VN Ren'Py Pale Carnations [Ch. 4 Up 4 Public] [Mutt & Jeff]

[Raven Suoh]

This game is incredible. Visually it's the best of it's kind, all the female character model's are visually pleasing. Writing is also great along with the story and characters. As someone that's not the biggest fan of extreme, sadistic, dark and ntr content this game is really amongst the best of V/N's.

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[UncleFredo]

My 3 - 3 saves with the walkthrough mod won't load. Interestingly my 3 -3 saves won't load with the modded 3 -3 update either. My assumption is that the mod has an issue and it appears I'll need to play fresh. However, I'd prefer to play 3 -4 with the walkthrough mod, even if its saves may also be compromised.

Do we know if the walkthrough mod will get updated?

 

[desmosome]

Don't worry, there's endings planned where Edwin fully embraces the club. That's kind of the whole point of the story.

It's just, while you've already made up your mind on how it's gonna end, Edwin's gotta ride the line for awhile until both possibilities (leaving or staying) can reasonably hold water. Him being 100% gung ho by week 2 would basically be splitting him into two characters and that would be a bit problematic development wise - not to mention he wouldn't have much of an arc.

I wonder how dark he can get at the end. I love the more grounded characters in this game, but the degenerate in me is hoping for a fully corrupted MC using that sex drug on all the girls and turning them into whores lol. Maybe that is going off the rails, but one ending that is full power fantasy might be cool.

 

[ename144]

I've played through the end of Chapter 3 several times now and I doubt I'll find much more without substantial effort. My expectations were mixed since I'm not really a fan of the Exhibition itself in Week 1. My feelings on the Exhibition haven't changed, but I'd say this was a very strong update despite that handicap.

We get plenty of exposition on how the Club works, which is a good start. This leads to some very interesting options for how the MC will respond to certain situations among the cast. It will take some time to see how these interactions play out, but the dilemmas seem well setup; they're a good blend of ideals and consequences that also serve to develop the characters involved. Along the way we get a lot of lewd content, but also plenty of other material as well. We also get some very nice work with Rosalind and Veronica, which is particularly welcome for me as a big fan of our resident amazon.

I'll put the rest of my thoughts in spoilers, since there's a lot to cover and I'm not always terse when covering it. Don't say you weren't warned!

Spoiler: Chapter 3, Update 4 - The Exhibition

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Spoiler: Chapter 3, Update 4 - Rosalind

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Spoiler: Chapter 3, Update 4 - Veronica

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Spoiler: Chapter 3, Update 4 - The Club

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Spoiler: Chapter 3, Update 4 - The Art

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Spoiler: Chapter 3, Update 4 - The Rest

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Okay, I think that wraps it up! Definitely a good update, lots to see even if you're not a fan of Kathleen's games. But mostly it just makes me eager to see how the next chapter will unfold!

tl;dr A good illustration of why the Exhibitions aren't my favorite parts of Pale Carnations, but also why Pale Carnations is my favorite AVN.

 

[TD1900]

I've played through the end of Chapter 3 several times now and I doubt I'll find much more without substantial effort. My expectations were mixed since I'm not really a fan of the Exhibition itself in Week 1. My feelings on the Exhibition hasn't changed, but I'd say this was a very strong update despite that handicap...

I always look forward to your takes and you don't disappoint! It's a lot and I'll have to read it again probably a couple of times to really digest it, but thank you for taking the time to compose all of that. I won't speak on anything specifically other than: that repetition in the Veronica scene was very much intentional. Not really quite a bookend to their relationship, but I hoped it would be a nice contrast.

Thanks again, ename, and I'm glad you were able to get something out of it despite it being an exhibition update.

 

[josephalex24681007]

does anybody has a previous save of the update.....i lost the entire data of my system

 

[ename144]

I always look forward to your takes and you don't disappoint! It's a lot and I'll have to read it again probably a couple of times to really digest it, but thank you for taking the time to compose all of that. I won't speak on anything specifically other than: that repetition in the Veronica scene was very much intentional. Not really quite a bookend to their relationship, but I hoped it would be a nice contrast.

Thanks again, ename, and I'm glad you were able to get something out of it despite it being an exhibition update.

As always, the pleasure is mine.

 

[MilesEdgeworth]

for me social chameleon is the most useful trait. Likely why I didnt know about Kathleens true intentions till I read here since I just got ian to bang ros

 

[Daken9]

Spoiler: Chapter 4, Update 4 - The Exhibition

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Great write up, and really agreed on this bit. If there's one critique that can be levelled towards the writing it's, i feel like, that low scores don't seem to influence much of anything throughout the story, especially when it comes to side characters.

I'm sure a low bromance score, or a low trust one, will start affecting things as we move closer to the ending, but it would have still been nice - and organic to boot - if Edwyn's disdain for Ian or Kathleen, reflected in some of the choices we can take, had already started colouring his inner monologue, if not their interaction.

Spoiler: About Rosalind

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[TD1900]

Spoiler: About Rosalind

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[name]

i wonder if the main character tasting his own batter is going to be a running gag. this is twice now it can happen. Ian and Hana poke fun at you for it even

 

[KKpotato]

i wonder if the main character tasting his own batter is going to be a running gag. this is twice now it can happen. Ian and Hana poke fun at you for it even

MC can be a True feminist sometimes

 

[Daken9]

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Also, as a late addendum and on a complete sidenote from the previous discussion, i can't praise you enough for Rosalind. It's so easy to miss all the quiet character work on her and just dismiss her as the naive mother in a tight spot, and it's so goddamn impressive how that's the point. Like, ever since i realized how hard of a hold she's got over herself and her emotions, or at least how much she utilizes the "doe-eyed" front to distance and protect herself from what she must do, it's become so difficult to tell apart when she's just paying lipservice and playing the role to when she's being actually forthright, especially because it's not like her club persona is all that different from how she really is.

No surprise this is my favorite scene of hers, with how unapologetically honest she gets for just a sec:

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All in all girl might just be the most cutthroat out of the bunch, but in a very real and relatable sort, and i fully expect a low affection/libido one to outright tell Edwyn to go fuck himself by the end of this. Which, it'd be totally deserved for the low affection. Best milf in porn.

 

[ename144]

Felicia is (in my opinion) stupid - she has the ability to meet other rich people given her connections. She has the looks and ability to seduce some rich idiot sure it went bad with her husband but there is always the next guy and given the game tries to be realistic, I think realistically she can find a suitable arrangement for herself. I think Rosie is the one who really needs to win given she is in actual physical danger. Yes her problems can be solved using money but if money was so easy to get she would not be whoring herself out like this.

I don't think Felicia is stupid by any means, but she definitely seems to be selling herself short.

Ah, yeah. I went around and around on what number would be appropriate there. It can be hard to get a good feel of what is reasonably achievable in a blind play through (which is usually my aim for these things) given all the options in the game.

Spoiler: Affection number required for the big Veronica choice

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I'd be interested in hearing how many other people found that threshold prohibitively too high.

I'm late to the party here, but I'd say that number is right on the cusp of what's possible in a run that favors Veronica but doesn't reject the premise of the club; I'm not sure if that's what you were going for or not.

It's important to note that lot of Veronica's early interactions can give you negative points with her, and not always in obvious ways. Picking Veronica as your favorite when she demos the week 1 costume is a -1 hit (-2 if you asked them to spin), whereas saying the question is stupid gives you +2 (and is only possible if you don't ask them to spin). That kind of swing makes a check like this difficult to balance.

Spoiler: Further Thoughts

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hey could some one please show me if theres a landlady in the game?

I suppose if we want to get technical Kathleen probably has at least some stake in the MC's apartment.

TD1900
Not sure if you can answer that at this point but I do wonder how you intend to deal with a possible problem that will arise after 3rd exhibition night, i.e. at this point one of the candidates/carnations might win the whole thing and 4th game won't be needed. From PC owners' POV that would be something undesirable and I would think they would try and rig the game so that they would continue for the 4th game (which means more bets and more money for the club). After all it was Kat (or rather the character you've written) who said:



So I guess one of the endings could be premature (although I doubt it since it would end things too fast and possibly spoil the story and consequences) or the "losers" could fight for a 2nd place and a 2nd prize (assuming one would be provided) or as I've said Kat could fix the 3rd game in favour of a woman who wouldn't be in the lead.

I've been assuming Kathleen would just rig the game to ensure the last place girl finishes strong in Week 3, but we'll see.

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Spoiler: MC's Thought Process

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Also, as a late addendum and on a complete sidenote from the previous discussion, i can't praise you enough for Rosalind. It's so easy to miss all the quiet character work on her and just dismiss her as the naive mother in a tight spot, and it's so goddamn impressive how that's the point. Like, ever since i realized how hard of a hold she's got over herself and her emotions, or at least how much she utilizes the "doe-eyed" front to distance and protect herself from what she must do, it's become so difficult to tell apart when she's just paying lipservice and playing the role to when she's being actually forthright, especially because it's not like her club persona is all that different from how she really is.

No surprise this is my favorite scene of hers, with how unapologetically honest she gets for just a sec:

Spoiler

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All in all girl might just be the most cutthroat out of the bunch, but in a very real and relatable sort, and i fully expect a low affection/libido one to outright tell Edwyn to go fuck himself by the end of this. Which, it'd be totally deserved for the low affection. Best milf in porn.

Agreed, love Rose. She's outwardly simple, but there's a lot going on beneath the surface to keep things that way.

 

[gregers]

I'm late to the party here, but I'd say that number is right on the cusp of what's possible in a run that favors Veronica but doesn't reject the premise of the club; I'm not sure if that's what you were going for or not.

It's important to note that lot of Veronica's early interactions can give you negative points with her, and not always in obvious ways. Picking Veronica as your favorite when she demos the week 1 costume is a -1 hit (-2 if you asked them to spin), whereas saying the question is stupid gives you +2 (and is only possible if you don't ask them to spin). That kind of swing makes a check like this difficult to balance.

Spoiler: Further Thoughts

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This encapsulates a lot of my thinking around that choice. The point about affection scores not generally being a measure of the MC's affection for another character is especially well made, I think.

And since the MC explicitly recognizes that extending an offer of friendship would be an empty gesture in any case, it seems odd to me that it is gated by an affection score.

Arguably, this could also be a place where a background trait like Social Butterfly came in to help, allowing the MC to better navigate an uncomfortable social situation.

if Veronica_Affection >= 18 or VeroFlag == True or perk_socialButterfly == True

That would make sense to me, but of course I have no idea if it fits the devs' intention for the choice. Obviously if it is supposed to be an option limited to the players who have been almost exclusively focused on building Veronica's affection to the detriment of anything else, fair enough.

 

[redknight00]

Finally got to play, I have to say this was a very packed update for the amount of time progressed in the game.

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[broken_division]

Hi there i made an android port ch3 update 4

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[Turret]

About the porn shot decision: I had few time in the last days, so I might be late to the party with two cents about that event, but here it is.
For reference, In my playthrough I play (renamed) Edwin as a nice guy (low toughness), but with some edges (he has some toughness when needed) of his own. I totally get why the option to refuse the porn shot exists and it is great it is there, but I chose to do it for several reasons.
One is roleplaying the "Social Chameleon" trait in that Edwin tries to balance how far he pushes back against the owners and how far he goes to fit in. Since his face will be obfuscated and he is not sure how rough Ian would handle Rosi, he goes through with it. It is a nice Background touch that Hana and August seem to be quite amused how this event plays out.

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Another reason for this Edwin to go through with the shot is gaining "brownie points" with Kath, Chuck and August, to have some wriggle room to refuse for really tough/sadist stuff that might come later.
A question for TD about the cumplay at the end of the shot: What is the relevance of this for Edwin? Can you tell us a bit what will happen if he does it or does not? Does he gain points with Rosi and Hana if he does or not? It was inserted for a reason, we need to know the strategic options in gameplay.

 

[vasesk]

After playing the new update without any problems , today ive tried to play with another save and now none of my old saves work . Im not using any mod.( awesome update btw)

 

[gregers]

A question for TD about the cumplay at the end of the shot: What is the relevance of this for Edwin? Can you tell us a bit what will happen if he does it or does not? Does he gain points with Rosi and Hana if he does or not? It was inserted for a reason, we need to know the strategic options in gameplay.

In the short term it increases Rosalind's sex drive and improves the performance slightly in Kathleen's eyes (+2 to
w2ExPointsRosalind and Rosalind_Libido). But the game also remembers the specific story choice (w2ExSnowball), so maybe that'll unlock further cumplay in the MC's future.

Hana and Ian make fun of the MC for it afterwards, but that's purely a dialogue variation.