- Jul 26, 2023
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And Nat, don't forget Nat. I definitely wanted a taste of Nat.
Nice, some cannibals also playing with us....And Nat, don't forget Nat. I definitely wanted a taste of Nat.
I had a weird feeling that I'd see that tag after taking a look at this game after so long. Not sure why. Think I'm just developing a sixth sense for this type of situation after so many of them have been just dropping like flies. Or maybe because so many of them are just dropping like flies I'm just more or less expecting to see it now.
DanThaMan
Engaged Member
- Jun 25, 2017
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Over the years I've just learned to expect most new games that come around will more than likely be abandoned.
True.
But you kind of get a feeling when something's more likely to be abandoned. Not much playtime/content each update and long dev cycles relative to the size of the update. There just wasn't a lot of momentum behind it.
(Watch him just drop a massive dump of an update the next day.
But probably not. Some have done stuff like that but it's a rare event.)
DanThaMan
Engaged Member
- Jun 25, 2017
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You could see his interest in this VN drop drastically from when it first started. Abandonment was expected IMOTrue.
But you kind of get a feeling when something's more likely to be abandoned. Not much playtime/content each update and long dev cycles relative to the size of the update. There just wasn't a lot of momentum behind it.
(Watch him just drop a massive dump of an update the next day.
Manifest it!Watch him just drop a massive dump of an update the next day.
I think AVNs/lewd games are just like anything else - lots of people think they want to try it, but only a small % of those who do have the business sense and patience and long-term commitment to finish a game.
I have drifted more to DL-ing games that look interesting and trying them out - just to filter out anything where the writing or mechanics are crappy - but then just making a notation as updates are released but not DL-ing anything more until the game is marked complete (excepting games I love). So I get invested in a lot fewer games, but I probably have saved myself a lot of disappointment too.
Restaurants famously fail at a 90% clip in their first year - I don't really see AVNs as very different than that (other than the timeline being a bit longer than 1 year). And honestly with constantly changing technology keeping a game that runs for more than 2 years 'fresh' is even harder than restaurants (food is food), since after 2 years a dev can look back at the early updates and get bummed at how outdated the graphics look, at which point many get caught in the endless whirlpool of 'remakes' and never progress with the actual story. It's a hard thing to do, a harder thing to finish, and hardest of all to do well AND finish. It really takes a warrior's mentality.
That's true. Especially with how saturated the VN niche is these days. There's a difference between making a short demo/first release and continuously writing, coding, and creating renders. You need to be good at a lot of things as a solo dev. Not to mention that you'll be managing your own project on top of all that.Manifest it!
I think AVNs/lewd games are just like anything else - lots of people think they want to try it, but only a small % of those who do have the business sense and patience and long-term commitment to finish a game.
I have drifted more to DL-ing games that look interesting and trying them out - just to filter out anything where the writing or mechanics are crappy - but then just making a notation as updates are released but not DL-ing anything more until the game is marked complete (excepting games I love). So I get invested in a lot fewer games, but I probably have saved myself a lot of disappointment too.
Restaurants famously fail at a 90% clip in their first year - I don't really see AVNs as very different than that (other than the timeline being a bit longer than 1 year). And honestly with constantly changing technology keeping a game that runs for more than 2 years 'fresh' is even harder than restaurants (food is food), since after 2 years a dev can look back at the early updates and get bummed at how outdated the graphics look, at which point many get caught in the endless whirlpool of 'remakes' and never progress with the actual story. It's a hard thing to do, a harder thing to finish, and hardest of all to do well AND finish. It really takes a warrior's mentality.
One thing I sort of disagree on is that I think something older than 2 years is just fine. It's probably more like after 4 to 5 years when things start looking kind of outdated. It's true that graphics cards are constantly improving every year but rather than feeling the need to make even better renders, I think it'd be better if devs used the improved rigs to cut down on production time. Then after 4 years, really ramp up the quality. I just think that's a better way to scale things instead of losing momentum by having production slow to a crawl.
It feels more like a trap devs constantly fall into. By the time they're done upgrading their render quality, the next graphics card will come out. No matter what, renders will always end up looking outdated with the passage of time. It really isn't easy to be a solo dev. Not only do you need technical skills and artistic sense, you need to have project management skills that allows you to think clearly and make those kinds of efficient decisions.
If it wasn't for Patreon, A LOT of these devs would have never made it this far. Since they get a paycheck every month regardless of anything released. As a matter of fact, some of them just go radio silent without giving any kind of status update.
Oh, I don't disagree at all. Personally I don't care if the early parts of a game look different than the later parts. I grew up watching clunky effects in movies like Star Wars and Jaws, so picking nits as rendering continues to improve seems silly to me.
I just meant that there are lot of devs who either:
- are perfectionists who look at older renders and start to nitpick themselves
OR
- start listening to a vocal minority complaining about how "bad" their first few chapters looked
OR
- are out of story ideas and see a chance to revise old content and keep collecting $ without adding new content
Yea, for sure. I thought about what I'd wrote and I don't even think I was disagreeing with you. I was just expressing how much I dislike devs like that but also acknowledge that it's not easy saying "No." to yourself and exercising some self-accountability. It was more like a random scream into the void, "Upgrading renders doesn't mean shit if it takes 10 years for you to complete a damn game!"
But the last one ... oh boy, that last one. I call games like that "limbo" territory and just ignore them once I realize it.
homejorz
Well-Known Member
- Apr 12, 2020
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Lefrench definitely falls into the perfectionist category. He was always trying his darndest to make the game look as good as possible render wise. I never thought renders alone were the only thing this game has going for it. I have seen another particular dev fall into the category of perfectionist, hyper focusing on stuff 99 percent of players wouldn't even notice. At that point you're not really focused enough on the big picture to get updates out consistently, or at all in some cases
Aristos
Forum Fanatic
- Dec 28, 2017
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The game always looked amazing since the first release. He didn't need to exert himself to make it look better.
I think the problem here was the lack of enough support during the first year and a bit, followed by his focus on secondary features like that character gallery which should have been a complement, not the primary focus of a whole update that took months to finish.
On a different note, if that dev you mentioned is who I think it is, he is a bit of a psycho for me. I really hope his hardcore fans will be able to prepare themselves mentally for the fact that he will never complete his games, at least not the most popular one.
Dogorti
Engaged Member
- Jan 23, 2021
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The fans of that dev are delusional, I criticized something about one of their games and they almost killed me lol
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- Jul 26, 2023
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Same, said something I didn't like it about it and felt like I got hit by a cement truck.The fans of that dev are delusional, I criticized something about one of their games and they almost killed me lol
Aristos
Forum Fanatic
- Dec 28, 2017
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You really dared to try?The fans of that dev are delusional, I criticized something about one of their games and they almost killed me lol
Phew, I'm glad you got out in one piece.
I feel like I know who you're all talking about but I'm not sure ... there's more than one crazy dev with rabid sycophants after all.
Dogorti
Engaged Member
- Jan 23, 2021
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The only dev that works in two novels that are bad soap operas.I feel like I know who you're all talking about but I'm not sure ... there's more than one crazy dev with rabid sycophants after all.
lipe2410
Forum Fanatic
- Dec 23, 2018
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Actually, there is just two devs with such fanatics minions. And it's not hard guessed who they are.I feel like I know who you're all talking about but I'm not sure ... there's more than one crazy dev with rabid sycophants after all.
Edit: and they share most of those minions
Yea. I think only one name comes up when someone says "perfectionist" who obsesses over shit players don't care about. And the "bad soap opera" part just confirms it. LOL.
Edit: Honestly should've got it immediately but the part about him not completing his second game threw me off. I think he will finish it. It'll take like 10 more years or something crazy or something abrupt because he finally gives up. It'll just be pretty mediocre at best if not a complete kick in the nuts.
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Dogorti
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