VN Ren'Py Completed Playing with Fire [v1.0.4] [HighbornTiger]

[Crimsonfiend76]

I want to play this but reading the threads here, not liking the dual male protags and mutually exclusive LIs. If the Dev wants to experiment by having multiple playable protag paths...in theory that's great but all it will do is extend the time between updates unnecessarily, especially when multiple LIs are involved.

Secondly, I also agree if you are going with multiple protags...say the best friend character, then there should be a choice to pick what girl he ends up with (ideally any LI the MC does not want) otherwise its just going to lead to more frustration. I'll be honest, I have just enough interest playing through one protag's path, I really couldn't give a shit in seeing my friend's own story/love life. That's something that should be saved for offscreen where I can choose not to see it until the epilogue. I get where there will always be additional story seen through the PoV of other characters, but they really should have saved that idea for a sequel where the player can this time play through that characters path.

 

[JollyGeorgieM]

i have to agree. one of my issues is introducing a girl like chloe into this game and not letting us have her. and as a result making me hate the other male protag.

100% this.
Normal stories its okay to have other characters with their own romantic interests but its quite another to introduce a potential love interest, get people intrigued, and then have to find out oh, she's for the other guy... it just breeds contempt for Daniel.
Best to separate the story/limit the other characters until its their time to shine with their man.

That said, i liek the game overall, but some things bother me very much... first of all, the other male (Daniel) in the game, there is introduced chloe (to me the hottest girl in the game, just from the looks) and we cant go for her, and instead the MC throws her to daniel... moah... why? The multiple protag tag shows to me that it is intended that we will play him too... well... no, please dont do that.

Derek (currently operating under the pseudonym "Daniel") is extra intolerable as a second mc because he frequently uses his invasive mind-reading on the first mc... a.k.a. us. Bad enough he gets a free pass into all the girls' minds (except Chloe, apparently, but boohoo for him that he can't get a proper read on one person out of everyone). As I played I increasingly felt resistant to interacting with "Daniel" because I knew what he was doing, resented it, and ultimately came away feeling manipulated. Worse, the game made me feel powerless to stop it, which really sours the mood. How many times does our mc say "Oh, I don't know why but I think I like this guy!"? No, in fact I don't. Not one bit. And I didn't even realize "Daniel" was gatekeeping some LIs because I went for Jenny first. (sidenote: Hahn81 respectfully agree to disagree regarding your incest hot-take. The patch does make sense and it is not equally taboo to bang your... roommate? Whatever Jenny is without the patch. That's got nothing on banging your sister, man. At least, imo. But we're 100% on the same page with the "Daniel" problem).

Spoiler: Examples of "Daniel" fucking with the first MC:

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There's more, but you get the point. "Daniel" doesn't just use his mind reading to manipulate what could have been LIs, he also does it TO YOU. He would probably say something like "I can't turn it off." Well, I don't care. GO AWAY, "DANIEL." I was this annoyed with the guy and I only interacted with him a handful of times, none of them confrontational. How bad would it be if we had direct conflict? But in fact we do - it's just between the player and "Daniel" instead of the mc and Daniel. I believe the primary reason, aside from loathing his manipulation we can't do anything about, is as my esteemed colleagues have stated: rather than sharing the spotlight, the way this game feels to play is there's some other guy trying to steal your status as the main character (and all your LIs with it). It isn't a friendly dynamic, no matter how much the game tries to cram that down your throat. Because let's be real here: who sounds like an actual mc? The new guy in town with a mysterious past and a mysterious power, pursued by mysterious forces? Or the dude who used to be super cool but got tired of it and is now just pretty cool ( )? Yeah. We're the second guy, but the first guy was given the story. So now we either wallow in irrelevance - no player's choice - or we push back... except we can't, by the dev's choice. Lose-lose.

TL;DR: The dev made us Steve. We therefore care about Steve. Thus, as Steve, I would really love to kick "Daniel's" fucking ass: you can read my mind, you prick, but just because you know what's coming doesn't mean you can stop it from happening.

Ultimately though, I expect nothing will change here, guys. The dev wanted to make the game this way. They've put considerable effort into it already. At this point, I wouldn't expect any dev to take feedback like this in stride and roll on all the plans they had, regardless of whether we make a compelling case for it or not. So... I think we're stuck with "Daniel". Which is a pity. I think you all were right that he (or either mc, really) definitely would have worked better in an entirely separate game.

 

[YogSothoth1982]

Derek (currently operating under the pseudonym "Daniel") is extra intolerable as a second mc because he frequently uses his invasive mind-reading on the first mc... a.k.a. us. Bad enough he gets a free pass into all the girls' minds (except Chloe, apparently, but boohoo for him that he can't get a proper read on one person out of everyone). As I played I increasingly felt resistant to interacting with "Daniel" because I knew what he was doing, resented it, and ultimately came away feeling manipulated. Worse, the game made me feel powerless to stop it, which really sours the mood. How many times does our mc say "Oh, I don't know why but I think I like this guy!"? No, in fact I don't. Not one bit. And I didn't even realize "Daniel" was gatekeeping some LIs because I went for Jenny first. (sidenote: Hahn81 respectfully agree to disagree regarding your incest hot-take. The patch does make sense and it is not equally taboo to bang your... roommate? Whatever Jenny is without the patch. That's got nothing on banging your sister, man. At least, imo. But we're 100% on the same page with the "Daniel" problem).

Spoiler: Examples of "Daniel" fucking with the first MC:

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There's more, but you get the point. "Daniel" doesn't just use his mind reading to manipulate what could have been LIs, he also does it TO YOU. He would probably say something like "I can't turn it off." Well, I don't care. GO AWAY, "DANIEL." I was this annoyed with the guy and I only interacted with him a handful of times, none of them confrontational. How bad would it be if we had direct conflict? But in fact we do - it's just between the player and "Daniel" instead of the mc and Daniel. I believe the primary reason, aside from loathing his manipulation we can't do anything about, is as my esteemed colleagues have stated: rather than sharing the spotlight, the way this game feels to play is there's some other guy trying to steal your status as the main character (and all your LIs with it). It isn't a friendly dynamic, no matter how much the game tries to cram that down your throat. Because let's be real here: who sounds like an actual mc? The new guy in town with a mysterious past and a mysterious power, pursued by mysterious forces? Or the dude who used to be super cool but got tired of it and is now just pretty cool ( )? Yeah. We're the second guy, but the first guy was given the story. So now we either wallow in irrelevance - no player's choice - or we push back... except we can't, by the dev's choice. Lose-lose.

TL;DR: The dev made us Steve. We therefore care about Steve. Thus, as Steve, I would really love to kick "Daniel's" fucking ass: you can read my mind, you prick, but just because you know what's coming doesn't mean you can stop it from happening.

Ultimately though, I expect nothing will change here, guys. The dev wanted to make the game this way. They've put considerable effort into it already. At this point, I wouldn't expect any dev to take feedback like this in stride and roll on all the plans they had, regardless of whether we make a compelling case for it or not. So... I think we're stuck with "Daniel". Which is a pity. I think you all were right that he (or either mc, really) definitely would have worked better in an entirely separate game.

I don't mind playing as Daniel as long as I can prevent him from having a relationship (or a sex scene) with any girl.

 

[Look-see]

I don't mind playing as Daniel as long as I can prevent him from having a relationship (or a sex scene) with any girl.

that's honestly the only reason i wanna play as him. i want to see the worst possible ending.

 

[YogSothoth1982]

that's honestly the only reason i wanna play as him. i want to see the worst possible ending.

Possibly following what I comment, get what you indicate. But really getting the worst possible ending for Daniel isn't the main motivation for my choice (at least for now). Although I don't particularly like Daniel, to be honest.

 

[Hahn1900]

(sidenote: Hahn81 respectfully agree to disagree regarding your incest hot-take. The patch does make sense and it is not equally taboo to bang your... roommate? Whatever Jenny is without the patch. That's got nothing on banging your sister, man. At least, imo. But we're 100% on the same page with the "Daniel" problem).

well, i tried the mod, and in the early going of the game it was multiple times mentioned that Jennys parents were dead and she moved in to the MCs parents house, so how makes this sense when they supposed to be siblings in this patch? Jennys parents are dead, the MCs not, but they are siblings? what kind of freaking science is this? nope, sorry this doesnt work for me, cant just "overread" things like that just to get the incest kink kicking in.

 

[DrDerpington]

played it, and like it... but the incest tag should be removed. There is no incest in the game without the mod, and the mod itself makes no sense... the story is cleary written without any incest. And the mod cant change that. Just to add "sibling" in the relationship doesnt make them to siblings... it is mentioned more than once during the game that Jennys parents died when she was 4 and that she moved in after that. And the mod doesnt change that.

Just to write a mod and make up some relations that arent there, doesnt make the game a incest game. and i would advise to not play it with the sibling-status on, cause it kinda ruins the game. the relationship between Jenny and the MC is "taboo" enough as it is... No need for incest, and like this the mod screw things just up. And for future incest content... well if the MC doesnt turn gay and will fuck his dad, there are no other related people, cause his "mom" is just his step-mom.

So here is the situation:
1.) Dev releases a game.
2.) People are crying that they want an incest mode.
3.) Dev finally relents and adds an incest as optional mod (nobody forces anybody to install it)
4.) People start crying about incest mode ruining immersion.

 

[Hahn1900]

So here is the situation:
1.) Dev releases a game.
2.) People are crying that they want an incest mode.
3.) Dev finally relents and adds an incest as optional mod (nobody forces anybody to install it)
4.) People start crying about incest mode ruining immersion.

View attachment 1735972

so what? after i tried the mod i played thorugh without it and as said in the earlier post i recommend everybody to not use the mod... why do you offend me now? no need for this... really... toxic much.

 

[DrDerpington]

so what? after i tried the mod i played thorugh without it and as said in the earlier post i recommend everybody to not use the mod... why do you offend me now? no need for this... really... toxic much.

Where do you see any toxicity? Dont take everything so personally. Nobody was trying to offend you.

Learn how to chill. This is the internet.

 

[zeggdar]

well, i tried the mod, and in the early going of the game it was multiple times mentioned that Jennys parents were dead and she moved in to the MCs parents house, so how makes this sense when they supposed to be siblings in this patch? Jennys parents are dead, the MCs not, but they are siblings? what kind of freaking science is this? nope, sorry this doesnt work for me, cant just "overread" things like that just to get the incest kink kicking in.

sounds a lot like you forgot to turn it on. The story in incest mode is 100% coherent, if it isn‘t then maybe give an instance wher the illusion breaks.

 

[JollyGeorgieM]

well, i tried the mod, and in the early going of the game it was multiple times mentioned that Jennys parents were dead and she moved in to the MCs parents house, so how makes this sense when they supposed to be siblings in this patch? Jennys parents are dead, the MCs not, but they are siblings? what kind of freaking science is this? nope, sorry this doesnt work for me, cant just "overread" things like that just to get the incest kink kicking in.

Yeah, like zeggdar said, it sounds like you didn't install the mod correctly or didn't activate it. That was not my experience at all - not once is it said anywhere that Jenny's parents are dead (since they're yours too and we see them leave). Plus the siblings discuss being siblings and the ramifications of that should their new relationship be exposed. The closest thing to weirdness I saw was at one point the mc referred to "Jenny's father", which was odd because it's his father too... but even in that instance it was clear he was referring to the very-alive dad in their family. Maybe give the incest patch a re-download and retry?

 

[HighbornTiger]

JollyGeorgieM Hey, thank you for your feedback. Just so you know, Daniel isn't fucking with Steve in the way you're describing. If you percieved it that way, then I probably did a bad job as a writer (First Game, my mistake). Still, I'm confident that when the final version of this game is released, you'll come around. Maybe I'm a bit biased here since I would have moved on to another project if I didn't believe that there would be a enjoyable story when all is set and done.

 

[HighbornTiger]

that's honestly the only reason i wanna play as him. i want to see the worst possible ending.

Probably going to be disapointed then. Give me a year, and maybe in the end you'll come to like Daniel and his story

 

[HighbornTiger]

Possibly following what I comment, get what you indicate. But really getting the worst possible ending for Daniel isn't the main motivation for my choice (at least for now). Although I don't particularly like Daniel, to be honest.

Wanted to tell you that you can go ahead and take a look in the about section of Playing With Fire.

 

[HighbornTiger]

Crimsonfiend76
These are defenitely valid criticisms. As the dev, I'd like to think that my game gets a bit of a bad rep from just reading this thread but yes, there will be multiple MC's. Experimenting is a good word. I can garanty you an interesting story with a good amount of sex.

The only thing is your point about the delayed updates. That's not really the case because the story of each MC isn't 'mixed'. With that I mean, it's not like the first scene is from Steve's perspective and the second from Daniel's. But I went ahead and told the story from steve's perspective and with v0.8 I start telling the same week from Daniel's perspective. It's less about a delayed update and more of a delayed second project with a different premise that might be of better quality, story and art wise.

 

[YogSothoth1982]

Wanted to tell you that you can go ahead and take a look in the about section of Playing With Fire.

I appear in the special thanks

EDIT: Although the N is a U, is BLASKYAU not



Otherwise I liked it a lot.

 

[HighbornTiger]

I appear in the special thanks

EDIT: Although the N is a U, is BLASKYAU not

View attachment 1738212

Otherwise I liked it a lot.

Will be fixed next release

 

[YogSothoth1982]

Will be fixed next release

No problem, I'm glad to hear that I've helped to improve the game.

 

[Darknesssilent]

Instead of making 2 games the dev decided to put 2 male mcs into the game with different Lis to get around the 3 letter tag and to gain more money from his supporters so he can bleed there cash for devolpment. having 2 male mcs and different Lis is a mistake on the dev and this way will keep going on with new devs that make a game.

 

[HighbornTiger]

Darknesssilent when answering here, I try to be polite and find the fault in myself rather than others but dude … wtf.
Can you please not insult me and the people supporting my game? I‘d really appreciate it.