Recommending Story-first games

[jufot]

@jufot have you tried No More Money?

Tales From The Unending Void

Neither of them are story-first games I don't mind if they are mentioned in a larger comment that is mostly relevant to this thread, but otherwise it's better to keep that discussion elsewhere.

 

[Deleted member 2657500]

I'm interested in games where the story takes precedence over everything else. My personal criteria are:

• Well-designed, internally consistent, coherent story with a beginning and an end - i.e. no games where the devs make shit up as they go along.
• Characters that are actual human beings, with lives, personalities and interests outside the MC.
• Sex scenes should serve the plot, not vice versa. If there is no story-relevant reason for a scene, it shouldn't be there.
• No Engrish. Non-native speakers are fine (I am one), but the dev should at least use Grammarly or LanguageTool.
• No cheap tropes (e.g every female character lusts after the MC's magical dick).

Games I've already played that - IMHO - mostly fit the above criteria, in alphabetical order: (last updated June 2022)

• Acting Lessons
• A Long Journey
• A Summer's End
• Blackberry Honey
• Callisto
• Camp Klondike
• Cardinal Cross
• Chrome Lifelines
• City of Broken Dreamers
• Corporate Culture
• Defending Lydia Collier
• Deviancy
• Divergence: Beyond the Singularity
• Elsaverse games (Omnibus first, followed by Nightmares, Transitions, and Chasing Beth)
• Elvensang
• Halfway House
• Hillside
• Intertwined
• Isabella - Dark Paths
• Leap of Faith
• Life Changes for Keeley
• Mad World
• Mythos: Book One
• Nothing is Forever
• Oathbreaker
• Oathbreaker 2
• One Day at a Time
• One Night Stand
• Penny for Your Thoughts
• Price of Power
• Rebirth
• Reluctant Archon
• Reunion
• Sorcerer
• Summer's Gone
• Terminus Reach: Sentinel
• The Bite: Revenant
• The Warrior's Heart
• Three Rules of Life

Any other suggestions in the same vein?

I really enjoyed the story of Life Is Good. There was some stuff that at first seemed to be silly but the story actually has a good plot with a twist or two that will keep you guessing.

 

[Raife]

Neither of them are story-first games I don't mind if they are mentioned in a larger comment that is mostly relevant to this thread, but otherwise it's better to keep that discussion elsewhere.

Those are porn-first games held together by stories, rather than the other way around. TOTUV is a _good_ porn game... but that's not what jufot is aiming for with this list.

Sometimes the line between story-first and porn-first is narrow, but here's a tip:

• If your game devotes most of an entire chapter to developing the character of an overweight, non-LI, Hawaiian-shirt wearing parole officer with a heart of gold... it is almost certainly a story-first even if the game also has sex scenes and a few porn tropes!
• If your game gives you the option of an orgy with a rando collection of pregnant ex-sex slaves that you just rescued from an illegal facility (hey, traumatized pregnant babes... lets get it awn!) it is almost certainly porn-first, even if the game also has an interesting plot!

 

[Raife]

That used to be my impression too, until I talked to him. It seems he's aware of the dangers of scope creep and is taking steps to rein it in. For example, my choices in episode 3 has put me on a path that apparently no longer exists as of episode 4 because he decided to merge it into one of the existing paths.

I've also asked him about long-term plans. He has solid ideas for the next several episodes, and vague thoughts about potential endings. His biggest bottleneck remains art, but he's dedicated to improving in both quality and speed.

That's encouraging. The MCs's mother and Trisha are excellent characters with ambiguous motivations and moral hinterlands that are unusual in games like this. It would be great to see them developed.

I wish that he wouldn't stress too much about art... his drawings are good! But... punters on this site are a bit obsessed with visual porn, so he might be right in a commercial sense.

 

[noping123]

Those are porn-first games held together by stories, rather than the other way around. TOTUV is a _good_ porn game... but that's not what jufot is aiming for with this list.

Sometimes the line between story-first and porn-first is narrow, but here's a tip:

• If your game devotes most of an entire chapter to developing the character of an overweight, non-LI, Hawaiian-shirt wearing parole officer with a heart of gold... it is almost certainly a story-first even if the game also has sex scenes and a few porn tropes!
• If your game gives you the option of an orgy with a rando collection of pregnant ex-sex slaves that you just rescued from an illegal facility (hey, traumatized pregnant babes... lets get it awn!) it is almost certainly porn-first, even if the game also has an interesting plot!

Hah. I know you're intentionally using extreme examples, but for me at least, the question is a really simple one:

Would the story survive if all the sex was removed? Aka could you make a R rated, or PG-13 version of the game? Or would the entire thing need to be totally re-written to remove all of those elements?

Of course it gets a bit harder when you get into the nuance of it all. For example in my game, the story itself would be fine and could be told in mostly the same way if you removed most of that... but 1 character would be removed entirely, and 2 would be written differently. Does that disqualify it because there are definitely a few elements that'd need to change, in order to "censor" the game properly?


What if the entire story is about sex?

Example, there's a game idea I had (That I will probably never make, but some of the concepts do interest me). The basic premise is a guy finds an ancient artifact that allows him to alter reality around him to his will. The problem is, at first, he can't control it - every passing thought he has, becomes the new reality. (Then when he recgonizes how fucking weird this is, things tend to snap back to the way they were.....mostly). One of the first scenes, is the woman he lives with (Older woman, NOT related... his parents died a couple years ago, she was a family friend, and took him in) blows him... then soon after "forgets" all about it - another scene shortly after is he sees a girl and thinks "damn she's hot I'd love to fuck her" and suddenly she's changed (different clothes/etc), and jumps on top of him....

As he learns to control the power, the story plays with a lot of ideas around the morality of all of it, of his choices, of how he decides to shape reality, or if he even should. Eventually (after doing all the dumb things a sex-crazed college kid might do) he realizes he could bring his parents back.... and should he? Finally the story delves into the history of the artifact, where it came from, why it exists, and who or what is behind it all.

Now that story I only wrote a single draft of (plus a couple of chapters... and eventually it got shelved, but it's still somewhere on the back-burner if I ever wanted to do anything with it), but where does that fall on the spectrum? I'd say no it's not story first... but the entire thing *IS* about the story. Mostly it's a morality play, with supernatural elements, but still. It might seem like just a vehicle for porn, but when I wrote it, it definitely wasn't - that stuff just made sense to exist within the context of the characters.


Funny. My original thought was "This is actually an easy question" but the more I thought about it, the more nuanced it became in my mind.

 

[moskyx]

Hah. I know you're intentionally using extreme examples, but for me at least, the question is a really simple one:

Would the story survive if all the sex was removed? Aka could you make a R rated, or PG-13 version of the game? Or would the entire thing need to be totally re-written to remove all of those elements?

Of course it gets a bit harder when you get into the nuance of it all. For example in my game, the story itself would be fine and could be told in mostly the same way if you removed most of that... but 1 character would be removed entirely, and 2 would be written differently. Does that disqualify it because there are definitely a few elements that'd need to change, in order to "censor" the game properly?


What if the entire story is about sex?

Example, there's a game idea I had (That I will probably never make, but some of the concepts do interest me). The basic premise is a guy finds an ancient artifact that allows him to alter reality around him to his will. The problem is, at first, he can't control it - every passing thought he has, becomes the new reality. (Then when he recgonizes how fucking weird this is, things tend to snap back to the way they were.....mostly). One of the first scenes, is the woman he lives with (Older woman, NOT related... his parents died a couple years ago, she was a family friend, and took him in) blows him... then soon after "forgets" all about it - another scene shortly after is he sees a girl and thinks "damn she's hot I'd love to fuck her" and suddenly she's changed (different clothes/etc), and jumps on top of him....

As he learns to control the power, the story plays with a lot of ideas around the morality of all of it, of his choices, of how he decides to shape reality, or if he even should. Eventually (after doing all the dumb things a sex-crazed college kid might do) he realizes he could bring his parents back.... and should he? Finally the story delves into the history of the artifact, where it came from, why it exists, and who or what is behind it all.

Now that story I only wrote a single draft of (plus a couple of chapters... and eventually it got shelved, but it's still somewhere on the back-burner if I ever wanted to do anything with it), but where does that fall on the spectrum? I'd say no it's not story first... but the entire thing *IS* about the story. Mostly it's a morality play, with supernatural elements, but still. It might seem like just a vehicle for porn, but when I wrote it, it definitely wasn't - that stuff just made sense to exist within the context of the characters.


Funny. My original thought was "This is actually an easy question" but the more I thought about it, the more nuanced it became in my mind.

I think that story would be perceived as 100% porny by the audience, even though your intention was deeper and more story-based... which only adds yet another layer of complexity to the discussion. It's basically the same as that sex scene that was being discussed the other day, which came out of the blue in the first chapter of a game but then the story moves forward and it seems that the author actually wanted to tell something else with it so that it feels justified later on... but there are still some people who will consider it a cheap porny resource either way.

 

[Raife]

Hah. I know you're intentionally using extreme examples, but for me at least, the question is a really simple one:

Would the story survive if all the sex was removed? Aka could you make a R rated, or PG-13 version of the game? Or would the entire thing need to be totally re-written to remove all of those elements?

We've been over this ground before (somebody like jufot probably remembers and can link to it)... but, you're right, there is an ambiguous grey area.

To my mind, though, your simple question is too simple: differentiating between story-first/porn-first is about more than the presence or absence of a coherent narrative. TOTUV, for example, would still have a PG-13 narrative if you excised the porn... but that does not make it a story-first game.

It's also about _intent_. Is the game primarily designed to deliver porn to the player, or is it primarily interested in delivering an compelling story (albeit one that might have sexy scenes or even porny elements)?

Intent tends to be reflected in player motivation: for example, I eagerly play through new chapters of many games on jufot's list (e.g. Rebirth, Tlaero's games, Elvensang, Price of Power, Hillside) even if I'm quite sure that there will be no adult scenes in the update. I'm playing for the story. TOTUV, on the other hand, is primarily about porn delivery... the story is secondary.

Which... takes us to your hypothetical game where the entire story is about sex. My answer is... it could be either, depending on the dev's intent and the method of execution! It might be easier to say 'I'll know it when I see it.'

 

[jufot]

As he learns to control the power, the story plays with a lot of ideas around the morality of all of it, of his choices, of how he decides to shape reality, or if he even should. Eventually (after doing all the dumb things a sex-crazed college kid might do) he realizes he could bring his parents back.... and should he? Finally the story delves into the history of the artifact, where it came from, why it exists, and who or what is behind it all.

where does that fall on the spectrum? I'd say no it's not story first... but the entire thing *IS* about the story. Mostly it's a morality play, with supernatural elements, but still. It might seem like just a vehicle for porn, but when I wrote it, it definitely wasn't - that stuff just made sense to exist within the context of the characters.

If the game is actually about morality, then I would expect something more than the MC retroactively feeling bummed about his actions. Perhaps one of his victims can become aware of his misdeeds and accuse him of rape? After all, intent matters very little in sexual assault.

That's another thing - I would expect the women in question to be treated by the story as what they are - victims, not LIs. Now, for that game you could replace all sex scenes with a fade to black without losing any narrative integrity

 

[noping123]

If the game is actually about morality, then I would expect something more than the MC retroactively feeling bummed about his actions. Perhaps one of his victims can become aware of his misdeeds and accuse him of rape? After all, intent matters very little in sexual assault.

I disagree to an extent. I think intent absolutely matters, at least in the context of the story I had in mind.

In any real-world scenario things are different, but since this isn't a real world scenario..... here i'll try to craft one.

A guy is walking down the street. He slips on a banana peel, but unlike in the cartoons, he beings to fall forward instead of backwards. as he's falling he attempts to catch his balance, resulting in a sort of front flip/roll combo, where he sort of tumbles forward a bit. As he's tumbling, his pants get caught on a sign in front of a coffee shop - due to the speed he's now built up, his pants are ripped clean off. Well now he's naked from the waist down... that sort of sucks, but at least he's finally managing to catch his balance..... That is until he looks up and sees the most beautiful woman he's ever seen. Damn, instant erection, this is embarrassing. Now he's hard, nude, in public. And since he hadn't fully gathered his balance yet, this distraction is the proverbial straw that broke the camels back. He flails forward into the air, at rather impressive speeds (remember he's been gathering it along this whole time), and flies right on top of her. To make matters worse, she was wearing a dress, and going commando today. Oops! Accidental penetration!

(Yes I just did a reverse "I fell, tripped, landed on his dick!").

Now, is that completely absurd above scenario sexual assault? I'd say no, it's an extremely unfortunate accident. It was something that happened with neither party wanting or even trying to approach that scenario - just a series of unfortunate events.

In the story I had originally written, the first few encounters that happen, are sort of the fantasy equivalent of the above. He has no knowledge or control over what's happening - just a passing thought suddenly becomes reality and he has no idea how or why. Later on he does figure it out, and to answer your question, yes at that point there absolutely are consequences beyond "aw shucks I sort of feel bad I effectively raped multiple people". Specifically (I don't mind spoiling this since it's a story I shelved and will likely never expand upon) each "use" of the artifact corrupts the users soul - the amount of corruption is in line with the "severity" of the use. Enough corruption kills and damns the user to hell. (I hadn't ever gotten to the point of working out the mechanics of it, but the plan was for the initial "accidental" uses to add enough that it'd only take a couple of intentional uses to kill). In addition, the whole bit of "altering" reality wasn't so much altering reality, as playing with the multiverse theory - every "alteration" wasn't changing things/people/etc in this universe, but rather pulling bits of other universes into our own - and when he "reverted" things, all the universes got put back together the way they should be.... except whatever happened, really happened... to those people. I hadn't gotten too deep into the specifics of it, but again the plan was for that to matter, and for those people who were violated, to do more than just be sad about it or whatever. The plan was for those to be real people, and for there to be real consequences.

That's also why the LI's I had created for that story were *NOT* treated as victims - because they weren't, not exactly. Their dopplegangers from parallel dimensions otoh, definitely were, and that was going to matter.

Ultimately I shelved the entire thing, primarily because I realized from a design and logistical standpoint it would have been so big in scope I couldn't really consider tackling it - and I already had other, (imo better) ideas for things large in scope. There were some issues with the story, but I could have ironed those out as I went along and iterated on it... I just never got that far.

 

[jufot]

A guy is walking down the street. He slips on a banana peel, but unlike in the cartoons, he beings to fall forward instead of backwards. as he's falling he attempts to catch his balance, resulting in a sort of front flip/roll combo, where he sort of tumbles forward a bit. As he's tumbling, his pants get caught on a sign in front of a coffee shop - due to the speed he's now built up, his pants are ripped clean off. Well now he's naked from the waist down... that sort of sucks, but at least he's finally managing to catch his balance..... That is until he looks up and sees the most beautiful woman he's ever seen. Damn, instant erection, this is embarrassing. Now he's hard, nude, in public. And since he hadn't fully gathered his balance yet, this distraction is the proverbial straw that broke the camels back. He flails forward into the air, at rather impressive speeds (remember he's been gathering it along this whole time), and flies right on top of her. To make matters worse, she was wearing a dress, and going commando today. Oops! Accidental penetration!

(Yes I just did a reverse "I fell, tripped, landed on his dick!").

Now, is that completely absurd above scenario sexual assault? I'd say no, it's an extremely unfortunate accident. It was something that happened with neither party wanting or even trying to approach that scenario - just a series of unfortunate events.

While that's definitely less rapey, it's a lot more porny. So much so that, the answer to your original question ("Would the story survive if all the sex was removed?") would be no.

 

[Tlaero]

Noping, all you need to do to make your shelved story not be porny is have the first few things he warps reality for not be sex. Have him stand up to his boss, the way he's always dreamed of doing. Have him find a winning lottery ticket. Have him say something intelligent to the beautiful woman when he'd normally be nervous and stumble over his words. And she smiles at him and walks on without sex.

I know the adage is that men think about sex every few minutes or something like that, but I'll bet you have other non-sexual desires and wishes as well. Cover some of those before the first sex scene and you've got a framework for a game that's story first rather than porn first.

Tlaero

 

[TheimmortalP]

Neither of them are story-first games I don't mind if they are mentioned in a larger comment that is mostly relevant to this thread, but otherwise it's better to keep that discussion elsewhere.

I know, I'm sorry. I actually just wanted some recommendations for very well paced games, and got carried away. I've made several recommendations request topics specifically asking for well paced games, but that part keeps falling on deaf ears sadly.

 

[Raife]

I know, I'm sorry. I actually just wanted some recommendations for very well paced games, and got carried away. I've made several recommendations request topics specifically asking for well paced games, but that part keeps falling on deaf ears sadly.

I thought your recommendation was made in very good faith -- thank you for offering it, IP. It was also useful in highlighting what jufot means by a 'story-first game' for the purposes of this thread, and what distinguishes a 'story-first game' from those more focused on delivering porn. So again, thank you.

 

[Tlaero]

I know, I'm sorry. I actually just wanted some recommendations for very well paced games, and got carried away. I've made several recommendations request topics specifically asking for well paced games, but that part keeps falling on deaf ears sadly.

I think the challenge you've got in finding recommendations for well-paced games is that, even more than story focused, "well-paced" is in the eye of the beholder..

You'll have some people who will feel that if you don't have a sex scene in the first 5 minutes, it's boring and not worth their time. And you'll have others who feel that if sex happens in the first few hours, it's too soon. Neither is wrong. Even for a given developer, different stories will have differing sexual ramps. If the game is about meeting a shy girl and eventually building a relationship with her, the sex will come much later than if the game is about a couple who already lives together. I've done both of those games (and many others in between). The pacing varies with the story.

Tlaero

 

[MyGirlsNowYoink]

Request to add. https://f95zone.to/threads/it-was-raining-that-night-v0-4-veronicaperv.66753/

 

[boobsrcool]

Request to add. https://f95zone.to/threads/it-was-raining-that-night-v0-4-veronicaperv.66753/

Will check this out and report back thanks


Games I have tried recently that may be of interest

Project Atmosphere
Bit of a rough landing from the beginning but is story first and has choices that matter. Worth noting it is a sandbox in presentation but doesn't play like one really. Most similar to Chrome Lifelines

Worlds of Wonders
Modern fantasy like sorcerer or reluctant archon. Is story heavy but MC does have a magic dick if that is a dealbreaker.

 

[Hildegardt]

Request to add. https://f95zone.to/threads/it-was-raining-that-night-v0-4-veronicaperv.66753/

I remember this game. It's story-first in the sense that the romance isn't only a stand-in for sex and it actually dares to lean into drama and tragedy as plot devices. But it's also porn-first in the sense that every single female character immediately jumps the PC's bones, even the one that gets introduced as a hard-ass.
At the end of the current update is a cliffhanger that plays out differently depending on your choices in the game so far. But it really only boils down to which LI you went with. No matter which one you chose, her only motivation seems to be getting into the PC's pants from now on, which isn't very "story-firsty" imo, because it becomes a little difficult to tell the LIs apart. But this might be up to everybody's own preference, because the game definitely still has a story that doesn't necessarily need the sex scenes.

Plot summary so far:
PC gets kicked out of a crime family for fucking the boss' wife, joins another crime family and marries the daughter against the father's will. Tragedy ensues on their wedding day.
What's a little weird is how the wife is depicted as very much in love, but the PC isn't really reciprocating no matter your choices. This only changes very suddenly on their wedding day. On top of that the PC conveniently loses his memory, seemingly only so other LIs will also get a chance with him. But be aware that the game will actually try to pull your heart strings, if you decide to cheat.

 

[Raife]

Worlds of Wonders
Modern fantasy like sorcerer or reluctant archon. Is story heavy but MC does have a magic dick if that is a dealbreaker.

This doesn't look like my bag... but it could cause interesting/amusing cognitive dissonance for jufot. He _loves_ fantasy and world-building, particularly in the games you mention. BUT he loathes magic penis-ism (although it would be amusing if it were a genuinely magic, magic penis, like Harry Potter's wand.)

I admire _Sorcerer_ for its world building and non-traditional LIs... but the sex is _not_ good... sufficiently bad, in fact, that it actually detracts from the story. Sex in _Sorcerer_ is so mechanical that it undercuts the LI relationships, from my point of view... although I understand that the MC is a bit of an oddball.

 

[Raife]

You'll have some people who will feel that if you don't have a sex scene in the first 5 minutes, it's boring and not worth their time. And you'll have others who feel that if sex happens in the first few hours, it's too soon.

Tlaero

So... speaking of fickle players and their annoying complaints... I have some whinging to do.

Devs... can we please have a more diverse cast of male MCs? There seems to be a proliferation of alpha male, ex-athlete, rich, successful, confident, authority figures (ex-cops, ex-military) with rather large cocks filling this role.

Since I was not born yesterday, I quite understand why so many MCs fall into this type... players want to play out a fantasy. (Or... worse... they want to play a slightly improved version of themselves... which is why we also have so many quasi incel MCs in their early 20s with unaccountably large penises.)

I get a kick out of playing more complex, troubled male MCs. For example:

• Edward in _Corporate Culture_ is totally screwed up for reasons that are well described in the story... but I think that makes playing him, and navigating the plot and his relationships, far more interesting.
• The MC in _Hillside_ fits the alpha stereotype... except that he hates himself, and constantly doubts himself, because of his perceived failures.

[Let me be clear: I am not criticizing _your_ male MCs, Tlaero... most of them do not fit fit the cookie cutter I've described at all. I'm just whinging more generally about the state of male MCs in these games and how boring it is to play many of them.]

For example, I'd love to play a self-doubting MC with an l'espirit d'escalier problem that he gradually overcomes, or a guy with a giant dick... and an occasional impotence problem that is related to trauma or self-doubt. In Elsaverse terms, I'd like to play a male MC that more resembles Tlaero's female MCs... someone who is hurt, or wounded, or generally messed up... but who learns to persevere and overcome. I'd love to play that MC.

 

[Tlaero]

For example, I'd love to play a self-doubting MC with an l'espirit d'escalier problem that he gradually overcomes, or a guy with a giant dick... and an occasional impotence problem that is related to trauma or self-doubt. In Elsaverse terms, I'd like to play a male MC that more resembles Tlaero's female MCs... someone who is hurt, or wounded, or generally messed up... but who learns to persevere and overcome. I'd love to play that MC.

I recommend Chasing Beth.

Tlaero