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so in between all those 57 pages of drama, any news about the game itself? I know they are removing "krystal" and using a "totally not krystal OC donut steal" replacement but that's about it.
Apparently, the village and models and such are done for the next demo, but they're waiting on animations.
- Apr 26, 2019
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- Sep 19, 2017
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Because it is the truth. You are the reason why it happened, Abel. Have you ever just thought "Maybe if I listened to Kuja/Vlad more, maybe if I wasn't such a dick at times, maybe if I bothered to separate myself with a very small portion of my income to hire a proper programmer that could put in a fucking sprint key, maaaaaaaaybe this wouldn't have all happened"
You have trouble accepting blame for anything, any time you do it is superficial. You can't work with other people. You may have the ambition and work flow of 10 men, but you will never work in a team until you correct your personality flaws.
I spent a long time on here protecting your image, I never told anyone the real reason why we restarted. But you are your own worst enemy.
I'm not reversing reality, you're refusing to accept it. My DMs are always open Abel if you want to scream and shout at me more. For a man your age, you lack much in maturity.
You are fucking delusional, Abelius. We don't care about your project. KUJA WAS HELPING YOU WITH YOUR PROJECT, until you fucking pissed him off with your inane pity party that you created. We don't care about your 'competition', only you seem to care.
You know what Abel? I hope that you strike it rich. I hope you make millions. I hope you get to take trips to the Philippines with your family every day of the week. I really do. I wish you nothing but happiness in life.
The porn was good. The gameplay was nonexistent. I want both. Truth be told I got bored playing through our own game time after time to test it.
No we've been listening to people, actually. But you can't please everyone, can you?
Because you speak for all people everywhere, do you? Yes, it is a porn game. Yes there will be oodles and oodles of porn. I'm sorry you have to wait for it.
The story was abhorrent and Abel resisted any attempts I made at improving it. You played as some odd space cop going to the planet to arrest a space demon that stole some random thing. Even I have forgotten what some of the story was.
It was forgettable, and I hated how forgettable it was. I don't want to half ass such a thing that important.
We saw one of those LoK style flash games get nuked by Nintendo from orbit, and we got a bit scared that the same might happen to us. So we distanced ourselves. Really all we did was include customization (Something we wanted from the beginning), make the name of the character player-generated, and remove any and all other references to anything Stair Fax.
We decided we would retread old ground with the village before we move on to other regions/characters for the game, so we are currently working to return to v0.8 levels of content. The village is almost completely done in terms of environments, and 90% of the characters are done/ready to be implemented.
We are merely waiting for sex scene animations for Vanlen, which are taking longer than we'd like, but when he is done, we will do Gauldryn's (Pot Guy) sex scenes, then Kantir/Nesi/Eri in that order. Then we'll be caught up, and can finally start making brand new things. Some of the sex scenes will actually be brand new compared to the original, and Cenvir will be redone entirely.
Yup.
Not possible.
Couldn't tell you, but the code aspect of the game is mostly done, actually.
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- Jan 29, 2019
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Their best?
It was literally a start of the story only. Those were introductive. Not a single story got to its end, nor to its middle even.
Krystal was betrayed, Shaman knows about technology and science, Krystal was about to go on her first hunt, Kantir had blood rivalry, Lust Demon was bearly shown and she was supposed to be the main enemy, the majority of the village was indoctrinated and abducted, we were going to get first wolfgirl as a captive and so on...
And all of those were only introductions, no story got its continuation to even reveal anything. How come they could be "their best" if they didn't get the chance to play out?
If you didn't get that, then it was just not down your alley, but if you think that introduction should be "the best" thing ever, I would have to ask you to get off your high horse and go play something else. Maybe TLoU2 would fit your preferences more.
- Sep 19, 2017
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I know what Abel planned for the story. There wasn't much there. I pushed for a 'big bad' and some corruption elements to the story, but he insisted that the Chieftain was the strongest person on the planet, and anything fighting him would be a push over.
I had 0 control over the story. All I could do was write characters, and dialogue.
The story I have now, I believe, is far better/more believable. I am actually very excited to see it pan out.
Also telling people to play TLoU 2 for a good story? Come on.
- Jan 29, 2019
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He wants "the best" at the very start. TLoU2 believes it has "the best" twist at the start with Joel.
I'm not being serious, I was ridiculing his idea of a "good story" because TLoU2's story is garbage, but it's over emotional af. It might fit his taste better.
What he had for the story and what it could become are 2 different topics. Before you started your revamp Vlad was going to seek help, including storywise. He was going to listen to people. Story could be better because he simply could've found someone who could've helped him with it. He didn't like your story and approach, but it doesn't mean that he couldn't have liked somebody else's story that also could be good.
He was willing to listen to other people, project could've gotten better if Abel were given the chance. We won't know that now.
b.t.w. having a charater that is a power house is not a problem at all. You can have a character who is physically strong but is a mess inside and you can build this character to be very interesting to watch (hello Homelander). It's about how you develop this character and not how that cahracter starts out. Great power can also be a great curse.
I know your story. It's very Halo- and DeadSpace-esque. Too bad you are not familiarised with these franchises, it could've helped you to make something more original.
From talking to you I could see your knowledge of modern games and game culture is somewhat limited. It bothers me, but I believe that your story can still be good.
I'm not a fan of story being darker and more serious, for as I stated before, I like when some stories are more light-headed, so that after a day of stressful work you wouldn't have to deal with bullshit that real life presents you with in game as well. I've had 1 porn game with a serious story before and in time of my depression its serious tone only made my depression worse. I'm not looking to experience something like that again.
I'm sure you will make a good story, but BSing Abel for a story that was at its start and ended up not being realised is like BSing a movie that is not out yet but you read some leaks, so it will 100% be bad. It's not fair towards him. Stories don't have to be complicated to be good, sometimes simple stories can provide the best type of entertainment.
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I'm sorry to hear that.
Everything won't take as long as Vanlen, that is what we are trying to fix. That said, Vanlen's entire sex scene arc is being completed, so you have to imagine it would take a little while. Though this is taking way too long, and I'll be the first to admit it.
The plans aren't actually that unfeasible, actually. Yes the map looks huge, but Kuja is insanely fast and skilled with environments, the world would be filled out very quickly. From there it is a matter of world-building/story telling. Mechanically, the game is almost done. The animations have been, since the beginning, the hardest part about everything, and that is what we are trying to sort out once and for all now.
Well see this confuses me, because part of the complaints of the new variant is that they are too 'anime' like. As a matter of fact Kuja's lizard designs are based off of an anime.
But there will be different species of lizards and mammals for you to like or dislike in the future, different customization and variations even.
Well that is a preference you have. I've heard a lot of positive things about the snakes. You don't have to like the snakes, there are plenty of other variations planned.
You have no fucking clue how many people are into Eri right now and consider her changes positive. I don't understand the attraction myself, but it was very much requested. Again, this is your personal preference.
On a few levels, I can sympathize with this. I do sometimes miss v0.8 and the magic it had, and every day I look to recreate it in the new version. However, you need to have trust with us that we are trying to do well by you. We are always looking for constructive criticism and advice, you can always talk to us.
It cannot be done. Abelius, Kuja, and I made a strong team but Abel cannot be worked with, so we had to find people to replace him. v0.8 is gone, we couldn't bring it back if we wanted to. We don't have the assets.
We actually are considering doing some simpler CG scenes in a lot of cases. Or perhaps having a sex-rig that is far simpler than the game rig.
I'm trying to do everything I can.
- Sep 19, 2017
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The only taste TLoU2 could fit is that of someone with no tongue.
I wish you defended us half as much as you defend Abel. There are many things I would praise Abel for, but his writing is not one of them.
I don't know much about Halo, or Dead Space (I played Dead Space, oddly wasn't very scary to me) beyond what people have told me about it. But I know that my story differs quite significantly from theirs. My inspiration actually came more from the lovecraftian side, and an old game called Eternal Darkness. I don't see why I should need to know modern culture unless I wanted to go woke, which will never happen.
The story isn't that dark, I certainly don't plan for it to be on the levels of Dark Souls, or This War of Mine. I usually bounce my ideas off of people and they'll usually tell me if I'm getting too dark. There are plenty of happy moments and good times to be had in my story. But how much darker can you get, Phantas, than Kantir's storyline? if you were fine with that in v0.8, you'll be fine with my plans.
If you say so. Hopefully you will then give me the same benefit of the doubt.
- Jan 29, 2019
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I can't defend you after I've tried helping you. I was sitting in your Discord channel all the time, I talked to you, I gave you advices, I gave you visual references, I showed where you did mistakes, I told you that you were making bad choices.
All of that was either ignored or ridiculed. I've spent a lot of my time on trying to help you, in return all I've gotten was disrespect and ignorance.
I can't defend deliberately-made bad choices.
Abel is no saint either, but he had potential that he couldn't realise because you ended it preemptively. He had no choice on the matter, whatever he would've decided .08 was done (and I can sympathise with a man who has 2 kids and a wife and who made those decisions to survive).
You have all the benefit story-wise from me. As I said, I believe you can write a good story. So you won't see me BSing nor your story, nor your dialogues until you are somewhere in the middle of the story, where it can be justifully judged (and if it's good I won't be hating it just for the sake of hating).
But the overall conversation that we've had here has never even touched story aspects. It's the rest of the gamedesign/management decisions that I'm not a fan of. And all of it could've been avoided if you had listened back in the day, but you haven't. You still don't. Nothing has changed, which is why this discussion can't end.
- Sep 19, 2017
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I don't recall ever disrespecting you, and claiming that people who do not follow your advice are 'ignorant' is a bit arrogant, don't you think?
I recall your advice, and I recall a ton of discussion that arose from it. I also recall telling you that we can't just change the model every single time someone complained about it, or we'd never be done. We've arguably changed the model waaaaaay more than we should have BECAUSE of feed back. Why should we give yours special treatment?
We drew Kay's ass based off of Oughta's reference. *Oughta* who is a masterful artist, and yet you even criticized his work. So seemingly nothing made you happy, I'm not sure why you expected us to always default to your opinion.
But to claim that we ignored you? To claim that we ridiculed you? That's nonsense.
Abel had an opportunity to keep working with us and we budgeted to keep him, he instead decided he couldn't work with us over his own pride. So I can no longer feel pity for him, especially with how often he's tried to get us to pity him. I can only feel so bad about his situation that he has put himself in until I start to become numb to it.
Phantas, what do you expect us to do, exactly? Dump everything and just do what you say? Advice is one thing, but being bitter because we didn't do what you said, regardless of whether or not it was a mistake, is dickish.
- Apr 26, 2019
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of course why do if can get free cash in patreon hehe...
- Jan 29, 2019
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1. I gave you visual references. A lot of them. Anatomically correct references in order to show that you drew it wrong. At first you ignored them, you didn't give an answer nor have you reacted in any way. Then I gave you a video in 3d to visually explain how lighting works and why your version is wrong. Your answer to a visual explanation was "It's a video, what does it have to do with our game? We have 2d.". After that we've discussed how it would be correctly drawn and your guy that draws comics in MSPaint started spewing nonsense, which you decided to support for some reason. After that Kuja finally answered and his answer was "Oughta helped me to draw this. If this is a mistake, it's a mistake he did. Do you really think that Oughta did a mistake?". After which I one more time presented visual references that showed that yes, mistake was made. To which Kuja then answered "I don't see any mistake" and went offline. Later he said that "Ok, we'll look into this" and after the next time you've shown your next work, mistake was still there. You just decided to ignore it and ignore anything related to it. After that me mentioning this was met with "ah yes, the guy-who-always-mentions-that-one-mistake, haha".
I've spent hours to create visual references to show where mistakes were. I've respected you enough to try helping you. I presented facts, only for them to be met with nonsene like "3d aint 2d, you can't show us 3d and tell us that that's how it works", after which such feedback would've being put on a shelf and ignored.
Now you come and tell people that you listen to feedback. No you fucking don't. You listen to the feedback of popular people who can promote your product in return, but other people? Nah, who the fuck are they to listen to their opinion? They are artists? Pfft, we have Oughta, that's all we need. He is popular, that means he's always right, right?
1. Because I've shown you goddamn visual actual anatomical references that were more than one. I've shown you why and where you made mistakes, I've even shown you how to fix them.
2. Oughta is a fucking human, Oughta can make mistakes in drawings too. Oughta is not perfect.
3. I'm an aritst with epxerience, with some level of knowledge and trust me on 1 thing: for correct anatomy you should reference REALITY and not other people's artwork. Because artwork may contain errors and if you reference it, you will reference errors. So when you are presented with believing either artwork or real-life reference, you must go with the real-life reference.
But you have no idea about these things because you have never worked in firmas or other places that teach you that, Kuja hasn't as well. You don't have that knowledge. I do.
4. And I told you that, several times. You ignored it.
5. Gizmo, who has experience in professional environment, unlike you, has supported my art theses several times.
If you have had respect towards me, you could've said "We aknowledge the mistake. We see it. It is there. But we've spent too much time developing what we have and we can't let ourselves to spend even more time on it. Your feedback is being noted, but we have to move on, sorry". Which would've been understandable. You didn't even have to change anything ,but you could've at least aknowledged that there were mistakes. But you decided to play dumb, decided to ignore the feedback and later on started joking about me and subject of my feedback.
Regardless of your choices, you always say that you listen, that you care and that you want to be better. You don't. You have your own vision and you don't care if someone is unhappy. Just stop writing this ridiculous EA shit that you care. You will care only if it's said by someone who is popular enough and who can support your project with their audience, like Oughta.
Besides, I can be bitter as much as I want. I've earned the right to be bitter through your unprofessionalism and not only have I never gotten any type of simple human apology from you, but instead I'm being called a dick.
Nice one, Vlad. Well played.
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- Jul 14, 2017
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I just went through every mention I made of you, and every conversation we had on discord. I don't believe I've ever insulted you, if I did insult you, then I'm sorry for that. Otherwise I have no idea what you're talking about.
1) Okay, but so have other people.
2&3) Oughta is also an artist with experience, and some level of knowledge. He also made references for us, tons of them.
4) I don't ignore feedback, we don't however follow all of it, because we either can't or our team disagrees.
5) Gizmo has never talked to me about your work.
By the by, I'm not an artist, and any artistic feedback I tend to forward to Kuja.
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- Jan 29, 2019
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1) Other people are not artists like me. They just throw their 2 cents because nowadays "everyone's opinion matters", but they haven't studied basics of art, they haven't worked as artists in the industry in any way, shape or form, they don't have experience of drawing/modeling/texturing/animating.
When it was happening not a lot of people have given feedback as I did. I've seen people providing references only a couple of times and some of them came from F95, the old thread. Maybe people from more "elite" chats have provided references? I don't know, becasue you closed them for those who stayd in the jungle. But even if they did, they never joined conversations that we had in illustrations chat, which made it look as if nobody else cared to the extent how I did.
2+3) He did, but when I provide a literal photo of a human being with actual anatomy and show you "mistake is here" with arrows, whatever artist you have, you're given literally fact-based proof that you/them were wrong. This is not a question of "who provides references", but the question of "if provided references by who-ever are correct".
If I call a senior artist from Blizzard who will give you the same referenes that I gave, will you listen to them then? Is that how it works? Is that how it should work?
4) Then you should say it, professionally. Not just start ignoring people or ridiculing them for "the same concearns that they can't deal with". If your team has decided for whatever reason to not follow the feedback - say it, explain it, while showing people who gave up their time for you that you at least value their efforts.
However you phraze your answers, people mainly hear "Stop bitching, shut up, you suck, leave us alone".
5) Gizmo voiced his approval in the chat during the discussions. There wasn't a reason for him to talk to you about it. Why would he? You have Oughta and you feel completely set with them. Also I said he agreed with my "art theses" - my approach, my vieweing on how art works. I have no idea if he has ever seen my art, but he agrees to my approach, because my approach comes from actual professional experience in the office which is universal for people who work in that industry.
I never forwarded artistic problems to you, I @ Kuja whenever something came up. I have no idea if he has even brought up problems that I have talked about, because every single time his answers were vague af or he didnt answer at all. Whenever you joined the frame it was because you saw how much of a ruckus I was making when discussing them and I guess yo ujsut wanted to put your 2 cents.
With you I have discussed game design only. And even though we have different opinions on it, it has never been as ridiculous as it was discussing art problems with Kuja. I know that you have your taste in games and I can respect that, so it's not even a problem.
Your management skills is a completely different topic though.
When this all over , will this thread be published as a screenplay and shown in a theater near ?
No, it will be a reminder to the future mankind why furry porn got mainstream. Honestly, it stopped being entertaining, i only have one question
Am i the only one who had fun with The last of Us 2 and want a sequel?
- Apr 26, 2019
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nothing like a good joel in one, then playing with dogs and having flash backs of saving zebras, then have you kill the dogs as ellie to try force emotions out of you oh and not have a single likeable character, and trying to say joel was a bad guy for saving ellie who was by the end his surrogate daughter, because poorly written buh he condemned the world because an immunity shot made by sacrificing a child is really going to fix the billons of clickers(zombies) that can still kill and eat people, and people will still be kill each other and lord knows in what ways the "cure" could be used/controlled in, its a much more complex matter than just oh a cure will fix every thing, but thats the writing you get when neil is made lead writer and no longer supervised by some one, tho the flags were already there when he came out saying he almost made a sexist game or some crap lmao.
anyway as for this game and the prior one, i did come to the conclusion that back stabbing is why the older game came to a halt but that's just what i think but regardless of if it is or isn't its over all a real shame it did, i though its style/designs were better to some extent but the pot dragging was abit much after the first 2 or 3 times, but hey every game has some sort of semi tedious padding, anyway seeing that this game has already been re rebooted from 3d back to semi 2d ? i will say this don't make this game the Duke Nukem Forever of porn games, if you know of that game if you don't it was essentially rebooted every time the project lead saw some new shiny feature of some new engine and that's why that game stayed in development hell, and yea i know you wont be changing engine all the time but also don't go to mad on over packing the game with unnecessary things i guess, and i saw mentions of wanting to be like kotor ? seems abit bold but eh.