VN Ren'Py Pale Carnations [Ch. 4 Up 4 Public] [Mutt & Jeff]

4.90 star(s) 474 Votes
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bacienvu88

bacienvu88

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Aug 3, 2021
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TD1900 said:
What I meant by the portion you quoted is that I recognize people by-and-large aren't looking at adult visual novels with a critical eye and that ties into understanding how someone might be okay with viewing a movie like Irreversible, but would absolutely avoid any game with the rape tag. Similar to your Pretty Woman -> Prostitution tag comparison.
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Yeah, on some level I understand. But I myself tend to look at story first and kinks second. And I can take most stuff I feel comfortable with as long as the writer tries to tell a story that makes sense about it.

If we take PC as an example. I'm not a fan of prostitution and most definitely is not into sadism like Kath is. And yet I find the game pretty good because, the subject is handled well and the problem subjects integrates into the story seamlessly. No, the problems I have are rather with how MC in particular and others to a lesser degree just accepts all that is happening at the club and mostly carrying on like all is normal.
 
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Terix3

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Aug 2, 2017
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nognub1 said:
Pale Carnations is porn, and so revolves around sexual gratification; Eyes Wide Shut, and other non-pornographic fiction does not center on sexual gratifying the viewer/reader. If someone finds a particular fetish in a porn game to be a turn-off, it's perfectly understandable that they would not want to play it. For the same reason a straight man would likely have no interest in playing a gay porn game, but would potentially have no issue in watching a movie that featured a gay couple.

Personally, I don't care about the sharing so long as it's optional.
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Partially true, while fetishes doesn't apply to non-porn media preferences still do. Straight man certainly find watching gay romance to be uncomfortable. Also while they don't have porn level sex, they do often have sex scenes/fade to black scenes even if it is not romance story. Not sure if it falls into the gratification category but i often feel those scenes are forced in just so the movie have one.

nognub1 said:
I'd say it's more about it being a porn game where the the MC is an extension of the player (we make decisions on the MC's behalf), whereas in regular porn you're just watching characters. This can give sharing scenes an unpleasant, cuckold like experience for players (at least for some). I'd also say that in regular porn stories it's more about characters who are promiscuous; not a lot of emphasis is placed on relationships and infidelity, and in cases where there is a lot of emphasis there, it is often categorised as a 'cuckold' porno -- and this is unappealing to many.

I do agree that thematically the LI's sleeping with other men can make sense, as was the case in Pretty Woman, but most people who play this game do so for sexual gratification -- the same can't be said for viewers of Pretty Woman. This does speak to a tension I see within the adult visual novel space: where creators have a hard time balancing a utilitiarian commitment to 'broadly appealing fap material' and an artistic desire to create a good story.
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bacienvu88 said:
Out of curiosity: Do you have this stance on mainstream media as well? I.e. do you refuse to watch things like Pretty Woman, Eyes Wide Shut, etc.? If not, what is the difference here?
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To put simply : different level of emotional connection. RPG games and interactive fiction have the player/viewer connect with characters the most out of all media. I don't think one inserts himself into the characters when watching movie but it is common when playing said games. To emphasize that, people have no problem with MC sleeping with prostitutes in porn or non-porn fiction but the second there is emotional investment to the character they expect exclusivity.

TD1900 said:
With how over-saturated the market is, readers can afford to be choosy.
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I find it to be the opposite - the market lacks porn games/VN that aspire to be more then a sum of their sex scenes. There are some in works but when you want good story you want it also to be complete.
 
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Poser_Voyeur

Poser_Voyeur

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Nov 14, 2020
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TD1900 said:
This is a question I've grappled with both as someone who doesn't self-insert into visual novels and as a developer of one.

I find the ways some people limit themselves based off an imprecise list of tags sans context instead of engaging with a work on its own merit peculiar, but I do understand that to most people, adult visual novels are simply a commodity. With how over-saturated the market is, readers can afford to be choosy. Personally, I think that's kinda a boring way to engage with fiction. Stories are the best tool there is to wrestle with ideas and experience uncomfortable things safely. Plus, I like the thrill of finding something new that I didn't expect I'd like.

...but at the end of the day, this is porn and not art. There isn't anything wrong with being choosy and it's understandable to want to avoid things that repulse or trigger you when what you're simply looking for is escapism.
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And the best illustration of this is this very game. I don't like BDSM and normally would nt have touched this game because of the tags. But as I said before I tried the game despite some of the tags and was incredibly (pleasantly) surprised.

I know that I will miss out on some content by virtue of not choosing all the scenes. And I am perfectly fine with that so long as the more extreme scenes are optional / based on previous choices.
 
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Turret

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Jun 23, 2017
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TD1900 said:
I find the ways some people limit themselves based off an imprecise list of tags sans context instead of engaging with a work on its own merit peculiar
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That is a correct observation and a reason why I stil test out games I might not like based on the tags. Pale Carnations is an evidence that tags are only a rough raster/help, not the end all. Some stuff depicted in PC I strongly dislike in real life, but the game is a must play as long as you can stand some events. As I wrote in an earlier post, I came to PC by pure chance and were not sure, I would like it. But I was happily surprised by Pale Carnations, which is one of the absolute best games on site!
You should not get too focused on the tags, try it out!
 
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itfod

Member
Apr 16, 2021
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dolfe67 said:
I know, what I said is to reduce the length of the thread's pages
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Ah shite. Sorry, read your post when I was exhausted last night before bed. I saw the SPOILING gets intense, sorry!

Raven Tomoe said:
More Pale Carnations FanArt hope ya'll like
You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.
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Holy shit! Beautiful! Raven Tomoe, thank you! Please do more creampies of our favorite characters, that's just amazing!
 
UnoriginalUserName

UnoriginalUserName

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Mograx

Mograx

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Oct 16, 2019
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Nemesiz691 said:
Any scenes with mc mom in these couple updates haven't play for a while
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None. If memory serves, we've only seen her old porno tapes a few times so far.

If you're asking if there will be any modern day sex scenes with her outside of her old porno tapes.. to my understanding, no, and there never will be.
 
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4.90 star(s) 474 Votes