VN Ren'Py Abandoned Sunville [v0.7beta3] [feierflei]

[TheDevian]

Even before Hannah and the "blackmail-but-not-really" thing, she seemed more submissive to me, personally at least. Marlene was the first instance of dominant action, and that didn't happen for a while - all of this is light, mind you, so when I say she was submissive I don't mean "crawl around on the floor and beg" extreme submissive, just that she would be much more likely to be submissive to SOME extent rather than dominant in a given situation.

Meanwhile, there was at the very least Maria, Hannah, the clothes store events, all with characters directing Lea to do things she was very much not comfortable with at the time and her doing them because she gave in after a push - which, yes, she enjoys exhibitionism, but that flavour of "doing exhibitionism things somewhat grudgingly and because someone else tells you to rather than because you choose to with no external influence" was very present in the first section of the game, and not really at all later.

Now, I personally took that as meaning that her exploration of exhibitionism was being propelled along and enabled by her submissiveness to others, who helped her push her boundaries - whereas later, she took the more dominant role with those very same characters, generally being the one telling THEM to do things.

The alternative is that she wasn't really submissive in the first place but rather was just embarrassed, which would make her not a switch but rather an undiscovered dom with confidence issues; but if that's the case, then there's still something I feel that's been lost along the way, because now she just, does exhibitionist things completely at her choosing whenever the situation arises, with no embarrassment, no hesitation, and barely a flat "whoops, oh well" when she gets caught out.

I suppose I miss the innocence and sweetness of early-game Lea, if nothing else, because I personally found that element of embarrassment and vulnerability - and how she grappled with and overcame those things in the moment while still very much feeling them, and while actually enjoying the embarrassment itself as she had said early on multiple times - cute and endearing.

If the dev's intention was that Lea was really a closet dom all along, rather than substantially submissive, fair enough.
I can't and wouldn't really try to argue that, because they'd know their intention best of course; it's just that I don't think that really came across super well in the writing.

It's not bad by any means, I LIKE the writing, the characters, and the situations a great deal.
I just think I liked the earlier character dynamics more, personally.

She was a fish out of water at first, a new town, a new school, and so on. She was nervous, and out of her element. It only makes sense that she would grow more confident as the story progresses. Character development is a good thing. The more she got used to the place, the new rules, the new people, and so on, the more confident she became, just like she told the other girls, she is comfortable in her own skin and it makes her more bold.

Had she been a sub, who was only doing things because she was told, and liked being pushed around, I would have stopped playing it, just like most other games like that. The same reason I started off not liking Hannah, I hate that stuff. I did get a little nervous when the blackmail started, but it did not last long, and she was not like that the rest of the time.

I would assume you just expected such things, because it is so fucking common in these games. If you have a female protagonist in a game with exhibitionism, odds are, she is going to be blackmailed, pushed around, and forced to do all kinds of things (and every guy around), because a strong woman is too much of a turn off for the insecure little boys, and we can't have a woman enjoying herself, she has to do what she is told.

Some of her early events were forced (not the beach though), but like Hannah said, she saw herself in Lea, and was doing that to encourage her, and once Lea discovered that she did like it, she no longer needed it, and Hannah also said that she never intended to do anything if Lea had refused, she was just playing around, even going as far as to switch places with Lea, and allow herself to be told what to do for a bit as well. It's a bit of a game they play now.

You are right, 'switch' is a bit of an overstatement, but she certainly leans more to the dom side, but she doesn't mind playing the sub role occasionally for fun too, with the right person (as Lara said in the last post).

But that is the thing, we can't all stay innocent and embarrassed in that situation forever, she has to get used to it eventually, but that is why we have new characters being added to the "naked club", to allow for that same feeling, without having stagnation. It was like she said in some of the earlier events, she had to stop lying to herself that she didn't like it, and once she embraced that fact, she gained a lot of confidence, and really learned to enjoy herself.

We all gain confidence when we are good at something we enjoy, and Lea is learning to be a leader. Taking the best from her mentors, and rolling it all into herself. Personally, I think it's been fun to watch her gain that confidence, and grow as a person, while she takes over as the corrupter, graduating as the corruptee. She already passed Hannah, and started corrupting her more, and at this rate she will even pass Ellie by the end of the semester, becoming more powerful than you could ever imagine... wait, what? lol

At first, we had Maria encouraging her to get naked in public (no sub, just equals having fun), then you had Hannah's little blackmail game, Ellie pushed her boundaries a bit after that, just to see how far she was willing to go, and then it was just that bit with Nadine where the two of them were going a bit out of their normal comfort zone with each other. After that, you are right, we had the boat ride and Lea got a real taste of being a dom, with not only Marline, but her mom.

Ellie is great, in so many ways, but she only really plays at being a dom, it's not her kink. Whereas on the boat, she ran into Ophelia, and that was the last piece she needed. Now she is like a kid in a candy store, she found something she really likes, and she is trying to get everyone else to love it too, and like Hannah did with her, she is willing to do a lot to encourage it.

The three of them (Ellie, Lea, and Hannah), are a pushing each other to go further and further all the time (their kinks are compatible that way), and they are taking everyone else along for the ride.

Okay, so yeah, long story short (too late), Lea is not a sub, but she allows herself to be pushed into doing things that she really wants to do anyway, plausible deniability, after all.

 

[Gwydion]

She was a fish out of water at first, a new town, a new school, and so on. She was nervous, and out of her element. It only makes sense that she would grow more confident as the story progresses. Character development is a good thing. The more she got used to the place, the new rules, the new people, and so on, the more confident she became, just like she told the other girls, she is comfortable in her own skin and it makes her more bold.

Had she been a sub, who was only doing things because she was told, and liked being pushed around, I would have stopped playing it, just like most other games like that. The same reason I started off not liking Hannah, I hate that stuff. I did get a little nervous when the blackmail started, but it did not last long, and she was not like that the rest of the time.

I would assume you just expected such things, because it is so fucking common in these games. If you have a female protagonist in a game with exhibitionism, odds are, she is going to be blackmailed, pushed around, and forced to do all kinds of things (and every guy around), because a strong woman is too much of a turn off for the insecure little boys, and we can't have a woman enjoying herself, she has to do what she is told.

Some of her early events were forced (not the beach though), but like Hannah said, she saw herself in Lea, and was doing that to encourage her, and once Lea discovered that she did like it, she no longer needed it, and Hannah also said that she never intended to do anything if Lea had refused, she was just playing around, even going as far as to switch places with Lea, and allow herself to be told what to do for a bit as well. It's a bit of a game they play now.

You are right, 'switch' is a bit of an overstatement, but she certainly leans more to the dom side, but she doesn't mind playing the sub role occasionally for fun too, with the right person (as Lara said in the last post).

But that is the thing, we can't all stay innocent and embarrassed in that situation forever, she has to get used to it eventually, but that is why we have new characters being added to the "naked club", to allow for that same feeling, without having stagnation. It was like she said in some of the earlier events, she had to stop lying to herself that she didn't like it, and once she embraced that fact, she gained a lot of confidence, and really learned to enjoy herself.

We all gain confidence when we are good at something we enjoy, and Lea is learning to be a leader. Taking the best from her mentors, and rolling it all into herself. Personally, I think it's been fun to watch her gain that confidence, and grow as a person, while she takes over as the corrupter, graduating as the corruptee. She already passed Hannah, and started corrupting her more, and at this rate she will even pass Ellie by the end of the semester, becoming more powerful than you could ever imagine... wait, what? lol

At first, we had Maria encouraging her to get naked in public (no sub, just equals having fun), then you had Hannah's little blackmail game, Ellie pushed her boundaries a bit after that, just to see how far she was willing to go, and then it was just that bit with Nadine where the two of them were going a bit out of their normal comfort zone with each other. After that, you are right, we had the boat ride and Lea got a real taste of being a dom, with not only Marline, but her mom.

Ellie is great, in so many ways, but she only really plays at being a dom, it's not her kink. Whereas on the boat, she ran into Ophelia, and that was the last piece she needed. Now she is like a kid in a candy store, she found something she really likes, and she is trying to get everyone else to love it too, and like Hannah did with her, she is willing to do a lot to encourage it.

The three of them (Ellie, Lea, and Hannah), are a pushing each other to go further and further all the time (their kinks are compatible that way), and they are taking everyone else along for the ride.

Okay, so yeah, long story short (too late), Lea is not a sub, but she allows herself to be pushed into doing things that she really wants to do anyway, plausible deniability, after all.

I guess all of that is fair, although I still think it also doesn't entirely line up with the development of the character in-game.
I also hate non-con stuff and blackmail, so that's not at all the part I miss.
But the thing is that for the first chunk of the game Lea LIKED the embarrassment, that was specifically stated as being part of her kink, and I enjoyed her enjoyment - it wasn't humiliation, which I also would have hated, she just found that feeling embarrassed and vulnerable was a huge turn-on, and I liked seeing her getting to experience that.
You could tell in a lot of the interactions between Lea and characters giving her those pushes that the intention of the pushing was to have fun rather than anything oppressive (Hannah outright stated as much when she worried that she was upsetting Lea, and Lea in turn told her that she enjoyed being embarrassed and was just feeling momentarily overwhelmed), and that everyone involved WAS having fun.

But now, nothing fazes her really, and it kind of feels like that particular spark is gone from her exhibitionism, which is a shame - if anything, I suppose what I liked MOST about early-game Lea was her bravery, because even with all the embarrassment and occasional panic she felt in those situations, when she was given that extra push (at first by her friends, but it could just as easily have been from her own thoughts) she CHOSE to do the thing she really wanted in spite of the anxiety she was feeling.

Now that part of the game has all been transferred to other characters, which is okay I guess but seeing as how we spend most of our time with Lea, and she IS the main draw of the game after all, it's a shame it's no longer experienced through/by her, and that a thing she enjoyed is no longer present for her.

So no, sure, it wasn't submissiveness, as such, that she was showing and that I miss - it was how she responded to embarrassing situations and chose to continue after getting a little push from somewhere necause she wanted to, but also that element of NEEDING that push, having that courage, rather than everything just being easy and of no concern to her.

I realise that you addressed many of those same points, it just seems we have slightly different perspectives on the direction in which they've developed.

For an outside example, you have Captain Grumpypants from A9 who is in a very similar spot to early Lea - she's a bit of a sub, sure, but for her it's mostly about allowing herself to do the exhibitionist things she wants, with the safety net of it initially being the MC who gives her that push, helps give her that confidence and permission to do so. She also starts doing things on her own, or even seeks out the MC directly, but never loses that element of embarrassment at being caught out either.

It's not that subs are inherently weak and lack confidence either, or that to gain confidence means "progressing" into being dominant - far from it, it takes a lot of courage to allow yourself that vulnerability, and often takes none at all to boss people around.
That actually might be a major part of the issue for me, now that I think of it - that as Lea has gained confidence in herself she's automatically become dominant, which feels like it reinforces that stereotype.

I said in an earlier comment too that I'm surprised that all of this hasn't progressed into very much sex, comparatively almost none, since that seemed like the natural next step of "new and exciting" experiences for the characters to move into, with a vast scope for potentially embarrassing situations for them to find themselves in - but I guess that may still come later.

 

[dolfe67]

So what kind of choices are there if you can't choose to be sub/passive or dom/proactive? Can you refuse some events? Or is this mostly kinetic?

 

[Gwydion]

So what kind of choices are there if you can't choose to be sub/passive or dom/proactive? Can you refuse some events? Or is this mostly kinetic?

It's mainly kinetic, there are various sets of events to play through, and the character develops and reacts on her own rather than requiring the player to make her choices for her.

I'm not certain, actually, whether there is anything optional apart from the couple of male-involving scenes that you get prompted as to whether you want to see them or not - like, I don't remember whether you can choose not to do some or any of the sets of side events, or whether they have dependencies other than reaching a certain number of days for example. But you can't opt out of, say, the 3rd beach bar event and then progress to the 4th one - you'd just not progress that set of events, if anything.

But I honestly haven't tried to skip anything other than the male stuff, which is why I can'tsay whether it's MAINLY kinetic, or ENTIRELY so - that being said, I'd imagine anything listed as a side-event is probably not mandatory, but like I said I suspect you'd be choosing not to do an entire set of events, rather than just one.

 

[TheDevian]

I guess all of that is fair, although I still think it also doesn't entirely line up with the development of the character in-game.
I also hate non-con stuff and blackmail, so that's not at all the part I miss.
But the thing is that for the first chunk of the game Lea LIKED the embarrassment, that was specifically stated as being part of her kink, and I enjoyed her enjoyment - it wasn't humiliation, which I also would have hated, she just found that feeling embarrassed and vulnerable was a huge turn-on, and I liked seeing her getting to experience that.
You could tell in a lot of the interactions between Lea and characters giving her those pushes that the intention of the pushing was to have fun rather than anything oppressive (Hannah outright stated as much when she worried that she was upsetting Lea, and Lea in turn told her that she enjoyed being embarrassed and was just feeling momentarily overwhelmed), and that everyone involved WAS having fun.

But now, nothing fazes her really, and it kind of feels like that particular spark is gone from her exhibitionism, which is a shame - if anything, I suppose what I liked MOST about early-game Lea was her bravery, because even with all the embarrassment and occasional panic she felt in those situations, when she was given that extra push (at first by her friends, but it could just as easily have been from her own thoughts) she CHOSE to do the thing she really wanted in spite of the anxiety she was feeling.

Now that part of the game has all been transferred to other characters, which is okay I guess but seeing as how we spend most of our time with Lea, and she IS the main draw of the game after all, it's a shame it's no longer experienced through/by her, and that a thing she enjoyed is no longer present for her.

So no, sure, it wasn't submissiveness, as such, that she was showing and that I miss - it was how she responded to embarrassing situations and chose to continue after getting a little push from somewhere necause she wanted to, but also that element of NEEDING that push, having that courage, rather than everything just being easy and of no concern to her.

I realise that you addressed many of those same points, it just seems we have slightly different perspectives on the direction in which they've developed.

For an outside example, you have Captain Grumpypants from A9 who is in a very similar spot to early Lea - she's a bit of a sub, sure, but for her it's mostly about allowing herself to do the exhibitionist things she wants, with the safety net of it initially being the MC who gives her that push, helps give her that confidence and permission to do so. She also starts doing things on her own, or even seeks out the MC directly, but never loses that element of embarrassment at being caught out either.

It's not that subs are inherently weak and lack confidence either, or that to gain confidence means "progressing" into being dominant - far from it, it takes a lot of courage to allow yourself that vulnerability, and often takes none at all to boss people around.
That actually might be a major part of the issue for me, now that I think of it - that as Lea has gained confidence in herself she's automatically become dominant, which feels like it reinforces that stereotype.

I said in an earlier comment too that I'm surprised that all of this hasn't progressed into very much sex, comparatively almost none, since that seemed like the natural next step of "new and exciting" experiences for the characters to move into, with a vast scope for potentially embarrassing situations for them to find themselves in - but I guess that may still come later.

While you are right, she did like the embarrassment, and she still does, the problem is, you cant stay embarrassed forever, even as they are stepping up their game. At least not to the same degree. We do see her talking about how she is too embarassed to go further, she just hides it better than she did. XD

Don't get me wrong, I love that embarrassment too, but for that we have the other girls, like Emma being my favorite in that regard right now.

I agree about the confidence thing, subs and doms are playing a role, and the best doms can play a sub too. In any healthy Sub/Dom relationship, the sub has at least as much power as the dom.

Canonically, the main reason is that the more sexual it is, the more illegal is it, and the more likely they would get in trouble for it. Outside of the game, that just isn't the main focus of it (which personally, I like, sex can get in the way of some good exhibitionism, depending on how it's done). It helps keep the 'wholesomeness' of the game, in my opinion.

As for A9, that is true, but Capt. GP is also more of a sub than Lea ever was (at least to my eyes), it is more than just having an excuse to indulge in her exhibitionist fantasies, but it is also about giving up control, she has been in charge for so long, with the weight of the world on her shoulders, she felt a huge relief when that was taken from her. At least, again, this is how I saw it.

 

[Gwydion]

While you are right, she did like the embarrassment, and she still does, the problem is, you cant stay embarrassed forever, even as they are stepping up their game. At least not to the same degree. We do see her talking about how she is too embarassed to go further, she just hides it better than she did. XD

Don't get me wrong, I love that embarrassment too, but for that we have the other girls, like Emma being my favorite in that regard right now.

I agree about the confidence thing, subs and doms are playing a role, and the best doms can play a sub too. In any healthy Sub/Dom relationship, the sub has at least as much power as the dom.

Canonically, the main reason is that the more sexual it is, the more illegal is it, and the more likely they would get in trouble for it. Outside of the game, that just isn't the main focus of it (which personally, I like, sex can get in the way of some good exhibitionism, depending on how it's done). It helps keep the 'wholesomeness' of the game, in my opinion.

As for A9, that is true, but Capt. GP is also more of a sub than Lea ever was (at least to my eyes), it is more than just having an excuse to indulge in her exhibitionist fantasies, but it is also about giving up control, she has been in charge for so long, with the weight of the world on her shoulders, she felt a huge relief when that was taken from her. At least, again, this is how I saw it.

All this talk has given me the urge to replay from the start so I can enjoy the whole thing all over again, and something I noticed straight away is that, at least at first, you actually do get some choice as to whether Lea acts bold or shy; given how long it's been since I've actually played the start, that may well be what I was remembering since shy is the way I was tending to play her - shyness rather than submissiveness (although there are some specific instances where she IS definitely submissive later).

Those kinds of choices do drop off after a while, so you do stop getting the opportunity to have her say she's not comfortable yet. Maybe that's part of why it seemed so drastic to me - my Lea went from generally shy to super-bold dom in the space of one afternoon on a boat, and I no longer had a say in it.

Regarding GP, I agree with you that she is somewhat more sub than Lea, more of a sub/exhibitionist mix; rather than Lea, who is an exhibitionist, with only an edge of actual submissiveness on occasion.

For sexual content, I for sure see why it might be difficult to have much of that set at the school or in public from an in-game legal sense, but there's always peoples' homes or other private spaces for that kind of thing - and honestly, if that little tidbit in the latest update about what the teachers can get actually get away with doing is any indication, there probably is more leeway at the school anyway.

I wouldn't want sex to replace exhibitionism as the main focus, by any means, since that is a large part of the draw for me, but some sex would be fun too; and sex can also be wholesome in itself, depending on how it's handled - if anything I prefer it when it IS that way.

By comparison, a game like Naughty Lyanna is kind of the opposite, where a lot more of the content skews towards sex rather than pure exhibitionism, and I didn't enjoy that anywhere near as much as Sunville.
Mind you, the fact that there's so much blackmail, abuse, situations that could easily avoided by characters making obvious non-stupid decisions, and sexually-exploitative r*pey rubbish in that game really soured the whole experience for me anyway, but I kept holding out hope that it would stop doing that until I eventually gave up.

 

[TheDevian]

All this talk has given me the urge to replay from the start so I can enjoy the whole thing all over again, and something I noticed straight away is that, at least at first, you actually do get some choice as to whether Lea acts bold or shy; given how long it's been since I've actually played the start, that may well be what I was remembering since shy is the way I was tending to play her - shyness rather than submissiveness (although there are some specific instances where she IS definitely submissive later).

Those kinds of choices do drop off after a while, so you do stop getting the opportunity to have her say she's not comfortable yet. Maybe that's part of why it seemed so drastic to me - my Lea went from generally shy to super-bold dom in the space of one afternoon on a boat, and I no longer had a say in it.

Regarding GP, I agree with you that she is somewhat more sub than Lea, more of a sub/exhibitionist mix; rather than Lea, who is an exhibitionist, with only an edge of actual submissiveness on occasion.

For sexual content, I for sure see why it might be difficult to have much of that set at the school or in public from an in-game legal sense, but there's always peoples' homes or other private spaces for that kind of thing - and honestly, if that little tidbit in the latest update about what the teachers can get actually get away with doing is any indication, there probably is more leeway at the school anyway.

I wouldn't want sex to replace exhibitionism as the main focus, by any means, since that is a large part of the draw for me, but some sex would be fun too; and sex can also be wholesome in itself, depending on how it's handled - if anything I prefer it when it IS that way.

By comparison, a game like Naughty Lyanna is kind of the opposite, where a lot more of the content skews towards sex rather than pure exhibitionism, and I didn't enjoy that anywhere near as much as Sunville.
Mind you, the fact that there's so much blackmail, abuse, situations that could easily avoided by characters making obvious non-stupid decisions, and sexually-exploitative r*pey rubbish in that game really soured the whole experience for me anyway, but I kept holding out hope that it would stop doing that until I eventually gave up.

Yeah, it got to be too much for him to program the different paths, and he had to cut back on it. He is getting better at it, but it was too much for him at the time. Trying to keep the options open, and still maintain the class schedule proved to be too much. People were having trouble keeping up with all the events.

Lyanna is a different world, and we have a lot more optional scenes. But it's a bit more story focused than Sunville, covering some some darker themes, though there are others that make even the darkest scenes we have there seem lighthearted by comparison. Even Tamara is not as bad as some of them and that one has a lot of sex, if you look at all three versions.

But yeah, that is why other than a few exceptions, I tend to avoid most female protagonist games around here, even though I would rather play one more of the time in general. I prefer a strong MC, who doesn't allow themselves to be pushed around more than necessary. This is also why I am happy to see more of the Dom side of Lea, rather than her getting dommed. Perhaps that makes me bias on that topic, but I still try to look at it objectively when I need to. lol

 

[Gwydion]

Yeah, it got to be too much for him to program the different paths, and he had to cut back on it. He is getting better at it, but it was too much for him at the time. Trying to keep the options open, and still maintain the class schedule proved to be too much. People were having trouble keeping up with all the events.

Lyanna is a different world, and we have a lot more optional scenes. But it's a bit more story focused than Sunville, covering some some darker themes, though there are others that make even the darkest scenes we have there seem lighthearted by comparison. Even Tamara is not as bad as some of them and that one has a lot of sex, if you look at all three versions.

But yeah, that is why other than a few exceptions, I tend to avoid most female protagonist games around here, even though I would rather play one more of the time in general. I prefer a strong MC, who doesn't allow themselves to be pushed around more than necessary. This is also why I am happy to see more of the Dom side of Lea, rather than her getting dommed. Perhaps that makes me bias on that topic, but I still try to look at it objectively when I need to. lol

Makes me wonder if they'll eventually get added back in/continued, once time and energy allows.

I also prefer female protagonist games myself, and you're right that there are slim pickings for non-exploitative ones, which is frustrating.

Personally, I think there's a definite difference, or there SHOULD be, at least, between being pushed around and being dommed - if a person is in a (healthy) sub/dom dynamic, it's because they're choosing to be, and the sub ultimately holds the real power despite the apparent vulnerability there because if they say no it stops.

They hand over most of the power to the dom in a given situation, yes, but it's by choice, not by force, and it stops when the sub says it does.
Well in fairness, either party can safeword out, but my point is that the sub won't be stuck in a vulnerable situation they have no way out of, unless it's actually an abusive relationship.

And as we talked about before, being a sub doesn't mean a person isn't strong, and being a dom doesn't mean that they ARE, so Lea didn't NEED to become dom in order to reflect her strength of will and character; but finding a game, book, series, etc. that acknowledges this and has a strong-willed but still sexually-submissive person is exceptionally rare, particularly when we're talking about a female character.

 

[TheDevian]

Makes me wonder if they'll eventually get added back in/continued, once time and energy allows.

I also prefer female protagonist games myself, and you're right that there are slim pickings for non-exploitative ones, which is frustrating.

Personally, I think there's a definite difference, or there SHOULD be, at least, between being pushed around and being dommed - if a person is in a (healthy) sub/dom dynamic, it's because they're choosing to be, and the sub ultimately holds the real power despite the apparent vulnerability there because if they say no it stops.

They hand over most of the power to the dom in a given situation, yes, but it's by choice, not by force, and it stops when the sub says it does.
Well in fairness, either party can safeword out, but my point is that the sub won't be stuck in a vulnerable situation they have no way out of, unless it's actually an abusive relationship.

And as we talked about before, being a sub doesn't mean a person isn't strong, and being a dom doesn't mean that they ARE, so Lea didn't NEED to become dom in order to reflect her strength of will and character; but finding a game, book, series, etc. that acknowledges this and has a strong-willed but still sexually-submissive person is exceptionally rare, particularly when we're talking about a female character.

I would not expect it.

Normally there is, in a real, and healthy sub/dom relationship, but most games like that are all about abuse/revenge/etc., not a healthy relationship. Don't get me wrong, there is always a place for that, but I prefer to be the one getting the revenge, than the one being abused.

Really, the sub is the one with the power, in a healthy relationship, They pick their dom, they say how far things go, they are the ones calling all the shots. It is all about the illusion of being powerless.

In many cases, the sub is a very powerful person, either they are strong, or they have a lot of money, or whatever, but being in control all the time is exhausting, and some people want a way to escape that.

Lea did not need to become a dom, she always was one, she just needed to unlock the skill.

Nadine is a strong willed person, who likes to be submissive sexually. But again, as Lea is the MC, personally, I am REALLY glad that she is not sexually submissive more often, as I don't like those scenes, I prefer when others are submitting to her. But then again, there are not a lot of sex scenes in this game anyway.

Strong (or otherwise) women who are sexually submissive are way too common in any medium. Almost every game on this site has women who are sexually submissive, that is almost all you find, unless it's femdom (and even some of them have that). I like that Lea is in control, same with Lyanna, I have 0 sub points with her, and it will stay that way. lol

Lea is going to be the next Ellie, she is going to need to be bold. XD

 

[Gwydion]

I would not expect it.

Normally there is, in a real, and healthy sub/dom relationship, but most games like that are all about abuse/revenge/etc., not a healthy relationship. Don't get me wrong, there is always a place for that, but I prefer to be the one getting the revenge, than the one being abused.

Really, the sub is the one with the power, in a healthy relationship, They pick their dom, they say how far things go, they are the ones calling all the shots. It is all about the illusion of being powerless.

In many cases, the sub is a very powerful person, either they are strong, or they have a lot of money, or whatever, but being in control all the time is exhausting, and some people want a way to escape that.

Lea did not need to become a dom, she always was one, she just needed to unlock the skill.

Nadine is a strong willed person, who likes to be submissive sexually. But again, as Lea is the MC, personally, I am REALLY glad that she is not sexually submissive more often, as I don't like those scenes, I prefer when others are submitting to her. But then again, there are not a lot of sex scenes in this game anyway.

Strong (or otherwise) women who are sexually submissive are way too common in any medium. Almost every game on this site has women who are sexually submissive, that is almost all you find, unless it's femdom (and even some of them have that). I like that Lea is in control, same with Lyanna, I have 0 sub points with her, and it will stay that way. lol

Lea is going to be the next Ellie, she is going to need to be bold. XD

So after having just blasted through the game again from start to finish, I can fairly confidently say we were BOTH wrong, and along the way I pinpointed why.

For the first 40 days, Lea was, far more often than not, told or asked to do something embarrassing rather than being the one making the choice solely on her own, and liked all of that, both the exhibitionism and being told what to do, although every time it was less coercion and more about helping her expand her comfort zone - at full count, this was the case with Maria, Hannah, Ellie, Sharon, Nadine, Heather, Charlotte, Mira, Amy, Emma, Eve, and even Marlene few times, and then there were the pool girls, the bar girls, and the random girls around town.
The ONLY time when she was actually forced to do something that she didn't want was when Heather revoked her underwear privileges and made her take them off in front of her and Ellie.

There were a few dominant acts sprinkled amongst those, but they were really far apart, they were almost always with Marlene, and Marlene was the one who even asked her to do it in the first place.

There have been more dominant interactions since the cruise, however I'd also forgotten that pretty much everyone on that boat was blind drunk at the time, so much easier to get carried away.

Since then, there's actually been a fairly even mix between scenes where Lea's been more dominant, where she's been more submissive, and where it's been just plain exhibitionism.

I think the thing that was throwing me off, is that despite time between updates being what it is, it's barely been a WEEK of in-game time from the start of the cruise weekend - so it really wasn't accurate for either of us to say Lea's a dom now.

You were more right initially when you said she's a switch, it's just that over that last week it's become a more even split between sub/dom rather than being mostly sub-flavoured as it had been before - the increase was noticeable, sure, but I think it was only because it was the case over every one of the last few updates that it stood out to me more; actually if anything the majority of the last week's scenes have been ones where NO-ONE has been in a dom or sub role, they've been more even - and in every single case that Lea has been acting in a dom role, it's been with people she already KNOWS like that kind of thing, so it IS acting, just acting that she enjoys too.

Added more into that, is that pretty much everyone in the class is getting involved now, either as someone doing something more risky, or being the ones encouraging someone else to do so, so the spotlight on Lea herself has been somewhat reduced.

Then too, I think because of the parts which stood out in my memory and those that didn't, I'd completely forgotten that Lea actually DOES still have that embarrassment in most new situations or when she gets caught out, up to and including the latest day, it's just that she recovers a little quicker now and there's less time dwelling on her inner-monologue about it - so I was being unfair there as well.

On a totally separate note, I realised after going though everything so quickly that Lea's actually had sex with all of her main friend group now, a couple of times each, as well as with Eve and Emma, so there's been more there than I'd remembered.

One thing that did come up, kind of all in one go really as it was all on the cruise as well, is that Maria, Hannah, and Marlene ALL FWB-zoned Lea, so there really is no actual romance or love-interest progress of any kind, it's just sex, which I was very disappointed by.
Then again, Maria also initially said she was straight and Lea said she wouldn't do anything sexual with a roommate, and Hannah at several points staked her claim on Lea (kissed her once too, while sitting in her lap even) as well as what very much looked like asking her out on multiple unofficial dates, so there's still time for all that to change - I hold out hope for the main four to form a loving polycule somewhere down the track.

 

[nyx3x]

I've gotten the game 2 days ago and basically played it through completely within a single day, and I agree with Gwydion that it feels like there is a shift in Lea's personality, which I think is not so much that she never did dom things before the yacht event but more so that she ONLY does dom things afterwards.

The game has great pacing, no long and boring text monologues with nothing happening for 10 minutes straight in order to build up a story like other VNs, but always keeps a good mix of short and interesting dialogues and kinky stuff happening while building the story along the way. The characters are interesting, the art is good and the story telling is interesting and believable, at first at least. There's barely any sex scenes which I surprisingly like a lot since it keeps the focus on the kinks, though I wouldn't mind if there was one character that was more handsy, for diversity

After the first two weeks or so of school I felt like this was one of the best games I've played from here. I loved how Lea was slowly exploring her kink, daring to do new stuff at times when she felt horny and felt like doing something stupid, and holding back at other times when the situation wouldn't allow it or it would have been too much by common sense. I liked her being pushed here and there to do stuff but more so the subtleness of others giving her the opportunity to experience and play out her kinks. Like when Hannah asked her to do stuff, or charlotte in the shop or Ellie creating situations to low-key corrupt her. I never felt like those situation were about her being submissive or dominant, it always was her being in control and choosing to do those things. Still I liked the parts where Hannah or others made still sure she was comfortable about it and apologized.

For me the biggest break of the story was when the strict algebra teacher heather suddenly made a 180° turn in personality and turned from a strong-willed and prude woman that tried to uphold some decency, to an apologetic pushover that gets truly blackmailed in a way that felt totally out of character. Apart from the fact that I didn't like Lea being actually abusive in that instance, it just felt totally unrealistic that heather would agree to wear that slutty outfit.

More importantly it removed a really important character roll in the game, that of a non pervert that upholds moral values and social norms. If everybody is an exhibitionist/pervert then nobody is. It makes all the characters feel bland, since they are all the same, and the new characters that were brought in, seem to only have been brought in for their bodies (toned natsumi, chubby molly) and join the naked group way too quickly.

And apart from the lack of diversity with everybody being a pervert, it also becomes less credible, since well, not everybody is, usually. That and the fact that there are never any consequences no matter what they do makes makes the story increasingly unrealistic and thereby boring. The whole class jogging naked through the streets? Her standing basically naked in the store? What about children in the town, concerned parents, prude people etc etc. Sure it's a fictional story, but it still needs to be logical in itself. Like how at first there's always the threat of the dean coming in to class, but later on they seem to not care in the least about that and suddenly the dean can't even say anything because of the previous lawsuit

Another big issue for me in the later part of the game is that Lea doesn't seem to excited about stuff anymore, and return I don't feel excited about it either. She doesn't care too much about pulling blank, about wearing barely anything in the store nor about the newer things like doming others. Sure she enjoys it, but I liked it when she got really horny and excited during some events or about the mere thought of doing something. That descriptiveness got lost along the way too

The yacht event was really meh, with it being all a "hey you might be an exhibitionist/sub, take of your clothes" *takes of her clothes* " haha I guess I like it" with multiple different characters... again everybody was too similar and it ended with everybody being naked

And on the dom/sub discussion: While I'd prefer Lea being balanced and enjoying and doing both, the issue for me is that dom Lea is not convincing at all. Her domming the others feels so weiiiiiird. It makes sense with Marlene, since it was a slow process, but the bits with her mom and nadine where she orders them and they are totally suprised and immediately follow since Lea just "got it" idk... it just doesn't feel right

All in all it developed from an interesting and exciting story about Lea being daring and exploring her kinks, to a porn-like game with the sole goal to show everybody naked

That being said, some of the side events and situations are still interesting and Ellie is way too hot, so it's still a good game overall. And the first couple of weeks are very very very good

 

[TomUK]

I know this is basically a lesbian game, but seriously, you could at least throw in some male teasing, think I've seen two guys in the whole game. They walk around naked all the time and never once see a guy.

Why do they always seem to be embarrassed when they are naked, you think with the amount of exhibitionism going on they would lose that pretty quickly. Every exhibitionist game I see on here is done wrong, there's never any consequence to being caught except for converting some other girl to get her kit off as well.

Don't get me wrong, I like the game, but I could see it being so much better just by adding some reality to situations.

 

[Gwydion]

I've gotten the game 2 days ago and basically played it through completely within a single day, and I agree with Gwydion that it feels like there is a shift in Lea's personality, which I think is not so much that she never did dom things before the yacht event but more so that she ONLY does dom things afterwards.

The game has great pacing, no long and boring text monologues with nothing happening for 10 minutes straight in order to build up a story like other VNs, but always keeps a good mix of short and interesting dialogues and kinky stuff happening while building the story along the way. The characters are interesting, the art is good and the story telling is interesting and believable, at first at least. There's barely any sex scenes which I surprisingly like a lot since it keeps the focus on the kinks, though I wouldn't mind if there was one character that was more handsy, for diversity

After the first two weeks or so of school I felt like this was one of the best games I've played from here. I loved how Lea was slowly exploring her kink, daring to do new stuff at times when she felt horny and felt like doing something stupid, and holding back at other times when the situation wouldn't allow it or it would have been too much by common sense. I liked her being pushed here and there to do stuff but more so the subtleness of others giving her the opportunity to experience and play out her kinks. Like when Hannah asked her to do stuff, or charlotte in the shop or Ellie creating situations to low-key corrupt her. I never felt like those situation were about her being submissive or dominant, it always was her being in control and choosing to do those things. Still I liked the parts where Hannah or others made still sure she was comfortable about it and apologized.

For me the biggest break of the story was when the strict algebra teacher heather suddenly made a 180° turn in personality and turned from a strong-willed and prude woman that tried to uphold some decency, to an apologetic pushover that gets truly blackmailed in a way that felt totally out of character. Apart from the fact that I didn't like Lea being actually abusive in that instance, it just felt totally unrealistic that heather would agree to wear that slutty outfit.

More importantly it removed a really important character roll in the game, that of a non pervert that upholds moral values and social norms. If everybody is an exhibitionist/pervert then nobody is. It makes all the characters feel bland, since they are all the same, and the new characters that were brought in, seem to only have been brought in for their bodies (toned natsumi, chubby molly) and join the naked group way too quickly.

And apart from the lack of diversity with everybody being a pervert, it also becomes less credible, since well, not everybody is, usually. That and the fact that there are never any consequences no matter what they do makes makes the story increasingly unrealistic and thereby boring. The whole class jogging naked through the streets? Her standing basically naked in the store? What about children in the town, concerned parents, prude people etc etc. Sure it's a fictional story, but it still needs to be logical in itself. Like how at first there's always the threat of the dean coming in to class, but later on they seem to not care in the least about that and suddenly the dean can't even say anything because of the previous lawsuit

Another big issue for me in the later part of the game is that Lea doesn't seem to excited about stuff anymore, and return I don't feel excited about it either. She doesn't care too much about pulling blank, about wearing barely anything in the store nor about the newer things like doming others. Sure she enjoys it, but I liked it when she got really horny and excited during some events or about the mere thought of doing something. That descriptiveness got lost along the way too

The yacht event was really meh, with it being all a "hey you might be an exhibitionist/sub, take of your clothes" *takes of her clothes* " haha I guess I like it" with multiple different characters... again everybody was too similar and it ended with everybody being naked

And on the dom/sub discussion: While I'd prefer Lea being balanced and enjoying and doing both, the issue for me is that dom Lea is not convincing at all. Her domming the others feels so weiiiiiird. It makes sense with Marlene, since it was a slow process, but the bits with her mom and nadine where she orders them and they are totally suprised and immediately follow since Lea just "got it" idk... it just doesn't feel right

All in all it developed from an interesting and exciting story about Lea being daring and exploring her kinks, to a porn-like game with the sole goal to show everybody naked

That being said, some of the side events and situations are still interesting and Ellie is way too hot, so it's still a good game overall. And the first couple of weeks are very very very good

It really is funny how, when I'd only been playing new content as it released versus playing the whole thing in one go, my views changed a lot -and then you do a full play and mostly reflect the views I had when only going from memory.

Lea certainly has been doing more domming in the last in-game week than ever before, and I do largely agree that the cruise was a LOT of people finding out they all had the same few kinks and Lea telling anyone in earshot to strip, but as to the why that could happen that way, we'll as I said everyone was REALLY drunk at that point.

Was it a crazy series of events? Yes. Was it excessive? For sure. But on the other hand it was a boat full of rich drunk perverts, so I can also see it happening.

Lea has definitely had a dom-rich week, but I think she's also in that "I've discovered a new toy" phase, seeing as how she's just newly started experimenting with that kind of thing, and it'll go back to more business as usual shortly - she's also indicated in internal-monologue that she's having fun putting on an act and playing at being a dom, so it's not like that's what she's actually like by nature.
And yeah, sometimes it's a little less believable of an act than others, but she IS pretty new at it.

In fairness as well, look at the situations she's been offered - continuing to help Marlene push her subby and exhibitionist comfort zones, Ellie serving Nadine up to the class, and then Nadine issuing a challenge about how untamable she is; perfect vehicles for testing out her dom act.

In amongst those though, there was a lot of embarrassed-exhibitionist stuff like being caught out in public walking back from the cruise, being seen multiple times around the school and in public, being recognised by Nora as the one running around nude in the VR game during that person's stream (in each of those, even at the times where there was no dialogue saying so, one look at Lea's face showed her embarrassment, and at one point she even had a mini freakout at being caught).
There was also aome more subbish stuff like being told to wear the increasingly-skimpy bar "uniform", Charlotte continuing to direct Lea to wear similarly skimpy outfits for her other job, and also, probably the biggest one I'd forgotten about, Lea's VERY telling reaction to Heather's sensually-agressive "Ara Ara" act. That last one was SUCH a subby reaction that I have no clue how I forgot about it.

 

[Gwydion]

I know this is basically a lesbian game, but seriously, you could at least throw in some male teasing, think I've seen two guys in the whole game. They walk around naked all the time and never once see a guy.

Why do they always seem to be embarrassed when they are naked, you think with the amount of exhibitionism going on they would lose that pretty quickly. Every exhibitionist game I see on here is done wrong, there's never any consequence to being caught except for converting some other girl to get her kit off as well.

Don't get me wrong, I like the game, but I could see it being so much better just by adding some reality to situations.

They covered that very early on, actually - for whatever reason that isn't gone into, in-universe there ARE hardly any males. Seems like the population is on average 90% female, so we're unlikely to see guys around very much - even then, in just over a month of time, there were three guy-spottings around town.

That's the in-universe reason, of course, which is just a fun justification for "the focus of this game is women, and enjoyment of said women".
No dudes needed or wanted here, and there are so, SO many alternative games you could play instead if you really need to involve a dick.

Regarding the embarrassment thing, these characters are continually being put and/or putting themselves in situations outside of their comfort zones, and then MOVING those comfort zones only to challenge themselves all over again - it would be far less realistic for them to just stop being embarrassed by anything, especially since that embarrassment is a large part of several characters' primary kinks.

For consequences, most of these are avoided simply by virtue of the fact that they're usually caught by like-minded people; there ARE sometimes consequences though, like Hannah pretending at blackmailing Lea for a while, or having to stand in front of the entire class partially or completely naked, or being disallowed from wearing underwear on school grounds for an undefined period of time.

There are also some less pleasant consequences for "undesirable behaviour", such as poor Hannah being screamed at in public by her mother until she ends up in tears, or being kicked out of her home entirely and being cut off financially.

 

[feierflei]

Hey folks ^^

First of all: Thank you very much, Gwydion, TheDevian, and nyx3x for your veritable essays on Sunville. I am extremely glad to have made a game that is worthy of such lengthy discussion

There is way too much here for me to individually reply to all points, so I'll write a mini-essay of my own:
I share many of your concerns, and they are in many ways the reason for the massive timespans in between the updates. It takes me way too many iterations of scenes to create something I am somewhat happy with. All you see in the game since v0.5 are events I wrote and rendered (if you can call it that) three, four, or even a dozen times, because I just can't seem to get it *right*. In that process, I can easily lose track of what I have and haven't written before, or what is and isn't still in the game. That can easily result in small "jumps" in character development or corruptive progression. And while I try to avoid such things, I am an absolute noob at writing, and on top of that I'm doing it all in a foreign language.
As such, it has been quite the challenge to live up to the expectations of the players - and, maybe even more importantly, my own.
To add to that, there is very little reference material for what I'm doing. In the early days of Sunville, I could easily take some inspiration from other games, doujiins, anime, you name it. Today, that is hardly possible, and I - an objectively not-so-good writer - am pretty much on my own. Which is fun in its own way, but still leaves me treading water more often than I'd like, simply because I have no idea what the fuck I'm doing.

...Now that I read my text again, it is just me saying "please don't hit me, I'm scared" and finding excuses, isn't it? xD
Anyways, I appreciate the feedback, and I'll keep it in mind for the next versions of Sunville, its sequel, and whatever projects will come afterwards.

Cheers!

 

[feierflei]

I know this is basically a lesbian game, but seriously, you could at least throw in some male teasing, think I've seen two guys in the whole game. They walk around naked all the time and never once see a guy.

If I added significantly more hetero content now, it would go against the very identity of the game, upset many of the game's oldest fans and supporters that have been around for almost two years at this point, and force me to write things I don't really enjoy writing.

Hence:

 

[Gwydion]

Hey folks ^^

First of all: Thank you very much, Gwydion, TheDevian, and nyx3x for your veritable essays on Sunville. I am extremely glad to have made a game that is worthy of such lengthy discussion

There is way too much here for me to individually reply to all points, so I'll write a mini-essay of my own:
I share many of your concerns, and they are in many ways the reason for the massive timespans in between the updates. It takes me way too many iterations of scenes to create something I am somewhat happy with. All you see in the game since v0.5 are events I wrote and rendered (if you can call it that) three, four, or even a dozen times, because I just can't seem to get it *right*. In that process, I can easily lose track of what I have and haven't written before, or what is and isn't still in the game. That can easily result in small "jumps" in character development or corruptive progression. And while I try to avoid such things, I am an absolute noob at writing, and on top of that I'm doing it all in a foreign language.
As such, it has been quite the challenge to live up to the expectations of the players - and, maybe even more importantly, my own.
To add to that, there is very little reference material for what I'm doing. In the early days of Sunville, I could easily take some inspiration from other games, doujiins, anime, you name it. Today, that is hardly possible, and I - an objectively not-so-good writer - am pretty much on my own. Which is fun in its own way, but still leaves me treading water more often than I'd like, simply because I have no idea what the fuck I'm doing.

...Now that I read my text again, it is just me saying "please don't hit me, I'm scared" and finding excuses, isn't it? xD
Anyways, I appreciate the feedback, and I'll keep it in mind for the next versions of Sunville, its sequel, and whatever projects will come afterwards.

Cheers!

I'm going to go ahead straight out and apologise, actually.
A lot of my concerns and criticisms ended up being entirely my own fault and perception because I misremembered or outright forgot something thanks to the "follow the updates" method I'd been going with, and having not played from the start for a very long time.

Some of that, also, is down to personal preference and I didn't mean it as a "you have to do it this way", more of a "this is what I like to see".

I very much enjoy seeing Lea growing through the game, and while I do like SOME dom stuff, the parts I most like are the ones which feed into the aspects of her personality I find endearing and cute, and at the same time which show her bravery and strength in how she ultimately chooses to go forward with them - so, I like seeing her discovering her enjoyment of exhibitionism while still being embarrassed by the situations themselves, and her enjoyment of the embarrassment itself.
It's why I feel like the times when she lets herself be vulnerable, and be pushed along into things she wants to do but doesn't necessarily feel comfortable with (and then chooses to do them despite that discomfort), those times mesh best with her enjoyment of exhibitionism/embarrassment.

At the same time, thinking as I'm writing, I think it's the AGGRESSIVE dom stuff I like less, particularly when Lea's going around trying to dom everyone in sight (but again, that was a very special boat, and everyone was very wasted, so I can excuse some of that obnoxiousness); I DO like the times when she's more PROTECTIVE dom - like when she swoops in to comfort Hannah after her mother tears into her; or cuts off the talk of piercing Marlene's nipples when she could see she didn't like it, by making it clear she liked her the way she was and that Marlene was HERS; or came to Maria's rescue in the VR game and toasted that bitchy streamer, or used her dom-voice to break Marlene out of her wank-trance so she would leave a risky situation).

I'm not sure whether you're intending everyone's relationships with each other to stay as "just friends" or whether they will develop into something closer, more on the romance side of the line (given how all three characters who certainly LOOKED, to me, to be heading steadily into girlfriend territory all turned Lea down for that during the cruise), but I will say I am personally HOPING that romance is in the cards for them down the line (my poly heart yearns for a Lea/Maria/Hannah/Marlene exhibitionist power-quad).

Personal preferences aside, and having replayed the entire game in one go, I think your writing is really good, actually; it's fun, it's sexy, characters' thoughts and ways of speaking read like how a person would actually think and speak, rather than coming off fake or robotic - and the characters themselves for the most part are distinct from each other and also quite consistent in their individual personalities, likes and dislikes, and how they act.

When a character DOES change significantly, it's usually for an understandable reason - like with Heather taking her personal issues out on the students and teachers, and putting up a rigid front to hide how upset she was; or Maria insisting she's straight, wavering, finding a guy to bang just to prove it to herself, only to ultimately accept that she's bi.

It's also much easier to see and appreciate the flow and progression when it's experienced in one shot, one of the downsides of getting content in small bites over an extended period of time.

 

[bacienvu88]

I have no idea what the fuck I'm doing.

For someone who don't know what the fuck they're doing you're doing a fucking amazing job!

 

[damnedfrog]

Which is fun in its own way, but still leaves me treading water more often than I'd like, simply because I have no idea what the fuck I'm doing.

Save yourself!
Women and children first!
The captain doesn't know what he is doing! We are on board the Titanic!


But I totally agree with bacienvu88

For someone who don't know what the fuck they're doing you're doing a fucking amazing job!

Heck, I like your game but exhibitionism and sub/dom game aren't even some of my kinks...
Sure, the fact that I'm a fan of lesbian FMC game help a lot .
But still, I think you do a great job to get me hooked up to the adventures of Lea and her friends.
For instance, the VR game is a good idea to add a fantasy plot without adding fantasy in the "real" world of the game.
So, I think you should keep going not to know what you are doing .

 

[x~Minchen~x]

Just played through the new update and I still like it. Lea is a cutie, even if she behaves a bit like a dirty old man now. For some reason she still gives me switch vibes (maybe I just want her to be one), but she became surprisingly 'dom' for the last few weeks. Some more meaningful relationships later on would be cool, maybe a few adventures like a trip...Or some actual dangers, like consequences for risking too much. The writing is good as always and I like the interactions with Hannah, Marlene und Maria the most.