Lolilol47

Member
Mar 4, 2020
116
74
Just finished the game. I find it quite good, if a little short.
You earn way to much cash for what is possible to buy right now.
I look forward to the continuation of this game. Keep up the good work! (y)
 
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DiscardedUnion

Dev & Writer of Sculptor
Game Developer
Apr 19, 2019
53
438
Code:
I'm sorry, but an uncaught exception occurred.

While running game code:
  File "game/scripts/core/family/first_time_seeing.rpy", line 158, in <module>
AttributeError: 'Target' object has no attribute 'effect'

-- Full Traceback ------------------------------------------------------------

Full traceback:
  File "script.rpyc", line 18, in script call
  File "scripts/plot.rpyc", line 46, in script call
  File "helpers/09events.rpyc", line 216, in script call
  File "helpers/09events.rpyc", line 225, in script call
  File "scripts/core/family/first_time_seeing.rpyc", line 141, in script call
  File "scripts/core/family/first_time_seeing.rpyc", line 158, in script
  File "D:\sculptor-0.12.1-win\renpy\ast.py", line 914, in execute
    renpy.python.py_exec_bytecode(self.code.bytecode, self.hide, store=self.store)
  File "D:\sculptor-0.12.1-win\renpy\python.py", line 2028, in py_exec_bytecode
    exec bytecode in globals, locals
  File "game/scripts/core/family/first_time_seeing.rpy", line 158, in <module>
AttributeError: 'Target' object has no attribute 'effect'

Windows-8-6.2.9200
Ren'Py 7.3.5.606
Sculptor 0.12.1
Fri Mar 06 18:21:34 2020
Thanks for the bug report—as others have noted you can use the "ignore" option to get around this for now, and it'll be fixed in the next version (it is just a simple bug my end).

ok one question how to eat lunch with she and her friend at the start later on you get no chose so is there a way
Playing without the Patreon patch (or cheating some other way) there is no way to do that, and as noted there isn't a lot there right now. This scene will later become something you get multiple chances at over the game with more content, so hopefully it offers the chance to see the progression between the protagonist and the antagonist (and maybe something fun for a potential NG+ mode?). It just isn't ready yet.

am i going nuts or doesnt she have a genitals?
Dont know how far the creator is taking this, but its wierd to see the line saying she/he got changed into a skirt and she is wearing pants still.

this girl is a pirates dream (flat as a board) wonder if there are plans for giving this she/he character some boobs wether it be cause your transforming them into some type of sissy, or even if its because you want the girl to have a actual chest...lol

same thing with the genitals if its a he, atleast stick some balls and a stick between the legs.
As other have said, this is just a case of the art not being complete yet. More sprites and more variants are on their way once the first scene CG is in.

Whens 0.13?
Currently targeted at the 16th of March for Patrons, the 20th publicly. In general, the release schedule is every two weeks, although I sometimes push it to three weeks where there is a good reason to.

>Browses the Trello
>Preganacy

Oh man now I'm curious how far the story can go...into Adulthood? That would be cool.
The game is set in sixth form in the UK (equivalent to UK college, which sits in-between secondary school and university), so they are adults (the protagonist and antagonist are both 18). The story will take place within the school year. (Although, as always, if there is demand once the base game is done I may well consider doing additional content outside those bounds).
 
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Pelican!

Member
Apr 15, 2019
184
332
Thanks for the bug report—as others have noted you can use the "ignore" option to get around this for now, and it'll be fixed in the next version (it is just a simple bug my end).



Playing without the Patreon patch (or cheating some other way) there is no way to do that, and as noted there isn't a lot there right now. This scene will later become something you get multiple chances at over the game with more content, so hopefully it offers the chance to see the progression between the protagonist and the antagonist (and maybe something fun for a potential NG+ mode?). It just isn't ready yet.




As other have said, this is just a case of the art not being complete yet. More sprites and more variants are on their way once the first scene CG is in.



Currently targeted at the 16th of March for Patrons, the 20th publicly. In general, the release schedule is every two weeks, although I sometimes push it to three weeks where there is a good reason to.



The game is set in sixth form in the UK (equivalent to UK college, which sits in-between secondary school and university), so they are adults (the protagonist and antagonist are both 18). The story will take place within the school year. (Although, as always, if there is demand once the base game is done I may well consider doing additional content outside those bounds).
Pregnancy content planned? Does that mean there will be specific scenes planned for male and female choices?
 

yerif

Newbie
Jan 20, 2018
19
51
I played through all the paths I could find, and quite enjoyed this in its current state. It goes without saying that it's in need of more art, but the writing quality is quite good, and makes up for a lot of that. I think you did an admirable job also writing fairly neutrally so that depending on which genitals you pick for Sam it doesn't have to dramatically change the tone of any given scene or add too much extra writing. That's tough to pull off without it seeming lazy, but all the scenes work either way with only limited changes, so well done there.

However, if I had to nitpick, I feel like there's some issues with the paths, or at least a bit of un-siezed potential. Going through it initially, I went for the sub/dom route and picked more or less all the most appropriate dialogue choices for that type of relationship, pleasantly surprised that it appeared choices would have a substantial effect on Sam's behavior and reactions in future interactions. On subsequent playthroughs though, it seems that although there are a few scenes that show up differently or only show up if you have a certain type of repeated interaction, that it doesn't branch off very dramatically.

The choice early on of your "objective" feels a bit odd to begin with, but now having played most of the variations of choices you can make, it doesn't even seem to have much/any impact on the scenes or the choices you get. I'm not sure if it was intended to actually be functional, or if it's just a "get the player in a certain headspace" thing. In either case, I didn't get the particular sense that it had an effect. Even picking the most dom/sub appropriate responses in every scene, the whole thing felt a little... hesitant? Like it wasn't sure how much the audience would accept? Don't get me wrong, I'm not expecting the characters to jump into hardcore BDSM right away, but just the attitudes toward those interactions seem a little bit like it's a "thing to do" rather than a "way to act" if that makes sense? Aside from Sam enjoying some harder talk, the rest of the relationship doesn't reflect the intended power dynamic as a result.

The friendly route feels particular feels lacking, as basically the only difference is one additional scene and a handful of different reactions if Sam's not subby enough to do what you say. There are some interactions where all options are some version of submission-inducing in Sam, which when you've played friendly up to that point, feels out of place. Based on some of the choices you can make earlier on, I definitely thought there was going to be a role-reversal/femdom route, but you just end up getting mostly the same scenes with the same or similar reactions.

I'm sure this is partially an economical choice so as not to end up writing two hugely divergent dialogue trees, but it feels a little unsatisfying. I wouldn't mind at all having it only be a single path, but at the moment it feels very much like either certain paths are completely missing, or that going anything other than light sub is either the "bad" choice or at least the one that's less satisfying and appropriate to the tone of the scenes that follow.

All that said, I'm really excited to see how this progresses. There's clearly a ton of careful work that's been put in here, and I appreciate both the quality of the content and the attention to detail, two things I think these games are often lacking.
 

fulcrum

Engaged Member
Feb 2, 2018
3,351
1,901
there are some scenes where sams gender and choice of gender are invalidated by simply using "they", and i too noticed that domination is lacking. i want to "put a spell" on sam, 'enslave' her without bondage or sm play so she deferes to me in every decision.
 

DiscardedUnion

Dev & Writer of Sculptor
Game Developer
Apr 19, 2019
53
438
Thanks for the in-depth feedback. The routes are definitely not that different right now, they each have the same number of dedicated scenes and that is currently quite low compared to the shared content.

It's valuable to hear about the dynamic and how it feels—the reality is that as a game that is under development publicly I have to build that over time adding new content. I'll be aiming to try and make the routes feel more distinct and the dynamic between protagonist and antagonist feel more strongly matched to the player's decisions as I go on.

You are correct that fundamentally there is a limit to the amount of branching I can do: each branch represents more content to write that not everyone sees, and very "wide" scenes don't feel like a lot of content in an update for a lot of writing, which is an inherent problem to the rolling release model of development.

So while I'm aware of the general problem, it is really useful to get the more specific feedback—it helps me actually fix the issues longer-term.

there are some scenes where sams gender and choice of gender are invalidated by simply using "they", and i too noticed that domination is lacking. i want to "put a spell" on sam, 'enslave' her without bondage or sm play so she deferes to me in every decision.
If that (using "they" incorrectly) happens, it is a bug. If you send me where you encountered it, I can fix it up.
 

StratoSquir

Member
Jan 19, 2018
370
981
However, if I had to nitpick, I feel like there's some issues with the paths, or at least a bit of un-siezed potential. Going through it initially, I went for the sub/dom route and picked more or less all the most appropriate dialogue choices for that type of relationship, pleasantly surprised that it appeared choices would have a substantial effect on Sam's behavior and reactions in future interactions. On subsequent playthroughs though, it seems that although there are a few scenes that show up differently or only show up if you have a certain type of repeated interaction, that it doesn't branch off very dramatically.

The choice early on of your "objective" feels a bit odd to begin with, but now having played most of the variations of choices you can make, it doesn't even seem to have much/any impact on the scenes or the choices you get. I'm not sure if it was intended to actually be functional, or if it's just a "get the player in a certain headspace" thing. In either case, I didn't get the particular sense that it had an effect. Even picking the most dom/sub appropriate responses in every scene, the whole thing felt a little... hesitant? Like it wasn't sure how much the audience would accept? Don't get me wrong, I'm not expecting the characters to jump into hardcore BDSM right away, but just the attitudes toward those interactions seem a little bit like it's a "thing to do" rather than a "way to act" if that makes sense? Aside from Sam enjoying some harder talk, the rest of the relationship doesn't reflect the intended power dynamic as a result.
I think you're absolutely right, i was thinking the same thing with that early choice
It feels like Dev wasn't sure if he wanted to have a regular visual-novel with routes influenced by choices,
Or a trainer that use stats for flavor-text
Which make that choice pretty meaningless since wether you decided to pick to make antag into a sub/GF/take revenge is influenced by the stats since it's what affect the flavor-text

And i also thought the writing, while being really good, is hesitant
The game start with a feminization revenge-plot which is clearly a power-fantasy, and slowly turn-more into a sexual-indentification thing
It feel like the antag is a little tame too-fast, he dosn't put-up much fight
It start with a power-relationship based on blackmail and bullying, and evolve too-quick into a almost-casual S/M relationship

I know it's the point, but it happen a bit too-fast in my opinion
it makes it feel more like you're helping him/her get-out of the closet than force-feminzating him/her
I think Dev might have been too scared to go full-force feminization, because it might have upset somes peoples since it's a touchy subject, it would have been pretty bad if he had caught the ire of LGBT+ communities, or just peoples in general
So he had to be careful and walk the fine-line between bullying and slightly forcing antag
It just feel like it happen too fast, and it does feel like Dev wasn't sure about how far he could go with the concept
As for myself, i would have liked it if the antag fought a bit-more

The friendly route feels particular feels lacking, as basically the only difference is one additional scene and a handful of different reactions if Sam's not subby enough to do what you say. There are some interactions where all options are some version of submission-inducing in Sam, which when you've played friendly up to that point, feels out of place. Based on some of the choices you can make earlier on, I definitely thought there was going to be a role-reversal/femdom route, but you just end up getting mostly the same scenes with the same or similar reactions.
Once again, i absolutely agree with what you're saying
Since the writing rush a bit the relationship between MC and Antag, it feel pretty shallow and out-of-place
As i already mentioned, i mainly play the Sub/dom route, maxing obedience and lust, while keeping friendship low
Which make the scenes when in which Antag and MC are friendly to each-others a bit weird
For example that kiss-scene and the following text, it might have been fine if had the choices but i didn't
It felt a bit forced and out-of-place considering the writing was pretty romantic
It would have been fine if it was influenced by your stats, like instead of it being romantic it would have been more of a humiliation-thing for Antag since it was in-front of his friends
But it wasn't like that, it was a bit too romantic


I'm sure this is partially an economical choice so as not to end up writing two hugely divergent dialogue trees, but it feels a little unsatisfying. I wouldn't mind at all having it only be a single path, but at the moment it feels very much like either certain paths are completely missing, or that going anything other than light sub is either the "bad" choice or at least the one that's less satisfying and appropriate to the tone of the scenes that follow.
I think Dev might have started-out wanting to make huge diverging path, like in most visual-novels
Which would explain the "objectives"-choices MC has to make in the start of the game
And then he realized it might have taken too much time and instead went for a trainer with flavoring-text
Which is probably much easier, and faster to do

And i think he made the best choice,
i'd rather have a lot of flavor-text influenced by stats raised by choices i made
Than the usual visual-novel model story with very-few choices that affect a lot the game
If you make a trainer, you need to have stats-checks pretty-often or they end-up feeling meaningless
And flavor-text win/lose events are both the best and easiest-way to reward players for stats-raising

All that said, I'm really excited to see how this progresses. There's clearly a ton of careful work that's been put in here, and I appreciate both the quality of the content and the attention to detail, two things I think these games are often lacking.
glad to see i'm not the only-one who could see the value in the game
it might have some slight-flaws, but i think it's one of the very-few quality indie-games on this site
There are no flaws that can't quickly be fixed,
And it can only improve as long as Dev just keep the writing as constantly good as it has been
 
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StratoSquir

Member
Jan 19, 2018
370
981
Thanks for the in-depth feedback. The routes are definitely not that different right now, they each have the same number of dedicated scenes and that is currently quite low compared to the shared content.

It's valuable to hear about the dynamic and how it feels—the reality is that as a game that is under development publicly I have to build that over time adding new content. I'll be aiming to try and make the routes feel more distinct and the dynamic between protagonist and antagonist feel more strongly matched to the player's decisions as I go on.

You are correct that fundamentally there is a limit to the amount of branching I can do: each branch represents more content to write that not everyone sees, and very "wide" scenes don't feel like a lot of content in an update for a lot of writing, which is an inherent problem to the rolling release model of development.

So while I'm aware of the general problem, it is really useful to get the more specific feedback—it helps me actually fix the issues longer-term.
IMHO, the way to write scenes and story is absolutely fine as it currently is
the good-thing with making scenes shared between routes, is that it's both easier to produce (i guess) and make the story flow more naturally
it also help a lot since they're a bit influenced by stats, which is a great-way to reward the player for raising them in the first-place


Branching the story would probably take a lot of time as you'd have to come-up with majorly different storylines or it would be meaningless
I think writing scenes with flavor-text as you currently are, is the best-choice
It gives meaning to the trainer aspect of the game sinces stats often influences the flavor-text
And it's easier to come-up to, and make the story feel fluid
Also it help us getting some new-content pretty-often, which is much-better than having to wait 6 months for a single major-update

The one thing i think you could maybe improve for now would be maybe the dynamic of the game as you said
It does feel like the writing dosn't always match what the player wants

Anyway, nothing you can't improve-on, and/or fix
Keep-up the good-work, i truly love what you are doing
 
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just1more

Newbie
Aug 8, 2016
44
37
I almost never comment on these threads, but I just wanna say that unlike one of the posters above, I really enjoy the way the two main characters interact. To me, the bully turned sub isn't really a power fantasy in this game, or rather, the power fantasy aspect of it is a red herring to me. The PC and I as a player quickly realize that Sam is just as shy, lonely and vulnerable as the PC. Their school experience isn't what it's supposed to be for the both of them and that gives them a lot in common. Also, I think the fact Sam goes along with everything pretty quickly fits with their character. Sam feels like they always have to act tough in order to belong, but nobody is tough all the time. The PC finally gives Sam a space where they can show that other side of themselves (whether it's their affectionate, submissive or feminine side), so to me, it makes sense they go along with it.

You've created an extremely likeable character in Sam and put them in an extremely relatable situation (for me anyway), so keep up the good work dude!
 

DiscardedUnion

Dev & Writer of Sculptor
Game Developer
Apr 19, 2019
53
438
I almost never comment on these threads, but I just wanna say that unlike one of the posters above, I really enjoy the way the two main characters interact. To me, the bully turned sub isn't really a power fantasy in this game, or rather, the power fantasy aspect of it is a red herring to me. The PC and I as a player quickly realize that Sam is just as shy, lonely and vulnerable as the PC. Their school experience isn't what it's supposed to be for the both of them and that gives them a lot in common. Also, I think the fact Sam goes along with everything pretty quickly fits with their character. Sam feels like they always have to act tough in order to belong, but nobody is tough all the time. The PC finally gives Sam a space where they can show that other side of themselves (whether it's their affectionate, submissive or feminine side), so to me, it makes sense they go along with it.

You've created an extremely likeable character in Sam and put them in an extremely relatable situation (for me anyway), so keep up the good work dude!
I'm glad the game works that way for you. I'd like the routes to offer both that kind of experience and a more dominant power fantasy experience if I can swing it, however, so hopefully everyone can find what they are looking for as the game goes forward.
 

Master of Puppets

Conversation Conqueror
Oct 5, 2017
7,376
9,754
Definitely looks like it has a lot of promise, the lack of artwork so far is a definite negative but when it gets that it could be really good. It might be an idea to have an option to turn on hints for what reaction different choices might give, to make things a bit simpler for people who want a specific route.
Also I have a couple of questions about the game;
  • If Sam starts as a boy, MC decides pretty quickly that he's really a girl but continues using masculine pronouns for him, wouldn't using feminine ones at least part of the time be better?
  • At the start it says the main character's attributes won't change, but there are a number of places where a masculine MC leads him by example, is this just to get him to try things or is the MC going femme as well one possibility?
  • So far Sam's identity and body don't seem to relate to each other at all, no mention of Sam being trans if you choose that. You'd think it would come up when you discover Sam masturbating.
  • Is there going to be a significant difference in story depending on if Sam starts as 'he/him' or 'she/her'? Like, if female or tgirl Sam's attitude was about being insecure about not being femme enough, while boy Sam was angry at being too feminine before being convinced to embrace it?
 
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DiscardedUnion

Dev & Writer of Sculptor
Game Developer
Apr 19, 2019
53
438
Hello, is 13.0 from public going to be released some time this week?
It'll be out tomorrow. Normally it'd be today but I was a bit late delivering to Patrons due to illness, so I'll eat a little bit into the public release as well.

Definitely looks like it has a lot of promise, the lack of artwork so far is a definite negative but when it gets that it could be really good. It might be an idea to have an option to turn on hints for what reaction different choices might give, to make things a bit simpler for people who want a specific route.
Also I have a couple of questions about the game;
  • If Sam starts as a boy, MC decides pretty quickly that he's really a girl but continues using masculine pronouns for him, wouldn't using feminine ones at least part of the time be better?
  • At the start it says the main character's attributes won't change, but there are a number of places where a masculine MC leads him by example, is this just to get him to try things or is the MC going femme as well one possibility?
  • So far Sam's identity and body don't seem to relate to each other at all, no mention of Sam being trans if you choose that. You'd think it would come up when you discover Sam masturbating.
  • Is there going to be a significant difference in story depending on if Sam starts as 'he/him' or 'she/her'? Like, if female or tgirl Sam's attitude was about being insecure about not being femme enough, while boy Sam was angry at being too feminine before being convinced to embrace it?
I know it is frustrating how long the artwork has been in the making, but once the first set is in, hopefully we can start turning artwork over faster and getting it in more consistently.

As to hints, it's been something I considered, and will likely be something I look to add at some point, but it isn't too much of a priority right now (vs, for example, giving people an idea of where they are stats-wise)—my recommendation would be to use rollback if you find an option doesn't meet your expectations.

The pronoun thing is something I've wanted to add for a long time, but it always felt a bit too quick, and I was surprised in terms of feedback how few people seemed to want it. It is something I'll be addressing soon though.

As to the protagonist shifting, there aren't currently plans for it—the game is built around an protagonist comfortable in their sexuality and identity who is able to lead the antagonist to discover things about themselves. I like the idea, but it is just a bit out of scope for the game as it stands. As always, if enough people are enthusiastic about it, I'd be happy to consider adding more stuff like that in once the core game is done.

As to the trans-ness of it all, you are right I don't explicitly call it out anywhere. I agree it'd make sense to do that, and at the time that was something I wanted to try and make sure I got the right tone on, but haven't really got back to. I'll take a look.

And to the last point, yes, those kind of things affect the story right now, although there aren't currently a huge number of places we directly see the antagonist's actual *issues*. As we delve more into that over the game, those differences will become more obvious.
 
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StratoSquir

Member
Jan 19, 2018
370
981
As to hints, it's been something I considered, and will likely be something I look to add at some point, but it isn't too much of a priority right now (vs, for example, giving people an idea of where they are stats-wise)—my recommendation would be to use rollback if you find an option doesn't meet your expectations.
yeah, hints in a game in which you can just rollback at anytime are pretty pointless
i've simply rolledback everytimes the stats i didn't want appeared
it's not like you're on iron-mode and can't go back, you can rollback at anytime with no consequences whatsoever

The pronoun thing is something I've wanted to add for a long time, but it always felt a bit too quick, and I was surprised in terms of feedback how few people seemed to want it. It is something I'll be addressing soon though.
yeah, a straight cis-gender person wouldn't decide to call himself/herself "her/him" in only like two days
it would take enough time for the person to realize he/she want to be associated with the other-sex
Antag isn't even confident enough to publicly crossdress yet,
so idon't see him/her come out the other-sex yet, it should take some time i think

And to the last point, yes, those kind of things affect the story right now, although there aren't currently a huge number of places we directly see the antagonist's actual *issues*. As we delve more into that over the game, those differences will become more obvious.
i realized there was something going-on with the dad, who seem really against feminity (is there a word for that?)
but i wasn't expecting it to go anywhere tbh
which is good, i think it would be great if the story evolve into something a bit deeper than it is for now
not gonna lie, it will be pretty hard tho', it take some good writing-skills to talk about that kind of things without seeming either ignorant or demagogic
 

Master of Puppets

Conversation Conqueror
Oct 5, 2017
7,376
9,754
As to the trans-ness of it all, you are right I don't explicitly call it out anywhere. I agree it'd make sense to do that, and at the time that was something I wanted to try and make sure I got the right tone on, but haven't really got back to. I'll take a look.
The most obvious difference I would expect is that if Sam is FtM his objections to being called a girl should be different to regular boy Sam being called a girl. Regular girl Sam and tgirl Sam I would expect to have pretty similar reactions to most things, with the only place I would really expect anyone to acknowledge it is the first scene where you catch her masturbating. There might be others later but that's where it stands out, just talking about 'her stroking her cock' without any comment on the fact she even has one.
Also, I found where 'they' is used if you didn't choose it:
Screenshot.png
I can't search for a line number or other instances as only the compiled scripts are included.


yeah, a straight cis-gender person wouldn't decide to call himself/herself "her/him" in only like two days
it would take enough time for the person to realize he/she want to be associated with the other-sex
Antag isn't even confident enough to publicly crossdress yet,
so idon't see him/her come out the other-sex yet, it should take some time i think
I don't mean Sam calling himself she/her, those are third person pronouns, you don't use them yourself. What I mean is our character, despite having chosen to treat Sam as a girl, calls him a girl to his face, but when thinking about him uses 'him'. I would expect at some point to start thinking of him as 'her', especially once she's dressing up and wearing makeup and sucking your cock.
 

StratoSquir

Member
Jan 19, 2018
370
981
I don't mean Sam calling himself she/her, those are third person pronouns, you don't use them yourself. What I mean is our character, despite having chosen to treat Sam as a girl, calls him a girl to his face, but when thinking about him uses 'him'. I would expect at some point to start thinking of him as 'her', especially once she's dressing up and wearing makeup and sucking your cock.
of course i don't use "he/him" to describe myself, but i use masculines nouns and adjectives to describe myself
so he would probably do the same at some point, i'm pretty sure that's what the feminity stat is in for after-all
but crossdressing isn't a magical transformation, it take some time and rationalization

it's not like as soon as you crossdress you suddenly start considering yourself as a girl
it does help a lot, but he would have to rationalize that he want to be one in first-place, and he's clearly not at that point yet
and homosexuality isn't related to genders-identity, you can consider yourself a manly-burly hair-on-his-chest man and still suck dicks, in fact that's the entire point of bara-yaoi
i get what you mean, but you just have to understand it would take some time that's all

And if you're thinking about how MC consider Antag, i get what you mean
MC is written like he has a clear objective of what he want to do with Antag,
so it does sound weird when he goes from talking to Antag as a girl, and then say internally nouns like "he/him"
but then again, maybe it's a question of time, like he use feminine nouns and adjectives in front of Antag because it re-inforce the feminization and he's trying to force on Antag, but still know Antag isn't fully feminized in his/her mind
i can't say for the dev if it's intentionnal or not, but when looked that way it make sense even if it's a bit inconsistent
 
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