VN Ren'Py Abandoned Nothing Is Forever [v0.7.3] [MrSilverLust]

[dolfe67]

Instead of copying japanese terms without understanding them, why not use english ones? We have cheating and sharing. Sure NTR is cheating with some flavor but still.

And yeah can't wait enough for the new tag system announced a few years ago.

 

[Ariathos]

All of those terms get conflated and confused with each other, both English and Japanese terms.
There exist clear and precise definitions (especially the Japanese NTR/NTS tags with various types)
But it seems like people will always confuse/misuse them.

If we stick to English terms, we have cuckolding, cheating, sharing
All of which are seemingly not clearly defined/agreed upon.
For instance, you will see many people who still think cuckolding=cheating.
Meanwhile actual cuckolding is consensual, encouraged, informed sex of your partner with another party.
But try to explain that to lay persons/vanilla people.

For example, if the partner of a cuckold has sex behind the cuckold's back without their knowledge/consent/approval, many would consider this cheating and grounds for serious discussion or even ending of the relationship/dynamic.

You have serious people who might live the lifestyle and clearly define those terms for themselves and others who indulge in similar dynamics.
And you've got people without any clue throwing those very same terms around everywhere.

 

[redoubt27]

For instance, you will see many people who still think cuckolding=cheating.
Meanwhile actual cuckolding is consensual, encouraged, informed sex of your partner with another party.

Definitions matter...
"Actual" cuckolding is cheating, by literal definition.
Fetish/kink cuckolding can be cheating, but can also be consensual.

But try to explain that to people who live in porn fantasy world detached from reality...
The ability to differentiate context is what separates us from imbeciles...

 

[miyuki25]

For instance, you will see many people who still think cuckolding=cheating.
Meanwhile actual cuckolding is consensual, encouraged, informed sex of your partner with another party.
But try to explain that to lay persons/vanilla people.

Actual cuckoldry is explicitly non-consensual (unknowing even) and requires the raising of another man's offspring, there's even another (somewhat archaic) term for when it is known and accepted: "wittol".

 

[Ariathos]

Actual cuckoldry is explicitly non-consensual (unknowing even) and requires the raising of another man's offspring, there's even another (somewhat archaic) term for when it is known and accepted: "wittol".

Not when we're talking about cuckolding as a fetish/topic in media.
What you are talking about might exist as a definition in different context/time periods.

What you refer to can be defined as cheating and/or cheating with impregnation/breeding.
Yes cuckolding has its root in the Cuckoo bird slipping their eggs into other birds' nests

But we're talking about specific fetishes or topics in porn games here

 

[Pr0GamerJohnny]

Not when we're talking about cuckolding as a fetish/topic in media.
What you are talking about might exist as a definition in different context/time periods.

What you refer to can be defined as cheating and/or cheating with impregnation/breeding.
Yes cuckolding has its root in the Cuckoo bird slipping their eggs into other birds' nests

But we're talking about specific fetishes or topics in porn games here

I understand what you're saying 100%, however the issue is these two definitions are very often conflated and freely used interchangeably by those outside the fetish as a tool for derision - (which would be invoking the non-fetish, nonconsensual version).

You're right, you'd think it'd be a no-brainer given the context of discussing porn games we'd be using the fetish variation - however for many the pejorative nature of the older definition is too tempting to pass up.

 

[redoubt27]

This stuff in context (of fetishes) is clearly defined.

No, it's not. You said yourself, people make up their own definitions...

You have serious people who might live the lifestyle and clearly define those terms for themselves

Consensual "cuckolding" is also referred to as hotwife, hotwifing, stag-vixen, etc.
Cuckolding in fetish/porn context is just as broad, convoluted, and not clearly defined/understood as netorase...

Just accept that there are serious people who define cuckolding exactly how it's defined in reality and differentiate in fetish/porn context with different terms like hotwife, stag-vixen, etc... They should be allowed to clearly define those terms for themselves and still be taken seriously, right?...

 

[Gicoo]

Yeah, only my definitions count. If other people have different ones, then they clearly don't have a distinguished and sophisticated porn knowledge as I do.

 

[Ariathos]

No, it's not. You said yourself, people make up their own definitions...

Consensual "cuckolding" is also referred to as hotwife, hotwifing, stag-vixen, etc.
Cuckolding in fetish/porn context is just as broad, convoluted, and not clearly defined/understood as netorase...

Just accept that there are serious people who define cuckolding exactly how it's defined in reality and differentiate in fetish/porn context with different terms like hotwife, stag-vixen, etc... They should be allowed to clearly define those terms for themselves and still be taken seriously, right?...

Never said they aren't allowed to do that.
Those terms exist exactly for this reason, because they're a variation or a different flavour.
So clearly differentiating between them is very important.

It doesn't help to call everything like that cuckolding, though.
It's swinging.
Or sharing.
Or hotwifing.
Or cheating.

Cuckolding can be a broad term for all those things
But as a fetish definition it's not and it's not helpful to keep conflating all those terms.

What I'm saying is, that people who actually do this stuff mean something very specific when they talk specifically about cuckolding.
If they meant to talk about hotwifing or sharing or swinging etc., they'd use those terms specifically.

 

[Ariathos]

Yeah, only my definitions count. If other people have different ones, then they clearly don't have a distinguished and sophisticated porn knowledge as I do.

Why do we bother to try to define something clearly so we can communicate better and understand each other better, when there are people who think making shit up makes so much sense?

 

[Dessolos]

tbh I just have my own definition of what it means to me , despite there being an actual definition. tho I will state as much cause I know not everyone agrees. Like to me I don't see any form of sharing as being cuckhold until there is some humiliation involved / the wife or the other guys is telling the MC what to do and he listens if it's in a humiliating manner.

As for cheating to me that only becomes cuckholding if the MC knows about it and accepts it and does nothing about it.

 

[osanaiko]

You all could not be more off topic.
Take this pointless discussion out of the game thread and into the general discussion area where it can fester with all the other noise.

 

[OnlyNeverNow]

Do your personality points/unlocked skills have any impact on the story/dialogue beyond unlocking choices? like, hidden checks in dialogue?

say for example, if i have the silver tongue perk, i may get an extra line of dialogue or two during a normal conversation about how smooth MC is, or if i have the asshole perk, they may mention that instead. or if it only takes into account actual choices i have made

Or if it's dependent on points, does that mean that buying skills will actually make me miss out on that dialogue? like if i spend all my sensitive points but none of my manly points, then maybe ill have 0 sen and 30 manly, so will the game treat me like i'm "manly"?

I'm just wondering basically if theres any roleplaying downside to just unlocking all the skills i want and making the choices i want to make for my character

 

[osanaiko]

OnlyNeverNow

I've spent 100s of hours in this game's source code while proofreading, play-testing and editing, from v0.2 to 0.7. (Having said that, it's been more than 1 year since v0.7.3, so the details are getting hazier in my memory)

I can confirm that there are many places where skill checks make a difference to the choices offered. There are also many dialogue variations that depend on previous choices.

I don't recall any specific places where there was different dialogue shown based only on a direct skill check. There may have been a few, but in general it is more indirect: buying a skill opens a new decision menu option, and by selecting that option the future story pathways/dialogue are changed.

I can't emphasize enough just how complex some of the internal structure of the scene code was getting in the 0.7.x version - there are five-ish, sometimes even more, variations in how certain scene's dialogue and events flow.

 

[Gicoo]

This thing is waste of time!

Didn't make it past the first chapter?

 

[osanaiko]

Perhaps didn't make it past 3rd grade reading level

 

[Dessolos]

A disgusting story with even worse characters.

lol that tells me either you didn't read much or you are hard to please. I thought at least 1/2 of the cast of the characters were good.

 

[cleanfeel]

I think this is one of the best games in NTR. There's really top tier writing here, but it suffers from
1) too many characters 2) too much scope

As such, the developer got bored of it and stopped updating it. The content and writing is really god tier compared to 99% of the games on this website.

 

[OnlyNeverNow]

OnlyNeverNow

I've spent 100s of hours in this game's source code while proofreading, play-testing and editing, from v0.2 to 0.7. (Having said that, it's been more than 1 year since v0.7.3, so the details are getting hazier in my memory)

I can't emphasize enough just how complex some of the internal structure of the scene code was getting in the 0.7.x version - there are five-ish, sometimes even more, variations in how certain scene's dialogue and events flow.

yeah haha thats why i asked. I took a peek in the code myself and it was overwhelming with the amount of variables and checks.

in my experience, it seems to be inconsistent through the game, there are a few spots where it checks your TOTAL mas/sen/hon/cun points that you've gotten through the whole game, and there are some spots where it just checks your CURRENT point values (which is the worse option as it may not reflect your actual playstyle if youve spent points on skills)

But its good to know there are no specific SKILL checks outside of choices, i think i will indeed just unlock all the ones i want and not stress about it in that case. thank you for the reply!

 

[osanaiko]

yeah haha thats why i asked. I took a peek in the code myself and it was overwhelming with the amount of variables and checks.

in my experience, it seems to be inconsistent through the game, there are a few spots where it checks your TOTAL mas/sen/hon/cun points that you've gotten through the whole game, and there are some spots where it just checks your CURRENT point values (which is the worse option as it may not reflect your actual playstyle if youve spent points on skills)

But its good to know there are no specific SKILL checks outside of choices, i think i will indeed just unlock all the ones i want and not stress about it in that case. thank you for the reply!

Hmm, I don't know either way about the inconsistent point-checks part, but I'll take your word for it.

In my mind there's not much value in treating it as a puzzle/grind game where you need to make perfect choices to reach the specific endings - the payoff is too far away from the place you make the choice, and the routes are very complex (as we discussed). I think the built-in "easy going" mode (whatever it's called) where you get double points is more fun to play because then you can just role-play a character and see where your choices take you, without needing to worry about metagaming the points.