Ren'Py Abandoned What a Legend! [v0.6.02] [MagicNuts]

[Jash83]

people are impatient? blame the devs for making such a good game that people can't get enough of

That's not reasonable at all. I'd rather blame the impatient people for being a bunch of whiny self-entitled cockwombles.

 

[Cappucinn0]

Hmm, i think people must be patient right now, its just like waiting for Cyberfunk to release i think.
maybe the dev just wanna give us the best they can give, hope when its coming its not disappoint
i read somewhere in this thread before the team for this game is only two people if im not wrong, i don't know if this team expanded or not.
and hope that the dev not abandoned the game progress

 

[Blades1138]

Man, F that popularity list. The elves first, and goldenbush third. That is the order of things as it was meant to be.

I think the popularity poll results are mostly due to the content currently in the game. I for one think Lady Goldenbush deserves to be higher on the list and I hope people realize that once more content with her is available.

 

[Clobbertime]

people are impatient? blame the devs for making such a good game that people can't get enough of

We live in the age of instant gratification. People have become so spoiled by technology making so many things available when and where they want it that it's become a foreign concept that there are still things that take time and effort to accomplish. Patience, like common sense, is dying out.

 

[Andonthatday]

I like the focus on giving a satisfying ending to an update like an episode rather than be just be an update.

The end of 0.3 was perfect while 0.4 felt little empty.

 

[destroyerofassholes]

We live in the age of instant gratification. People have become so spoiled by technology making so many things available when and where they want it that it's become a foreign concept that there are still things that take time and effort to accomplish. Patience, like common sense, is dying out.

this is a perfect boomer comment I forgot where I was lol, reads like a newspaper comments section.

phone bad, tech bad, youth bad, old good...

 

[schmunky]

You guys (the devs) get way too much shit. This game is fantastic. One of the best on here. Keep doing what you're doing (unless you're gonna burn out!)

 

[Unreal434]

Myrtle, Holly, and Gomira, based on a public poll on our Patreon page.


Would you rather I didn't answer questions? I'll repeat Tlaero's question, which I believe you ignored: what are you asking me to do differently?


We are two people working full-time seven days a week, it's not been six months, there are more than a few artworks added with each update (although whether they're enough or not is, of course, subjective), and we mostly know what we're doing, but other times we get things wrong and go back and fix them, experiment, and try to come up with new ideas to improve the game. But all these aside, could you tell me what bugs you encountered? I'd like to fix them for the next update if possible.


If you still haven't found it, there's one pinned to the help channel of our discord server.


I don't know whether it's typical for games to take longer to develop the more popular they get, but no, we don't want it to become typical in our case. You're wrong about 'milking' not being evil or malicious, though. If I accept people's donations on the promise of working on a project, I'm morally obligated to do the best work I can and do it as honestly and transparently as I'm capable of. Things go wrong, of course, but that's a different story. Please note that I'm talking about my game and am not referring to any other game or developer (I know very little about other devs, and each person or team has their own approach and relationship/understanding with their patrons).

Now about 0.5, the current release cycle is caused by us wanting to have a sense of 'completion' similar to the end of 0.4. 0.5, however, is one continuous story, and events have to happen before that satisfying end is achieved. Basically, had we taken different design decisions, for example, had we broken up the main story update into two parts (similar to 0.1 and 0.2) the result would have been different. It's a lesson to learn for continuous story updates, in contrast to side-quests, rather than a model to copy for future releases.


This is an answer I gave to someone with a similar question on Discord:

Creating 2d artworks takes time, and progress is not always linear. By that, I mean that we take the time to create something, but the result doesn't always work and has to be redone or improved. As an example, there are several artworks that we were so sure we would use that we even recorded and shared them on Patreon, but in the end, they didn't find their way to the update because they didn't match the direction that was better for the game. There are also two complete sprites (with some expressions) that we have not yet used but that at the time had to be created because we thought they were going to be used. It is a process that involves planning things, doing them, testing, and evaluating and fixing things when needed rather than releasing them out even though we think they don't work. That's true about the art, true about the writing, the posing, etc. Now that's one aspect of it. The other one is that the artworks need a lot of researching to create. Most of the videos you see on our Patreon (there are several public ones that you can access without being a patron) are at x5-x10 speed, and that's just the artwork and doesn't take the many hours that go into researching and adjusting things to look good.

Now that was about the art, which is I think most people will agree is one of the most important aspects of the game. For my part, every line of the text needs to be posed, and there are hundreds of them. This is not the typical approach, but it's a decision we made in 0.1 to have characters in a scene change with each line of dialogue and respond to it. 0.5 has over 4700+ lines, and every single one of them needs at least one sprite being called and changed. For example:

show myrtle enarrow bdoubt hbneu2 rneu2
show horse bup ehalfb msad
show kevin eneu
show pov eneudown bup mneu
show hammerdick ewidedown bdoubt mneu
myrtle "But isn't Lady Goldenbush the ruler?"

The simple line from Myrtle in 0.4 "But isn't Lady Goldenbush the ruler?" needed all of the characters present to have their sprites changed to match it. You can see Myrtle, the horse, Kevin, the MC, and Hammerdick, each having different facial expressions and body gestures. That's an extreme case since not every line is uttered in the presence of 5 characters, but most are done with 2 sprites (in 0.5, for example, the MC and Lana), and they need to be edited and posed one by one. Every 4700+ one of them.


Patrons choose which character/story we focus on next, but it is us who decide the poll options.


We're still in the fourth month (until tomorrow, actually). Most people ignore the qualification that it might vary depending on the story/circumstance and that 0.5 is one of them. We did not set out to take this long, but at this point, the only thing we can do is try to finish it as well and as fast as we can and apply what we've learned about releasing main story content to future updates. I would rather learn to plan better than remove that because I think patrons should know what they're supporting.


I update it every night before going to bed, but perhaps it doesn't register or show you the cached image. At any rate, if you don't see it here, check our website or discord server; it'll be there.


Check the Hidden Photos Locations in the OP.

You shouldn´t take the impatient ones / doubters too personally. I think they are not attacking nor rushing you. They are just afraid another promising game will turn out like all the others before.
I´m sure you´ve already read something like this but in the past there were quite a few promising 2D handpainted games that over the years either fizzled out or turned into bloated Holstein cows.

I think the doubters see a pessimistic future of July 2024 where everyone is waiting for What a Legend v0.771,01a, when future-magicnuts posts something along these lines:
"Ok guys it took us 11 months but we added 5 new girls (without content), 13 side characters and new supa fany villains that reference Kim Jong-un and Putin. We also patched bugs that should´ve been patched two versions ago, added X amount of words and updated 2 background to HD. Next patch will be "technical one" because our code is Mom´s spaghetti and android users demand 8k images now so pistachio can´t draw anything meanwhile. See you in 2026."

 

[Tlaero]

While that future is certainly possible, it would be much more helpful for people to post advice on how to keep it from happening rather than posting assertions that it's already happened.

Tlaero

 

[Clobbertime]

this is a perfect boomer comment I forgot where I was lol, reads like a newspaper comments section.

phone bad, tech bad, youth bad, old good...

I never said tech was bad. I enjoy it a great deal myself. It's the people letting it make them soft. It's not the phone's fault the person using it walks into a wall because he's giving all his attention to the phone and not where he's going.

 

[bogodit]

You shouldn´t take the impatient ones / doubters too personally. I think they are not attacking nor rushing you. They are just afraid another promising game will turn out like all the others before.
I´m sure you´ve already read something like this but in the past there were quite a few promising 2D handpainted games that over the years either fizzled out or turned into bloated Holstein cows.

I think the doubters see a pessimistic future of July 2024 where everyone is waiting for What a Legend v0.771,01a, when future-magicnuts posts something along these lines:
"Ok guys it took us 11 months but we added 5 new girls (without content), 13 side characters and new supa fany villains that reference Kim Jong-un and Putin. We also patched bugs that should´ve been patched two versions ago, added X amount of words and updated 2 background to HD. Next patch will be "technical one" because our code is Mom´s spaghetti and android users demand 8k images now so pistachio can´t draw anything meanwhile. See you in 2026."

Is that a jab at summertime saga, because that's exactly (more or less) what happened.

 

[j4yj4m]

These SS comparisons aren't useful anyway. SS wasn't even supposed to be a game at first and there was neither a concept nor a plan when everything started basically by accident. The mistakes which were made back then had to be corrected or the game the game would have been an ugly (most people seem to have forgotten how bad it looked), boring and unplayable mess by now.

WaL! on the other hand is well organized from the start and most of these issues simply won't arise. The only mistake people should not make is equate money with speed. Just because a dev makes 2, 3 or 4 times the money, doesn't mean that there'll be more updates. That's really all there is to know, especially when the game is essentially given to the players for free. People should look at what a dev promises and what he delivers and that's really all there is.

 

[Dragon59]

These SS comparisons aren't useful anyway. SS wasn't even supposed to be a game at first and there was neither a concept nor a plan when everything started basically by accident. The mistakes which were made back then had to be corrected or the game the game would have been an ugly (most people seem to have forgotten how bad it looked), boring and unplayable mess by now.

Are you implying it was more like evolution than intelligent design? In other words more like real life than a machine.

 

[j4yj4m]

Are you implying it was more like evolution than intelligent design? In other words more like real life than a machine.

Well, that would probably be a bit too positive. In the end the decision that had to be made with SS in early 2018 was to either rush the game to the end as quickly as possible and leave things (bad) as they were or to go big, which meant that a lot of the content that was produced from mid 2016 until then was essentially kinda "for nothing".

Having said that, even though people imply that DC is changing random stuff all the time, there's indeed a clear pattern to every rework/change.

But as said, these things don't really apply here and it looks like the WaL! is able to support its own development and growth right from the start. The only thing that's needed now is time and patience =)

 

[rickpool98]

so i wanted to ask who is the focose on the next update

 

[sexypeanut]

so i wanted to ask who is the focose on the next update

Lana and the daughter of Lord Hammerdick

 

[diras2010]

Well, that would probably be a bit too positive. In the end the decision that had to be made with SS in early 2018 was to either rush the game to the end as quickly as possible and leave things (bad) as they were or to go big, which meant that a lot of the content that was produced from mid 2016 until then was essentially kinda "for nothing".

Having said that, even though people imply that DC is changing random stuff all the time, there's indeed a clear pattern to every rework/change.

But as said, these things don't really apply here and it looks like the WaL! is able to support its own development and growth right from the start. The only thing that's needed now is time and patience =)

As early player of that game, have to say that even DC said that if they wanted to make that game into something complete, at certain point on time, they had to re-do all the coding, due the fact that the game itself would become something unmanageable, so it was sink or swim, kind of, at the end, the old Dev Dogeek told me that making the new coding and the old coding working alongside was a huge headache, because if they switched something old, to the new sytem, they had to properly adjust the old system in order to avoid the game to crash and burn due inconsistencies

AFAIK WaL Dev has been doing a great job, and have commited to go step by step, tackling everything as best as possible, without compromising quality

A good job is not the done faster, but the one done carefully and in the right way

As I always said, don't force yourself onto the devs, they know what they're doing, and the less you nag to them, the more they have time to focus on the game and the faster the game gets developed, instead of bitching because the next update is not ready, why not give the devs emotional support, and make them feeling appreciated

 

[bogodit]

These SS comparisons aren't useful anyway. SS wasn't even supposed to be a game at first and there was neither a concept nor a plan when everything started basically by accident. The mistakes which were made back then had to be corrected or the game the game would have been an ugly (most people seem to have forgotten how bad it looked), boring and unplayable mess by now.

WaL! on the other hand is well organized from the start and most of these issues simply won't arise. The only mistake people should not make is equate money with speed. Just because a dev makes 2, 3 or 4 times the money, doesn't mean that there'll be more updates. That's really all there is to know, especially when the game is essentially given to the players for free. People should look at what a dev promises and what he delivers and that's really all there is.

But what if WaL dev hires more people for the necessary stuff?

 

[bogodit]

Lana and the daughter of Lord Hammerdick

I wanna bang that old elf lady!

 

[bogodit]

old Dev Dogeek

He isn't with the team anymore?