Porrvald

Active Member
Sep 12, 2020
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View attachment 3622820
I did some math a few weeks ago. Depending on supply and market location: knives, rifles, shotguns, and plasma rifles shuffle in and out of being most profitable investment. When knife supply is at lowest level, they win out overall.
The reason that knives becomes better is because you have reached lowest possible steel price at Dakota's sisters store.

And while that may seem like a good thing... It actually is a very bad thing for the long term sustainability of the production.

Why? Because a single efficient workshop, with 9000 production points, will consume 1800 steel per day and only 140 steel per day will replenish on a dying world (and I'm guessing 700 on non-dying world).

So, when producing 900 knives per day you will reduce the available steel market supply by 1100-1660 units per day.

If instead producing 100 rifles, you will only consume 600 steel per day, which will then never run out on normal difficulty and last several years longer on a dying world.

It is of course possible to avoid this by producing plasma rifles, but then the problem shifts towards lack of dura steel instead.

Which probably means that the best compromize is auto rifles.

If you wanted to visualize this dimension, then you could simply add a production points per day value, somewhere in the sheet, and then add columns for steel and durasteel consumption per day, based on that value.
 
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Porrvald

Active Member
Sep 12, 2020
596
634
Yeah, probably? I dunno, it's currently free though!
But for how long?

After reading up a little, it looks like they tried to increase income by retroactively adding cost per installation and presumably adding spywhere to monitor it. When that failed, they fired 25% of their staff.

I would expect that they will try something same "but different" as soon as they realize that revenue is still not meeting expectation.
 

roadesst

New Member
Jun 23, 2020
1
1
Are there any keyboard shortcuts for the different buttons, like when you are in the house. If not, is there a way to mod or hack in keyboard shortcuts into a html game?
 

khumak

Engaged Member
Oct 2, 2017
3,717
3,750
It's not that it removes anything. It just looks like the training is based on diminishing returns and the diminishing is now at 30 points higher.

<<if $mctraitdis gte 75>><<set $chance+=30>><</if>>
...
<<set $chance-=$masterstrength>>
...
<<if $chance gte 1>>
...
<<set $masterstrength+=1>>

Basically this: Do dice rolls and lots of adjustments to chance, Add 30 if Disciplined, subtract strength, if end result greater than 0 then increase strenght.

Unless there is a cap somewhere that I'm missing, then it would mean that you can train 30 more points per skill, before it becomes impossible to train further.
Was curious about this so I actually just tested it. Disciplined has no effect on the stat caps, it just makes it easier to hit the existing caps. Without the dojo the cap is 120. With the dojo the cap is 130. You can hit 130 with or without Disciplined, but with disciplined you can do it fairly easily. Once you get to 130 there's a massive penalty of more than 100 that makes every attempt an automatic failure even with disciplined.

You can build more than 1 dojo for some reason but they don't do anything past the first one other than cost you money.

Melee and ranged can both go to 150 via combat but you can only train them to 130 in the dojo.

I didn't test the caps for followers. In previous versions the follower's frame determined their caps so for instance Ayden had higher caps than Bud. Not sure if that's still true.

It's possible to start with almost 200 strength using an enhanced start if you cheese it to the max when creating your character but I'm not sure it's really worth spending so many points when you can get to 130 for free via training.
 
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Clemency

Active Member
Jan 21, 2024
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I didn't test the caps for followers. In previous versions the follower's frame determined their caps so for instance Ayden had higher caps than Bud. Not sure if that's still true.
I think they have the same caps but more muscular bodies have a better time raising their strength but are penalized in rolls when raising their dexterity past around 90 dex. More lithe bodies are penalized in their strength training rolls starting at around 90 strength. So while they have the same caps, one guy is going to struggle very very hard to get there while another gets there easier.
 
Mar 5, 2024
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I think they have the same caps but more muscular bodies have a better time raising their strength but are penalized in rolls when raising their dexterity past around 90 dex. More lithe bodies are penalized in their strength training rolls starting at around 90 strength. So while they have the same caps, one guy is going to struggle very very hard to get there while another gets there easier.
Well, a short look at the code for 8.32 (and 8.31) suggest, that npcs with certain body types do not have any strength cap (via training in the dojo) and that other npcs with other certain body types do not have any dex cap (via training in the dojo). Ie. petite and very petite bodied npcs can get dex of 999+ (yes the chance is slim to raise above 120, but it is above zero) and herculean bodied npcs can get herculean strength of ie. 999+ str (yes the chance is slim to raise above 120, but it is above zero) and in both cases the chance for a raise is the same for raising from 120 to 121 and from 998 to 999 (or with other words, if an npc can raise his/her dex/str from 120 to 121 via dojo training, then he/she can raise his/her dex/str from 998 to 999, meaning their is no cap for the npc and that particular dex/str training).

Now the question for you is, do you prefer npcs (as followers) which cannot be hit via melee attacks (from creatures like Goran-Ika) or do you prefer npcs which deal more damage via melee attacks? (Or does that depend on the combat, ie. if you can make sure, that only a certain npc is targeted via melee attacks in advanced fight, then you might want a mixed line-up (where the ultra dextrous female is always targeted but always evades the attack), while your herculean npcs make short work of the enemy).
 

Clemency

Active Member
Jan 21, 2024
619
670
Now the question for you is, do you prefer npcs (as followers) which cannot be hit via melee attacks (from creatures like Goran-Ika) or do you prefer npcs which deal more damage via melee attacks? (Or does that depend on the combat, ie. if you can make sure, that only a certain npc is targeted via melee attacks in advanced fight, then you might want a mixed line-up (where the ultra dextrous female is always targeted but always evades the attack), while your herculean npcs make short work of the enemy).
I prefer to raise both stats to their hardest soft cap instead of trying to brute force a -120 roll. Time enough for later when your combat teams are set to try and get your NPCs past the hard soft cap. God knows my workaholic Ayden is still capped at 120 strength at day 500.
 
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khumak

Engaged Member
Oct 2, 2017
3,717
3,750
Well, a short look at the code for 8.32 (and 8.31) suggest, that npcs with certain body types do not have any strength cap (via training in the dojo) and that other npcs with other certain body types do not have any dex cap (via training in the dojo). Ie. petite and very petite bodied npcs can get dex of 999+ (yes the chance is slim to raise above 120, but it is above zero) and herculean bodied npcs can get herculean strength of ie. 999+ str (yes the chance is slim to raise above 120, but it is above zero) and in both cases the chance for a raise is the same for raising from 120 to 121 and from 998 to 999 (or with other words, if an npc can raise his/her dex/str from 120 to 121 via dojo training, then he/she can raise his/her dex/str from 998 to 999, meaning their is no cap for the npc and that particular dex/str training).
I haven't looked at the code but from the training I've done with mercs in game this is just not true unless the chance you're talking about is WAY less than 1%. Maybe some kind of critical success is possible that makes the penalty irrelevant but I have never seen it. To me if the chance is less than 1% then it might as well not exist.

Once you hit the cap, whether that's 120, 130, or whatever you see a massive penalty on every roll from then on even with a maxed out dojo and even with the disciplined trait. The penalty is so large that if you roll a 1 you still fail by a huge amount. In previous versions Ayden was able to train beyond 140 (I think he capped around 160 or so but it's been awhile) because of his herculean frame while someone with a smaller frame like Bud could only train to 120. At that point their chance for further increases was 0%. You could do hundreds of training sessions after that and you would never gain even 1 point.

Disciplined does make it really easy to actually reach that cap so it's a very noticeable brick wall you hit. You'll go from like an 80% chance of success all the way up to the cap to suddenly 0% as soon as you hit the cap. Without disciplined you might have more like a 15% when you're nearing the cap and then 0%.
 
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DrLizardman

Member
Apr 28, 2021
447
125
So I know manhunter only works on the MC but if I am doing a ranged build ie: lower strength and dex, is it still worth grabbing for the extra sell price? or do I just train up those stats and then do captures myself?
 

annoyedlurker

Newbie
Oct 18, 2023
26
9
So, I took one of the girls who didn't have much art, Av101, and replaced her with a girl I made more art for in Daz3D. Is there any way to get the game to recognize that so it'll give me stuff like the strip naked button, or was I silly to try this?
 

annoyedlurker

Newbie
Oct 18, 2023
26
9
save file please
Are you talking to me? Let me know if this is a bad format or something, it's what it saved as.

Edit: Okay it looks like that might not work, let me mess around with it some more.
Edit2: I've got no idea if you can get anything useful out of this, is there some preferred format I need to shift it to before attaching the file? First time sticking a game save file in a forum text box.
 
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DrLizardman

Member
Apr 28, 2021
447
125
I think you can change it later, but what dice roll system is best for a "realistic" playthrough I do not interact with dice often I just want the rolls to be fair.
 

Porrvald

Active Member
Sep 12, 2020
596
634
Was curious about this so I actually just tested it. Disciplined has no effect on the stat caps, it just makes it easier to hit the existing caps. Without the dojo the cap is 120. With the dojo the cap is 130. You can hit 130 with or without Disciplined, but with disciplined you can do it fairly easily. Once you get to 130 there's a massive penalty of more than 100 that makes every attempt an automatic failure even with disciplined.

You can build more than 1 dojo for some reason but they don't do anything past the first one other than cost you money.

Melee and ranged can both go to 150 via combat but you can only train them to 130 in the dojo.

I didn't test the caps for followers. In previous versions the follower's frame determined their caps so for instance Ayden had higher caps than Bud. Not sure if that's still true.

It's possible to start with almost 200 strength using an enhanced start if you cheese it to the max when creating your character but I'm not sure it's really worth spending so many points when you can get to 130 for free via training.
Yes, it was right under my nose the entire time.
1715416577142.png

I misread -=120 as -=12, like this:
1715416906333.png

Two conclusions:
1. Disciplined is not very useful as you can easily reach the max cap 130 with trainer and push it options.
2. I need something other than Notepad++ to read the html file.
 
Mar 5, 2024
68
33
View attachment 3622820
I did some math a few weeks ago. Depending on supply and market location: knives, rifles, shotguns, and plasma rifles shuffle in and out of being most profitable investment. When knife supply is at lowest level, they win out overall.
Well I also did some math, at one point anyway. In any case, your spreadsheet looks a little bit simple (ie. a whole lot of things that do affect prices for different materials are missing), also concerning to the selling prices of items (or better weapons) - also the results might be a little bit different, depending on the difficulty level (ie. selling prices for some weapons are lower on grimdark difficulty).
 

zaqwsxcde1

Member
Mar 17, 2019
169
106
How to trigger Bud's personal quest? Going to dinner with him and asking him personal question doesn't trigger any quest. Where it supposed to be appeared?
 
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