VN Ren'Py Radiant [v0.6.3] [RK Studios]

[Cartageno]

I mean, its ok to aim for "longer updates", but 4 months between updates? It seems a bit too long, many people will have to repeat previous content because they already forgot what happened on chapter 1.

It should be noticed though, that - financing the project notwithstanding - at the end of the day the goal is a game/VN that you can then play. That we can test pre-finished versions is a bonus, but waiting times in here have no real effect on how the game as a whole will turn out. Sure, I said "financing notwithstanding" and it might for many not be as "notwithstanding" as I made it out to be, but if you don't care about it now and download the game in 3-4 years, when it is finished, it will not matter at all whether it was done in daily increments, monthly, every half year, or just dropped on the scene, the game would be the same.

 

[juan palote]

It should be noticed though, that - financing the project notwithstanding - at the end of the day the goal is a game/VN that you can then play. That we can test pre-finished versions is a bonus, but waiting times in here have no real effect on how the game as a whole will turn out. Sure, I said "financing notwithstanding" and it might for many not be as "notwithstanding" as I made it out to be, but if you don't care about it now and download the game in 3-4 years, when it is finished, it will not matter at all whether it was done in daily increments, monthly, every half year, or just dropped on the scene, the game would be the same.

But the Devs say they prefer these longer updates because they dont want "inconsistent incremental releases", which also in the long term wont be an issue because when the game is finished you wont have inconsistencies based on missing content.

I think 4 months is too long, that doesnt mean asking for weekly releases like some Devs tried, i think a good release schedule is a monthly release, and Devs should try to plan their champters around that. That allows Devs to have time and means players wont have to repeat old content to have a clue about what is happening or who is who.

Of course, that is my opinion.

 

[Cartageno]

But the Devs say they prefer these longer updates because they dont want "inconsistent incremental releases", which also in the long term wont be an issue because when the game is finished you wont have inconsistencies based on missing content.

I think 4 months is too long, that doesnt mean asking for weekly releases like some Devs tried, i think a good release schedule is a monthly release, and Devs should try to plan their champters around that. That allows Devs to have time and means players wont have to repeat old content to have a clue about what is happening or who is who.

Of course, that is my opinion.

And you are perfectly entitled to it. I tend to disagree somewhat though. Planning your game around a release schedule will always mean having to compromise some stuff and in the end will lead to a worse game. Whether that's noticeably worse can be up for discussion, but anything a dev does to satisfy the patreons will have the chance of compromising the game.

Of course I don't blame devs. Listening to what people want can also increase quality for many, and at the end of the day, people have got to make a living. But for me, while I enjoy the ride, I judge games by the finished product, and I want that to be great, however bumpy the ride was.

 

[Maviarab]

Well just got around to this one, that was bloody fantastic. Genuinly choked up reading the letter. Damn, extremely well done and written.

Definitely watching this one!

But the Devs say they prefer these longer updates because they dont want "inconsistent incremental releases", which also in the long term wont be an issue because when the game is finished you wont have inconsistencies based on missing content.

I think 4 months is too long, that doesnt mean asking for weekly releases like some Devs tried, i think a good release schedule is a monthly release, and Devs should try to plan their champters around that. That allows Devs to have time and means players wont have to repeat old content to have a clue about what is happening or who is who.

Of course, that is my opinion.

But perhaps also as a reason, unlike some 'devs' not everyone has 3 PC's churning out 50 renders a day. One of the reasons I've not started this myself (as well as other reasons), selfish attitudes. I can compete quite easily with the likes of DPC in terms of writing and graphical quality. What I cannot do is churn out more than 5 renders a day with my time/hardware. Still want a monthly release of 10 mins worth of content and less than 100 renders?

It's free...if it's 4 months it's 4 months.

 

[Kittenfox]

Dear Dev. I hope you see this story through to the end, and give it the ending it deserves.
So far the story has touched my heart like no other game ever has. The characters are believable and lovable, the sorrow so deep and heartbreaking.
I don't have words for how well this is written, but I assure you it is good and well liked.
Please don't ever give up on your writing talent, for you have a gift.

 

[ImmortalNight]

Dear Dev. I hope you see this story through to the end, and give it the ending it deserves.
So far the story has touched my heart like no other game ever has. The characters are believable and lovable, the sorrow so deep and heartbreaking.
I don't have words for how well this is written, but I assure you it is good and well liked.
Please don't ever give up on your writing talent, for you have a gift.

You should check his other game Polarity. The visuals aren't as good, but the story and characters have similar emotional depth.

 

[ironbeazt]

For me it doesnt matter if the updates takes 4 months before getting update, what matter is the update are long enough that it can satisfy and justifiable for the people who supports the game

 

[RandoCard3]

For me it doesnt matter if the updates takes 4 months before getting update, what matter is the update are long enough that it can satisfy and justifiable for the people who supports the game

Yeah, I hope updates are generally meatier than what we got for the first release. This was a good appetiser, but not much happens. It'd be frustrating to get as little content after such a long wait each time.

 

[meanmike]

I see the devs didnt even bother pretending that they would actually work on the game this time. I love patreon haha

 

[Squark ⚧❤️]

I see the devs didnt even bother pretending that they would actually work on the game this time. I love patreon haha

You're just being ridiculous. You have no idea what takes them so long, do you?

 

[Jasonfrans]

Any idea for the progress update?

 

[RandoCard3]

Any idea for the progress update?

They're aiming for sometime this month I believe, but haven't commited to that.

 

[Kata]

And you are perfectly entitled to it. I tend to disagree somewhat though. Planning your game around a release schedule will always mean having to compromise some stuff and in the end will lead to a worse game. Whether that's noticeably worse can be up for discussion, but anything a dev does to satisfy the patreons will have the chance of compromising the game.

Of course I don't blame devs. Listening to what people want can also increase quality for many, and at the end of the day, people have got to make a living. But for me, while I enjoy the ride, I judge games by the finished product, and I want that to be great, however bumpy the ride was.

It doesn't always lead to a worse game.

It can also lead to a better game because keeping to a [reasonable] release schedule can keep the developers focused on the project instead of giving them too free reign to deviate and get their ideas muddled. There's a certain great bearded fantasy author who probably needs someone keeping him on a tighter schedule and rein in his process.

There's some games that take so long to finish that they end up getting stuck in meandering side plots that go nowhere, or simply take so long that the author's style or feel for the characters and stories (or even their memory of events that have already transpired) has morphed from beginning to end, leading to a jumbling mess.

Regardless, if you're going to create a Patreon for a game, you shouldn't completely ignore the experience of those who pledge to support you in order to chase the finished project. It's the mistake of many a perfectionist. Taking too long between updates alienates your players, and thus your support base. Taking a few months is fine, particularly if they're heartier updates. But once you start approaching the 6 month mark, people are going to forget all their previous experiences and choices by the time your update rolls around.

 

[RandoCard3]

There's a certain great bearded fantasy author who probably needs someone keeping him on a tighter schedule and rein in his process.

If you mean who I think you mean, then scheduling isn't his problem. He'd planned for a 5 year timeskip, then realised that caused some narrative problems so dropped it. Except then he had to rework the arse end of the story due to all his plotting needing a timeskip.

On top of that, he has a character focused, over plot-focused writing style which sometimes leads to characters developing in ways the author wouldn't expect, which, in this case, requires him to put in the extra work to make sure the ending he has planned for that character makes sense with the new direction that character went. The problem with the TV show is that they didn't do this, resulting in characters acting out of character so they could get to the planned end point.

Anyway, to avoid this just being an off topic tangent, who's everybody's favourite girl so far? I think I prefer Maddie, cause she has sass. I hope she doesn't lose that when her and the MC make peace.

 

[Elinan]

It doesn't always lead to a worse game.

It can also lead to a better game because keeping to a [reasonable] release schedule can keep the developers focused on the project instead of giving them too free reign to deviate and get their ideas muddled. There's a certain great bearded fantasy author who probably needs someone keeping him on a tighter schedule and rein in his process.

There's some games that take so long to finish that they end up getting stuck in meandering side plots that go nowhere, or simply take so long that the author's style or feel for the characters and stories (or even their memory of events that have already transpired) has morphed from beginning to end, leading to a jumbling mess.

Regardless, if you're going to create a Patreon for a game, you shouldn't completely ignore the experience of those who pledge to support you in order to chase the finished project. It's the mistake of many a perfectionist. Taking too long between updates alienates your players, and thus your support base. Taking a few months is fine, particularly if they're heartier updates. But once you start approaching the 6 month mark, people are going to forget all their previous experiences and choices by the time your update rolls around.

I totally agree with this point of view. half of the players probably already forgot about this game, we can only hope they will find it again when it updates.

 

[Halfbreed]

I totally agree with this point of view. half of the players probably already forgot about this game, we can only hope they will find it again when it updates.

I haven't. I'm a supporter, but that will either continue or stop depending on the quality of this update. I mean, it has been ages, but I was so impressed with the first edition, so hopefully the time is justified and they focus on this project rather than others.

 

[Cartageno]

If you mean who I think you mean, then scheduling isn't his problem. He'd planned for a 5 year timeskip, then realised that caused some narrative problems so dropped it. Except then he had to rework the arse end of the story due to all his plotting needing a timeskip.

On top of that, he has a character focused, over plot-focused writing style which sometimes leads to characters developing in ways the author wouldn't expect, which, in this case, requires him to put in the extra work to make sure the ending he has planned for that character makes sense with the new direction that character went. The problem with the TV show is that they didn't do this, resulting in characters acting out of character so they could get to the planned end point.

Anyway, to avoid this just being an off topic tangent, who's everybody's favourite girl so far? I think I prefer Maddie, cause she has sass. I hope she doesn't lose that when her and the MC make peace.

Or, to quote another author: “I love deadlines. I love the whooshing noise they make as they go by.”

As for the girls: I really will have to wait and see and get to know them better (which, for once, isn't meant as a euphemism).

 

[Cartageno]

It doesn't always lead to a worse game.

(...)

Regardless, if you're going to create a Patreon for a game, you shouldn't completely ignore the experience of those who pledge to support you in order to chase the finished project. It's the mistake of many a perfectionist. Taking too long between updates alienates your players, and thus your support base. Taking a few months is fine, particularly if they're heartier updates. But once you start approaching the 6 month mark, people are going to forget all their previous experiences and choices by the time your update rolls around.

You make some salient points in the first part (I only edited them out for shortness of this post). Meandering can happen (by the way it can also be a good thing, many famous stories and characters have changed substantially from what they were intended to be and for the better, but getting off track is generally not as good a thing than staying on track), as can losing focus. The latter of course will very much depend on the author's personality, some people need deadlines, some are getting restricted by them and "panicking".

As for the Patreon part: that one I agree with completely, my comments were meant entirely from the POV of "finished result quality" and not taking into account mere human necessities like "organizing to get paid to be able to afford food" and the compromises one must take to do that.

 

[Maviarab]

I totally agree with this point of view. half of the players probably already forgot about this game, we can only hope they will find it again when it updates.

That's their problem though not the dev's.

 

[Kata]

You make some salient points in the first part (I only edited them out for shortness of this post). Meandering can happen (by the way it can also be a good thing, many famous stories and characters have changed substantially from what they were intended to be and for the better, but getting off track is generally not as good a thing than staying on track), as can losing focus. The latter of course will very much depend on the author's personality, some people need deadlines, some are getting restricted by them and "panicking".

I agree. There are projects that work better if given enough time, and other projects that work better if they have a little bit of pressure so they can avoid development hell. There's no one size fits all here.

I don't want to imply that I want them to rush and panic in order to hold a firm deadline. But you shouldn't get too lax and pump out 1-2 updates a year either, even if your updates are substantial. Your efforts would probably be better off giving shorter-interval, smaller updates and getting live feedback on your work. One of the best features of alpha/beta testing is that you can make short term pivots based on feedback. You shouldn't relinquish this advantage in favor of developer perfectionism.

That's their problem though not the dev's.

Any good developer considers their user experience.

Any game that's heavily reliant on individual past choices and stats needs to consider that if they wait too long between updates, many players won't remember what they picked.