RPGM Completed Roundscape Adorevia [v6.7] [Arvus Games]

[Nightguy1]

Man, this is definitely one of the most unhinged takes I've ever seen. "Less Talented" artists shouldn't charge for their art and art has held back h-games. Take a step back, art is entirely subjective. "Less Talented" art can definitely be way better than more detailed art. It can make a medium more unique, have more charm, be more tailored to the characters and story they portray. Hell, consider Avatar, where my profile pic comes from. The art in that show can be considered as "Bad Art" when it comes to detail. It's simple, cartoonish, and yet holds so much charm and makes it stand out on it's own.

The major reason most people despise AI art isn't just that it takes away opportunities from real artists, whilst also stealing their work. But it creates "art" that is just soulless, riddled with continuity errors, and anatomy issues. And I'll completely debunk you right now on the idea that AI art will improve h-games. We've seen it in the games that have come out, and in this game's attempt right now. The devs use the most basic, "AI art style" that is provided with the engine. A bland, airbrushed style, which yes, you could argue is detailed. But lacks soul and character BECAUSE it's the "AI art style". If everybody uses the same art style, then you lose originality and identity. Which is essential to making your game stand out. And the majority, if not all of the AI h-games we've seen have been crap cash grabs made by devs who are too lazy to go the extra mile to fix errors, ask for a unique art style or do anything. It's basically going to, and has already, bring the h-games version of shovel-ware into the community.

It's such a bad president to allow, and accept. There are ways to do AI right, such as drawing a background and asking the AI to tweak certain aspects of it. Not just tell it to make everything from scratch and leave it at that. Artists deserve the respect they get, they MAKE the styles we come to know and love, forge the personality and charm to mediums we eagerly consume. Pretending that AI is this godsend piece of technology is flat out ignorant, and a dangerous ideology to hold. Just because something is quick and easy, does not make it good. Yes time is an important factor, but it's also something we need in order to make a product the best it can be.

Avatar is a million dollar franchise huge fan btw that hired some of the best artists they could get and payed them quite handsomely for their professional talents not sure why you even brought that up.

And just because you say your an artist doesnt mean you have the ability level to sell art as a product in the early days of h games just straight up amateurs could put a price on art because game devs simply had no options they could not pay the hefty fees that artists demand such as the avatar artists you jump to the defense of .

And just like Ue5 has an AI solution to create large detailed worlds that so many games have jump to take advantage of or even starfield thats about to come out AI has reduced the burden on environmental artist so us the consumer can get what we want lots of high quality shit we can feast our eyes on trust me UE5 has not ended environmental artists careers and this wont for cg artists they will just need to be better.

 

[whamos_olrac]

Well, you can sell them for 250 gold each, so extra currency, perhaps? Like all those Souls of Nameless Soldiers from Dark Souls, that you can pop-up when you need souls ASAP?

Though I am reluctant to sell them not knowing what they are for.

Ah, maybe...

To be honest with you I haven't actually thought of that lol. I just stored them throughout my entire playthrough thinking that they might be used for buying super-secret-powerful-items or something in that manner haha. Plus, I recall not buying anything with glass coins, sooo, there's that lol.

EDIT: Fuck me, but there's this area in the castle (can't recall if it's the abyss or training, really sorry) where you can use glass coins to buy upgrades. So, nvm what I said above this. Been a long time since I last finished the game.

 

[GrandPaBrowning]

Avatar is a million dollar franchise huge fan btw that hired some of the best artists they could get and payed them quite handsomely for their professional talents not sure why you even brought that up.

And just because you say your an artist doesnt mean you have the ability level to sell art as a product in the early days of h games just straight up amateurs could put a price on art because game devs simply had no options they could not pay the hefty fees that artists demand such as the avatar artists you jump to the defense of .

And just like Ue5 has an AI solution to create large detailed worlds that so many games have jump to take advantage of or even starfield thats about to come out AI has reduced the burden on environmental artist so us the consumer can get what we want lots of high quality shit we can feast our eyes on trust me UE5 has not ended environmental artists careers and this wont for cg artists they will just need to be better.

Why the F did you put "avatar artists" and "(porn)game devs" in the same sentence?! How it is even connected to other parts of your message, let alone to the message you are answering to?! Was your message written by AI perchance?

And what environment artists have to do with this whole topic altogether? Why do you think the experience of wholly different type of art with different demands is applicable here?

UE5 has not ended environmental artists careers and this wont for cg artists they will just need to be better.

By God, how could anyone make a take that is so infuriatingly backward?!

If you don't insentify practise of artists - which requires monetary recompense for the vastest amount of time, efforts and sometimes even materials to maintain - artist won't become better. If instead of paying beginner artists comissions to insentify their practise we will use AI "because artists draw shit!!", less artitsts would be practicing. With less artists practicing, we will have less and less great artists - because great artists at some point drew shit themselves!

Why do I have to explain something so glaringly obvious?!

 

[GrandPaBrowning]

Ah, maybe...

To be honest with you I haven't actually thought of that lol. I just stored them throughout my entire playthrough thinking that they might be used for buying super-secret-powerful-items or something in that manner haha. Plus, I recall not buying anything with glass coins, sooo, there's that lol.

EDIT: Fuck me, but there's this area in the castle (can't recall if it's the abyss or training, really sorry) where you can use glass coins to buy upgrades. So, nvm what I said above this. Been a long time since I last finished the game.

Oh, thank you very much! And I was leaning to selling them - you were quite in time. Thank you.

 

[Uncle Iroh]

Avatar is a million dollar franchise huge fan btw that hired some of the best artists they could get and payed them quite handsomely for their professional talents not sure why you even brought that up.

And just because you say your an artist doesnt mean you have the ability level to sell art as a product in the early days of h games just straight up amateurs could put a price on art because game devs simply had no options they could not pay the hefty fees that artists demand such as the avatar artists you jump to the defense of .

And just like Ue5 has an AI solution to create large detailed worlds that so many games have jump to take advantage of or even starfield thats about to come out AI has reduced the burden on environmental artist so us the consumer can get what we want lots of high quality shit we can feast our eyes on trust me UE5 has not ended environmental artists careers and this wont for cg artists they will just need to be better.

... Ok,

"not sure why you even brought that up"

I brought it up for the exact reason I stated in the exact same sentence. The art in that show can be considered "bad" art by some due to it's lack of detail. I'll say the exact same thing again; it's simple, cartoonish, and yet holds so much charm and makes it stand out on it's own. AI would not make an art style like that on it's own. It needed artists to conjure it up themselves. Yes avatar is a massive property. It doesn't detract from my point that art that is "bad" in certain aspects, be it colour theory, detail, or popularity. Doesn't mean it can't be amazing in it's own right.

Point 2,

" just because you say your an artist doesn't mean you have the ability level to sell art as a product in the early days of h games "

Unhinged, of course people have the right to sell their own work. It's insane to think otherwise. Just because you don't like their product, doesn't mean you can walk in and say "get lost mate, you can't sell that". Of course they fucking can. YOU can choose not buy it. End of.

Same with the third point really, you've actively chosen to ignore the points I made in order to feed your own beliefs. Fine, if that's what you want to do, go for it. But don't come back with the my exact points as a positive with no flaws when I've literally pointed out the flaws that come with those points.

Anyway, I'll leave it on this note, AI art can make "good art", but it's at the cost of individualism, a lack of variety of styles, non-existent continuity between art pieces, and a mess of errors within the art that people who are using the AI generator can't fix because, shocker, they aren't artists. If you want shovel-ware, a flood of low quality games, and a lack of variety in art, keep fighting the fight for AI and shit on upcoming artists. By definition AI art NEEDS artists to make the art it generates. Any argument to throw artists aside in favour of it is so ignorant of that basic definition.

 

[whamos_olrac]

Oh, thank you very much! And I was leaning to selling them - you were quite in time. Thank you.

You're welcome man haha.

 

[grbt420]

is there some special trigger for tish's first scene with a male mc in the tent? the guide just says 5+ affection after you finish her first quest but she's talking about taking a bath which seems to come after your first session in the guide.

 

[GrandPaBrowning]

is there some special trigger for tish's first scene with a male mc in the tent? the guide just says 5+ affection after you finish her first quest but she's talking about taking a bath which seems to come after your first session in the guide.

I've had same issues since forever. But frequently visiting her always helped. At some point scene just triggered, though I am not away as to why it works as it works.

inb4: spaghetti code

 

[Nightguy1]

Why the F did you put "avatar artists" and "(porn)game devs" in the same sentence?! How it is even connected to other parts of your message, let alone to the message you are answering to?! Was your message written by AI perchance?

And what environment artists have to do with this whole topic altogether? Why do you think the experience of wholly different type of art with different demands is applicable here?



By God, how could anyone make a take that is so infuriatingly backward?!

If you don't insentify practise of artists - which requires monetary recompense for the vastest amount of time, efforts and sometimes even materials to maintain - artist won't become better. If instead of paying beginner artists comissions to insentify their practise we will use AI "because artists draw shit!!", less artitsts would be practicing. With less artists practicing, we will have less and less great artists - because great artists at some point drew shit themselves!

Why do I have to explain something so glaringly obvious?!

Uncle Iroh brought up Avatar cant you read?

Because large scale industry trends in a related field can inform movements of another do i have to explain supply and demand here as well.

This point has some merit but i suppose where i differ from you is that i look first to the benefit of the consumer and yea practicing for no pay until your good enough to sell a product is what everyone everywhere has to do lol some chumps even have to pay to practice (schl) artist should be no different.

 

[GrandPaBrowning]

Uncle Iroh brought up Avatar cant you read?

Because large scale industry trends in a related field can inform movements of another do i have to explain supply and demand here as well.

You won't be able to because none of it makes any fucking sense. Your argument about large scale industry already fell flat, and avatar artists have nothing to do with porn games. Regardless of whether or not your opponent mentioned them. The fact that your mention of those artists is relevant to the topic he mentioned does not make this mention relevant in situation you used it in.

This point has some merit but i suppose where i differ from you is that i look first to the benefit of the consumer and yea practicing for no pay until your good enough to sell a product is what everyone everywhere has to do lol some chumps even have to pay to practice (schl) artist should be no different.

You aren't though. If you were really into consumer rights, you would have put an actual effort to figure out the most obvious conclusion that if consumer consumes art, it is in his bloody interest to insentify the artist into making more and better art. Since what you suggest would logically lead to the very opposite effect, you are not looking at consumer's benefit - not at first look, not at all.

Again - and I won't reiterate anymore! - you say that some artist draw shit and therefore shouldn't sell they product, but your approach in using AI instead would inevitable de-insentify artists from improving their art. Meaning there would be more shit and less great artists.

Listen, pal, I won't repeat it any one more time. I am tired. For some reason I have to pander the most obvious fucking point about this whole debacle for third time in a row. I deserve better than my explanations being tossed aside or ignored.

P.S. And no "X field has this experience so Y field will have the same" isn't an argument without some very concrete elaboration. You can't just throw phrases like "large scale industry trends in a related field can inform movements of another" or "some chumps even have to pay to practice (schl) artist should be no different" and expect others to accept it as is. Without elaboration this is just a word-mix.

 

[BahBar]

So for now no one have found camilla ??, it say at the very begining of Act 2, so perhaps it trigger in novos ?

 

[Nightguy1]

... Ok,

I brought it up for the exact reason I stated in the exact same sentence. The art in that show can be considered "bad" art by some due to it's lack of detail. I'll say the exact same thing again; it's simple, cartoonish, and yet holds so much charm and makes it stand out on it's own. AI would not make an art style like that on it's own. It needed artists to conjure it up themselves. Yes avatar is a massive property. It doesn't detract from my point that art that is "bad" in certain aspects, be it colour theory, detail, or popularity. Doesn't mean it can't be amazing in it's own right.

Point 2, Unhinged, of course people have the right to sell their own work. It's insane to think otherwise. Just because you don't like their product, doesn't mean you can walk in and say "get lost mate, you can't sell that". Of course they fucking can. YOU can choose not buy it. End of.

Same with the third point really, you've actively chosen to ignore the points I made in order to feed your own beliefs. Fine, if that's what you want to do, go for it. But don't come back with the my exact points as a positive with no flaws when I've literally pointed out the flaws that come with those points.

Anyway, I'll leave it on this note, AI art can make "good art", but it's at the cost of individualism, a lack of variety of styles, non-existent continuity between art pieces, and a mess of errors within the art that people who are using the AI generator can't fix because, shocker, they aren't artists. If you want shovel-ware, a flood of low quality games, and a lack of variety in art, keep fighting the fight for AI and shit on upcoming artists. By definition AI art NEEDS artists to make the art it generates. Any argument to throw artists aside in favour of it is so ignorant of that basic definition.

*sigh* Your creating arguments i did not make Iroh i never said lacking in detail = bad you created this argument and are now arguing against it it so i agree with everything you say here AI cannot consume artist great artist plus AI equal consumer win so we agree completely here.

Never said they didnt have the right to sell just that amateurs did sell so yea another argument you made on your own...

Great artists will always have work was one of my main points the hgame industry is evolving and the demands of the consumers are putting strain on developers and artists they cannot keep up with the quality level and speed being asked of them get used to AI its not going anywhere. The real discussion should be how artists will integrate AI into there workflow to increase productivity thats where the magic is.

 

[GrandPaBrowning]

hgame industry is evolving and the demands of the consumers are putting strain on developers and artists they cannot keep up with the quality level and speed being asked of them get used to AI its not going anywhere. The real discussion should be how artists will integrate AI into there workflow to increase productivity thats where the magic is.

Now that's good point. Yes, demand is rising and AI will help to deal with it. It could be used to create drafts to be worked upon, testbeds for ideas, or be used to draw backgrounds, thumbnails and other stuff that is usually very repetative and bland.

All in all, I am cautious, but nevertheless optimistic. AI will stay, it is the future - the question is: what future it would be?

Another idea is that AI could potentially run images through filters to give them certain stylizations. Artist could potentially be able to make a multi-style set from a single picture. Or add post-effects that they wouldn't be familiar enough with. And again, it could be used as a testbed of sorts, to figure out how this or that would look when put on paper, so to speak.

And of course, it has potential to be used to make some niche fetishes that most artists won't work on. There some that has almost no pictures, and existing one often of subpar quality. AI can do that, while also not extracting much from artists, because no one would have made the chosen volume of niche pictures anyway.

Even as is, without taking into account the certainty that it will be improved, AI is very versatile.

 

[The_fallen_dragon]

Anyone know the work around for the Sandra bug, I can't talk to her because she's in the middle of the tavern unable to be interacted with so I can't turn in the 5 Petra quest.

 

[grbt420]

I've had same issues since forever. But frequently visiting her always helped. At some point scene just triggered, though I am not away as to why it works as it works.

inb4: spaghetti code

searching around in this forum says it actually only pops up after you help summeredge. guide could do with a touch up but I wonder if red even still cares about this game.

 

[GrandPaBrowning]

Anyone know the work around for the Sandra bug, I can't talk to her because she's in the middle of the tavern unable to be interacted with so I can't turn in the 5 Petra quest.

You mean you have took her quest, then travelled to farmlands, killed petrans there and returned to her? Could you have, mayhaps, missed some of the enemies?

 

[The_fallen_dragon]

You mean you have took her quest, then travelled to farmlands, killed petrans there and returned to her? Could you have, mayhaps, missed some of the enemies?

I mean I took her quest, she went to the back of the tavern like she usually did. Tool the letter for carys quest, she came back to the middle of the tavern and I couldn't interact with her. When I try I get the gold star above her head.

Went to the farmland, killed the five Petra got the mission complete and my journal update, went back to her and still couldn't interact with her.

 

[GrandPaBrowning]

I mean I took her quest, she went to the back of the tavern like she usually did. Tool the letter for carys quest, she came back to the middle of the tavern and I couldn't interact with her. When I try I get the gold star above her head.

Went to the farmland, killed the five Petra got the mission complete and my journal update, went back to her and still couldn't interact with her.

Sorry, no idea then. Sometimes I forget how her quest works and try to talk to her withouth killing petras. Thought you may've had the same issue.

 

[GrandPaBrowning]

Another AI replacement:

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By far not the worst AI picture, quite the contrary. Bot not without issues though.

Facial expression on the 1st pic is okay, a bit off though, but on the second its fucking comical derp-face. Also, no continuity between pics - different face, different skin color, different background. And the background is fucked up on the 1st picture - parts of it are painted the same color as tentacles, but you clearly see its the background because a few straight lines run through them.

The lack of continuity is infuriating - devs cared so little they didn't even do as much as just crop bigger image to make a close-up like the artist did before. Despite that it would take literal seconds in MS Paint and greatly help the continuity. Its that simple and yet they couldn't bother enough to do it.

What a mess.

 

[namenotinuse]

Is the gallery finally fixed ? I remember it being a mess that didn't even include the latest scenes a few years ago.