VN Ren'Py Twisted Memories [v0.9b] [BaiBai]

[jvbatman]

I really hope Catherine gets some dick next update.

 

[Froilan]

Wow nice game, waiting for more

 

[Maulis47]

I really hope Catherine gets some dick next update.

Theoretically that's what the mc promised her Friday. We will see if he delivers on it.

 

[Kawai Shrek Bomberman]

I would understand if the dev wants to scrap the solo endings, especially if writing that many routes contributes to burnout. That said, it would be really nice if he does add them in. Solo routes really add to the replayability of a vn imo, since you can go back and focus only on the character you're most interested in at the time.

True, being able to choose between solo and harem is good for the player's experience, but for the developer it's quite complicated, I think a good idea is to build so that the ending or almost ending is solo, but then later he adds the harem endings. I think it's smart that he divided the 12 characters into groups to reduce the complexity of these endings.

 

[Kawai Shrek Bomberman]

A funny thing that happened in update 0.9 was that the husband of that woman julia had the same name as my character, that was really funny, I thought my character was talking to himself. this game is really cool, I'm still reading it, I haven't finished version 0.9 yet.

 

[Alandir]

True, being able to choose between solo and harem is good for the player's experience, but for the developer it's quite complicated, I think a good idea is to build so that the ending or almost ending is solo, but then later he adds the harem endings. I think it's smart that he divided the 12 characters into groups to reduce the complexity of these endings.

Lmao, no that'd be a terrible idea. Most people are here for the harem, so that should go first.

 

[Master of Puppets]

True, being able to choose between solo and harem is good for the player's experience, but for the developer it's quite complicated, I think a good idea is to build so that the ending or almost ending is solo, but then later he adds the harem endings. I think it's smart that he divided the 12 characters into groups to reduce the complexity of these endings.

To be fair it's probably not really as complicated as it sounds. If you have any choice at all other than full harem, you have to write a non-love-interest story for each girl that might not be chosen, regardless of if you can pick girls individually or only in groups. These probably aren't going to change all that much based on which girls the player does choose. Sure, if there are ten girls and you are allowed to choose yes or no to each individually that's over a thousand possible combinations, but most of those are going to be pretty similar to each other and easily combined.

 

[Alandir]

To be fair it's probably not really as complicated as it sounds. If you have any choice at all other than full harem, you have to write a non-love-interest story for each girl that might not be chosen, regardless of if you can pick girls individually or only in groups. These probably aren't going to change all that much based on which girls the player does choose. Sure, if there are ten girls and you are allowed to choose yes or no to each individually that's over a thousand possible combinations, but most of those are going to be pretty similar to each other and easily combined.

Just write a completely different story, lmao. Yeah not complicated at all.
That's maybe how it works in sandbox games where each characters story might as well happen in another universe as far as interconnectivity is concerned but this is thankfully not that story.
The stories are heavily interconnected and that is one of this games great strenght. Mcs relationship with vicky would be vastly different if he hadn't been together with steph. His relationship with Steph would have been different if he wasn't so openly thirsting after other girls like cathrine. His relationship with Emily would be different. His relationship with Alyvia would be different if he hadn't gone after jackie. His relationship with Abigail is strongly influenced by whether or not you have pursued mrs. clements.
You can't just make a relationship platonic in this game and expect the rest of the story to remain the same. That's not how this story works and thanks fuck for that, because it's a much more interesting story as a result.

 

[wWbcbc]

This is my favourite game on the site atm. The only 'flaw' that really sticks out (to me) is when the text removes me from the game because of a very obvious spelling error or a weird sentence getting thrown into the mix. So I decided to proofread the game for myself, but then thought that I might as well share it. I've only completed the first day (because I only work on it whenever I feel like it (I started around January)) and if anyone else wants to do it then feel free. I'll prolly make my own version anyway and maybe just not post it, cause I really like the game. This might also happen if Baibai wants this removed (don't know why, but it's Baibai's game so...).
Sidenote: I don't think Baibai is a bad writer at all, I just think the translation process gets messy from time to time. If you have to write everything at least two times it also increases the chances of errors, not to mention all the other stuff Baibai has to do while working on this thing. (being a non-native speaker also doesn't help)
I've also included a document of most of the changes I've made (if anyone wants it). This might've been a waste of time (especially since I had to do a lot of it twice) because it means spending double the amount of time on something that might be unnecessary. When I start on day 2 I'll do the changelist too at first, might reconsider if nobody wants it.
Last little thing: I've tried keeping the text as original as possible and many changes are made willy-nilly. Some might've been unnecessary (like moving around commas and contracting words) and I've definitely missed things. If you find some glaring fuck-ups feel free to message me about it. And thanks for making the game Baibai

 

[jI11jaCksjAkk]

I think a good idea is to build so that the ending or almost ending is solo, but then later he adds the harem endings.

That seems to be what most devs do (the ones that work them separately at least). Makes sense because it is a lot more work (writing and rendering) completing all the solo paths, and then you can probably re-use a good % of those renders later for the harem story path by just changing the dialogue accompanying those images.

The amount of new rendering and writing for the harem ending is by definition less because you are combining/consolidating storylines as you approach the finish. And since you've already explored and mapped out their individual characters more fully in the solo routes, understanding how they would fit into a larger group would be a lot easier.

If you try to do the harem route first, you're probably going to have to take a lot of time to fully explore each LI individually first anyway to make the harem ending believeable and consistent character-wise with the later solo endings, so...why not release that individual LI content (solo paths) as you work them out and then go back to assemble all those ready-to-use pieces for the harem ending afterward?

I play for harem endings 99% of the time, but you can't ignore the logic most devs use when finishing the solo routes first.

 

[Kawai Shrek Bomberman]

That seems to be what most devs do (the ones that work them separately at least). Makes sense because it is a lot more work (writing and rendering) completing all the solo paths, and then you can probably re-use a good % of those renders later for the harem story path by just changing the dialogue accompanying those images.

The amount of new rendering and writing for the harem ending is by definition less because you are combining/consolidating storylines as you approach the finish. And since you've already explored and mapped out their individual characters more fully in the solo routes, understanding how they would fit into a larger group would be a lot easier.

If you try to do the harem route first, you're probably going to have to take a lot of time to fully explore each LI individually first anyway to make the harem ending believeable and consistent character-wise with the later solo endings, so...why not release that individual LI content (solo paths) as you work them out and then go back to assemble all those ready-to-use pieces for the harem ending afterward?

I play for harem endings 99% of the time, but you can't ignore the logic most devs use when finishing the solo routes first.

Yes, that's right, and if you look at it he's already started this construction of some solo routes in the last update (probably), those moments when we have choices of liking or not liking certain girls are probably the triggers that the developer has defined to clean up or build the final context of the story.
I don't really remember every choice in the story, but there's probably one girl who will always be with him in the end.

 

[Kyril87]

Harem or solo, the fact is that Bai Bai has crafted an engaging narrative. The most important criterion is maintaining the standard of writing. If this is done I can live with whatever order he uses to complete the endings.

 

[Alandir]

Yes, that's right, and if you look at it he's already started this construction of some solo routes in the last update (probably), those moments when we have choices of liking or not liking certain girls are probably the triggers that the developer has defined to clean up or build the final context of the story.
I don't really remember every choice in the story, but there's probably one girl who will always be with him in the end.

I feel like the guys talking about solo routes haven't even played the game.
What are you talking about choice liking or not liking certain girls? The choices in the last update have been purely choices between seduction and corruption for main girls and whether or not to pursue side girls, like it has been in every update.

That seems to be what most devs do (the ones that work them separately at least). Makes sense because it is a lot more work (writing and rendering) completing all the solo paths, and then you can probably re-use a good % of those renders later for the harem story path by just changing the dialogue accompanying those images.

The amount of new rendering and writing for the harem ending is by definition less because you are combining/consolidating storylines as you approach the finish. And since you've already explored and mapped out their individual characters more fully in the solo routes, understanding how they would fit into a larger group would be a lot easier.

If you try to do the harem route first, you're probably going to have to take a lot of time to fully explore each LI individually first anyway to make the harem ending believeable and consistent character-wise with the later solo endings, so...why not release that individual LI content (solo paths) as you work them out and then go back to assemble all those ready-to-use pieces for the harem ending afterward?

I play for harem endings 99% of the time, but you can't ignore the logic most devs use when finishing the solo routes first.

It really feels like you haven't played the game. The routes for the different characters are heavily interconnected. Harem isn't a matter of combinding and consolidating storylines as you put it. The default storyline of this game is already aimed straight at harem. The mc pursues all 6 main girls no matter what you choose. His goal is to get a harem no matter what you choose.
The characters are not only already well explored in this combined storyline, a large part of their character is explored because it's a combined storyline. The fact that mc persues other girls is vitaly important to the storyline and character development of multiple characters.
It's the solo routes in this game that would take extra effort, since they would require to disentangle the tight web of interconnected storylines that we currently have. Unless you do a lazy "And then they moved to another city to live happily ever after. The end." for every single one.

I am not just saying this because I personally want the harem more. What you are saying makes sense for a lot of games, whose storylines with different characters may as well take place in a different dimension from the storylines of the other characters, since there's zero overlap. But that is very specifically not the case in this game, so I am kind of confused with what you guys are talking about. Are you sure that you have played the game?

 

[Master of Puppets]

I feel like the guys talking about solo routes haven't even played the game.

Maybe you should tell the dev that. He was the one who said that there would be solo routes. He may have since changed his mind, but you are way out of line insulting people for talking about plans that the dev himself brought up.

 

[BaiBai_]

My 2 cents on how I currently think about solo endings:

When I first started the game I wanted to go about the harem and the solo endings a bit different than most games I myself played so far tend to do it. The MC was supposed to actively pursue a harem and then get get put to the test, the choice before him: Risk the second chance he got in hope to form his harem or take it with one girl he can be sure of that he can life a happy life with. Accordingly I've been trying to build up every girl to get into a position to fit for the later BEFORE giving the player the choice to reject her. I do like to think that I've been doing a decently good job at that but the more I've been doing this dev thing the more I've started to see other problems with my initial idea.

First: A story telling reason. Writing break ups for 5+ girls that feel appropriate to the build up of their relationships that came before seems increasingly challenging to me and this many break ups will probably get pretty old, pretty fast.

I could of course do it in narration only accompanied by a time skip but that again brings multiple problems in my mind: 1. It wouldn't be satisfying, 2. It would heavily disconnect the story lines forcing me to write 7+ paths at the same time, or 3. If I were to do it in a prologue kind of way where to choice for a girl is directly followed with her ending it would make the solo routes end way earlier than the harem route as I'm sure as hell not going to do a “harem is formed, game is ending” kind of harem ending.

Second: The amount of work it would require. When I planned the game at first I was very conscious about doing it in such a way that I could actually manage to finish it. Still, planning something like this without ever having done it and actually doing it are two entirely different pair of shoes. Neither is it helping that the effort that goes into the game went up drastically over the time of the development or that I was still studying and had a lot of free time when I started this project that I no longer have (The advice generally given to new devs to start with a small project has its merits but its hard to overcome ones own ambition).

Third: I always wanted this to be a tight-knit story with a lot of character each of which can stand on their own and only gets elevated by being forced to bounce off each other through this harem-building setting. But, the more I've been doing it this way the harder it seems to me to actually untangle all of this again to make satisfactory solo endings possible.

All in all the way I see it now and if I were able to start over it would probably have been better to either give the player the choice to pursue a girl right from the get to, or to go full force into the harem-building aspect of things making the choices not about who is part of the harem but instead the way it is build and the dynamics within. At least I think those would make for more clear cut paths that can still be interesting but such realizations come with experience especially if you try to be a snowflake in the market of harem avn's.

In the end its a miscalculation by me and even though I still like the idea of solo endings very much as I truly think every one of the main girls would be deserving of one, I would hate not to be able to bring the game to a satisfactory end even more. And having done this for a few years now (although I still feel like a new dev), knowing how much time this takes up and seeing how the story so far developed I'm simply getting increasingly worried that by making solo endings I will end up not being able to deliver either.

 

[Draverik]

Little bro is worrying about how to wrap up the story and meanwhile we still haven't even kissed the most important girl and the guy had the gall to send her off for a few days...

 

[Alandir]

Maybe you should tell the dev that. He was the one who said that there would be solo routes. He may have since changed his mind, but you are way out of line insulting people for talking about plans that the dev himself brought up.

Can you point me to the insults I am supposed to have said.
That it sounds like they didn't play the game?
I said that because they talked about choices that aren't in the game and talked about a story structure of disconnected character stories that does not apply to the story structure of this game, so I was confused why they were talking about these things that don't apply to the game.

 

[Studman99]

For sole developer or small teams, do not go for over-ambitious scope or over-promise. In the end, you wont be able to deliver so many endings. Stick to the harem ending which is the original goal. Most of the customers just want a good narrative and animated scenes. Dont put in minigames and branching choices Mass effect style.

Even for AAA developers, they fall short and even shut down because of crazy ambitious goals.

 

[jI11jaCksjAkk]

Can you point me to the insults I am supposed to have said.
That it sounds like they didn't play the game?
I said that because they talked about choices that aren't in the game and talked about a story structure of disconnected character stories that does not apply to the story structure of this game, so I was confused why they were talking about these things that don't apply to the game.

It is at least in poor taste to insert oneself and one's opinions into a direct reply from one person to another. I replied to a point made by someone else that I agreed with in general, not to you or your post. But you still felt the need to insert yourself. Are you that desperate to force others to agree with your opinions that you felt threatened by me agreeing with someone you disagreeed with??

I ignored your post because you stated your opinions about the game's development - as a player, of a game you are not the dev of - as facts, and that is often a red flag indicating posters unwilling/incapable of being respectful of any viewpoints that differ from their own.** And then you inserted yourself again with a second post, once again implying that anyone who disagrees with you must not have played the game (i.e., has no idea what they are talking about if they don't agree with you).

There is an old adage: better to keep one's mouth closed and be considered a fool than to open it and remove all doubt. Now Ignored officially rather than just in practice.

**I am absolutely guity of this myself on occasion, but I try my best not to make a habit of it.

 

[jvbatman]

Boy I sure hope we argue more about something that is never going to happen.