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sorco2003

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For all those going on about the future...and SG....having a character in SG that is the result of an incestuos relationship...is NOT against their TOS. Having a character begat of that relationship, discussing it, having it happened in the past off-screen, also does NOT break Patreon's TOS.

If people lived their lives based off of what may happen in the future, what a company may do in the future or how something may change their terms....nothinhg would ever get done and you'd likewise never do anything with your life. If this is the reason for Ocean's change regarding futurproofing WIAB with Steam, he's an idiot.

As for those saying it's no different if real or adopted family...yes, yes it is different. Very pschologically different if you have any experience of it so yes, it does hugely and fundamentally change the entire dynamic of the story and the characters.
Personally I don't think this is the case, rather because the LI and MC could be related, emphasis on could. Plus I guess there will be visual revelations in the future of SG that makes WIAB have to change, the golden child must be protected.
 

GetOutOfMyLab

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Wild that this is even a debate. I don't know if it's naiveté, ignorance or a blatant disregard for biology. To even imply there is no difference between a blood bond a a legal one is absurd.
Tell that to someone who was adopted at a young age and their adoptive parents are the only parents they've ever known and see what they tell you.
 

RNasc4444

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Tell that to someone who was adopted at a young age and their adoptive parents are the only parents they've ever known and see what they tell you.
Tell a child they were adopted at a young age and watch if they can resist the urge to look for their biological parents despite having had wonderful adoptive parents their whole lives.

Biology matters. Blood ties matter. No matter how you spin it. I'm not trying to imply that you can't love adopted children like they were your own or that adopted kids can't love their adoptive parents like they were their own. I'm saying the relationship dynamic is always, definetely different.
 

GetOutOfMyLab

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Tell a child they were adopted at a young age and watch if they can resist the urge to look for their biological parents despite having had wonderful adoptive parents their whole lives.

Biology matters. Blood ties matter. No matter how you spin it. I'm not trying to imply that you can't love adopted children like they were your own or that adopted kids can't love their adoptive parents like they were their own. I'm saying the relationship dynamic is always, definetely different.
Not all adopted children look up who their biological parents are, but those that do choose to have their own individual reasons. Often curiosity of their background or even medical reasons. That doesn't change the secure attachments formed through consistent caregiving and emotional support, regardless of being adopted or not. I think it's mostly psychological. That's why in the real world, there are step-siblings who are repulsed by the idea of doing anything sexual with each other. Because mentally, they are still family, which is defined by more than biology - love, support, etc.

But maybe I'm confused on what you mean by the relationship dynamic is always, definitely different. In an adoption scenario, the biological parents are complete strangers to the adopted and these kids see their adoptive parents as their real parents. At least that's what two different adopted kids I knew from high school told me.
 
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Cabin Fever

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Tell that to someone who was adopted at a young age and their adoptive parents are the only parents they've ever known and see what they tell you.
Tell a child they were adopted at a young age and watch if they can resist the urge to look for their biological parents despite having had wonderful adoptive parents their whole lives.

Biology matters. Blood ties matter. No matter how you spin it. I'm not trying to imply that you can't love adopted children like they were your own or that adopted kids can't love their adoptive parents like they were their own. I'm saying the relationship dynamic is always, definetely different.
I personally know an adopted person that only cares about their adoptive parents and couldn't be bothered to learn anything about their biological parents.

I also personally know another adopted person that would never pass up any opportunity to learn anything they can about their biological parents, while still loving their adoptive parents to the end of the world.

That is to say, it all depends on the individual. There is no "always", "definitely", etc. on this.

Side note - it's highly entertaining listening to my two friends trying to convince each other they are wrong, especially after they've had some alcohol in their bellies. :ROFLMAO:
 

AlexFXR

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Sep 24, 2023
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I think at this point the best solution would be for Nika to not be William's son. I would have prefered Nika to be a part of the Zane dynasty but i guess he can still become that through marriage when all LI's are kinda Zane's :ROFLMAO:
They cannot be close relatives at all, much less a son and a father. We know that Nika’s parents died, and William is still alive. In addition, they have different last names... Cyrus and Zane. At most, they can only be distant relatives to each other.
 

sorco2003

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They cannot be close relatives at all, much less a son and a father. We know that Nika’s parents died, and William is still alive. In addition, they have different last names... Cyrus and Zane. At most, they can only be distant relatives to each other.
MAybe you dont know the last news... William is probably not a Zane.
 

sorco2003

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It wouldn't matter anyway. Just because people don't have the same surname means absolutely nothing. We also don't know shit...we have been told stuff....but we still don't actually 'know' shit....
Knowing that maybe the message I answered is hidden (that list is only growing) is to answer a part of it "... have different last name Cyrus-Zane".
The implications of the change could be nothing or all, and William being a Cyrus as BobTheDuck theorized at one point, is entirely possible until the changes are firm and we see them.
 
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Maviarab

Dark Lord of the Coffee
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Knowing that maybe the message I answered is hidden (that list is only growing) is to answer a part of it "... have different last name Cyrus-Zane".
The implications of the change could be nothing or all, and William being a Cyrus as BobTheDuck theorized at one point, is entirely possible until the changes are firm and we see them.
Yeah I was just making the point it's the usual fare from him. So to him, not having same surname means not closely related....and we know for a fact (according to him) his parents are dead, because we were told so... :ROFLMAO: :rolleyes:

Ahh..should never have expected a normal reply, waste of time clicking show ignored content, I should know better myself by now.
 

BobTheDuck

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It wouldn't matter anyway. Just because people don't have the same surname means absolutely nothing. We also don't know shit...we have been told stuff....but we still don't actually 'know' shit....
Knowing that maybe the message I answered is hidden (that list is only growing) is to answer a part of it "... have different last name Cyrus-Zane".
The implications of the change could be nothing or all, and William being a Cyrus as BobTheDuck theorized at one point, is entirely possible until the changes are firm and we see them.
Might not know shit, but damn if I don't have enough umption to make an ass out of it :sneaky:

Theories are fine, but Ocean has to patch SG if Leia or Willi are the "Zane" in ZPR and their names change. So I'm going to assume Ocean will go adoption, as there's no problem with that if Willi and Leia are confirmed related. Dylan is the Zane patriach, unless Helen's kept her maiden name and she's the powerhouse, or what does it even mean to be a Zane? Cyrus could be a cryptid, a Keyser Söze. A story told so kids don't ask caregiver Noji awkward questions! After all, Holgerson said he doesn't know any Cyrus's so clearly they can't exist....

Right now I'm going to assume Ocean's only going to change Willi and Leia's blood relations to everyone else but have them adopted ...because who exactly will be the Zane who establish ZPR, if Katie (as the only blood Zane child - assumed) is an underling at ZPR? Will we have Helen as dommy school mommy?

So many questions, and assumptions, and I'm heading out further on a limb.

But there's always Katie

1.jpg

From the same person who hid contacts with almost all of the city's high society
Do you mean Noji? Who still worked with Scarlet, and goes to a bookclub that both Katie and Leia also go to, as well as Amber, who's friends with Katie's (ex? current?) girlfriend? Noji is so sneaky she can hide everyone in plain sight. :sneaky:
 
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Maviarab

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Might not know shit, but damn if I don't have enough umption to make an ass out of it :sneaky:

Theories are fine, but Ocean has to patch SG if Leia or Willi are the "Zane" in ZPR and their names change. So I'm going to assume Ocean will go adoption, as there's no problem with that if Willi and Leia are confirmed related. Dylan is the Zane patriach, unless Helen's kept her maiden name and she's the powerhouse, or what does it even mean to be a Zane? Cyrus could be a cryptid, a Keyser Söze. A story told so kids don't ask caregiver Noji awkward questions! After all, Holgerson said he doesn't know any Cyrus's so clearly they can't exist....

Right now I'm going to assume Ocean's only going to change Willi and Leia's blood relations to everyone else but have them adopted ...because who exactly will be the Zane who establish ZPR, if Katie (as the only blood Zane child - assumed) is an underling at ZPR? Will we have Helen as dommy school mommy?

So many questions, and assumptions, and I'm heading out further on a limb.

But there's always Katie

View attachment 3856907



Do you mean Noji? Who still worked with Scarlet, and goes to a bookclub that both Katie and Leia also go to, as well as Amber, who's friends with Katie's (ex? current?) girlfriend? Noji is so sneaky she can hide everyone in plain sight. :sneaky:
To be honest, if we are guessing and trying to assume his reasons, the only, only logical assumption I can come to (unfortunately) is:

Leia will no longer be a LI. What may or may not have happened in the past, is in the past and despite anger, resentment, conflicting emotions, deep love...that's where it will stay. It's the only, single way Ocean can future proof both stories and keep them 'clean'....

And despite Katie being my fave, if that actually is the case, I'll be done with both (as I only follow SG due to this, if this didn't exist, SG just isn't interesting enough to me as a VN to keep following it).
 

AlexFXR

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Sep 24, 2023
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MAybe you dont know the last news... William is probably not a Zane.
You're right, I missed the latest news. But there are still a few inconsistencies remaining. Nika's parents died, but William is alive. But even if we do not take this into account, there remains a book club scene in which Nika should have recognized one unexpected guest if he were William's son. But he did not recognize his relative.
 

sorco2003

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You're right, I missed the latest news. But there are still a few inconsistencies remaining. Nika's parents died, but William is alive. But even if we do not take this into account, there remains a book club scene in which Nika should have recognized one unexpected guest if he were William's son. But he did not recognize his relative.
In no case (neither in the current canon, nor in this crazy theory) does the MC know his parents (there was something about a voice... but it's nothing in stone for now), so why should he recognize a relative?
 

BobTheDuck

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To be honest, if we are guessing and trying to assume his reasons, the only, only logical assumption I can come to (unfortunately) is:

Leia will no longer be a LI. What may or may not have happened in the past, is in the past and despite anger, resentment, conflicting emotions, deep love...that's where it will stay. It's the only, single way Ocean can future proof both stories and keep them 'clean'....

And despite Katie being my fave, if that actually is the case, I'll be done with both (as I only follow SG due to this, if this didn't exist, SG just isn't interesting enough to me as a VN to keep following it).
I guess at very least, this question will be answered pretty obviously by Ch4 with their interactions at Leia's home. I have the feeling that he'll keep Leia as a LI, because he assumes it'll make some people happy that she's his sister. I'm not sure Ocean's naive enough to think people were upset just because they couldn't work out what 'old friend' meant.

In no case (neither in the current canon, nor in this crazy theory) does the MC know his parents (there was something about a voice... but it's nothing in stone for now), so why should he recognize a relative?
The thing about the voice was Nika telling whoever he walks with in Ch4.5 that he doesn't know if it's a dream, but he remembers his mother's voice reading a book about the stars to him:

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But that unreliable NIka memory:

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Since we are going down that rabbit hole of "Nika said his parents are dead" not being entirely true for whatever reason...

Given the complicated relationships in the Zane background story, it's entirely possible that some Zane's were estranged from each other. And therefore it's not entirely unreasonable if "William's son" wouldn't recognize his Katie, especially when at least half a decade has passed since they've last met.

I'm not saying Nika is William's son. I'm saying there isn't enough enough concrete proof one way or another.
The two pertinent quotes from Nika are above, in spoliers, plus this one from the start. Nika at least gives the same age twice. So even if someone lied, he's been raised as an orphan from the age of 3. So 15 years of bad memory (other than Summer), doesn't remember their faces, and only thinks he has heard his mother's voice, doesn't know for sure. THe quote below gives more credence than what he said to Maja, as it's his expositional "break the fourth wall to set the scene" internal monologue, and he has no reason to lie, or hide the situation. But he remembers an uncle who taught him basketball. While he was living with Noji.

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sorco2003

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I guess at very least, this question will be answered pretty obviously by Ch4 with their interactions at Leia's home. I have the feeling that he'll keep Leia as a LI, because he assumes it'll make some people happy that she's his sister. I'm not sure Ocean's naive enough to think people were upset just because they couldn't work out what 'old friend' meant.
As every time Ocean throws a smoke bomb, it's all so vague that it can be interpreted in many ways...

* fans of incest stories would be upset that he changed the status of the rest of the family

* players who don't like incest (remember that the "official" version of Patreon assures that "nobody is related to anybody" would be very upset about having an official incestuous relationship.

It's all speculation...
 
4.20 star(s) 198 Votes