Ren'Py The Headmaster [v0.15.3.1 Public] [Altos and Herdone]
- Thread starter AltosandHerdone
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- Sep 10, 2022
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It will be later. Altos stated in his last development Update, that it may be released in early summer.
I was bored and decided to look at the update history for the game. For context, I was a former subscriber and stopped supporting due to the lack of updates. I understand that "support" means many things to different people but for me I was supporting based on the 'Patreon goal' promise of "significantly greater output on content". I think this promise has been removed from the site since I last posted about this.
I have dabbled in content creation and can say that it is very labor intensive. Although, once the engine and assets are figured out it speeds up quite a bit. I think you see that speed up in the first year. Then, for whatever reason, it slows down consistently with only 2 updates a year for three consecutive years.
For the record I enjoy this game and am happy for the creator and their time in making this. Being a non-supporter now I am willing to wait for however long the updates take. They do not owe me anything. But if you are paying them money simply be aware of the history.
I would implore the creator to not focus so much on reinventing the game mechanics or anything else that takes up more time. Instead focus on the story and the renders. The story is what we all fell in love with and its the most important thing. If they can get to a 3 month (1 per quarter) release cycle I will support again.
I focused on beta or initial releases to keep it consistent. I also did not include holiday or survey based releases.
I have dabbled in content creation and can say that it is very labor intensive. Although, once the engine and assets are figured out it speeds up quite a bit. I think you see that speed up in the first year. Then, for whatever reason, it slows down consistently with only 2 updates a year for three consecutive years.
For the record I enjoy this game and am happy for the creator and their time in making this. Being a non-supporter now I am willing to wait for however long the updates take. They do not owe me anything. But if you are paying them money simply be aware of the history.
I would implore the creator to not focus so much on reinventing the game mechanics or anything else that takes up more time. Instead focus on the story and the renders. The story is what we all fell in love with and its the most important thing. If they can get to a 3 month (1 per quarter) release cycle I will support again.
I focused on beta or initial releases to keep it consistent. I also did not include holiday or survey based releases.
| Version | Release Dates | Days Between Releases |
| 0.1 | 03/01/2019 | 74 |
| 0.2 | 18/03/2019 | 54 |
| 0.3.3 | 11/05/2019 | 61 |
| 0.4.3 | 11/07/2019 | 36 |
| 0.5 | 16/08/2019 | 119 |
| 0.6.1 | 13/12/2019 | 99 |
| 0.7.1 | 21/03/2020 | 70 |
| 0.8.1 | 30/05/2020 | 161 |
| 0.9 | 07/11/2020 | 154 |
| 0.10.1 | 10/04/2021 | 90 |
| 0.11 | 09/07/2021 | 210 |
| 0.12 | 04/02/2022 | 204 |
| 0.13 | 27/08/2022 | 251 |
| 0.14 | 05/05/2023 | 224 |
| 0.15 | 15/12/2023 | 136(So Far) |
Yeah kinda seems like the typical point where an adult indie game gets pretty successful, and mid way through the dev hits burnout. This game showed amazing promise when I first discovered it, but since then it just feels like the dev has lost focus/direction. Updates are taking forever and it doesn't really feel like the game is advancing that much with each update.
There was the whole update that was supposed to make the graphics way better, some BS about improving the butt jiggling realism during spankings or some shit, they made the punishment mode even easier by basically spoon feeding you every single thing you need to do each time now so there isn't really even a puzzle to it, it's just spank by numbers at this point... yet we still don't even have the core punishment mechanic for a bunch of the main girls that have been in the story for years. (Instead, let's add even more girls with very limited functionality lol.)
And dude, regarding the content slowing down after the game hits it's stride, that is a feature of Patreon lol... Let's say the dev used to spend IDK 200 hours on a decent sized "update" and that took him 3 months. Over time, they realize hey I can do the same 200 hours over 6 months, and these Patreon saps will still keep paying almost the same amount monthly. So they actually make more $/hour for less work, and it stalls off them finishing the game, which is scary as fuck because then they'd have to come up with a whole new idea.
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- Jan 5, 2019
- 327
- 4,947
This analysis is completely misleading because it doesn't take into account the number of words, renders or videos in each release (or the quality for that matter). From roughly 0.9 onward, the updates more than doubled in size. Early updates were around 20K works and a few hundred renders, current ones are around 50K words and over a thousand renders, plus dozens of videos (early updates had almost no videos files). Early on I also had a back catalog of writing and renders to work with (I was working on this game for about a year before 0.1), whereas these days I have to write the equivalent of a novels worth of dialogue from scratch every six months, on top of all the rendering, animations and Patreon management. You are also completely ignoring the improvements in quality, which I have invested significant amounts of my time improving over the years. I have had a small team helping me with the code and animations since version 0.12, however, that has mostly led to improved quality (less bugs, better UI, gameplay and animations) rather than faster development. I still have to do the vast majority of the creative work myself which creates a bottleneck in terms of production speed. On average, each update takes me around 1000 hours, which roughly equates to six months working regular office hours. I will put in 12 hour days if a deadline is looming or I am having fun with a scene or special. However, I can not maintain that pace over the long term. I am only human. Unfortunately, I would not be able to go back to quarterly releases without significantly reducing the size or quality of each update.
Obviously this and everything else you wrote is true. You've done an amazing job. If I may humbly offer my own view. I think in 2022-2023 you got stuck on a couple of big tar babies that seemed like distractions and did not really move the original game forward (Moles and Manor). I think you have said that yourself (at least for moles). Planned character and plot developments got bumped. So not only were releases further apart, they didn't progress the game, if that makes sense, which was a double whammie. I haven't played the last release but that and the upcoming release seem to be more over the target.
Just my view, but either way you have oodles of credit in the bank. I think even the post you were responding to recognized that and was trying to be constructive, although it may not have come across that way.
- Jan 5, 2019
- 327
- 4,947
Thank you, I appreciate the kind words.
Yes, I fully admit that I got sidelined with the mole rat storyline, and I've spoken about that at length before. There were a lot of reasons for this. However, one of the main ones was that I did not properly think through a poll. I was surprised by people's choice and had a hard time pulling off what I promised. That said, I do not regret making that storyline, I think it will make a good chapter break before we move into Chapter 3. I just have a little bit of catching up to do first.
The Mykock's Manor specials probably took me about 50 hours each to make. Not a lot from my point of view, especially as they were a fun change of pace. The manor environment and girls were already made, ready to appear in the main game at some point. So, most of that time was spent deciding on the outfit choices; something I would have had to do whether or not I made the specials. On the whole it was probably only a few days additional work each time to make the specials rather than not. I have always put a lot of creative energy into my polls, the only difference now is that everyone gets to benefit from that time. Plus, by testing things out visually in a special I avoid the situation of promising something I later find is hard to deliver, such as the fundraiser. Is it the most efficient way to do polls? Certainly not. Is it a fun and unique way to engage with my fans and make them feel part of the story? I believe so.
- Apr 11, 2023
- 83
- 94
I always get a little worried when a developer starts responding to criticism and/or trolls, because it can end up being just a screaming match. But your response was quick, to the point factual, understandable and professional. So I was glad to see that. While I would want faster updates with much content (who doesn't), I don't mind waiting for quality content. I am really glad you did the mole rat storyline because I wasn't interested in Maxine at all, but now I am very much invested in her.
As I was busy with school projects to finalize my graduation, I only completed Mykock’s Manor 2 a couple of days ago. When continuing at the previous poll results I was happy to see 4 of my “choices” won. Adding to that, seeing your stroke of genius with the transparent underwear made me change my mind about the preferred underwear. So 5/7 final choices had my approval. I do have a question about the first poll question of Mykock's Manor 1. In Mykock’s Manor 2 it shows 71% voted to not punish Reilly Goodhead (which is obviously the right choice because a good boss, leader, manager or CEO should train the people below them to make the right decisions when they are not available, because 1 person cannot do the work of 20+ people by themselves as there are not enough hours in a day and punishing subordinates for making the correct decisions can't be helpfull), but Paul Mykock was lying to Reilly Goodhead that the poll result said she did need punishment.
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So my question is: are the results of the poll accidently reversed for this question or is Paul Mykock just trying to get his way
and will this be resolved with Reilly Goodhead finding out the truth?As for the poll in Mykock’s Manor 2. Without changes to the designs my vote would be:1-4-5-3-2. But my own personal best would be an alteration to option 1: having option 1 being made from the transparent material instead or using option 1 as is but with transparent colored underwear material with the color being either red or the blue/purple tint from option 4. Maybe option 5 could be used as a beach, swimming and volleyball outfit with one of the other outfits as official punishment outfit? Personally I dislike dominatrix characters (unless they deep down want to be dominated and use this persona to find a real dominant man and filter out the weak ones) as well as their outfits and I agree with other on this forum that Miss Newman doesn’t fit as a dominatrix. This is why I put option 3 and 2 at the bottom. But me not being a patreon feel free to ignore all I said.
With the transparent underwear idea as proof I have faith you will surprise and satisfy us all in time. I can’t wait for more Ruth and Charlotte.Lastly I couldn’t find the result of this poll, is the result already released?
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You got me curious, so if you don't mind sharing...
What is the oldest image in the game?
Who was the first girl rendered?
Specific to my favorite girl, what was the first image of Lucy?
This is a screenshot from Patreon:I always get a little worried when a developer starts responding to criticism and/or trolls, because it can end up being just a screaming match. But your response was quick, to the point factual, understandable and professional. So I was glad to see that. While I would want faster updates with much content (who doesn't), I don't mind waiting for quality content. I am really glad you did the mole rat storyline because I wasn't interested in Maxine at all, but now I am very much invested in her.
As I was busy with school projects to finalize my graduation, I only completed Mykock’s Manor 2 a couple of days ago. When continuing at the previous poll results I was happy to see 4 of my “choices” won. Adding to that, seeing your stroke of genius with the transparent underwear made me change my mind about the preferred underwear. So 5/7 final choices had my approval. I do have a question about the first poll question of Mykock's Manor 1. In Mykock’s Manor 2 it shows 71% voted to not punish Reilly Goodhead (which is obviously the right choice because a good boss, leader, manager or CEO should train the people below them to make the right decisions when they are not available, because 1 person cannot do the work of 20+ people by themselves as there are not enough hours in a day and punishing subordinates for making the correct decisions can't be helpfull), but Paul Mykock was lying to Reilly Goodhead that the poll result said she did need punishment.
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So my question is: are the results of the poll accidently reversed for this question or is Paul Mykock just trying to get his way
As for the poll in Mykock’s Manor 2. Without changes to the designs my vote would be:1-4-5-3-2. But my own personal best would be an alteration to option 1: having option 1 being made from the transparent material instead or using option 1 as is but with transparent colored underwear material with the color being either red or the blue/purple tint from option 4. Maybe option 5 could be used as a beach, swimming and volleyball outfit with one of the other outfits as official punishment outfit? Personally I dislike dominatrix characters (unless they deep down want to be dominated and use this persona to find a real dominant man and filter out the weak ones) as well as their outfits and I agree with other on this forum that Miss Newman doesn’t fit as a dominatrix. This is why I put option 3 and 2 at the bottom. But me not being a patreon feel free to ignore all I said.
Lastly I couldn’t find the result of this poll, is the result already released?
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- Apr 11, 2023
- 83
- 94
TY, then the data is swapped in Mykock's Manor
.Guess I am back down to 4/7 poll questions in my favor.
- Jan 5, 2019
- 327
- 4,947
Looks like I messed up when filling in the table for part 2. The majority did indeed vote for Reilly to be punished.I always get a little worried when a developer starts responding to criticism and/or trolls, because it can end up being just a screaming match. But your response was quick, to the point factual, understandable and professional. So I was glad to see that. While I would want faster updates with much content (who doesn't), I don't mind waiting for quality content. I am really glad you did the mole rat storyline because I wasn't interested in Maxine at all, but now I am very much invested in her.
As I was busy with school projects to finalize my graduation, I only completed Mykock’s Manor 2 a couple of days ago. When continuing at the previous poll results I was happy to see 4 of my “choices” won. Adding to that, seeing your stroke of genius with the transparent underwear made me change my mind about the preferred underwear. So 5/7 final choices had my approval. I do have a question about the first poll question of Mykock's Manor 1. In Mykock’s Manor 2 it shows 71% voted to not punish Reilly Goodhead (which is obviously the right choice because a good boss, leader, manager or CEO should train the people below them to make the right decisions when they are not available, because 1 person cannot do the work of 20+ people by themselves as there are not enough hours in a day and punishing subordinates for making the correct decisions can't be helpfull), but Paul Mykock was lying to Reilly Goodhead that the poll result said she did need punishment.
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So my question is: are the results of the poll accidently reversed for this question or is Paul Mykock just trying to get his way
As for the poll in Mykock’s Manor 2. Without changes to the designs my vote would be:1-4-5-3-2. But my own personal best would be an alteration to option 1: having option 1 being made from the transparent material instead or using option 1 as is but with transparent colored underwear material with the color being either red or the blue/purple tint from option 4. Maybe option 5 could be used as a beach, swimming and volleyball outfit with one of the other outfits as official punishment outfit? Personally I dislike dominatrix characters (unless they deep down want to be dominated and use this persona to find a real dominant man and filter out the weak ones) as well as their outfits and I agree with other on this forum that Miss Newman doesn’t fit as a dominatrix. This is why I put option 3 and 2 at the bottom. But me not being a patreon feel free to ignore all I said.
Lastly I couldn’t find the result of this poll, is the result already released?
- Jan 5, 2019
- 327
- 4,947
This was Lucy's first appearance in the game on day one. She was one of the first student's you can speak to after leaving your office.
As for the very first character rendered, I could not tell you. I made and remade the oldest scenes several times over, constantly refining the models and environments until I was happy with them (and I still tweak them to this day).
Here are some of the earliest renders I made back in early 2018. As you can see, they were complete garbage, lol.
Lucky for you guys I don't give up easily and kept at it until I got good at both character design and rendering. What a difference several thousand hours of practice makes...
- Dec 1, 2019
- 8,378
- 14,247
Phew, some of them really have changed. I'd argue Priti is the closest to the original version, while some others are hardly recognizable.This was Lucy's first appearance in the game on day one. She was one of the first student's you can speak to after leaving your office.
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As for the very first character rendered, I could not tell you. I made and remade the oldest scenes several times over, constantly refining the models and environments until I was happy with them (and I still tweak them to this day).
Here are some of the earliest renders I made back in early 2018. As you can see, they were complete garbage, lol.
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Out of curiosity, out of all the different characters, game mechanics, scenes and animations etc, so far what would you say the trickiest thing to get right was and the one that provided you the most satisfaction in getting just how you envisaged?
FWIW the mole rat story is my favorite and IMO hottest part of the game. It's definitely a departure from where the story was going before, but it's so good I don't care.
I wrote that a year ago (almost precisely). Nothing has changed, including new posts appearing, which somehow assumes each update to be of equal size. As such this issue shouldn't be new to the followers of this thread. I will take the liberty of assuming that most people here aren't upset with the update frequency/quality, though in a way that is self fulfilling as upset people will likely leave.
This is a fair point. I did not intend to imply that these updates were equal scope or size. I was trying to illustrate the growth of the story. Depending on how you define you workload your critique is valid.
Also I am certainly not a troll as some other person said. I have a great appreciation for the work games take. I have more experience in this area than many here would understand. The only reason I even bothered to comment is because of how much this game stands out from the others on this site. You can see I generally keep to myself.
I suppose my grip is surrounding *where* the effort takes place. The original goal for subscribing was to increase output and increase releases. As others have pointed out, the storyline has slowed down (and there are may open stories such as: Yoga on the weekends, Nude beach, fantasy board game, Ms Chang etc.). I know some polls have pushed you to update other things. As much as engagement with your supporters is important sometimes giving them an update they DON'T want is better so they anticipate the update they DO want.
Additionally, some of the new dialog reiterates things the player already knows. You may have written the original explanation four years ago but the player just saw the MC explain his feelings less than an hour ago. You can save writing time and allow the player to insert themselves into the mind of the MC.
Finally, patrol events add a lot more to the game then they are given credit for and should be a focus in and of themselves. I think you have talked about this previously at some point so see my point about allowing the subscribers to dictate your focus.
If you are now the bottleneck then the amount of subscribers and financial support should help find a way through this problem. There are many creative people out there that can help with this burden. You are the leader of a small company of sorts now. Ultimately your delegation, approval, and oversite would be the key to continued success.
Anyway, I appreciate your initial response. I am sure you are not interested in a back and forth in a public forum with some bloke on the internet. I truly wish you luck and hope to resubscribe soon.
- Jan 5, 2019
- 327
- 4,947
Tough question. I have struggled with a lot of things over the years. Figuring out the headmaster's justifications for all the clearly perverse and immoral things he does, and trying to keep them consistent and believable (at least within the context of the games world) isn't as easy as I make it look. I usually have at least a couple of weeks in each update cycle where I'm really stressed out trying to figure these things out. I normally just keep obsessing over the details until everything suddenly falls into place. I think Rachel's storyline was the hardest from that point of view. However, finally having that eureka moment and figuring out how to tie the scenes together and to get to the ending I want is always very satisfying. So I guess the hardest and most satisfying parts are often the same thing.
I think my favourite scene to make is probably still the water fight. I had a lot of fun with that one. Also, that was one of the first scenes I made after quitting my day job to do this full time, so it was extra enjoyable to be doing something so fun and creative instead of sitting in an office doing a job I hated.