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- Mar 25, 2023
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Yes, unfortunately Nika is useless from the waist down... Mr. Director, we need a new main protagonist...
I don't recall anything in the game that alluded to an upcoming time skip. What makes you think that?
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A time skip at this point makes very little sense to me.
Unless by time skip you mean Ocean the usual sweet time for the next release, then yeah, there probably will be a time skip in the near future.
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The only time skips I'm seeing is that we don't have to sit through the entire lectures but Nika does.
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I should have made it clear right away why I find Nika and Bella's actions against the Holgersons so bad. I just assumed you'd already seen my previous posts on this topic and I don't need to repeat it again.
Not the heist but the use of Vanessa makes them look particularly awful. Bob mentioned how sinister she is towards Mila, so indeed she might be involved. But before, she is presented as just Mario's girlfriend, she had nothing to do with what's going on between them. Even if Bella has seen her previously and made a bad impression of her, Bella never said why Vanessa deserved to be treated like that. Vanessa's perceived as innocent here.
Bella's convinced Stefan wants her mother. Hmm, let's assume. But at the same time, she doesn't have a problem giving him another woman for the sake of her and Nika's stupid plan. No doubt if it hadn't failed, they would have used her. And they didn't learn any moral lessons, they just shrugged and moved on. Give them a different victim and they'll try to do it again.
That alone is completely fucked up.
And for that reason, the restroom scene doesn't work for me. Just like the words that Nika says to Mila. Bella's regrets have no weight, so far they don't affect her actions. She has a selective sense of conscience. Nika who advises her to redeem herself for bullying a woman remains silent in the Vanessa situation. They're both blind.
Regarding Mila, I blame Nika for his stupidity that got her in trouble. How is he not responsible if he acted like an idiot when she told him not to do anything foolish? She acted like an adult, he acted like a child. Mario didn't say anything bad to her, he only insulted Nika's hair. And if Nika is involved in the heist, you may not see it as a big deal, but I find his act particularly pitiful given how disproportionate was his response. I don't get why I should treat it like it's not a big deal. In my eyes, that makes him an undeniably bad person.
Before the rework, Nika and Bella looked even worse. If I remember correctly, Bella mentioned that she had studied the layout of the Holgerson house and she knew the location of the security cameras. She was planned this in advance and she acted like someone for whom this wasn't the first heist. Nika had planned something specific against the Holgersons before they charged Mila. His dialog was rewritten and now he sounds less ominous. He came up with the plan on the fly... but was preparing just some ideas since they insulted Mila.
Overall, Nika and Bella are doing shitty things right now. I see no reason why they should be in a grey area. They're straight up awful people. I ofc don't consider them evil, that's too strong for their description.
What do you mean he told her she isn't this bad?
He explicitly said she isn't bad person, far from it.
And she replied to him, I know. And the story just moved on.
Meanwhile, they're doing awful things that aren't being judged at all.
I don't mind the characters making excuses for themselves. They are human, they can be wrong. But I'm not okay that the story that presents itself very seriously and supposed to be about healing and redemption gives this slack and doesn't show signs they're misguided.
This whole thing bothers me because Ocean isn't being completely honest about Nika and Bella's behavior, on purpose or not. This could be for the better or bad depending on how the story progress. But for now, this leads to a twisted view of the characters.
I'm not blaming him, by the way. He is hostage to the format in which he tells the story. And if he's telling it right, it'll probably be another two-three or ten
years before we get to a rethinking of Bella and Nika's behavior.The main factor that makes me trust him is Leia and the consequences she faces. He is very frank and honest about her, sometimes cruel. I love the way he reveals her. Of course, that doesn't mean he should treat Bella in the same manner. She's more likeable person. My favorite little moment with her is when she sees a child with parents and smiles. It was cute, I smiled back. I can't imagine Leia in her shoes.
Most WiAB characters are in a gray area because we know too little about them. But we know enough about Leia to conclude that she is without a doubt a bad person, personally I see her far worse than Bella and Nika.
Well, I'm not really interested in Marla either. If I had to choose between having a romance with her or Ayua in the game, I would choose Marla. And if I was offered a choice of which one of them should be a LI, I would choose Ayua. But only because Marla makes more sense as a lewdable, not because she's somehow worse than the rest of the LIs or Ayua. I hope I didn't confuse you with my train of thought here.Haha im just really not a age-gap fan and i love ayua
I'm pretty sure Ocean's intentionally creating this pathetic comic evil image around Stefan to trick our expectations. Bella says Stefan lusts after her mother, but I don't buy it. She doesn't provide any solid evidence. Her accusations of him being a pedophile look even more suspicious.
I also doubt Mario asked Stefan to press charges against Mila. From what we've seen of Mario, he looks more like a weak guy who got involved with bad company and blindly repeats after his rich friends so he doesn't get out of their circle. He acts very passive when he sees Mila, doesn't say anything against her, just smirks at his friends' comments, but immediately turns away when Nika stands up for her. The fact that Vanessa turned him into her play toy only confirms it.
Anyway, that's just my first impression of him. There's a possibility he doesn't actually hold any grudge against Mila and what is happening between them is somewhat similar to what happened between Mila and Bella when they were kids. It will be interesting if Mario has his own healing theme too.
I don't think the Holgersons are going after Mila because of some pettiness. I don't believe it also because it just doesn't take the plot anywhere. Either Stefan has plans for her or he somehow knows about Nika's involvement and he's using her as bait against him.
I've seen the suggestion that there might be conflict between the Holgersons and the Zanes. And at some point in the story the Zanes would stand up for Nika to save him from Stefan (BobTheDuck, if I remember correctly, you mentioned this possibility). But is there any indication of that in the game?
On the contrary, I get the impression that the Holgersons and the Zanes might be in the same boat. I think it's more likely that the Zanes, the Petrovas, the Reveras, the Holgersons and detective Ceril, all of them are part of the same criminal network. And the more we interact with them the closer we get to Leia and William.
If the Holgersons and Zanes are indeed working together, then I'm just taking a wild guess here: Stefan wants to get Mila to work at Leia's club. There are hints of this plot twist. Mila is poor and needs money. Bella's jokes about her working part-time as a prostitute. Mila's disapproval of Nia being a camgirl and then her shock when she hears how much Nia makes per day.
Yeah, the farm, nothing special. Except for the underground Gus Fring-type drug lab.
Depending on how big that lab was and what drugs they're developing there, it could have cost them as much as the entire Holgerson house, minus the gold panties... Just kidding, of course. But it still cost them a lot, I think.I just had a wild theory. What if Vanessa is lying about this "I'll never have to work" nonsense and is actually working for Leia at her club instead Emilio? She examines Mila, her future subordinate whom Stefan is offering to Leia. She establishes contacts with her in order to later influence her to work at the club. Evil, evil witch.
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For now Amber or Nami is going to revive El Peepee
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I only raised the thought to show we really don't know how these people interact. Mario and Stefan have been mentioned by two people as problems, Bella and Mila. Our eye witness example is he hangs around some entitled trash talkers. The Stefan we see in WiaB is far more personable. Stefan also doesn't send his son to his sister's gf's college. Zoey and Katie at least were dating even if that's no longer a thing (we don't know), so it appears that he is putting distance between himself and his childhood friends the Zanes. Keep in mind Stefan's wealth was not a thing in WiaB, his parents were losing money, so like the Zane's he is new money. Presumably, from riding the Zane's coat tails. Then we next see him at Relucia where he's meeting with representatives of different colleges, some of who are not great people. FInally, we know he files charges against Mila without evidence, and the whole deal with Vanessa. So we're predisposed to think of him as nefarious in some way. But he also appears independant of the Zanes to some extent, but Mario going to a different college.I've seen the suggestion that there might be conflict between the Holgersons and the Zanes. And at some point in the story the Zanes would stand up for Nika to save him from Stefan (@BobTheDuck, if I remember correctly, you mentioned this possibility). But is there any indication of that in the game?
On the contrary, I get the impression that the Holgersons and the Zanes are in the same boat. I think it's more likely that the Zanes, the Petrovas, the Reveras, the Holgersons and detective Ceril, all of them are part of the same criminal network. And the more we interact with them the closer we get to Leia and William.
If the Holgersons and Zanes are indeed working together, then I'm just taking a wild guess here: Stefan wants to get Mila to work at Leia's club. There are hints of this plot twist. Mila is poor and needs money. Bella's jokes about her working part-time as a prostitute. Mila's disapproval of Nia being a camgirl and then her shock when she hears how much Nia makes per day.
Yeah, the farm, nothing special. Except for the underground Gus Fring-type drug lab.
I just had a wild theory. What if Vanessa is lying about this "I'll never have to work" nonsense and is actually working for Leia at her club instead Emilio? Her behavior makes more sense now. She examines Mila, her future subordinate that Stefan is offering Leia. She establishes contacts with her in order to later influence her to work at the club. Evil, evil witch.
I think Ceril is actually a legit cop who is just a nasty person. Not sure she's corrupt, just a lack of compassion, a sense of judgment rather than justice.
But in this, we just have to stay aware of the crumbs, because we don't know all the connections. FInding out that ZOey is Bella and AMber's friend changes things a bit. Every revelation does.
Regarding Mila working at whatever the current version of Leia's club is, I guess that choice will be impacted by whether you choose to mention Venus to her or not. I think corruption paths with have to have some form or redeeming arc to make sense, otherwise I'd feel bad for Mila being dragged back into the life she tried to escape by leaving home. That would be a huge level of trauma in the game to deal with. Having said that, I think your idea of Vanessa working for the club could actually be a thing. That would explain her weird ideas about relationships a lot. But - she'd be noticed at the club, so she'd be known as the duty manage or whatever, wouldn't be able to hide that from her prestigious university, that she works for the head of a rival university in an upmarket gentleman's club. A club that Mario and his pals probably frequent though.
- Mar 25, 2023
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Guy in me feels bad for brothers who can't enter the land of honey. So I hope for the best.I envy your excessive optimism...
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It could have been a separate story here. Oh those wasted talents.
Bella knew the location of the cameras because she was in the house. I also know the complete location of the cameras in the nearest supermarket, there's nothing special about it at all..
Btw, can I ask? A couple of questions. Why is Vanessa such a saint? From the first second of her appearance, she is shown to be an arrogant manipulator, above anyone else. Is it a wonderful butt plug or heterochromia that makes her so praised? For about the entire season, nothing is known about her except a photograph.
Since when is a direct insult on the part of Stefan, nowhere more direct than that, except maybe the “mother of easy virtue” (but wait, this is also in that dialogue), is not a reason for punching a person... in the gilded face? What surprises me even more is that you are not the least bit confused by the reason for this attitude. Well, her absence. "Just because I can", because ass plug with inlay, “Archduke Joseph”, no less.
But, okay, it's not that important. What's more interesting is why we're so worried about Vanessa and not Brenda.
Well, yes, breaking up families is, of course, probably bad. But who's stopping Holgerson from keeping a goose in his pants? Do we assume that he will use it? No, really, it will hold it?
lol
P.S. In fact, here we can really get together in a barn and write a book, with half of the participants in the topic. We have one chapter and a mystery on a mystery. Even the prequel has not yet had time to give a picture of Holgerson, whether he really managed to fuck half the city, or whether Bella imagined it after the gummy bears.
By the way, where did the train of Ayua fans go? We've gotten to Bella, her personality is just developing, let her get drunk and sleep it off. By the way, where did the train of Ayua fans go? Attached to Bella, her personality is just developing, let her get drunk and sleep it off. Actually, as in the case of the protoganist, he still has a chance to find Ricardo Milos pants and go after the boys. Perhaps this is the solution to that problem. Well, which appeared in front of the restaurant..
We have a circle of aesthetes here
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Unfortunately, not. The full download only had the PC version. For the MAC I downloaded the compressed MAC from one of the great, benevolent compressors. I struggle with tech, so I haven't been able to convert the PC to MAC or work out why the "start label" can't be found. Thanks for asking. Take care.
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Download the version of renpy you need from the renpy site. They have instructions and there are other threads on the forum in this subsection where you can ask and get great help here. They'll be able to completely help I'm sure.
If you know how to right click and select "show package contents on the compressed mac, you basically can replace the "game" folder with the full PC game folder you downloaded (which in the mac is located in the package contents "contents/resources/autorun). Just overwrite that for a quick dirty fix, and learn to use renpy, I'm not great at explaining renpy before I've had more coffe than I've had today!
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What makes you think I or anyone else here sees Vanessa as a saint?
I'm probably the only person here who praises her. I find her a captivating character. Don't know about the butt plug, never had the experience. I hope she doesn't stab Nika with it when he goes after her. But yes, I love her heterochromia. I also love the visible veins on her chest and her appearance in general, her style and that mysterious dark vibe around her, her brevity and her habit of scanning people.
To me, she's the most intriguing LI so far.
However, I never considered her a good person, much less a saint.
Part of the reason I'm interested in her is because she's a bad person.
But her being a bad person doesn't excuse Nika and Bella one bit.
When they develop their plan, they don't care what kind of person Vanessa is.
Wrong. She is shown to be a silly rich girl that Bella and Nika think they can easily use. At least that's how Bella describes her after meeting her. Spoiled, but still innocent. Even if she had revealed her true nature to Bella, her being an arrogant manipulator doesn't make her a justifiable victim for their plan.
I didn't understand anything you wrote here.
Please point out the moment you are referring to.
Who cares about this Brenda?
Bella showed regrets. Deal with it.
Bella's mother is the perfect candidate for it. She seems like an intelligent and educated person who also well versed in psychology. I'm sure she's more than capable of dealing with this sleazy womanizer.
Clearly not Bella and Nika. So far, these two have hurt themselves, the people around them, but not their target.
And again, Bella's accusations have no evidence whatsoever. At the same time she's easily emotional and antagonizes with every other person she meets. Her fans recognize that she is a very fragile, vulnerable creature. Do you find it wise to take such a person at their word and then ruin other people's families and lives?
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- Dec 24, 2018
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Which, as you've already pointed out makes them pathetically bad people, rather than effectively bad people. If they had succeeded, then what? They prove to themselves that they can do bad things and get away with it.
One interesting thing is to see where this plot thread goes. The initial plan was to monitor Stefan's movements over several dinners, Nika was to get a sense for his habits and so forth. There wasn't meant to be any epiphany in the plan, no target like Brenda. And how did Bella know to get the mobile slurper thing? That wasn't part of the plan either... To some extent, this is just an action scene based on Mission Impossible or something with weird hair Tom Cruise wannabe and Bond girl. It exists to give Bella and Nika reasons to interact outside of the college/homework paradigm, so we can see their character outside of the soocial structures. To some extent, I think it'll end up being a bit of a dead end, and they'll get some minor reprimand.
If Ocean is planning to develop this further after Bella meets with Holgerson, and if we get more Mission Impossible in the gala when its time for that, it's because Ocean wants to show enabling relationships. That will then lead to Bella and Nika having to learn to start afresh without enabling each other. In this sense (I hope anyway) we'll see an actual romance rather than two people setting each other off like a drag race, and I say that as someone who is not interested that much in Bella.
Bella talking to her sister and the locker room scene are maybe the only times we've seen her talking completely honestly. In the locker room scene they both realise they are enablers, and they are drawn together for those reasons in my opinion.