Bawdy Ink Slinger

Monster Girl Farmer
Game Developer
Jun 1, 2017
356
490
Wait is this OC art? In a text based game? That's kinda rare, to the point I feel we should have a tag for it.
Yes it is, but as you can see I've gone through a few artists along the way. That's why the artwork is in different styles. I really like my current artist, and I'd like to think she's a keeper. Eventually, she'll replace the other artists work, but I think most players would prefer more artwork to consistent artwork at this point in time?

I'll ask the staff about a tag for that. Thanks for the idea.
 

Malcowitz

Active Member
Feb 14, 2018
757
1,104
Sure! I'd love that feedback. It's kinda hard to talk about UI without getting visual, so I think it makes more sense to give me your ideas here or on my discord ( )

Looking forward to your ideas!
Ok, so I moved the main screen around a bit so that at the start, the things you click are all grouped together. This is just a simple ergonomy, to reduce mouse-travel. The most used are the Dining room (because it leads to the bed), the Field (as part of the early game money loop) and then the Forest because the majority of gameplay happens there.

I used this method just because it involves the least amount of work for you: all you need to do is move them around but ideally, they would be radial, with dining room in the center and he more used ones being closer and the other farther away but that also takes effort for limited gains. (you also aren't trying to use these for touch screens methinks where the radials are the most popular for a reason lol)

The other screens don't see so much switching between them but the principle is the same really.

Secondly, the starting loop for farming and selling would be simplified by firstly moving the crops button to the top and possibly adding a "go farm" command to the bedroom. You should also ideally have a "Go to sleep" command next to the energy bar so you can just go straight to bed. Saves a few clicks. Stores should ideally simply enter the sell/buy (ideally both) at the start rather than having you choose.

Thirdly, when you increase affection the random element is weird. It's inconsistent and the items are, odd. (I'd have thought a horse appreciated carrots?? Eating cherries lets you infinitely continue because you get more than you lose?) You get used to them right away though.

It's easy to suggest a bunch of reworks to that system which I'm sure many have so I'm gonna say that fewer commands with more depth would be better while acknowledging that it would involve a lot of work and would not be guaranteed to be a better system that would engage more. (Though I feel a simple give/touch/play/talk where you simplify existing options into it and have deeper feedback would be better)

Probably the lesson I feel most pornogame developers should remember is that mechanics should ideally be serving the goal of getting people off, just like horror games should be increasing tension and action games giving you thrills. The start, where you are focused on getting food to feed the doggirl to get into her good graces is good. The care mechanic is good because it leads to scenes. The exploration mechanic is good if it leads to content but mostly, it does not, so it needs work.

The scenes with the girls need repeatable variants or least a way to watch them again. The girls need to have more interactions as even doggirl only has a few. All of that needs time and effort though.

I think it's admirable that you solicit a lot of feedback from people but in the end I feel like your duty as gamedev is mostly to actualize your own vision then cut it down into the absolute minimum needed to achieve that goal, then build around it what improves it. Easier said than done I suppose, but that means that things that waste player time like randomization that take you time to do should be avoided for instance, unless it's simple to implement because at the end of the day you're a team of one and your time is limited.

Anyway thats about it. I don't have a burner discord account so I'm afraid I can't post there. I hope
 

Bawdy Ink Slinger

Monster Girl Farmer
Game Developer
Jun 1, 2017
356
490
Thanks for the thorough reply. I think the end of your last sentence got cut off, but I have a feeling I know what you are going to say. :)

you also aren't trying to use these for touch screens methinks where the radials are the most popular for a reason
actually, the game is responsive and a lot of people play it on mobile. 25% as of right now.

Secondly, the starting loop for farming and selling would be simplified by firstly moving the crops button to the top and possibly adding a "go farm" command to the bedroom. You should also ideally have a "Go to sleep" command next to the energy bar so you can just go straight to bed.
Maybe this is terrible design, but I planned to add that functionality as upgrades.

Eating cherries lets you infinitely continue because you get more than you lose?
Only if you have infinite cherries, right? Is it easy to come by them?

Thirdly, when you increase affection the random element is weird. It's inconsistent
I'm not sure which random element you are referring to. Could you give an example?

I'm gonna say that fewer commands with more depth would be better
Hm. Well, I think of this as a classic JRPG where you learn new spells as you level up. One of the things that kept me going was wondering what the next spell was going to be and how useful it would be.

Other than that, I think more depth to commands would be very useful and fun. I've got a plethora of ideas to steal from JRPG's. Any of the battle actions a character can use in Final Fantasy 1, for example.

That said, I'm interested in any ideas you or anyone else may have.

The scenes with the girls need repeatable variants or least a way to watch them again.
I agree that they should be repeatable. This was some lost functionality that used to exist in the previous version. It's gone now so I could release sooner, but I'm in a try to add that back in in the next release

Thanks for all this wonderful feedback! I'm definitely going to rearrange the map so it's more ergonomic :)
 

Malcowitz

Active Member
Feb 14, 2018
757
1,104
Thanks for the thorough reply. I think the end of your last sentence got cut off, but I have a feeling I know what you are going to say. :)

actually, the game is responsive and a lot of people play it on mobile. 25% as of right now.
All right, then radials are something to think about if they aren't a hassle; I'm on the graphic design end, not the programming one so no clue. It also means your current vertical layout is a necessity rather than spreading out more.

Maybe this is terrible design, but I planned to add that functionality as upgrades.
Tbh, from what I vaguely remember skimming through the thread you talked about automating part of the resource gathering? These would be more worthwhile updates I feel, because they'd be, again, making it quicker for you to get into the parts that have you dealing with the part that matters, the monster girls, and less to do with the farming. (Though I do dream one day about having a game where you have to think about soil quality, proper drainage, pests and whatnot I don't think that gives many other people hot and bothered)

Only if you have infinite cherries, right? Is it easy to come by them?
Grinding the tree is easy because it's in the field and all the interactions with the girls become fairly simple once you reach the 20 energy interactions, the cleaning and intimate questions just make it simpler to do so.

I don't think that's a bad thing per se; you just have to decide if items are something you get a lot of and throw around willy nilly or if they're rare and powerful. You can even go for both with "rare drops" but these are, in my opinion at least, lame design because they're pavlovian gambling and not actually good mechanics.

You also haven't decided if money is really important or not and so items fall under that too. Right now it's not really any use, but you could go for something like having money sinks in the town to revitalize it, using it for "cosmetic" upgrades (improving your house) or even scenes (buying the girls things like clothes, toys, potions and such)
I'm not sure which random element you are referring to. Could you give an example?
Sorry, I meant the energy costs that come with the girl events some of the time when you do things. (the pink bordered text)

It also kinda goes against the caring aspect of it because you lose energy when you actually see what the girls do, as you want them to be non-responsive (and therefore not cost energy). Them being uniformly negative is possibly the problem

Hm. Well, I think of this as a classic JRPG where you learn new spells as you level up. One of the things that kept me going was wondering what the next spell was going to be and how useful it would be.

Other than that, I think more depth to commands would be very useful and fun. I've got a plethora of ideas to steal from JRPG's. Any of the battle actions a character can use in Final Fantasy 1, for example.

That said, I'm interested in any ideas you or anyone else may have.

I agree that they should be repeatable. This was some lost functionality that used to exist in the previous version. It's gone now so I could release sooner, but I'm in a try to add that back in in the next release
Progression is always good for games because it gives you a sense of growth that lets you feel empowered as you play, but usually the best games use that progression to further the central theme of the game. If you want a player to be able to spam intimate questions going forward to charm every monster that's fine, because it's a way to let them quickly get to the best content, which are your wonderful scenes.

One simple thing I can think of immediately that would also segue into the repeatable scenes would be to split it so it would be either lewd charming or friendly charming, with lewd charming letting you repeat scenes for lesser rewards and friendly charming letting you get rewards but no sex scenes. (For quick resources)

To use the already existing system, something like half a bar for friendly, three quarter for lewd at current level and then full bar for next unlock? Just what I thought of imagining it right now. This would also not necessitate using the whole of the energy bar, while letting you get lots of smaller scenes with the monster girls that would make them feel more like living characters; I'm thinking walking the forest with the dryad to pick wood, helping the centaur hunt, Hanako lifting you up to pick her berries and so on. This would also make it possible to outsource some of these character building scenes because as people playing get more of a feel for the characters they can make them and vetting them would be easier and simpler for you than sex scenes.

You could also go for more effects and limits on them (like icebreaker only works up to 20% and intimate questions are only possible above 50% of the bar being full and such) to make their use more tactical and not making them uniformly active across monster girls (Our dog girl for instance might love walks but Hanako and our Fungi? Not so much)

Other ideas are just the obvious, more interactions between girls, more scenes and such. Oh and not losing money when running out of energy at home maybe, is my dog robbing me??
Thanks for all this wonderful feedback! I'm definitely going to rearrange the map so it's more ergonomic :)
I'm glad to hear it! This is a very promising game and I actually had a lot of fun with your original game, where my fav theme, amusingly enough, was the lactation, transformation and most especially the breeding so I was a bit surprised you're keeping the cowgirls for later ;)
 

Bawdy Ink Slinger

Monster Girl Farmer
Game Developer
Jun 1, 2017
356
490
Normally I don't create new posts for minor releases, but I think this one might be worth informing people about: if you were experiencing performance issues when changing from passage to passage, that has been fixed.

It was caused by auto saving too frequently. Now autosaves only happen after "battles" (I really want to think of a better term then this) and after you sleep.
 

Bawdy Ink Slinger

Monster Girl Farmer
Game Developer
Jun 1, 2017
356
490
All right, then radials are something to think about
I googled for this but I'm not really sure what it means. I don't think I found the right search terms.

Tbh, from what I vaguely remember skimming through the thread you talked about automating part of the resource gathering? These would be more worthwhile updates I feel
Sure, that might come into play as a feature. It's a matter of prioritization. But I'm also interested on your thoughts of the feature I proposed.

Grinding the tree is easy because it's in the field and all the interactions with the girls become fairly simple once you reach the 20 energy interactions, the cleaning and intimate questions just make it simpler to do so.
Right. I plan to solve this in two ways: make a max amount of items a character will drop per battle, and make some monster girls drain more energy than others.

You also haven't decided if money is really important or not
It's definitely going to become more important, just haven't had the time to make it so. :( E.g. I want "armor" to protect you against types of monster girl attacks. Maybe weapons to make certain attacks do more damage.

Sorry, I meant the energy costs that come with the girl events some of the time when you do things. (the pink bordered text)
See don't like how the damage is random. Why don't you like that? There isn't much variation: it's always around 15 energy points.

It also kinda goes against the caring aspect of it because you lose energy when you actually see what the girls do, as you want them to be non-responsive (and therefore not cost energy). Them being uniformly negative is possibly the problem
I have a feeling this will be resolved when the text in the pink box relates to your actions. That's how I foresee this working in the future. I would've done that this release, but I didn't want to delay this release by another week to write all that content, especially because I had no idea if this battle system was a turd of a concept. But it sounds like people are saying it has a lot of potential.

One simple thing I can think of immediately that would also segue into the repeatable scenes would be to split it so it would be either lewd charming or friendly charming, with lewd charming letting you repeat scenes for lesser rewards and friendly charming letting you get rewards but no sex scenes. (For quick resources)

To use the already existing system, something like half a bar for friendly, three quarter for lewd at current level and then full bar for next unlock? Just what I thought of imagining it right now. This would also not necessitate using the whole of the energy bar, while letting you get lots of smaller scenes with the monster girls that would make them feel more like living characters; I'm thinking walking the forest with the dryad to pick wood, helping the centaur hunt, Hanako lifting you up to pick her berries and so on. This would also make it possible to outsource some of these character building scenes because as people playing get more of a feel for the characters they can make them and vetting them would be easier and simpler for you than sex scenes.
I think I get the concept of the first paragraph, but I don't get how it would be executed. So there are some care activities that wouldn't do anything until you seen the first two scenes already?

I apologize, but I don't really understand the second paragraph.

You could also go for more effects and limits on them (like icebreaker only works up to 20% and intimate questions are only possible above 50% of the bar being full and such) to make their use more tactical and not making them uniformly active across monster girls (Our dog girl for instance might love walks but Hanako and our Fungi? Not so much)
Yep I think this is a good idea and I plan on doing it. It's actually already half implemented. When you find Sophie in the forest, if you try to play with her, she has strong defenses for that and may even lose affection points. That's just an example, there are many more, but it's probably too subtle to notice-- I consider that to be a balancing issue. In the future, I plan making it so that every monster girl has some sort of reaction to every care activity.

you're keeping the cowgirls for later
Yeah, I'd like to think of a way of adding them sooner.

Thanks for the ideas!
 

Malcowitz

Active Member
Feb 14, 2018
757
1,104
I googled for this but I'm not really sure what it means. I don't think I found the right search terms.
Tbh, thinking back on it, it might not be the best. Radial menus radiate out from the centre is the simplest way to explain it I guess: it's more for use in consoles than phones.

Sure, that might come into play as a feature. It's a matter of prioritization. But I'm also interested on your thoughts of the feature I proposed.
Arright, in that case you could possibly tie them into progression with dog waifu, where instead of having her gather resources she unlocks upgrades like this if you also purchase things for her. Like, if you buy her a dog bed to keep in your room you can click her to go farm right away or if you buy her weights she works out enough that she can carry you home. This would also make you care more about her as a character.

Right. I plan to solve this in two ways: make a max amount of items a character will drop per battle, and make some monster girls drain more energy than others.

It's definitely going to become more important, just haven't had the time to make it so. :( E.g. I want "armor" to protect you against types of monster girl attacks. Maybe weapons to make certain attacks do more damage.
The two of these tie together strongly too, because ideally you want to have the player have to decide what to do with the items. Adding perishability to them is something some games do but it's an overcomplicated way of solving it.

Also, consider money sinks that give alternate progression; maybe you can donate to the local church or to the civic revival project to spruce up the town or get a better rep. Equipment is good but the best rewards for players are always content but as you adroitly point out, it's time that's always the issue with development.

See don't like how the damage is random. Why don't you like that? There isn't much variation: it's always around 15 energy points.

I have a feeling this will be resolved when the text in the pink box relates to your actions. That's how I foresee this working in the future. I would've done that this release, but I didn't want to delay this release by another week to write all that content, especially because I had no idea if this battle system was a turd of a concept. But it sounds like people are saying it has a lot of potential.
It does and what would make it intuitive right away without changing it too much would be to list the energy costs as a range, so Headpats would be 5-20, rather than listing 5 then ending up being 20. Also more events that are positive or at least neutral or tying them to the girls so that you want to use the right ones on the right ones in the right context but again, effort, time and so on.
The range at least makes it obvious right away and keeps the random element while still informing you of the effects.

I think I get the concept of the first paragraph, but I don't get how it would be executed. So there are some care activities that wouldn't do anything until you seen the first two scenes already?

I apologize, but I don't really understand the second paragraph.
I made a pic again to explain things, I am, alas, not the best communicator out there and have a tendency to leave people confused.

Tbh, the care acts are actually already fairly well balanced due to the random events making more expensive acts relatively cheaper.

Yep I think this is a good idea and I plan on doing it. It's actually already half implemented. When you find Sophie in the forest, if you try to play with her, she has strong defenses for that and may even lose affection points. That's just an example, there are many more, but it's probably too subtle to notice-- I consider that to be a balancing issue. In the future, I plan making it so that every monster girl has some sort of reaction to every care activity.
Yeah, I noticed some of it but it was subtle.

Yeah, I'd like to think of a way of adding them sooner.

Thanks for the ideas!
Take your time: burnout is one of the worst enemies to projects like this and its best to go at a pace you find comfortable. Hope the game goes fantastic.
 
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Malcowitz

Active Member
Feb 14, 2018
757
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:unsure: I don't know if people would want to play scenes over and over again, especially the non-lewd ones. I know that's not the main part of your proposal, but I'm having trouble looking past it.
The non lewd scenes would be for resource grinding and to let people know the characters better, both as part of the story as well as to let you have partial successes and let you discover better what activities they might like.
 

Bawdy Ink Slinger

Monster Girl Farmer
Game Developer
Jun 1, 2017
356
490
The non lewd scenes would be for resource grinding and to let people know the characters better, both as part of the story as well as to let you have partial successes and let you discover better what activities they might like.
Hm, we might be on the same page, but I was going to do that as her response to your care activities instead of a separate scene.
 

Bawdy Ink Slinger

Monster Girl Farmer
Game Developer
Jun 1, 2017
356
490
I just released v0.13.02. It has a bug fix: If you saw Fern's third scene before meeting Hanako, you would sometimes get errors while battling Fern.
 

deversari

Member
Oct 5, 2017
178
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What system is this programmed on? I know a lot of games use it, but is there a database of them somewhere?
 
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