Over the last four weeks it looks like TD and GIL managed to complete 226 statics, 9 animations, and pen 5936 words despite the end of year festivities. That's an average of ~57 statics, 2.3 animations, and 1484 words per week over that period, or an overall average of approximately 98 statics, 1.1 animations and 1774 words per week since work on Chapter 4 Update 2 began. Here are the charts:
As you can see, progress has been a little slow by historical norms, particularly on animations. But that's probably just a side effect of the holiday season falling in the early weeks of development; Chapter 3 Update 1 had a similar slow start around the same time of year. We should see the numbers pick up as we get back to normal. Since we still don't have a clear read on how large this particular update will be, we probably wouldn't be making particularly informed guesses about the release date anyway.
But I suppose there's no reason we can't make uninformed guesses; it's not like you guys can demand a refund. So here goes. We know the update will start with a big scene at the Club (the penalty game from the last exhibition, and presumably outlining the theme for Week 3), followed by some type of content with Mina. It's possible there will be also further content after Mina the devs simply haven't mentioned yet, but simply ignore that possibility. If we assume we're roughly halfway done with the Club content (call it another 900 statics, 10 animations and 15,000 words), and that Mina's event is roughly on par with Hana's date (ballpark 900 statics, 55 animations and maybe 20 kilowords), that would give us targets of approximately 2730 statics, 76 animations, and 35k words. That would be a bit on the large side as updates go (for statics, anyway), but certainly plausible.
If we next assume a rate relatively in-line with a sustainable historical average going forward (something like 115 statics, 4 animations and 2200 words per week), we'd be wrapping things up around the end of April for the artwork, but words would be finished in early March. That's probably a decent back-of-the-envelope estimate for a release window, so we'll go with that. The next update will definitely be released sometime in March or April! (plus or minus about 4 months)
I've had this thought rattling in my head for a while now but I've decided against sharing it here... until now. If this comes off as cringe, sorry.
As a preamble, I'm a huge sucker for harem/"getting ALL the girls" content/paths. I know, I know Pale Carnations isn't necessarily meant to be that (at least afaik) and I'm NOT saying the game should completely change course just to cater to me and my specific fetishes. This is one of those rare gems of a game that is just of such incredible quality that I'll love it even if I have to suffer through group/sharing content that I don't like.
But the thing is my idea makes sense within the game and what it has established. And again, not saying the games direction or whatever has to change if this doesn't fit, but at least I want to throw out a suggestion of a possible, alternative path, maybe, or an alternative ending, or something. Basically I just think the idea makes too much sense not to at least share here. Maybe parts of it are things the developer is already planning on and that's why they make so much sense.
So basically, my idea is just about how the games story could develop to where we basically get to keep all the carnations for ourselves and remove the losers from the obligation of becoming "just" another whore, and maybe free any of the other girls from that fate that wants it as well. But how could that possibly make sense in the story?
Well basically, the people with positions of real power in the club are August, Charles and Kathleen, right? Hana is expected to start taking over from August, it's been hinted that Charles had hoped Killian would inherit his role but he hasn't showed himself to be of the right caliber. So then, if the MC convinces Killian to take charge of his life and go to Uni (like his Mother has already asked us to convince him to) and with how Charles basically already sees the MC as part of the family, it should be fairly easy with Killian out of the picture to get Charles to see us as the logical heir to his role. Hana is going to inherit August's role and we already have the possibility of having a great relationship with her, and maybe even have Hana be a little bit deferential to us. That just leaves Kathleen which certainly isn't someone the MC can overtly control but we already have every chance of having impressed her many times already and with the right development she certainly would at least listen to our ideas.
So then, if all this comes true that would mean it'll eventually be the MC, Hana and Kathleen who are in control of the club instead, whenever August and Charles steps down for health reasons or whatever else. That changes everything. Hana already doesn't like how the girls are treated and Kathleen has certainly showed a great deal of loathing for all the male patrons of the club who do not show her enough respect (even if she doesn't have an overabundance of love and care for the girls, per se). To me, all this points to the possibility of a route where the MC not only gets to have a large degree of influence over the future of the club, if we play Hana and Kathleen right (and playing people, even the people we like, is already a core theme in Pale Carnations and a stated conflict in the head of the MC) it leaves the doors wide open for us to change the club completely. Rather than rely on prostitution the club could change to where most of the girls in the club are just high-end strippers instead. Sure, it would take some convincing of the clientele but they are ultimately not in charge and the club would still serve just as well as the meeting spot for the same elites, the entertainment would just be limited to a VIEWING experience instead. And the girls would be free to "belong" to the MC without any interruption. Maybe even make the MC fucking the club girls as part of the viewing experience, but limit it at that.
Veronica and Rosalind wouldn't have to be full prostitutes in case they lost and if Felicia won she would benefit from being a full member of a club that Kathleen had much more power to make respectful of female members. Additionally I can already see before me such scenes as a threesome with Hana and Harper etc. Basically this would also be the route for the players who actually care about the club girls and don't want to see them disgraced and basically mistreated as they often are now, but still want to have sex with them.
So yeah, maybe that's a wild idea, but I think it makes sense. And to be clear, I'm not advocating that this would be the ONLY path in the game, just one path among all the others that would make sense. And obviously I'm not EXPECTING any of this to happen, of course the developer doesn't OWE me anything like this. I simply think it would be an awesome way for the story to develop and if it happens to appeal to the developer, if they aren't already planning something like this, then that's all it is.
I've had this thought rattling in my head for a while now but I've decided against sharing it here... until now. If this comes off as cringe, sorry.
As a preamble, I'm a huge sucker for harem/"getting ALL the girls" content/paths. I know, I know Pale Carnations isn't necessarily meant to be that (at least afaik) and I'm NOT saying the game should completely change course just to cater to me and my specific fetishes. This is one of those rare gems of a game that is just of such incredible quality that I'll love it even if I have to suffer through group/sharing content that I don't like.
But the thing is my idea makes sense within the game and what it has established. And again, not saying the games direction or whatever has to change if this doesn't fit, but at least I want to throw out a suggestion of a possible, alternative path, maybe, or an alternative ending, or something. Basically I just think the idea makes too much sense not to at least share here. Maybe parts of it are things the developer is already planning on and that's why they make so much sense.
So basically, my idea is just about how the games story could develop to where we basically get to keep all the carnations for ourselves and remove the losers from the obligation of becoming "just" another whore, and maybe free any of the other girls from that fate that wants it as well. But how could that possibly make sense in the story?
Well basically, the people with positions of real power in the club are August, Charles and Kathleen, right? Hana is expected to start taking over from August, it's been hinted that Charles had hoped Killian would inherit his role but he hasn't showed himself to be of the right caliber. So then, if the MC convinces Killian to take charge of his life and go to Uni (like his Mother has already asked us to convince him to) and with how Charles basically already sees the MC as part of the family, it should be fairly easy with Killian out of the picture to get Charles to see us as the logical heir to his role. Hana is going to inherit August's role and we already have the possibility of having a great relationship with her, and maybe even have Hana be a little bit deferential to us. That just leaves Kathleen which certainly isn't someone the MC can overtly control but we already have every chance of having impressed her many times already and with the right development she certainly would at least listen to our ideas.
So then, if all this comes true that would mean it'll eventually be the MC, Hana and Kathleen who are in control of the club instead, whenever August and Charles steps down for health reasons or whatever else. That changes everything. Hana already doesn't like how the girls are treated and Kathleen has certainly showed a great deal of loathing for all the male patrons of the club who do not show her enough respect (even if she doesn't have an overabundance of love and care for the girls, per se). To me, all this points to the possibility of a route where the MC not only gets to have a large degree of influence over the future of the club, if we play Hana and Kathleen right (and playing people, even the people we like, is already a core theme in Pale Carnations and a stated conflict in the head of the MC) it leaves the doors wide open for us to change the club completely. Rather than rely on prostitution the club could change to where most of the girls in the club are just high-end strippers instead. Sure, it would take some convincing of the clientele but they are ultimately not in charge and the club would still serve just as well as the meeting spot for the same elites, the entertainment would just be limited to a VIEWING experience instead. And the girls would be free to "belong" to the MC without any interruption. Maybe even make the MC fucking the club girls as part of the viewing experience, but limit it at that.
Veronica and Rosalind wouldn't have to be full prostitutes in case they lost and if Felicia won she would benefit from being a full member of a club that Kathleen had much more power to make respectful of female members. Additionally I can already see before me such scenes as a threesome with Hana and Harper etc. Basically this would also be the route for the players who actually care about the club girls and don't want to see them disgraced and basically mistreated as they often are now, but still want to have sex with them.
So yeah, maybe that's a wild idea, but I think it makes sense. And to be clear, I'm not advocating that this would be the ONLY path in the game, just one path among all the others that would make sense. And obviously I'm not EXPECTING any of this to happen, of course the developer doesn't OWE me anything like this. I simply think it would be an awesome way for the story to develop and if it happens to appeal to the developer, if they aren't already planning something like this, then that's all it is.
only having the mc fuck girls would be horrible for the club, if i was a patron i would leave, its total scam from what it started out as, it puts so many restrictions on what could be done to degrade the girls, seems like youre trying to get a vanilla or harem ending in a not so vanilla game
only having the mc fuck girls would be horrible for the club, if i was a patron i would leave, its total scam from what it started out as, it puts so many restrictions on what could be done to degrade the girls, seems like youre trying to get a vanilla or harem ending in a not so vanilla game
The primary reason for the club existing isn't actually prostitution, because people can get prostitutes anywhere. It primarily serves as a meeting place for sleazy corrupt people to talk freely. What the club serves as entertainment is kind of secondary.
Besides there has already been several scenes where most of the entertainment consisted of either the MC or Kathleen fucking/manhandling the carnations, it's safe to say there's an interest in that but most of it would in this hypothetical consist of variations of stripshows, but ones that would cater to all kinds of fetishes.
And yes, I don't like degrading the girls, not beyond just a little bit anyway. The game already explicitly supports players who aren't into the worst degrading scenes so it would make perfect sense for there to be a path/ending that supports this as well. Just because the game supports heavy degrading and you're into that doesn't mean it can't also have a more vanilla path. I'm not trying to argue for your preferred playstyle to get any cut in content so it would be nice if you'd be the same.
only having the mc fuck girls would be horrible for the club, if i was a patron i would leave, its total scam from what it started out as, it puts so many restrictions on what could be done to degrade the girls, seems like youre trying to get a vanilla or harem ending in a not so vanilla game
Yea, that's the problem with MrJay's plan. Sure, if through shrewd political maneuvering, MC becomes the shot-caller at the Carnation Club, at the end of the day, it's still a business. As the effective head of the club, he'd have the opportunity to run the thing into the ground, and August's mafia friends would have an opportunity to set up a rival club that caters to the tastes of the sick fucks that previously enjoyed the services of the Carnation Club. Without August in the picture, the Cosa Nostra would probably have no reservations about doing so, they'd stop supplying the Club with new girls, and would probably recruit or recall the girls that are already at the club. The house girls, now working as strippers so making dramatically less money, which is motivating factor for many, are easily persuaded to jump ship.
Also, I don't imagine that a rug-pull like this would go over well with corrupt police chiefs and politicians either. MC would not only be killing the business that he just acquired the power to run, but also making a lot of powerful enemies in the same stroke.
Whiteknighting and harem-building sounds nice, but the economics just don't work out in this case.
I've had this thought rattling in my head for a while now but I've decided against sharing it here... until now. If this comes off as cringe, sorry.
As a preamble, I'm a huge sucker for harem/"getting ALL the girls" content/paths. I know, I know Pale Carnations isn't necessarily meant to be that (at least afaik) and I'm NOT saying the game should completely change course just to cater to me and my specific fetishes. This is one of those rare gems of a game that is just of such incredible quality that I'll love it even if I have to suffer through group/sharing content that I don't like.
But the thing is my idea makes sense within the game and what it has established. And again, not saying the games direction or whatever has to change if this doesn't fit, but at least I want to throw out a suggestion of a possible, alternative path, maybe, or an alternative ending, or something. Basically I just think the idea makes too much sense not to at least share here. Maybe parts of it are things the developer is already planning on and that's why they make so much sense.
So basically, my idea is just about how the games story could develop to where we basically get to keep all the carnations for ourselves and remove the losers from the obligation of becoming "just" another whore, and maybe free any of the other girls from that fate that wants it as well. But how could that possibly make sense in the story?
Well basically, the people with positions of real power in the club are August, Charles and Kathleen, right? Hana is expected to start taking over from August, it's been hinted that Charles had hoped Killian would inherit his role but he hasn't showed himself to be of the right caliber. So then, if the MC convinces Killian to take charge of his life and go to Uni (like his Mother has already asked us to convince him to) and with how Charles basically already sees the MC as part of the family, it should be fairly easy with Killian out of the picture to get Charles to see us as the logical heir to his role. Hana is going to inherit August's role and we already have the possibility of having a great relationship with her, and maybe even have Hana be a little bit deferential to us. That just leaves Kathleen which certainly isn't someone the MC can overtly control but we already have every chance of having impressed her many times already and with the right development she certainly would at least listen to our ideas.
So then, if all this comes true that would mean it'll eventually be the MC, Hana and Kathleen who are in control of the club instead, whenever August and Charles steps down for health reasons or whatever else. That changes everything. Hana already doesn't like how the girls are treated and Kathleen has certainly showed a great deal of loathing for all the male patrons of the club who do not show her enough respect (even if she doesn't have an overabundance of love and care for the girls, per se). To me, all this points to the possibility of a route where the MC not only gets to have a large degree of influence over the future of the club, if we play Hana and Kathleen right (and playing people, even the people we like, is already a core theme in Pale Carnations and a stated conflict in the head of the MC) it leaves the doors wide open for us to change the club completely. Rather than rely on prostitution the club could change to where most of the girls in the club are just high-end strippers instead. Sure, it would take some convincing of the clientele but they are ultimately not in charge and the club would still serve just as well as the meeting spot for the same elites, the entertainment would just be limited to a VIEWING experience instead. And the girls would be free to "belong" to the MC without any interruption. Maybe even make the MC fucking the club girls as part of the viewing experience, but limit it at that.
Veronica and Rosalind wouldn't have to be full prostitutes in case they lost and if Felicia won she would benefit from being a full member of a club that Kathleen had much more power to make respectful of female members. Additionally I can already see before me such scenes as a threesome with Hana and Harper etc. Basically this would also be the route for the players who actually care about the club girls and don't want to see them disgraced and basically mistreated as they often are now, but still want to have sex with them.
So yeah, maybe that's a wild idea, but I think it makes sense. And to be clear, I'm not advocating that this would be the ONLY path in the game, just one path among all the others that would make sense. And obviously I'm not EXPECTING any of this to happen, of course the developer doesn't OWE me anything like this. I simply think it would be an awesome way for the story to develop and if it happens to appeal to the developer, if they aren't already planning something like this, then that's all it is.
There's about one way I can see this game ending up with a pseudo-harem at the end, and it could even be relatively vanilla (by this game's satndards). Yours is somewhat close, but too much wish fulfilment imho.
Treat the carnations well, support them with their goals, and corrupt them enough. Only enter into casual/Fuckbuddy relationships with Hana and Mina.
Work against Kathleen in the club, take over her portion of the club while Hana takes Augusts' and Killian (if you reform him) takes over from Chuck. This allows you to treat the club girls better and cut down on the abuse by patrons. Club girls will be willing parts of your "harem", but there's no way you can stop prostitution at the club. That's wishful thinking.
Now, since you treated the carnations well, and corrupted them enough sexually, they might just continue being your fuckbuddies even after leaving the club. Or even slave, depending on which route you take (Rosalind). They'll have trouble finding someone who can satisfy them in bed after what they went through, and if they like you well enough you'd be an obvious option.
Could even see romance options for Felicia and/or Mina on this path. They're both kinky enough that they could be fine with you fucking other people even if you're romantically involved with them. Felicia moreso than Mina.
There isn't going to be a true romantic harem in this game. It's way too grounded in realism for that.
I've had this thought rattling in my head for a while now but I've decided against sharing it here... until now. If this comes off as cringe, sorry.
As a preamble, I'm a huge sucker for harem/"getting ALL the girls" content/paths. I know, I know Pale Carnations isn't necessarily meant to be that (at least afaik) and I'm NOT saying the game should completely change course just to cater to me and my specific fetishes. This is one of those rare gems of a game that is just of such incredible quality that I'll love it even if I have to suffer through group/sharing content that I don't like.
But the thing is my idea makes sense within the game and what it has established. And again, not saying the games direction or whatever has to change if this doesn't fit, but at least I want to throw out a suggestion of a possible, alternative path, maybe, or an alternative ending, or something. Basically I just think the idea makes too much sense not to at least share here. Maybe parts of it are things the developer is already planning on and that's why they make so much sense.
So basically, my idea is just about how the games story could develop to where we basically get to keep all the carnations for ourselves and remove the losers from the obligation of becoming "just" another whore, and maybe free any of the other girls from that fate that wants it as well. But how could that possibly make sense in the story?
Well basically, the people with positions of real power in the club are August, Charles and Kathleen, right? Hana is expected to start taking over from August, it's been hinted that Charles had hoped Killian would inherit his role but he hasn't showed himself to be of the right caliber. So then, if the MC convinces Killian to take charge of his life and go to Uni (like his Mother has already asked us to convince him to) and with how Charles basically already sees the MC as part of the family, it should be fairly easy with Killian out of the picture to get Charles to see us as the logical heir to his role. Hana is going to inherit August's role and we already have the possibility of having a great relationship with her, and maybe even have Hana be a little bit deferential to us. That just leaves Kathleen which certainly isn't someone the MC can overtly control but we already have every chance of having impressed her many times already and with the right development she certainly would at least listen to our ideas.
So then, if all this comes true that would mean it'll eventually be the MC, Hana and Kathleen who are in control of the club instead, whenever August and Charles steps down for health reasons or whatever else. That changes everything. Hana already doesn't like how the girls are treated and Kathleen has certainly showed a great deal of loathing for all the male patrons of the club who do not show her enough respect (even if she doesn't have an overabundance of love and care for the girls, per se). To me, all this points to the possibility of a route where the MC not only gets to have a large degree of influence over the future of the club, if we play Hana and Kathleen right (and playing people, even the people we like, is already a core theme in Pale Carnations and a stated conflict in the head of the MC) it leaves the doors wide open for us to change the club completely. Rather than rely on prostitution the club could change to where most of the girls in the club are just high-end strippers instead. Sure, it would take some convincing of the clientele but they are ultimately not in charge and the club would still serve just as well as the meeting spot for the same elites, the entertainment would just be limited to a VIEWING experience instead. And the girls would be free to "belong" to the MC without any interruption. Maybe even make the MC fucking the club girls as part of the viewing experience, but limit it at that.
Veronica and Rosalind wouldn't have to be full prostitutes in case they lost and if Felicia won she would benefit from being a full member of a club that Kathleen had much more power to make respectful of female members. Additionally I can already see before me such scenes as a threesome with Hana and Harper etc. Basically this would also be the route for the players who actually care about the club girls and don't want to see them disgraced and basically mistreated as they often are now, but still want to have sex with them.
So yeah, maybe that's a wild idea, but I think it makes sense. And to be clear, I'm not advocating that this would be the ONLY path in the game, just one path among all the others that would make sense. And obviously I'm not EXPECTING any of this to happen, of course the developer doesn't OWE me anything like this. I simply think it would be an awesome way for the story to develop and if it happens to appeal to the developer, if they aren't already planning something like this, then that's all it is.
The primary reason for the club existing isn't actually prostitution, because people can get prostitutes anywhere. It primarily serves as a meeting place for sleazy corrupt people to talk freely. What the club serves as entertainment is kind of secondary.
Besides there has already been several scenes where most of the entertainment consisted of either the MC or Kathleen fucking/manhandling the carnations, it's safe to say there's an interest in that but most of it would in this hypothetical consist of variations of stripshows, but ones that would cater to all kinds of fetishes.
And yes, I don't like degrading the girls, not beyond just a little bit anyway. The game already explicitly supports players who aren't into the worst degrading scenes so it would make perfect sense for there to be a path/ending that supports this as well. Just because the game supports heavy degrading and you're into that doesn't mean it can't also have a more vanilla path. I'm not trying to argue for your preferred playstyle to get any cut in content so it would be nice if you'd be the same.
Hi!
Please do not take it the wrong way, but your scenario would be simple wishfullfilling and will never happen like this.
A major point in game which TD mentioned several times already is the choice to stay with the Club or leave it. so no matter if it becomes a good or bad ending, if you stay with the Club you are invested to make it a success. And your idea won´t be one.
Another important point is that Hana´s problem in the club is the willful abuse of the girls done by Kath and the neglect of some problems by August and Chuck. She has no problems with prostitution as a job at all. There is a reason Hana says one time she wished all the girls in the club were like Feli. Felicia is in the club by her own choice and mostly has fun. Granted there are things she does not like, even hates, but generally she has fun.
I think one of the goodish endings might be a PC with Hana, Edwin and Killian (maybe even August still in some control or Sophia and Abel on board) as the "head honchos", where the house girls are treated right, but the Club stays fully in business. Depending on how you go about it, it might be possible that the Carnarions moonlight as "parttimers" in the Club beyond the competition.
Y'all motherfuckers trying to get rid of Kat, but realistically the only harem possible here is if Edwin uses her help to turn all girls into his brainwashed playthings.
The KEY for success in novelism is... TRUE love and care not only about personages (no matter how filthy they are) but for humanity itself. And... this is IT!
Y'all motherfuckers trying to get rid of Kat, but realistically the only harem possible here is if Edwin uses her help to turn all girls into his brainwashed playthings.
I think the Carnations meeting for lunch every week is doing more than you may realize in that regard. Sure, it doesn't make sense for the story to have a harem as written, but I'm just saying that there's another avenue to theoretically pursue where Edwin is their point of familiar commonality... so, all he would really have to do is convince Hana (who's already into Mina, probably) to watch him fuck Carnations and house girls while she jills off... as Bill Burr says, "well, you've already started the luge, it's goin'...".
I do recall seeing some videos with camera graphic overlays at around that time period (though not a running timestamp, now that I think of it). The early aughts was when all the older videos were starting to get digitized, so these sorts of timestamps had been emblematic of digitized amateur content and staged porn always needs a veneer of authenticity. But I don't have any saved examples and I'm not sure how I'd search for them easily, so it's certainly possible my memory is wrong.
Here i am a bit confused, because the shoot i claim to be raw footage is the second, the 'yellow' one and it doesn't display another camera in the ingame pictures so i am pretty sure i didn't say we see a camera there (just checked my post again, and no, didn't say that).
However, what i did, was explaining the much higher visual quality of the chronologically set-in-between doggystyle picture with the ingame use of a second, digital camera offscreen. We players know why this picture has a better quality: because it is from a much later update.
If trying to explain how this visual inconsistency could have happened ingame comes back to bite me in the ass, i'll gladly drop my idea of a second camera in this shot, and state it was all recorded with just one, who miraculously improved its quality in the close-up of the doggy. There is no second digital camera.
My 'proof' for being raw footage relies not on a second camera, but on the presence of the timestamps in Edwins available video, which he watches on his computer and not on his also available TV set, like he does with his mothers casting video. So i assumed he pulled it from the internet to which it was posted by an unknown source. He very likely doesn't own this footage on DVD, like his mothers casting, because nowadays DVD drives for desktop PCs have become rare, and a physics student probably doesn't use an ancient personal computer. Double that if Victoria is telling the truth about her age, because this would mean the current ingame year is 2023 or 2024.
Explaining this occurence with faux-BTS footage and being a semi-amateur video with an unpolished feel works of course too.
(if they are really a thing)
I see, you're saying the MC has a DVD-equivalent without timestamps and an MP3-equivalent with them? Maybe, but I think it's a lot more likely the MC's TV is hooked up to play MP3-type files. We know Mina's TV has that capability (she found Killian's video on "a random USB" and Felicia shows it to the MC on her TV).
I'm also skeptical the MC would have a physical disc of the scene; it's not impossible, but it would have been hard for him to obtain it surreptitiously at the time, and hard to source it years after the fact (unless it was from a particularly solvent porn studio, but that's not the feel of the vid IMHO).
According to your math above 2009 + 14 years or 15 years would get us 2023 or 2024 as the current ingame year.
I'll try to show now, why i believe this is wrong.
So even if you don't follow my last two clues, the years 2018, 2019 or 2020 are backed by much more ingame information, than a single statement of a person, who
is reluctant to reveal personal information in a porn video, like she tried with her real name
is probably embarrassed to start doing porn at her age, especially if you cross-reference this with Rosies statement about her own age: "That's right. I'm practically over the hill for this kind of thing, aren't i?"
and lead to kinda awkward future 2023 (not anymore, though) or 2024 as the current ingame year.
However, if you think my proposed years are valid, it's clear that Victoria is lying about her age, with further consequences. Like for example that now her 'debut' age is close to 36 which is incidentally Rosies age. Again coincidence? I don't think so.
I had forgotten the 2017 notice on the old Exhibition footage. That does seem like a solid starting point to estimate the current year from. (The placard at the start of the game is valid evidence too, but games sometimes try to keep current action contemporary, so I trust it less.)
So I'll agree Victoria is likely lying about her age, and would make the MC's age at the time of the videos ~11. (Which seems to line up with the apparent age of the MC when he steals from the school/videos the neighbors/burns down a shed, interestingly.)
Do i? Apart from from her probably five years older age? Which means she didn't started just after her husbands death?
Well,
is conveniently vague enough to literally span any duration (what is brief in Edwins book?) at nearly any point in time between his father's death and the current ingame year, as long as it includes 2009 and 2010.
It's a bit like saying: "The second world war took place during the twentieth century." Which is obviously not wrong, but of limited explanatory power.
I agree, but AFAIK it's all we really have to compare it to. I certainly read it as being 'soon' after his father's death, but I guess it doesn't have to be. Subjectively it probably depends on how long it took for their financial situation to stabilize; if they were living hand to mouth for, say, a decade, I could see the MC lumping all that time together as "after my father died." The more restricting point is that her time in porn was "brief," but as you say that's pretty vague.
My larger point, however, was that the MC is a relatively smart guy and he's clearly investigated all this on his own: he must have, since we know he's never talked to Victoria about it directly. If he's managed to track down the videos, I think there are good odds he has a better idea than we do just when Victoria's career started and ended, and how that ties in to his memories. Thus I trust that his summary to Hana is accurate even if it is overly broad.
Doesn't change the fact, that a GP, even if they start 10 years later due their prolonged educational needs and their higher study debts, catches up and surpasses those engineers and physicist in roughly 13 years, probably even faster if they are self-employed. After that they are still earning more than them for like 20 years. Income-wise GP is the better option in the long run.
But it's not just that you start later, you also have to pay more. Medicine has a negative income for the first few years after college. And it's notoriously competitive, at least in the US. Now we know the MC is driven, so I can see him betting on himself. But he's also coldly rational, so he must know that if he doesn't make the cut the situation will be that much worse, moneywise.
I don't think we can take it for granted that the MC wants to become a doctor for the money (though the money is clearly not lost on him).
AFAIK that's the flavour text if you choose the "Helping People" motivation at the start of the game.
If you choose "Money" as motivation it's
"As they say... money isn't everything, but not having it is. Growing up watching your mother try and scrape by, you understand that as well as everyone. (...) You are fundamentally concerned with the pursuit and accumulation of wealth."
No, I thought he discussed it with one of the girls at some point. But I can't remember where and I don't have time to see if I can find it at the moment.
Ehh, what?
Except the tarantula which exploits Veronicas phobia and i personally believe is just a tiny tad above what Victoria endured, the other two incidents are magnitudes tamer.
A fake interview? In which you can choose how far it goes? With a certified slut who gets off on it? Really?
And some photos showing quick flashes of boobs and pussy in a public place? Fucking on a toilet or groping in a secluded tunnel? This is stuff a lot of normal, vanilla people do to bring a little spice to their sexlife. There was no porno shoot on a public lawn inside the park.
I don't see how this relates in any way to above topic. We know that she is dangerous, but that's not part of her usual routine.
She doesn't have a whole dungeon full of her former 'toys' lined up for testing. This wouldn't go unnoticed by her companions.
I think you're focusing on the sex acts alone rather than the larger picture. Recording what's effectively a porno right under Elias' nose is threatening Felicia's livelihood in a very direct manner. Likewise, Rosalind getting caught being publicly indecent in an area very close to her home is threatening to expose her antics to her daughter's peers, which is undoubtedly Rose's greatest fear about being a Carnation (obviously gangsters hurting her daughter is her single biggest fear).
That's not to say Victoria didn't have a miserable experience; she did. But that it was very much the miserable experience she signed up for, whereas Kathleen goes out of her way to make the experience much worse than the girls intended. And that's just the Carnations. I'm completely ignoring the way house girls can suffer life-threatening injuries without anyone (in management) really caring.
Sorry for the delay responding, BTW. There's a lot to cover and I had some other stuff that needed doing, too.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again: I love these exchanges with ename144 and selberdreher. These guys are true fans. Such thought and detail go into these posts. Reading their theories and reasoning is almost as much fun as reading Pale Carnations itself.
I do recall seeing some videos with camera graphic overlays at around that time period (though not a running timestamp, now that I think of it). The early aughts was when all the older videos were starting to get digitized, so these sorts of timestamps had been emblematic of digitized amateur content and staged porn always needs a veneer of authenticity. But I don't have any saved examples and I'm not sure how I'd search for them easily, so it's certainly possible my memory is wrong.
Just a quick answer, because i am working on a longer post.
Pale Carnation is eerily close to our real world, so close, that the events depicted 'could' have happened in ours.
We often refer to 'our' real world, because i think we can agree, it's meant to be a realistic story and it does a stellar job so far for being a smut game. No starships warping space with the use of dilithium.
However, it isn't our world or reality, it's not a documentary of real incidents, there is no covid in PCs world and no Morehead Hills in ours.
So i can easily go along with your proposal, since it's not that far off, it 'could' have been a thing in PCs aughts.
I was just curious, because i was looking through stuff like backroom casting couch, Ed Power's castings, czech castings, Woodman castings, exploited college girls or those clips in which an alleged shoplifter tries to wiggle her way out. BTS stuff from early GGG videos, desperate housewives etc.
Only woodman has a still image at the beginning of his shots; stating name, location and date of the casting, no running timestamps, though.
If you would ever happen to run into some of those shots again, i would be certainly interested to get a link or a studio name.
And leaving this specific issue aside, your reminder that porn shoots are being most of the time staged, is definetly something to take into account when talking about Victorias'. I'll keep that in mind when i am reviewing them (but tbh i believe i already did, like Victorias staged porn talk during the doggy). My posts are often already so big, if i would spell out every other possible explanation for a specific scene, i would probably annoy my readers even more than i already do. I leave bringing those other possibilities up to you guys.
Please note, i am not the pope, i'm not decreeing infallible truths, the only real authority regarding PCs story is of course TD1900.
I am just offering myinterpretation of the currently available content, because i am interested in your views on it.
see, you're saying the MC has a DVD-equivalent without timestamps and an MP3-equivalent with them? Maybe, but I think it's a lot more likely the MC's TV is hooked up to play MP3-type files. We know Mina's TV has that capability (she found Killian's video on "a random USB" and Felicia shows it to the MC on her TV).
I'm also skeptical the MC would have a physical disc of the scene; it's not impossible, but it would have been hard for him to obtain it surreptitiously at the time, and hard to source it years after the fact (unless it was from a particularly solvent porn studio, but that's not the feel of the vid IMHO).
Damn, i'll never get to write that other post.
My idea was like: he has the 'yellow' one with timestamps -for whatever reason- as a file (.avi .mpeg .flv, whatever) sitting on his desktop pc because he watches it there in the very first scene of PC and the date is visible on his monitor. There is also a TV in his old apartment, but -for whatever reason- he sits at his computer.
The 'grey' casting video, however, shows no timestamps on his TV screen, while Edwin watches it in his new livingroom after the first exhibition.
Regarding the physical DVD, it's not canon, but TD1900 left us this easteregg in the game files:
I tried to factor that in with those 13 years, but it was late and a made a rough estimate.
Lets see: 23 x 72.000$ = 1.656.000$, +25% income gain from his career = 2.070.000$ total for engineer. After 23 years.
GP: 6 x -60.000$ + 4 x residency salary ~ 63.000$ + 13 x 230.000$ (no income gain) = 2.882.000$. After 10 years of education and 13 in practice. Looks like the break-even point could be reached even earlier?
Not that it really matters, in the long run GP will outperform engineer or physicist, normally.
No, I thought he discussed it with one of the girls at some point. But I can't remember where and I don't have time to see if I can find it at the moment.
I think i faintly remember something like that in his first meeting with Dr.Abel? Not sure, though. You could be right.
Anyway, we should also take into account that "Helping People" has has a much higher social desirability than plainly saying: "I'm doing it for the money." Most people don't like to reveal stuff about themselves, if it could shed a bad light unto them.
I have another qualm with this though. Let's say he really and full-heartedly wants to become a GP.
Do you really believe it would be because "I liked how the doctors tried to help and cared for my father, it was a great comfort for my mother."
Do you really believe the first thing which comes to the mind of a 6+ year old child is "Wow, those docs were great, i don't mind my dead father, i want to become just like them. Look how not-sad my mom is now"?
Pfff, my ass. They tried and failed. He died, those doctors sucked. This whole mess after that would never have happened, if they would have been doing their job right, right?
Whereas, what if Edwin would be able to help back then, what if he was one of those doctors, could he have made a difference?
Edwin wouldn't be the first person to enter a security, care or social profession after experiencing something traumatic in which they had no agency.
The policeman whose uncle was shot in a mugging, the social-worker with an alcoholic father or the medical scientist whose sister fell victim to cancer.
