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Joshua Tree

Conversation Conqueror
Jul 10, 2017
6,158
6,571
Wow talking about strawmanning dude. You're being totally unreasonable but still I'll give you this one time the chance for a good faith discussion. So I'd suggest you to be cognizant of this, if you think about responding:

I'm going to simply ignore your first paragraph because it's just a strawman for which you should apologize. This is not, what I have been saying and if you actually read my comment, you should know that.

As soon as money is in play it becomes less a hobby and more a sidejob. Don't forget that Patreon money is taxable income so just calling it a hobby is dishonest. Legal code is clear... I understand that people do this on the side given that for many it is not really viable, yet as soon as money comes in play a certain sense of responsibility should come into play regardless. If you are obviously not able to hold those responsibilities then I think the most honest thing would be to discontinue the project or go fully back to it as a hobby without money in play. There are tons of creators of games who don't use Patreon and still develop games on the side on their own dime. That is also okay. But to constantly back out of promises of update schedules (you advertise those on your Patreon to entice more patrons after all), isn't really fair at all. That it is also bad business practice shows that even developers with lower quality games have much higher income just because they are able to keep schedule.

So hopefully you really just did misunderstand my argument and just went for the typical standard talking point of "defending muh dev" and are not dishonest... But here as well, I'll hold my breath...
You can have a hobby of make crafts and arts and what not, and sell, and pay tax on. Just because you pay tax of something doesn't make it a job. He already posted why things are like they are. No one forces people to pledge and support. Vote with your money is a nice thing. And if people never tipped his jar to start with, sorry, you got no say really. You in it for a free lunch.

When you emphasize on the money aspect and that he should abandon it unless he can push out faster contnet, because.. money... Then it sound like you feel entitled because you did support him. So asking you how much you did tip the jar for is not that unreasonable in that regard.

Also, you don't really advertise on Patreon. Patreon doesn't promote creators, or advertise for them. If you want to advertise your patreon as a creator you need to do that yourself. People can come across his site browsing nsfw stuff on Patreon.

He said he won't announce any release dates anylonger, which tbh, is completely fine, and imho all creators should do something similar... get it done when its done, and release it. To many creators burn the fuse in both end and trainwreck themselves in the process leaving an wake of abandoned and incomplete games, or release a mess of things.
 

Ozygator

Engaged Member
Donor
Oct 15, 2016
2,375
3,992
I'm sure glad I read some of the feedback about the new update before I downloaded it

This was a good game........someone needs to slap the dev. of this game up side the head

And say WTF is up with You stop F**king around and work on Your game
Only if they do the same to you and say "Pay the dev some cash if you expect him to work for free around his regular job just so you're entertained!"
 

crashload

Member
Jul 8, 2018
167
91
Okay the update was good many good scenes but really now we have an old dude who fucks the Maid that is really annoying I hoped that the Mc is the only one who gets action now a fucking old dude gets action too at least you could have let him die on the floor but no he survived and will maybe spy on the girls ughh but else its was a good update even when I hate to share girls and this game was so promising for that not much guys on the island storm is there well whatever I hope in future updates there will be no other guy who gets action ;)
 

Nightphysics

Member
Jun 11, 2018
168
222
You can have a hobby of make crafts and arts and what not, and sell, and pay tax on. Just because you pay tax of something doesn't make it a job. He already posted why things are like they are. No one forces people to pledge and support. Vote with your money is a nice thing. And if people never tipped his jar to start with, sorry, you got no say really. You in it for a free lunch.
What did I write though? Read properly please. As soon as money comes in play any artist will tell you, they do put work into their art and take it more seriously. You normally feel the sense of responsibility to actually deliver something. And the last sentence is just nonsense as people can and will still voice their opinion.

When you emphasize on the money aspect and that he should abandon it unless he can push out faster contnet, because.. money... Then it sound like you feel entitled because you did support him. So asking you how much you did tip the jar for is not that unreasonable in that regard.
Again you are fishing for personal attack points... People can never just have a sense of fairness or anything right? You are revealing more about yourself than the other way around. My original point is though that even on Patreon you can change the support from per month to per release for example, which would also help the point you are making a bit down the line regarding creators developing themselves in a corner.

Also, you don't really advertise on Patreon. Patreon doesn't promote creators, or advertise for them. If you want to advertise your patreon as a creator you need to do that yourself. People can come across his site browsing nsfw stuff on Patreon.
You are advertising your game on your Patreon main site ("Hello my name is X and this is/these are my games") together with public news regarding the game the dev releases. That is what I'm talking about.

He said he won't announce any release dates anylonger, which tbh, is completely fine, and imho all creators should do something similar... get it done when its done, and release it. To many creators burn the fuse in both end and trainwreck themselves in the process leaving an wake of abandoned and incomplete games, or release a mess of things.
That last point is something I can agree on with you (although the solution you propose won't help). Which is why I find the whole Patreon thing with video games extremely counter productive as the development phase is the only part, where the dev earns money pretty much. Compare it to a early access game in which the finished product on a platform like Steam is it's most worth when it is actually finished. So yes, there is an issue with the whole business model of supporting somebody as long as the game is unfinished and only the good will of the dev is the deciding factor if a game gets finished in the first place. That is for example the reason why Beggar of Net got under scrutiny. It looks for many people like he is just lengthening the development cycle. I don't see the current prevailing business model as really reliable.
 

Joshua Tree

Conversation Conqueror
Jul 10, 2017
6,158
6,571
What did I write though? Read properly please. As soon as money comes in play any artist will tell you, they do put work into their art and take it more seriously. You normally feel the sense of responsibility to actually deliver something. And the last sentence is just nonsense as people can and will still voice their opinion.

Again you are fishing for personal attack points... People can never just have a sense of fairness or anything right? You are revealing more about yourself than the other way around. My original point is though that even on Patreon you can change the support from per month to per release for example, which would also help the point you are making a bit down the line regarding creators developing themselves in a corner.

You are advertising your game on your Patreon main site ("Hello my name is X and this is/these are my games") together with public news regarding the game the dev releases. That is what I'm talking about.
A hobby will remain a hobby, unless the creator is able and ready to take the plunge. If you make something from it, you have a incentive to do better/more, but not necessary make a full job out of it.

Just because Patreon allow creators different ways to monetize support to them. Doesn't mean one way or the other is right or correct. When I pledge to a creator I don't focus so much on when is the next release, but on what they already done so far, if I like it, and I want to see it completed. I support the creator not just in it for the next release. Although, I do tend to just support creators for a few months at a time, and then support someone else just to spread it around.

Again, just because you are a creator on patreon, it doesn't mean you advertise on Patreon. Because Patreon is little more than a wallet, which do not promote or advertise any content creators on their site. Creators need to self-promote to bring traffic to their Patreon. Some creators is very good at this and might pull quite a lot in pledges, yet their game might be inferior to some other creator that make less, which not so good at promote themselves.

Not fishing for any "personal attacks". But if people just in it for a free lunch, their opinion carry less value tbh. Than those that do support. And if those that support does so because they want to support the creator, and not so much focus on when the next release. Who to tell them they are doing it wrong or whatever?
 
Jan 15, 2018
297
268
need walkthrough i got lost
milouderr jon shoulda just told you, dunno why people gotta be like that
but you have to go back to your room (room 23)
you'll get some text about spending time before your evening date
exit lobby > go to street
Enter~ Jada
answer = knife > then pot and crowbar (if you're a wise ass you'll get raped in prison jus sayin)
Enter~ Ingrid
Quest find her cross necklace (she gives a hint that you shouldn't check the second floor she hasnt been there yet)
Go to [<] room
click orange pillow on the right > Clasp Get!
Cleaning cab > get necklace
Clasp + Neckalce = Broken Necklace with clasp
Pliers + Broken Necklace with clasp = there ya go fixed ye
small scene (glimpse of whats to come~)
head over to the shop to see Maria
SIKE! Shorty pulls a fkin gun an Jada
respond I'm just passing by (you wanna get shot or somethin?)
nothing in your inventory will save you gonna keep it real
talk to the guy > Distract him > talk to Fluffy > Attack!
booty munchin scene
now go to the shop > backyard
sit next to her > not sure if order really matter, go through all of the choices (i did statue picture bench)
I'll leave the rest of this scene to you
after you're done fucking her go back to your room
dream scene
ask your mom to "help" you
no hot water
after > first floor > lobby (auto chat with Tina)
Quest... Find Leo the repairman
[>] Corridor > Elevator 2nd Floor > Kitchen (auto chat with Bella)
Leo's inside of Ingrid
right before you stick it in Grandpa Leo has a heartattack, stroke? whatever he keels over
and its up to you to save him
drawer to the left of oven > fork and turner Get~
pliers on Coffee Maker > wires get~
combine both items to get the defibrillator > use em on Leo
oh welp he wakes up, too bad
click on his old man pants > Leo's pills get > now use em on him
Quest Find Leo is done, the hot water is now up and running
first floor > [<] corridor > elevator (second floor)
mom's lewd showering scene
corridor > talk with Aunt > corridor > room 22
The Doc exposes your relationship with your mom

that's all for this build
 

Nightphysics

Member
Jun 11, 2018
168
222
A hobby will remain a hobby, unless the creator is able and ready to take the plunge. If you make something from it, you have a incentive to do better/more, but not necessary make a full job out of it.
You're just reiterating with slightly different the same comment, while ever so slightly missing my point... I can just tell you again and again that as soon money comes in play people take up generally more responsibility cause it is the right thing to do. I don't even know at this point if you disagree just to disagree or what is going on...

Just because Patreon allow creators different ways to monetize support to them. Doesn't mean one way or the other is right or correct. When I pledge to a creator I don't focus so much on when is the next release, but on what they already done so far, if I like it, and I want to see it completed. I support the creator not just in it for the next release. Although, I do tend to just support creators for a few months at a time, and then support someone else just to spread it around.
Well given the fact that YouTubers and many other creators or entertainers are on Patreon there are different monetization options and they are there because given the type of product you create, there are options that are more or less fitting. I am arguing that the monetization by release may be more fitting and may even solve the problem you outlined in your earlier comment regarding racing towards the next update (at least for people who do this on the side).

Again, just because you are a creator on patreon, it doesn't mean you advertise on Patreon. Because Patreon is little more than a wallet, which do not promote or advertise any content creators on their site. Creators need to self-promote to bring traffic to their Patreon. Some creators is very good at this and might pull quite a lot in pledges, yet their game might be inferior to some other creator that make less, which not so good at promote themselves.
You are misunderstanding my point. On your Patreon Site you directly try to convince any person who by whatever means found your site to pledge to your art. You do this by showing pictures or videos, showing a roadmap and showing what you have achieved in X amount of updates/time. That all is part of the convincing/advertising process.

Not fishing for any "personal attacks". But if people just in it for a free lunch, their opinion carry less value tbh. Than those that do support. And if those that support does so because they want to support the creator, and not so much focus on when the next release. Who to tell them they are doing it wrong or whatever?
With that argumentation you can theoretically make fraud sound moral...

"People who haven't been frauded out of their money have a less valuable opinion than those that have been fooled. And if those that are being fooled to give even more money to this pyramid scheme then who to tell them they are doing anything wrong?"

You see how that sounds? I can very well argue that people are being led on by false hopes and are foolish to support somebody further than to a certain point. Me not being financially invested actually makes my opinion in that circumstance more valuable as I can't be biased then. Ever heard of the Concorde fallacy? Look it up...


We have now gone quite far from the original topic TBH, so we should stop it here. Again, I think that this update was extremely underwhelming and I don't know if the dev can actually in a reasonable timescale release progress but from what I read, I am not hopeful.
 
3.20 star(s) 32 Votes