Dr.TSoni

Well-Known Member
May 20, 2022
1,506
4,892
So what has Ocean done? He's made changes that mean the games that he's invested more than half a decade into aren't a negative statistic by reworking things that are problematic for the ongoing story. There are quite a few examples of this. Ocean has been the most dramatic in changing the fundamental direction of SG and starting from the ground up with WiaB.
I have three problems with this point:
- Ocean has never been clear about it and instead of telling us outright "I've got the Patreon inquisition so far up my ass, if they spits it's coming out of my mouth." he came up with "artistic decisions".
- He didn't make these changes, the problem arose with the suppression of WiAB from there to the release on Steam could have fixed the relationship between Nami and Nika in Season 1
- The change he wants to make to WiAB could potentially change the very core of the story
 

Elduriel

Forum Fanatic
Donor
Mar 28, 2021
4,662
8,486
I'm also very fussy lol...and getting more so as I get older. This is a great example, were it nor for WIAB, I'd have dropped this a long time ago too ;)
I'll probably play each new update that comes out, but I'm nowhere near as enthusiastic about it as I was a couple years ago. Too much disappointment as to how the dev process was handled. So I'm just tagging along, but don't really give a shit.
 

sorco2003

Engaged Member
Donor
Sep 3, 2020
2,032
14,851
Well, that's the thing, I COULD give examples, but it's against the rules ...which makes me look like a wanker saying it. But my sample size is based on having a current watch list of 320, having played 94 games that got abandoned, 34 games that got completed, and having a further 77 games that I've partially played that have been completed (that aren't on my watch list). This means I have years worth of material to play, some of which might be shit, but I'll delete when I discover that.

I tend to give things a chance, and by looking at the number of abandond games I've played (some of them absolute gems better than the average released) I see that same stat on the site. There are WAY more RenPy games that get abandoned than finished (I almost only play RenPy games): on the site, 41.7% of RenPy games are abandoned, 28.1% completed and 29.1% are in active development, including games that haven't seen an update in a year. Is this because the renders make it appear less of a fantasy to the censors? Most likely. RenPy devs don't have a good average.

That implies my sample size is pretty large even if I'm only active in this thread - I mean, I have been here since 2018, like an absolute leech :coffee::whistle: What I've noticed is the biggest changes are usually finding the simplest ways around incest and school settings. ONe game got abandoned for non consensual sleep sex, it was a vague horror.

So what has Ocean done? He's made changes that mean the games that he's invested more than half a decade into aren't a negative statistic by reworking things that are problematic for the ongoing story. There are quite a few examples of this. Ocean has been the most dramatic in changing the fundamental direction of SG and starting from the ground up with WiaB.

The problem isn't the continuity of the story, but the continuity of our memories of what we played last. If you can divorce what you remember from what's in front of you, the continuity within the published form of the game really has one glaring issue, that that's the nature of Nika and Nami's past. That's Ocean's biggest omission. But that hasn't made sense from any version of the game. Most of the things that don't make sense (other than the bad writing of cat scratches, impossible timelines and cabin distances) are trying to reconcile our memories of the previous versions.

The canon isn't an ironclad plot, it is simply the officially published plot that the author has released. Steam isn't early access for SG, so therefore, we assume a finished season. The bad will Ocean would generate by changing season 1 would outweigh most benefits of the time wasted doing it. I won't put it past him, but it's less likely now it's behind him.

As far as grand statements though, changes to characters - Nia, Robin, Kate, Maja, Sasha, Sonja, Jeff, Trey, Zara, Vanessa, Amber, Nadia, Kate ...the vast majority have had no substatial changes to their continuity. Some of that is lack of content, but it is mostly Bella, Nami, Mila, Vic and Nika who have suffered. Bella hasn't changed but been toned down. Her story is essentially the same as it always has been, but it's lost a bit of impact. Nami is the one has suffered the most, and she is the one that is the biggest potential to cause Ocean issues. Mila ...her story hasn't changed at all. But who is Mila, I can't guess day to day what she'll look like. At least now I have a face that's relatively consistent (but not 100% ...lets pretend it's makeup or something). Vic has had the same problem as Mila, it's mostly cosmetics that have changed, but she's more consistent. Ayua, again, cosmetics, like Robin - their stories are still mostly the same, just expanded.

Nika, Nami and Noji are the real ones with the problems, as they have changed between versions in dramatic ways. We've debated how that's changed, and mostly it's because we remember the old versions and hold onto them.

If we talk WiaB, since the reboot - what continuity errors? Again it's our expectations based on the memories of the old versions that make us unhappy with what's in front of us. I've made a decision to try to keep a separation between the old, redundant canon of pre-rework in both games so I can try to see the games as someone who stumbles across it now for the first time. Of course I still reference the old versions about things I hope to see, like Donna and Elena's involvement in WiaB and how they become part of ZPR - because currently none of that material even exists, it's only hints.

Anyway, you've seen me write all this stuff before. It's just that tiresome point when people go, "hey NIka has green eyes and Leia has green eyes! Wow". We ALL know Ocean's on patreon, end of similarity right there.



I think I've addressed this, my hyperbole is about as dramatic as people making connections to abandoned content. I didn't even include a picture of Katie in my ted talk. It's time for more interesting things, like coffee or an update :coffee::whistle:



Edit: Actually, thinking more about the numbers here - of the games you are interested in, as opposed to discounted due to no interest - those 20 that were dropped were dropped because they changed right? The other 561 were just things you decided you didn't like. So of the things that interested you that are in current development, there are 89 threads, you dropped 20 of those due to changes and 15 more are likely to be dropped. 35/89 is roughly 2/5ths. 39% risk of changes that cause you to drop a game (that interests you) because it shifts too far from what attracted you are pretty significant odds. Even if we discount the 20, it's 1 in 5 games that are in development (that you're interested in) that have changes causing you to potentially drop them. Again, that's not insignificant.
Wow! It's been a long time since I've seen such a big wall of text. I understand the original point, proposing that William is the father of the MC of SG based on the asset of the first William resembling the asset of the third MC of SG is stretching the limits of reality too much. For the rest exposed here, well, we all have to agree that the explanations only serve those who want to accept them, and even many who don't accept them still stay here and download the game.
In my particular case, I've always said that to abandon games there has to be a deal breaker, and it doesn't necessarily come from the changes. I abandoned SG because it dangerously approaches spoilers of important things for WIAB, even though I often shared that the old story resonated with me better than this new iteration, but even with the old game, I would have abandoned it at the same point. I abandoned a game because I felt deceived by the relationship with a character that I thought was more of a father-daughter relationship and it turned out to be a LI. I abandoned another game because it takes too long (the irony is total).
In another because they decided to remake an avn as a sandbox... and so hundreds of examples where the deal breaker varies.
And obviously, I've abandoned games because I didn't like them!"
 

BobTheDuck

Engaged Member
Dec 24, 2018
2,118
12,322
I'm also very fussy lol...and getting more so as I get older. This is a great example, were it nor for WIAB, I'd have dropped this a long time ago too ;)
Same - I am fussy, but I download anyway, and bookmark anyway. Most games coming out now are usually at a minimum of where OG WiaB or SG was at, most are better. WiaB and SG just got in before the rush. What OCean has done with the reworks isn't perfect, but moved the bar. I still want to know what happens next, and that's really all that needs to be said, even though I toy with theories while waiting. I also only really engage with these threads because of the people here.

I have three problems with this point:
- Ocean has never been clear about it and instead of telling us outright "I've got the Patreon inquisition so far up my ass, if they spits it's coming out of my mouth." he came up with "artistic decisions".
- He didn't make these changes, the problem arose with the suppression of WiAB from there to the release on Steam could have fixed the relationship between Nami and Nika in Season 1
- The change he wants to make to WiAB could potentially change the very core of the story
1. Of course Ocean can't be outright about patreon. If he said that, they would be so far up his ass he wouldn't be able to talk. "Aha! You admitted it WAS what we suspected! No subs for YOU!" Youay don'tay talkay aboutay theay inquisitionay.
2. The changes haven't had an effect, and we don't know what form the changes will be. So we don't know if it affects the relationship. We still don't know what Ocean intended, or how the change will impact what we haven't had revealled. The WiaB change might not have any affect on Nika and Nami's story. It is only the assumptions we *cherish* without any other evidence other than model and eye colour similarities that make us think we're in on a nudge nudge wink wink moment now. Sure that can change, but at the moment it's an assumption - since season 1 came out, there was no evil modder. But until we know what that changes do in practical terms, it's premature to wonder about the effects downstream. One step at a time.
3. Or it might not. Because in that devlog, Ocean talked about telling the story he wished to tell. Maybe it will be streamlined rather than byzantine.

It just waiting to see what the update brings that is making us eat too much popcorn.

Anyway, happy end of a crazy year, may the new year be kinder to us all :)
 

rudy007

Engaged Member
Mar 17, 2021
2,486
6,260
I have a feeling Ocean scraped many alternative routes with LI's. He simple realized that game will be never finished how he meaned to do it. We will probably get one update of each game this year. I will say the truth; I still looking forward to it!


This year was a difficult year for us who love Ocean's games, but I know it was a difficult for Ocean too. The problem I see with this Patreon situation is similar to many other devs; you rework the game or you stop. What I don't understand devs waited to the last moment and then tried on other sites. It's TWO years since Patreon started to kick developers and barely anybody moved a finger. And when they were kicked out, panic, disbelief... You simply cannot put your finger into ear and sing LA LA LA for two years and hope everything will go away.


I hope Ocean can still fix it, primarily I hope for WIAB, and for SG too, it's WIAB's sequel. Sequel doesn't make sense if WIAB is bad. And fast.

And no more fixing characters and their tits; Vic, Mila, Leia. And any other change what no one asked for; Ayua, Nojiko...
 

LHDLLB

Active Member
Oct 3, 2019
815
1,881
The problem isn't the continuity of the story, but the continuity of our memories of what we played last. If you can divorce what you remember from what's in front of you, the continuity within the published form of the game really has one glaring issue, that that's the nature of Nika and Nami's past. That's Ocean's biggest omission. But that hasn't made sense from any version of the game. Most of the things that don't make sense (other than the bad writing of cat scratches, impossible timelines and cabin distances) are trying to reconcile our memories of the previous versions.

The canon isn't an ironclad plot, it is simply the officially published plot that the author has released. Steam isn't early access for SG, so therefore, we assume a finished season. The bad will Ocean would generate by changing season 1 would outweigh most benefits of the time wasted doing it. I won't put it past him, but it's less likely now it's behind him.

As far as grand statements though, changes to characters - Nia, Robin, Kate, Maja, Sasha, Sonja, Jeff, Trey, Zara, Vanessa, Amber, Nadia, Kate ...the vast majority have had no substatial changes to their continuity. Some of that is lack of content, but it is mostly Bella, Nami, Mila, Vic and Nika who have suffered. Bella hasn't changed but been toned down. Her story is essentially the same as it always has been, but it's lost a bit of impact. Nami is the one has suffered the most, and she is the one that is the biggest potential to cause Ocean issues. Mila ...her story hasn't changed at all. But who is Mila, I can't guess day to day what she'll look like. At least now I have a face that's relatively consistent (but not 100% ...lets pretend it's makeup or something). Vic has had the same problem as Mila, it's mostly cosmetics that have changed, but she's more consistent. Ayua, again, cosmetics, like Robin - their stories are still mostly the same, just expanded.

Nika, Nami and Noji are the real ones with the problems, as they have changed between versions in dramatic ways. We've debated how that's changed, and mostly it's because we remember the old versions and hold onto them.
I will address just a few points because the discussion about the infinites changes made is tiresome at this point.I agree with you regarding the Cannon and ultimately is a Oceans decision. I don’t think you are wrong but this changes hurts the story and makes it harder to engage with it.Precisely because people grow attached to the first story they experienced. We can try to experienced it as the the others do not exist, but they do, and people will like one or the other more. Ocean changing character, names, relationships turns what should be solid foundation into shaking grounds, and then, I can't get invested into a story if two updates ahead I can't be sure the the story that I like now still will be the story that I like then.


Regarding Nami and Nika and Noji. They definitely had a clear definition up to chapter 3 I think. The problem is Ocean wanting to have his cake and eat it too. Noji is less of a problem but Nami is a torn on his side that I don't know if he can handle it. And it is not a small part of the story, Nami is a huge part of the story.
 
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Dr.TSoni

Well-Known Member
May 20, 2022
1,506
4,892
1. Of course Ocean can't be outright about patreon. If he said that, they would be so far up his ass he wouldn't be able to talk. "Aha! You admitted it WAS what we suspected! No subs for YOU!" Youay don'tay talkay aboutay theay inquisitionay.
In short
tenor (1).gif
3. Or it might not. Because in that devlog, Ocean talked about telling the story he wished to tell. Maybe it will be streamlined rather than byzantine.
For now we are at Schrödinger's cat stage until chapter 4 comes out
 
Mar 29, 2023
27
5
Combined Mod
View attachment 3966847


I want to play with SG1 original game (without incest and uncensored) with all the cinematics, uncut scenes, and original music. So, I combined,
Walkthrough Mod, Music Restoration Mod, Uncut Mod, and Gallery Unlocker and Cheat (it came from Scrappy).

Note:
It will not work with previously saved files. You may need to restart to enjoy the full game experience.

Change log:
25-Aug-2-24,
Combined all media files
Review and update scripts and dialogs
GUI updates

Installation:
  1. Remove all other mods or Install orginal game without any other mods.
  2. Extract and copy the game folder from this mod
  3. Merge with original game directory. If it's asking to replace, you can replace.
Android:
This mod is working with Android also. Download Android version from this post https://f95zone.to/threads/summers-gone-s1-steam-dlc-oceanlab.29981/post-13709619 and extra the game folder contents into (your device)\Documents\RenPy_Saves\com.koga3.summersgoneseason1\game\.

Download: Pixeldrain
Happy new year everyone and Thank you very very much for combining the mods.
I just wanted to ask which file do I replace or add to include the incest patch and I just wanted to confirm this but I am using this with kogas Android port
So, there's no compatibility issue there right or any tips that I should look out for and this has scrappy's latest wt mod and kogas gallery mod right?
 
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John972

Well-Known Member
Apr 24, 2018
1,101
3,530
Man I feel fortunate to have only found this game in the last 4-5 months. I've tried twice but couldn't find myself getting into WIAB. I have read some of the multipage dissertations of complaints about reworks here, but so far I've enjoyed SG without having to worry about past versions or other connected games.
Man, what I'd give for a pill to put me in your state, you lucky bastard! :) There are many here - including me - who have followed the Ocean saga for years and cannot unsee what we've seen. I think it doesn't help that updates for both games are so few and far apart that we cannot help but fear story changes with every update - simply because that's exactly what has happened over the last few years.

I look forward to a time where both AVN stories progress without major drama,
 
4.30 star(s) 547 Votes