- Jul 23, 2020
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Nah that is his cousin thanos this is tanos
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- Jun 23, 2017
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While it is true that they are "on another level", it is worth noting that Valravn in particular specifically has the power to negate intangible abilities' effects on himself. They can't mind-control him because he is simply outright immune to mind control as part of his power.
- Jun 23, 2017
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Valravn explicitly heals very slowly, even when he is free to hunt for hearts, having only reached 163 power by the time of his fight, so I don't expect him to recover too quickly while locked up in a power-negating cell under constant surveillance by HERO. If he gets out on his own, it'll likely have something to do with taking advantage of some other disruption, and/or the fact that the cell's power negation is probably from the same origin as Valravn's powers. (Negation is a power of the lineage of the 7th/Dark, which Valravn is a pure, first-generation member of.)
As for Cole's fight, they ambushed him after some major ritual. Cole was fighting him with Zara and Briar as support. And they were losing. They needed Ella to intervene, and then, despite the fact that she has similar powers to MC... Ella needed Briar's help to keep going.
I'll also note that despite your comment, MC's powers are a rather good matchup. Valravn is immune to intangible abilities, and effortlessly cuts through tanks. Another super of comparable level to MC would be dead, even if they could theoretically take out Valravn faster than MC could.
Valravn is not likely to be "significantly weaker" than the rest, unless they're unfathomably powerful.
sorry for not having a degree in this games lore or others characters power levels your
- Jun 23, 2017
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No need for the passive-aggression. I wasn't trying to attack you, merely clarify, and apologize if I came across as hostile.
And I did not misread. I just felt my addendum worthwhile, if tangential.
- Jun 22, 2017
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I think this is due to the nature of Valravn's power, his miasma makes him a hell to fight for most people, from what i understood this also makes him immune to both Zara and Charlie's powers, other S Ranks like Exenringue are not, my guess is that most monsters are either forced/tricked to take the mark and vows or maybe take them voluntarily, some monsters, the Elite ones monster dog mentioned are beyond that and have their own goals and only cooperate with SIN because they want to.
- Nov 8, 2020
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- Jul 13, 2021
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Yeah, I'm refering to the ones that the Hound showed MC. I don't really have a better name for them. Pure S Ranks? Ascended S Ranks? An interesting question thought is how stronger they could be compared to the other S Ranks like Hex and Goliath. These two seem to fair pretty well against Nico and Alexis respectively although Malik had an easy time against Goliath, even if he didn't stay to finish it off. I also found it curious that the Fairy is one of them, as I expected Hex to be more powerful, which makes it even more odd than Xanthe delegated it's capture to the Aldains instead of bringing the full might of HERO for this mission.
Briar claims that Aglaecwif and the rest of the monsters are his friends and mentions mind-control only when it comes to Hex and Valravn, noting that these two were defeated. As for Valravn, the probable reason they failed to do anything to him is because of his miasma which makes him immune to intangible abilities. I bet that in order to control the monsters, they have to defeat them first.
It makes a lot of sense that Ella was a level 4 when she fought Valravn and it's probable that the kids ambushed him. There is some intrigue with Cole messing up, and it's possible that Valravn used his heart to conduct the ritual and the kids somehow managed to steal it, leaving him weakened, but Cole wanted to kill it and fucked the plan up. This is conjecture but it's a plausible scenario for all the shit he's got and the accusations the others throw at him.
For all her skill, I think Ella, even as a level 5, isn't strong enough to be the cream of the crop, especially considering her feelings towards Alexis. If Alexis isn't capable enough to beat Goliath, Goliath isn't even one of the top monsters, Ella is so pissed at her, and Alexis claiming that shapeshifters counter her power, then this is a very strong possibility. Which would also mean that the Ascended S Ranks willingly work together with SIN and they have their reason for staying despite Ella dying. If that reason is supposed to be some ritual, then I have to assume that at least someone else knows about it, and if Aglaecwif claims that she doesn't know, my best guess is Tanos.
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It's been a while since this was mentioned, but after seeing the monster report for Valravn and learned that the Fairy is one of the all powerful monsters, I think it's fair to say that Alice has indeed inherited the pure Space trait and she's for all intends and purposes similar to an apostle spawn. Perhaps there may be some power related considerations, but if Valravn as a 1st gen is confirmed to be able to pass the pure trait, it stands to reason that the Fairy can do it too.
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That's the million dollar question. The public version changed some dialogue to indicate that Met may be a level 3. If Met is a level 3, has a bit of advantage thanks to his lightning powers, and only managed to tie against Evander, then it's probable that Evander is also a level 3 that somehow evolved super quickly.
If that's the case, then MC's performance is more than acceptable. If not, then Evander is probably a walking plot hole, because a level 2 going toe to toe with a level 3 is already a stretch, but doing it against 2 level 3s, one of them having an advantage, is ridiculous.
One of the great questions is how Ella knows so much. Xanthe has been researching monsters for decades and he looks like a schoolkid compared to Ella. I can accept that she may be exceptionally smart and having augmented her brain in ways that humans can't compete, but she's only been at it for what, 5 years? It's unlikely that level 1 or level 2 Ella was remotely interested in researching monsters. She looked like a scared girl trying to deal with the voices in her head.
It stands to reason that she has help, and at this point, the only one who is knowledgable enough about monsters is Tanos. We know from Markus that Tanos and Bramon had a falling out, and that Tanos worked on Markus' formula. He also looks middle aged, probably close to 45, so he could have a good 20 years of experience researching monsters, and he is a superhuman of creation, similar to Deryl, probably having a similar affinity.
I can only find 2 indications that Ella may had a falling out:
1) She looks miserable in the photo.
2) She used human teachers to research her forms.
However both could be explained away, the first by just considering her age and the circumstances of her infection, and the second by trying to use her school time efficiently (although I'm not really sure why she even attended school at this point, perhaps she was directed to, or she used it to hide from something?). The fact that this picture was found in the middle of a room which is hidden and personal to Ella, along with the fact that SIN progressed so fast after she joined, suggest that Ella has a good relationship with him, or at least a neutral one.
Edit: Although now that I think about it, perhaps these monster church people may have helped Ella with lore and knowledge. Althught the way they talk about the partnership makes me think that it's fairly recent. Perhaps that's the reason Langdon knows about MC? Ella wanted them in her side and told them that she has created an apostle spawn?
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- Jul 13, 2018
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They were referred to as the Chosen. All of them being pure 1st generation monsters from an Apostle line.
These monsters are likely not working for SIN or being controlled by them. Three of them don't even care about Ella all that much and only listen to her because she's a fellow chosen. Those being Aglaecwif, Rebis and Valravn. Aglaecwif herself willingly went against Ella orders just to spite her and to follow her own self interest in the MC. Rebis flat out rejected working with her, according to Deryl. We all know Valravn only cares about his Lord.
So in my own view of it all. The Chosen aren't actually on SIN side. They're much more powerful than all of them and the chances that Charlie, even at Level 4, can control them is slim to none. The same goes for Zara's marks. They're just guiding them along until their Apostles arrive.
I also don't think Ella's plan actually align with SIN's but that's a whole other subject. Especially since they don't know about the doll and the fact that Tanos has powers similar to Rebis but she went to Deryl instead for the Heart. Though, Doll Ella could be also waiting for the chance to absorb her power from the tree and absorb her original body once the negative energy wears off. That would explain why she's still lingering around HERO's base.
At least, that's how I see it currently.
- Jul 13, 2021
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I too don't think that they are on SIN's side. I'm just trying to figure out why they even bother with them. Hex in particular is literally SIN's lifeline. There is no way SIN can survive outside the dimension or without it's teleport and blocking capabilities. Tanos' research on twins may be a reason and having access to SIN's infrastructure could be a boon, but I kinda find it a stretch. Yet the monsters play well with them and even do their bidding instead of being more controlling.
Btw I really don't think that Charlie is a level 4. I have 2 reasons for this:
1) She looks like a child. This is further augmented by both her sprite image name being ycharlie (meta reason, y almost always stands for young), and how Shen's body matured when he reached his 4th (in game reason)
2) I think it's fair to assume that MC as a high compatibility superhuman can gain more power than other superhumans. If that's true, then it's possible that Met has significantly less power, to the order of 100 to 150, despite having his power for a similar amount of time. If Charlie has high compatibility and had her power for 2-3 years, she could have easily accumulated around 1000 power.
So having 10x Met's power as a level 3 could be a very plausible scenario.
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This didn't make too much sense when I read it, but assuming that Evander is level 3 or an unnaturally powerful level 2, perhaps it's very significant. Still it shouldn't explain how a level 2 can go against a level 3 that easily, due to level 3 strengthening the body too, but anyway:
1) Unnatural GrowthMonster Church guy said:
2) One evolution, both bodies rise.
This is cryptic as fuck and the implication can create an infinite loop, so we can't know exactly how this works.
Some possible interactions:
1) When 1 evolves, the other evolves too.
This is a bit iffy cause it could create an infinite loop. For example, Devana evolves, which causes Evander to evolve, which causes Devana to evolve, etc.
2) When 1 evolves, the other gains a similar evolution boost.
The siblings were training for 1 month, and they both have accumulated 10 power.
Evander evolves, which gives him 20 power.
Now they both have 30 power, but Devana is a level 1.
Devana evolves, which gives her more power and Evander instantly benefits from it.
a) For argument's sake, let's keep it at 20 again.
So now both of them are level 2 with 50 power.
b) If we go by my theory of 3x, Devana will get 60 power through her evolution, so both of them will reach 90 power.
This would put them at a power level similar to MC when he fought Valravn.
On the other hand, if Devana and Evander have unnatural growth due to them being apostlespawn twins, then it seems kind of odd that MC, who is literally 2 in 1 and connected to an Arbiter, can't casually annihilate level 4s by now. But anyway.
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Who says it triggers an infinite loop? Surely, if one evolves, the other similarly begins to evolve, then that's it? I don't think this is as big of an issue as you think. Having it be so that one gets a power boost if the other evolves seems way more unnatural and unintended.
- Jul 13, 2021
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The point of my argument is to attempt to explain how Evander can casually go against level 3s in such a short time. If they just evolve together but have a normal power progression, then I don't see how they could become so "unnaturally" powerful. They would just be normal superhumans that somehow evolve together no matter what. Not a big deal. MC and Jake kept a similar dynamic without being twins.
Frankly, Devana looks like a powerful level 2, but nowhere near level 3. MC had an easy time against her even during the tournament where he couldn't use his powers. The only thing her creations can do to him is being a roadblock. His whole problem is Evander.
If they evolve together, then Devana should also be a level 3 and her performance should have been far more impressive. So in order for Evander to be so strong, he must somehow leverage this unique and unnatural feature to reach level 3.
The only way this could happen, would be that he evolves, she evolves, and he evolves again due to her evolution. But what's stopping this from becoming an infinite loop?
Couldn't the unnatural power boost mostly come from the extreme degree to which they are a genetic match for their apostle parents? Plus, these twins are in a fundamentally different situation, where pressure to grow stronger is higher than it is for the otherwise communal HERO organization, where the MC can mostly rely on others to back him up in a pinch, whereas if the twins drop they will likely let them die and just try again with a new pair of twins.
EDIT: Plus, we know that although there are average power levels at which evolution can occur, it doesn't strictly need to adhere to it, especially since we've seen people who have evolved multiple times in a matter of days. It's possible that they've evolved at higher power levels than the MC did, which results in them being stronger.
- Jul 13, 2018
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I don't think Charlie is Level 4 myself. It would be odd that she's that powerful and it's only been like a year or so since she got her power. If I recall correctly, Oscar "died" about a year ago. If she was already a Superhuman by then, then she should've been able to stop the Wepwawet with her power. Not to mention, I also don't believe Met is Level 3. If he is, I don't have a problem with it because he's been a Superhuman just about as long as the MC. It just seems rather convenient that some many lone Level 3s are popping up with everyone stated it's extremely rare.
And yes, you're right. Technically speaking, if Laurie's power didn't grow much, MC would have 10 times more power than her. Since she had around 30 something and he has over 400 Power Points currently. So yeah, if Met is still Level 2 with say 60 power, it's possible that Charlie has around 600 power which still makes her statement true.
- Jul 13, 2021
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It could, but I have a few objections.
1) Can anyone really claim to have more genetic compatibility than MC who is literally connected to an Arbiter?
2) MC and Jake had similar growth rates and they had to deal with Ella. MC during his first 2 months had to fight a monsterfied superhuman, a level 2 (Danica) and Klaus who had his power for far longer than him. Jake had to use his powers against level 5s and he was under constant distress due to the Mia situation. Shen on the other hand seems to like positive reinforcement and Devana in particular seems of the happy-go-lucky sort. I doubt he was harsher than Ella.
Hmm, I really thought that Charlie has been a superhuman for far longer. Oscar joined the Aldains about the time Klaus turned. So that's 6 months. Since then, another 6 months have passed. This is what the narrator during Michael vs Oscar
"Long forgotten nostalgia", "long while". The narrator makes it sound like years. We also know that Charlie and the Wepwawet's corpse were gone after Oscar woke up.
So unless I've missed something, I don't think it's a stretch to think that Charlie has been a superhuman for quite a while longer than a year. Add to that the fact that children tend to take better to it, and we have a winning combination.
Another thing to consider is that "ten times stronger" could be something of a boast. She could be 5-6 times stronger instead. It's a low threat environment, for both Charlie and Met who just met someone familiar.
As for the level 3s in the building, of the new recruits, that would only be Met and there were probably at least 20 recruits there. The numbers check out according to Ella. So I don't find it that far fetched. But then again I have to leave every scenario open because it's not the first time MC has been wrong or the game tried to tell us something that just isn't true.
What can I say. The simple truth is that I'm still butthurt from MC's performance, so I'm looking for explanations
Does anyone have a save filed with a hybrid mc?
Like around 380+ power and 32+ skill points?
Like around 380+ power and 32+ skill points?
- Jul 13, 2018
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From my understanding, the timeline is like this.It could, but I have a few objections.
1) Can anyone really claim to have more genetic compatibility than MC who is literally connected to an Arbiter?
2) MC and Jake had similar growth rates and they had to deal with Ella. MC during his first 2 months had to fight a monsterfied superhuman, a level 2 (Danica) and Klaus who had his power for far longer than him. Jake had to use his powers against level 5s and he was under constant distress due to the Mia situation. Shen on the other hand seems to like positive reinforcement and Devana in particular seems of the happy-go-lucky sort. I doubt he was harsher than Ella.
Hmm, I really thought that Charlie has been a superhuman for far longer. Oscar joined the Aldains about the time Klaus turned. So that's 6 months. Since then, another 6 months have passed. This is what the narrator during Michael vs Oscar
"Long forgotten nostalgia", "long while". The narrator makes it sound like years. We also know that Charlie and the Wepwawet's corpse were gone after Oscar woke up.
So unless I've missed something, I don't think it's a stretch to think that Charlie has been a superhuman for quite a while longer than a year. Add to that the fact that children tend to take better to it, and we have a winning combination.
Another thing to consider is that "ten times stronger" could be something of a boast. She could be 5-6 times stronger instead. It's a low threat environment, for both Charlie and Met who just met someone familiar.
As for the level 3s in the building, of the new recruits, that would only be Met and there were probably at least 20 recruits there. The numbers check out according to Ella. So I don't find it that far fetched. But then again I have to leave every scenario open because it's not the first time MC has been wrong or the game tried to tell us something that just isn't true.
What can I say. The simple truth is that I'm still butthurt from MC's performance, so I'm looking for explanations
1 - Danica gains her power 2 years ago.
2 - She reached Level 2 in a couple of days.
3 - A couple of months to a year goes by from then and Oscar's becomes a superhuman.
4 - A full year goes by from Dani's perspective and she fights Oscar, getting seriously injured.
5 - Klaus and Danica hunt him down and he joins their group. This leads into the Aldain Arc in a few months.
So between 3 and 4, Charlie gained her power. So that's about around a year worths of time. Depending on how long she was an orphan and who turned her. Now, there's definitely the growth rate being higher for kids but it's questionable that she outpaced everyone to reach Level 4, including Ella and her kids. Only way I can see that is if she already knows her requirements. Level 3 Charlie isn't a problem since a year's worth of time is about accurate for reaching Level 3, if all goes well.
- Aug 16, 2023
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