Unreal Engine Completed Subverse [v1.1.1] [Studio Fow]

[ronadan]

Let people enjoy the content in their game and keep real-life concepts like "that girl cheated on me with X" out of it.

well unfortunately NTR and cheating are big, problematic subjects around here. many threads got struck by banhammer of mods because of offtopic talks and guess what? almost always there was an argument about NTR/cheating. there's for sure too much sensitivity about something you can avoid. I even remember someone posted a negative review about a game with similar features (avoidable NTR, could just turn it off at the start) and his reasoning was "he was missing out on content because he didn't like NTR". like dude, it's not like that's the only porn game in existence. if you don't like it, leave it to its fans. it's not like porn is your real life
I personally think if someone's familiar with studio Fow's work, themes like these are to be expected. they created some pretty hardcore videos. it's their style and their appeal, their "win condition". it's like watching their many rape-themed videos and then bombard them with comments like "I hate rape. this is wrong" or "why couldn't you make a vanilla porn video?"

 

[j4yj4m]

I see people here are again crying about NTR because they have nothing better to do. Because of you StudioFOW already did put that horrible pandora system into the game ruining sex scenes by not connecting them to the story and characters just so your insecure feelings wont get hurt by being "cucked".

Well, SFOW obviously didn't do it because some people complained, but because they wanted to tap into that huge playerbase to get additional revenue. You either write a game that appeals to the mainstream or you don't. In this case your complaint should really be directed at SOFW and not at those who don't like a certain kind of content. I think we agree that nobody would expect people to pay for a game they don't like.

Then again, the main problem seems to be that SOFW simply didn't bother to implement these things well. Most of this could have been avoided quite easily.

 

[xemurai]

i downloaded the full archive and it just brings up steam? how do i get it to play, anyone know?

 

[Joshua Tree]

i downloaded the full archive and it just brings up steam? how do i get it to play, anyone know?

Nope, never been brought up in this thread before.... Or maybe... that search feature up there can help you, or maybe the OP can too..

 

[xemurai]

Nope, never been brought up in this thread before.... Or maybe... that search feature up there can help you, or maybe the OP can too..

is that sarcasm? xD i genuinely don't know and i tried looking but i couldn't seem to find it. def would love a solution bc i waited hours to download it (':

 

[xemurai]

nvm i found the cracked files LOL

 

[Razrback16]

Well, SFOW obviously didn't do it because some people complained, but because they wanted to tap into that huge playerbase to get additional revenue. You either write a game that appeals to the mainstream or you don't. In this case your complaint should really be directed at SOFW and not at those who don't like a certain kind of content. I think we agree that nobody would expect people to pay for a game they don't like.

Then again, the main problem seems to be that SOFW simply didn't bother to implement these things well. Most of this could have been avoided quite easily.

Exactly. It's the fact that the developer wants to tap into more sales...which seems to be a pretty reasonable goal, it's just like other members mentioned already - their 'solution' handles the issue so poorly that they might as well have not made any changes to begin with and just gone balls to the wall on cuck type content with the mantics for the crowd that's into that. To me, not having to watch the scenes themselves isn't much of an improvement if the dialogue and codex entries referencing the events are still intact during the story. As myself and others have covered already this was actually pretty easy to avoid unless the xeno content is so deeply integrated into the narrative that it's unavoidable no matter what (a key reason to wait until the game is at v1.0 before even considering purchasing it).

We've seen good VNs created by dev teams consisting of one human being (City of Broken Dreamers, Being A DIK, etc.) that have complex dialogue and choice / event trees, and no one is even asking for that here - just having one branch where it either contains those references, or they are completely absent from the narrative was all that was really needed to address this and both parties would have been in good shape. And I want both parties to be in good shape. I want the people who are looking for mantic / beast stuff to be happy - I don't want content to be REMOVED from their version of the game, I just want options for our side so that both sets of gamers can be happy.

i downloaded the full archive and it just brings up steam? how do i get it to play, anyone know?

You need the crack files - they are in the OP I believe, but you can also just scroll up the thread a bit. I believe some others posted links to pre-cracked sources of the game.

 

[Joshua Tree]

is that sarcasm? xD i genuinely don't know and i tried looking but i couldn't seem to find it. def would love a solution bc i waited hours to download it (':

It's probably the most posted about thing next to the whole ntr debacle.. in the thread , so yeah...

 

[Joshua Tree]

We've seen good VNs created by dev teams consisting of one human being (City of Broken Dreamers, Being A DIK, etc.) that have complex dialogue and choice / event trees, and no one is even asking for that here - just having one branch where it either contains those references, or they are completely absent from the narrative was all that was really needed to address this and both parties would have been in good shape. And I want both parties to be in good shape. I want the people who are looking for mantic / beast stuff to be happy - I don't want content to be REMOVED from their version of the game, I just want options for our side so that both sets of gamers can be happy.

I don't want any shooting in GTA5, I just want the driving, and no guns and all that violence.... I don't want the cops to start chase me if I run people over either... how about it, can you make that happen?

It's simple, we play the games we like, and we avoid the ones we don't. If you feel the game have elements that isn't for you, then you stay away from it. Games is not made for everyone. If there is enough things I like in a game Vs things that doesn't really appeal that much I'm still inclined to play them. Then again, as for Subverse I think to much of myself to self insert to a dude with panties on his head. But if that is your cup of tea, by all means.

 

[DouglasCosta]

NLT Media was also in a similar situation and made the right decision to cut all the comic sensitivities thing like sharing, swinging, gangbang, rape ... etc when making video games to focus on vanilla route and making huge success. Fow Studio wants to satisfy both old and new fan and get caught up in this headache

 

[Razrback16]

I don't want any shooting in GTA5, I just want the driving, and no guns and all that violence.... I don't want the cops to start chase me if I run people over either... how about it, can you make that happen?

It's simple, we play the games we like, and we avoid the ones we don't. If you feel the game have elements that isn't for you, then you stay away from it. Games is not made for everyone. If there is enough things I like in a game Vs things that doesn't really appeal that much I'm still inclined to play them. Then again, as for Subverse I think to much of myself to self insert to a dude with panties on his head. But if that is your cup of tea, by all means.

It's not quite that black and white and I agree that every game is not made for everyone. This one is a gray zone currently. The studio clearly knows there's a good chunk of their target audience (normies) that aren't into the xeno / cuck stuff. And we know they are targeting normies with this game given how they (even Valen noted this) changed some of the forced content that they know is a turn-off to that demographic, but as others noted, this really wasn't a solution since they still contain narrative references to the content. So given what we know, the studio seems like they WANT people who are more into vanilla / romance content to buy their game, but there is a bit of a conflict with some of the content, there.

We're basically at a point now where some folks like enough of the game that they will continue following it in the hope that it ends up in a state they like enough to buy. But with the presence of these forced narrative elements, these people don't feel comfortable enough to pull the trigger on a purchase, and so they remain in a holding pattern so-to-speak to see how things end up. I'm basically in that boat. I think the graphics are great, I think the voice actors and actresses have done a good job and the story is interesting enough and I'd actually like to support them for those reasons. But I'm not going to buy the game with canonized xeno narrative elements.

NLT Media was also in a similar situation and made the right decision to cut all the comic sensitivities thing like sharing, swinging, gangbang, rape ... etc when making video games to focus on vanilla route and making huge success. Fow Studio wants to satisfy both old and new fan and get caught up in this headache

Can you fill us in on what happened with this? I'm not familiar with this company, so just curious what happened? What made them decide to change their content, exactly, was there an incident of some kind, etc.?

 

[NBV]

Yep, I remember people having this exact same NTR discussion months ago, not much has changed since then. It's amazing how the main criticism of Subverse in this forum went from the sex scenes being disjointed 10-second gifs that have no connection to the story, to some of those scenes being TOO CONNECTED to the story lol (the mantic scenes in Pandora that everyone says are canon NTR or whatever).

That's the problem with trying to appeal to a purely vanilla audience when the core of your game is just supposed to be wacky sex for all parties. There will always be those vanilla fans that will not be satisfied until the game has absolutely no mentions or even slight implications of these things. The only way to purely solve this problem is to either only appeal to one audience, which will likely fuck us monster sex fans over, or completely lock the different sides of content off with a main menu kill switch.

Well, SFOW obviously didn't do it because some people complained, but because they wanted to tap into that huge playerbase to get additional revenue.

Well, the complaints obviously didn't help. Even the staff within the discord on launch were answering critic on the system with it being changed to not upset those who don't want to see it. But yeah, we don't need to argue why they changed it. The best thing they can do is fix this change to make it more organic and less lazy. People on their Discord, their Reddit, and their Steam have all been suggesting the same kind of fix. What's left is to see if they actually take the feedback into account and try working around that idea. Nobody is saying they should take orders from their player base, but a sign of non-shit game dev is at least listening to what of the most agreed about critic your EA game is having and trying to build upon making it better. When almost everyone in the most opposing groups of fetish fanbase (the vanilla whiners vs everyone else) are able to agree that they'd be happy for a single main menu button to make these things simply not appear, then why is it so hard to build on that?

The fact of the matter is that they clearly want their game to have this kind of slutty mantic stuff, even if it's just small offhanded comments. Even when they tried appeasing to normies, they still have Lily reference her background with fucking aliens. Their own player base is flat out giving them the easy solution to being able to satisfy the players's want for more integrated mantic sex and Fow's obvious own want to see that happen.

[B]Joshua Tree[/B] constantly telling everyone that they should just not play it and that not every game is made for everyone simply doesn't work under these circumstances. StudioFow is TRYING to make the game for everyone, and failing at it. Their change in direction to issue the Pandora system and lock Mantic scenes outside of the main game was solely to make it usable to everyone. We're trying to talk about how they can do this better, since they've already made the decision that they want to appeal to the most whiniest type(the most extreme waifu/vanilla fans) of people possible.

 

[Joshua Tree]

It's not quite that black and white and I agree that every game is not made for everyone. This one is a gray zone currently. The studio clearly knows there's a good chunk of their target audience (normies) that aren't into the xeno / cuck stuff. And we know they are targeting normies with this game given how they (even Valen noted this) changed some of the forced content that they know is a turn-off to that demographic, but as others noted, this really wasn't a solution since they still contain narrative references to the content. So given what we know, the studio seems like they WANT people who are more into vanilla / romance content to buy their game, but there is a bit of a conflict with some of the content, there.

It's quite simple. They grew up, they got a proper game studio. They hired even more people, there is wages and bills to be paid. They are already making a game for a very small niche market in the game industry. There is nothing more wrong with doing that for them, than you have creators on patreon that bombard their games with a billion tags/fetishes to reach as many as possible. The effect is the same, people get upset, because they can't have the entire cake and eat it too.

NBV yeah it is that simple. If you don't like something then stay away from it, or you accept there is things you don't like there, but the good stuff outweighs it. Because the thing is, if "YOU" get it your way, there is other people that will complain they didn't get it their way. Scenes in pandora need to be unlocked by points you earn. They made it a player choice what to unlock and watch. That doesn't mean they made it for everyone. Just look at angsty people that get all riled up over a few lines of text in the story and codex. It's like some super religious person refused to read the bible because there so much horrible shit in it that they don't like or want to think about.

 

[j4yj4m]

That's the problem with trying to appeal to a purely vanilla audience when the core of your game is just supposed to be wacky sex for all parties. There will always be those vanilla fans that will not be satisfied until the game has absolutely no mentions or even slight implications of these things. The only way to purely solve this problem is to either only appeal to one audience, which will likely fuck us monster sex fans over, or completely lock the different sides of content off with a main menu kill switch.

You won't even need a switch. Just look Summertime Saga for example, which hides its "controversial" trans-content behind a well written two tier ingame choice. Up to this day there are players who played the whole game and who have no idea that the game even has this kind of content while those who like will reach it naturally (and can still decline if they don't want to see it in their playthrough). It's really not that hard if someone is willing to spend a little time and effort on it. Sure, a switch would be fine too but that's already kinda the cheap solution.

As said above, I don't like the vanilla/whiny narrative. They could have written a game for the "non vanilla/not whiney" audience some here describe, but then they'd have lost a ton of sales. The problem isn't that these players exist, the problem is that SOFW obviously caters to them to get their money. And if they do that, they better deliver on that "promise". It doesn't mean that they have to exclude everybody else, as many other games show, but essentially it's really that easy.

Ulitmately it looks like they want to please as many as possible but at least until now chose one of the worst ways to do it. I still hope they may learn from these mistakes and correct them at some point, especially since it's quite easily doable.

 

[Readerf2b]

I don't want any shooting in GTA5, I just want the driving, and no guns and all that violence.... I don't want the cops to start chase me if I run people over either... how about it, can you make that happen?

Maybe you shouldn't buy grand thieft auto and instead buy big rigs, lol.

It's simple, we play the games we like, and we avoid the ones we don't.

So critique is nonexistent in your world? Imagine hoi4, but where you cant play axis because some vocal idiots thinks it promotes fascism, but you are not suppose to say that its dumb.

 

[Joshua Tree]

Maybe you shouldn't buy grand thieft auto and instead buy big rigs, lol.


So critique is nonexistent in your world? Imagine hoi4, but where you cant play axis because some vocal idiots thinks it promotes fascism, but you are not suppose to say that its dumb.

Exactly and that is where you don't buy such games. There is a difference between critique something, and want changes that applies to your own preference. Because, screw all those other people right? There will always be unhappy people about something. And still the best thing is.. if you don't like something, stay away from it. Very simple that...

 

[Readerf2b]

There is a difference between critique something, and want changes that applies to your own preference.

There is no difference. When you critique something, it implies that something needs to change to make object of your critique better, at least in your own eyes, especially when its not about someone's preferences but base game feature being done poorly compared to analogues.

 

[Joshua Tree]

There is no difference. When you critique something, it implies that something needs to change to make object of your critique better, at least in your own eyes, especially when its not about someone's preferences but base game feature being done poorly compared to analogues.

No, because everyone have ideas for changes that would in their eyes make things better. It's subjective to your preference, regardless if you have other people that agree with you or not. Because there is other people out there with other ideas that you wouldn't like at all. Imagine they would implement every idea and suggestion people throw at them. How great a game that would make right?

 

[Readerf2b]

No, because everyone have ideas for changes that would in their eyes make things better. It's subjective to your preference, regardless if you have other people that agree with you or not. Because there is other people out there with other ideas that you wouldn't like at all. Imagine they would implement every idea and suggestion people throw at them. How great a game that would make right?

So valid critique, or mass of critique that have common ground is still what? Irrelevant? Comparison critique is irrelevant? You know, you should play big rigs, and than all you can say is that you liked or disliked it. You cant mention what they did wrong.

 

[Limited20]

It's not quite that black and white and I agree that every game is not made for everyone. This one is a gray zone currently. The studio clearly knows there's a good chunk of their target audience (normies) that aren't into the xeno / cuck stuff. And we know they are targeting normies with this game given how they (even Valen noted this) changed some of the forced content that they know is a turn-off to that demographic, but as others noted, this really wasn't a solution since they still contain narrative references to the content. So given what we know, the studio seems like they WANT people who are more into vanilla / romance content to buy their game, but there is a bit of a conflict with some of the content, there.

We're basically at a point now where some folks like enough of the game that they will continue following it in the hope that it ends up in a state they like enough to buy. But with the presence of these forced narrative elements, these people don't feel comfortable enough to pull the trigger on a purchase, and so they remain in a holding pattern so-to-speak to see how things end up. I'm basically in that boat. I think the graphics are great, I think the voice actors and actresses have done a good job and the story is interesting enough and I'd actually like to support them for those reasons. But I'm not going to buy the game with canonized xeno narrative elements.



Can you fill us in on what happened with this? I'm not familiar with this company, so just curious what happened? What made them decide to change their content, exactly, was there an incident of some kind, etc.?

I agree with you completely. Im also on the "Wait and see" with subverse.
But the voice acresses are simple carrying the game in my opion. Kili and Demi can just get me rock hard with their sultry voices


As for NLT media.
They were making hardcore NTR/Cuck/Sharing content at the start. They were making comics about sharing the the mothers, fucking around etc ....

People were not too happy with such content, so with their 1st game they removed almost all such elements from their game.
They made it so the comics are not canon.

But sadly the 1st game has a small sharing scene at the start (But the game is not an ntr,cuck,sharing game).
Some little loser ate out Amber's pussy and you then fucked her. That was the sharing scene. There is no more sharing after that.
The little loser is there to give you the Threat/Danger of NTR. But it never actually happnes.

People did not like that ... so they (the devs) went full vanilla in their next game Treasure of Nadia.
Treasures of Nadia is a full on harem game, where only the MC is fucking the girls. No sharing, no cuck stuff, no ntr, no sloppy seconds etc...
Its honestly one of the best games. The visuals are insane and the animations are smooth and hot.