progress is made.
What I feel a lot of people here do not understand, is patreon is a gamble. You are gambling with us, and that sounds bad, but you need to decide if you want to see this project succeed or not. I am fully aware of the reputation of Patreon projects, all you have is my word.
Whether you trust me or not, is up to you, but I have no interest in lying, nor have I lied. We do not make much money off of this project, and we are always taking pay cuts to make progress happen faster. Any increase in supporters we have, is turned into making the project function. The pay I get from this barely covers my rent, and I often put most of my money back into the project to hire more contractors. Every asset we create is original, and it is a staggering amount of work.
So I have no real way of convincing you, you can either choose to believe me or not. I imagine many people are the wait and see type, but if too many people decide to wait and see then we won't be able to develop the project. It's kind of a self-defeating mindset for patreon.
It was a good ending, but it wasn't a good ending, if you catch my meaning. It is complex, it shows the depth of characters, their arcs. It is a warm tragedy, and I love the ending because Joel is a very well thought out character.
TLOU2 was fairly bad from start to end. The plot makes little sense, the characters are neutered and relatively stupid, and I have absolutely no investment in any of the new characters. I managed to even dislike Ellie by the end of it. It is bad writing, and I play games like that for the writing. Uncharted series has better writing than TLOU2 by comparison, which is sad.
They don't get points for polish or for graphics. This is a triple A game, not an indie game, I expect them to have such things.
To each his own.
I don't know why you intend to annoy me. if you like it, good for you. Buying things to spite me is rather petty, because in the end I don't really care what you buy.
Yes, Sek and Nesi will of course be returning. Sek is my favorite character I've made so far, he'll see justice.
Yes to both. I shall spoil a bit of the plot here if you are interested:
You don't have permission to view the spoiler content.
Log in or register now.
Once all of Vanlen's (Or a good chunk) scenes are done, we'll release a new update, and follow with that logic as we finish the village. In terms of sex scene priority, we'll probably go in order of:
Vanlen
Galdryn (pot guy)
Kantir/Nesi
Cenvir
Nemiri
etc.
Mostly chronological order.
As for a release date, I cannot give you. There are so many unforeseen things that are capable of delaying us, I have no idea myself. I can only give you progress updates.
I blame it on my English skills for failling to get my point about self-image and the one others have about us. It wasn't anything about believing or lying, but i guess i can't get my point across, so don't dwell on it ^^
As for the annoying, call it my way of not going into ranting or flaming to my hearts content about the stuff that pisses me off. You may have forgotten (and with the amount of people interested no wonder) our dialogues and exchanges through more than 80+ pages on two threads, i didn't and yes i hold grudges, i'm getting old and am allowed to do so. So my new way is to ask questions / give feedback, but with a little "feel good" for myself.
Because, as stated countless times, yes i want your team and project to succeed, because i invested in the previous version - you may distance yourself as far as you want, but to me there would be no remake from you without the remake that existed. As you said, Patreon is a gamble, and so far it feels lost to me - due to many reasons like the state of the game, or, as mentioned, some responses from you (i may have been sometimes not easy or too direct, but at least i had the decency to aknowledge some of my overstepping) or the fact that thanks to Discord it's hard to keep track if you are not checking up every day (personal feeling=not everybodys problem) But you are indeed right and i acknowledge you for pointing it out fair and square - having that written, i will tell you that i gladly support your team the moment the contet is as equal as it's predecessor was in terms of porn and you show a static output. On the behalf of output, it was a perhaps most criticized point for the old variant (except the last sex scene which felt awkward), but there WAS output. I don't want to sound demanding or rude, but i fail to see improvement or acknwoledgment for that fact, i mostly read how stupid we are for not getting the grasp or so (something you didn't this time). Thats my little rant for this time, do with it what you want ^^
But back to topic: I'm glad to hear what is planned, even though i had hoped to have more interactions on the ship (idk like reports where she tries to hide the fact how slutty she got) but i will take what i can get. A little sad because no date means not planned in the near future but hey, since i don't gamble anymore i can only win nothing for the time being. Thanks for taking the time to answer my question, the important ones about the game and the others for the fun. Oh and try to animate your animator to do some overtime, tell him there may be coockies ^^
- Sep 19, 2017
- 222
- 474
Sorry, I come here with a defensive mindset. Pikant doesn't even want to come here unless posting updates. I certainly don't want to come here, but I do so anyway because I feel like I need to.
I have forgotten. I do not hold grudges myself, I still try to be friendly with everyone, including Abelius despite our history. I also have no interest in going back to read 80+ pages to find out if I like you or not, so it shall stay forgotten. I do not remember what made you have a grudge with me, but I apologize.
We are only distancing ourselves from Nintendo to avoid their wrath. We are still very much making Lok, and I adored v0.8 for all its flaws. I wish that v0.8 could have continued comfortably, but there were too many issues on the inside... we were very much afraid the project would die.
Those fears haven't died, but they aren't internal. We fear eventually support will dry up for us, because we are ambitious in what we want to make. Perhaps too ambitious, but such is a fault we cannot correct at this time.
Were I to make a new game, it would be far **far** less complex than this.
Some days it feels lost to me, but I, and the other members of this team, still put in as much effort as we can. It is an uphill battle, but every day we make progress, chipping away at the mountain. The game will be made, so long as we can afford to pay the two or three specialists we have.
I, more than most, understand how slow we have been in development. Abelius was many things, but he was very fast with animations. I tried to bring him back into the fold but he wouldn't work with Pikant, who is a master of the technical side of Spine.
So, right now, we are trying to find someone that can animate as quickly and as well as Abelius could. As it happens, Spine is a very rare skill, and often a very expensive skill. So we have a narrow pipeline for animations currently. Something we have been working for the last few weeks to fix.
But, once our animation pipeline is fixed once and for all... we shall steam forward. We already have the entire Razorclaw village made, matching v0.8's content is only a handful of animations away.
We intend for the ship to be vastly overhauled in the beginning of the game, so you can explore, and even stock up on some items before you reach the planet. There will even be sexual content between some characters.
As for overtime... that won't help in this case for the reasons above.
- May 31, 2018
- 271
- 334
Your current game is unlikely to attract attention from Nintendo, since there is only one character in it, which is like Krystal, but, in same time - is not. And to be honest, I don't think Nindendo cares about porn games, especially those that are offered for free. But if you were selling your abandoned version of the game, there might be a chance to get DMCA ticket, but again, I don't think Nintendo wants to get their hands dirty about a porn game of a small development team. The Internet is clogged with pornography with Krystal, some of which is only available to paid patreon users only, but so far Nindendo has not punished anyone for this.
And about ambition - until you give up yourself - nothing is over. But if you give up, there will be even more haters on your future projects, and this is hardly what you need.
So fight till the end like Johnny Silverhand bequeathed to V