VN Ren'Py Where It All Began [Ch. 3 Full] [Oceanlab]

[yossa999]

No no nono no...NO! Let's kill this narrative right here. I'm not too picky and not all characters are built the same.

You cannot possibly disagree with the take that Ocean quite often goes overboard with his character models. Jabba and Mila are obvious examples. His style is quite realistic, so when you have these clearly over the top examples, they stand out. Gravity is real. Sagginess is also real. And while I'm a little more forgiving with Mila since I assume she's 18 or 19, it's hard to be as generous with someone of Helen's age. It just feels unnatural.

I'm not picking a fight here. Not dying on this hill. It's not a big deal at all but I will throw some jabs here and there for the fun of it

EDIT: Not wanting to spam with another comment I'll just edit this one. Solid devlog. Productivity talk is boring but he brought it right back with some weather and temperatures stuff. Then he added a little tax info which is always welcome. Finally, a brilliant finish with a couple of Katie renders and some Kat teasing. Amazing!

... Said the guy who didn't like any LI in the other game. Sorry, no potato nose and ducky lips for you here too.
I'm glad that at least a family household narco lab in a barn feels completely natural!

The development log was perfect, showing the number of renders completed. And nothing else matters.

 

[BobTheDuck]

... Said the guy who didn't like any LI in the other game. Sorry, no potato nose and ducky lips for you here too.
I'm glad that at least a family household narco lab in a barn feels completely natural!

The development log was perfect, showing the number of renders completed Katie's underboob. And nothing else matters.

 

[Dr.TSoni]

No no nono no...NO! Let's kill this narrative right here. I'm not too picky and not all characters are built the same.

... Said the guy who didn't like any LI in the other game. Sorry, no potato nose and ducky lips for you here too.
I'm glad that at least a family household narco lab in a barn feels completely natural!

The development log was perfect, showing the number of renders completed. And nothing else matters.

View attachment 4023948
View attachment 4023951

 

[Maviarab]

No no nono no...NO! Let's kill this narrative right here. I'm not too picky and not all characters are built the same.

You cannot possibly disagree with the take that Ocean quite often goes overboard with his character models. Jabba and Mila are obvious examples. His style is quite realistic, so when you have these clearly over the top examples, they stand out. Gravity is real. Sagginess is also real. And while I'm a little more forgiving with Mila since I assume she's 18 or 19, it's hard to be as generous with someone of Helen's age. It just feels unnatural.

I'm not picking a fight here. Not dying on this hill. It's not a big deal at all but I will throw some jabs here and there for the fun of it

EDIT: Not wanting to spam with another comment I'll just edit this one. Solid devlog. Productivity talk is boring but he brought it right back with some weather and temperatures stuff. Then he added a little tax info which is always welcome. Finally, a brilliant finish with a couple of Katie renders and some Kat teasing. Amazing!

Clownishly overtuned opinion if you think a hyperrealistic model doesn't look like a human just because "boobs don't sag enough", but you do you.

... Said the guy who didn't like any LI in the other game. Sorry, no potato nose and ducky lips for you here too.
I'm glad that at least a family household narco lab in a barn feels completely natural!

The development log was perfect, showing the number of renders completed. And nothing else matters.

View attachment 4025012

View attachment 4025016

 

[HellFire_UA]

I don't know why, but this reminds me "Dora the Explorer"

 

[SamualHand]

I have to say guys I can't wait for these babes to cuck me. I'm going to go to every bar around until I find the most hung guy for their pleasure.

We all know how you will find out.... take them deep!

 

[sorco2003]

Dev Log from 25 Apr:
"The upcoming update is the biggest Update WiAB has had yet, I'd estimate around 2500-2800 renders. But we all know my render estimations are always lowballing it."

Dev Log from 12 Sep:
"Slowly, but surely I'm closing in on the 2000 still renders."

So, in a very, very rough estimate, it's 70-80% completed. Of course, it's unknown how much work will be required for animation, postwork and polishing, all sorts of Steam shit and whatnot..

Render-wise it's already the same size as the CH3 Full.

In the super optimistic version of myself, I estimate more or less the same, if it wasn't that after the last dev log I wrote him and he gave me a number of renders a little (not so little) higher than what he said in the beginning. Anyway, forgetting that, just focusing on the public information, I would estimate about 12 weeks more for the still renders. What makes me doubt that finally it could be ready is that "animation with blender"... that fact puts a lot of clouds to my optimism, I don't think it's convenient to experiment at this moment since the priority should be to go out to Steam, what happens if the experiment doesn't convince him? pass to Daz and do it again? I understand from what I have read that the animations in Blender have many advantages in the pre-production times, but not so much at the time of rendering (there are several examples that I do not mention not to attract the off topic).

I thought he'd put off buying the second workstation until after the tax issues were dealt with, I assume he has the one kick ass machine and the one with the older bits that he probably doesn't like turning on and probably keeps as a back up/experiments computer. No knowledge on my behalf though, just my assumption from the way he talks about his 'pride and joy' machine.

I think I'd say the same thing (if I'm wrong, we can blame the Mandela effect).
Still, we've already seen that more hardware capacity means more renders for the chapter and not less time between chapters (and no, not just Ocean, every single dev who doesn't form a team).

 

[BobTheDuck]

In the super optimistic version of myself, I estimate more or less the same, if it wasn't that after the last dev log I wrote him and he gave me a number of renders a little (not so little) higher than what he said in the beginning. Anyway, forgetting that, just focusing on the public information, I would estimate about 12 weeks more for the still renders. What makes me doubt that finally it could be ready is that "animation with blender"... that fact puts a lot of clouds to my optimism, I don't think it's convenient to experiment at this moment since the priority should be to go out to Steam, what happens if the experiment doesn't convince him? pass to Daz and do it again? I understand from what I have read that the animations in Blender have many advantages in the pre-production times, but not so much at the time of rendering (there are several examples that I do not mention not to attract the off topic).



I think I'd say the same thing (if I'm wrong, we can blame the Mandela effect).
Still, we've already seen that more hardware capacity means more renders for the chapter and not less time between chapters (and no, not just Ocean, every single dev who doesn't form a team).

I think regardless of what Ocean says aloud, it's pretty clear he wants it out this year. He's done ~2000 renders for WiaB and ~3000 renders at least for SG. As far as production potential goes, I really don't care how he manages them. If I was apaying supporter (rather than a steam purchaser) I'm maybe care 1% more, because I'm investing in workflow as well as outcome, but as a steam purchaser, I buy outcomes. How Ocean gets the product done can be a black box process as far as I'm concerned. I do like thinking about it and possibilities, but it's pretty idle thought. Going back to the work station situation, having two identical rigs is optimal for any creative workflow - if one rig goes down for any reason, work can keep going, and redundancy is an awesome safety net. He can switch back and forward between them with identical workflows rather than spend time dividing tasks according to tech specs. I get that devs want to increase the life of their stories with more renders - enough renders fast moving and you have the whole thing animated... but WiaB is the smaller of the two games. If LI's get branches, suddenly each chapter is 5000 renders. At some point, I do believe Ocean will realise that different render sets for different clothes is only practical when it's done in the game engine. Consider that an LI needs two sets of renders if they have multiple body shapes possible in their path (Dana), as well as multiple outfits. Personally I prefer the story to dressups. One great outfit is fine.

Going back to the blender point, we've seen good blender renders from Ocean almost a year ago, not as good as what he can do in Daz, but not far off, and that was then. I'm sure he's done more in blender than we realise, and has regular training, like gym time, he clocks his blender hours. Weren't the short stories going to be done in blender? Maybe his backup rig can do the blender renders while he's busy working on other parts anyway.

 

[sorco2003]

I think regardless of what Ocean says aloud, it's pretty clear he wants it out this year. He's done ~2000 renders for WiaB and ~3000 renders at least for SG. As far as production potential goes, I really don't care how he manages them. If I was apaying supporter (rather than a steam purchaser) I'm maybe care 1% more, because I'm investing in workflow as well as outcome, but as a steam purchaser, I buy outcomes. How Ocean gets the product done can be a black box process as far as I'm concerned. I do like thinking about it and possibilities, but it's pretty idle thought. Going back to the work station situation, having two identical rigs is optimal for any creative workflow - if one rig goes down for any reason, work can keep going, and redundancy is an awesome safety net. He can switch back and forward between them with identical workflows rather than spend time dividing tasks according to tech specs. I get that devs want to increase the life of their stories with more renders - enough renders fast moving and you have the whole thing animated... but WiaB is the smaller of the two games. If LI's get branches, suddenly each chapter is 5000 renders. At some point, I do believe Ocean will realise that different render sets for different clothes is only practical when it's done in the game engine. Consider that an LI needs two sets of renders if they have multiple body shapes possible in their path (Dana), as well as multiple outfits. Personally I prefer the story to dressups. One great outfit is fine.

Going back to the blender point, we've seen good blender renders from Ocean almost a year ago, not as good as what he can do in Daz, but not far off, and that was then. I'm sure he's done more in blender than we realise, and has regular training, like gym time, he clocks his blender hours. Weren't the short stories going to be done in blender? Maybe his backup rig can do the blender renders while he's busy working on other parts anyway.

Let's separate things, and I start with what can be clearer. Blender: Animations is different from still renders. He himself said he was going to experiment, not me. So that point should not be debatable.
Next, I fully agree with what you say about the branch, and we can say that in WIAB is even worse than in SG, each LI in WIAB has by default two paths (vanilla and ntr) and to that we add that each of the LI has all possible combinations in the open relationship, how many exclusive renderings will there be only for Katie? he will dress her differently for only Katie, Katie Zoey, Katie Zoey Miru, Katie Zoey Leia (if this still exists), Katie Leia Miru (idem), etc etc etc etc ? It would be too big a gamble to see it materialize.
Although the last thing I put may change, we don't know yet...
As for development times and progress, I do care, if something WIAB gave me is the possibility to follow the step by step of the creative/productive process of an avn, it worries me? not in the case of WIAB, since I accepted that it is a slow project that will be done as Ocean keeps wanting to do it. I follow other avn's in the same way, but those other avn's are the main focus of their developer, and the "demands" are different (note the quotation marks).

 

[Maviarab]

Let's separate things, and I start with what can be clearer. Blender: Animations is different from still renders. He himself said he was going to experiment, not me. So that point should not be debatable.
Next, I fully agree with what you say about the branch, and we can say that in WIAB is even worse than in SG, each LI in WIAB has by default two paths (vanilla and ntr) and to that we add that each of the LI has all possible combinations in the open relationship, how many exclusive renderings will there be only for Katie? he will dress her differently for only Katie, Katie Zoey, Katie Zoey Miru, Katie Zoey Leia (if this still exists), Katie Leia Miru (idem), etc etc etc etc ? It would be too big a gamble to see it materialize.
Although the last thing I put may change, we don't know yet...
As for development times and progress, I do care, if something WIAB gave me is the possibility to follow the step by step of the creative/productive process of an avn, it worries me? not in the case of WIAB, since I accepted that it is a slow project that will be done as Ocean keeps wanting to do it. I follow other avn's in the same way, but those other avn's are the main focus of their developer, and the "demands" are different (note the quotation marks).

Possibly three paths/branches for some characters if he decides to still keep some D/s elements in.

I do agree with you though on your previous post...it's becoming concerning...

 

[BobTheDuck]

Let's separate things, and I start with what can be clearer. Blender: Animations is different from still renders. He himself said he was going to experiment, not me. So that point should not be debatable.
Next, I fully agree with what you say about the branch, and we can say that in WIAB is even worse than in SG, each LI in WIAB has by default two paths (vanilla and ntr) and to that we add that each of the LI has all possible combinations in the open relationship, how many exclusive renderings will there be only for Katie? he will dress her differently for only Katie, Katie Zoey, Katie Zoey Miru, Katie Zoey Leia (if this still exists), Katie Leia Miru (idem), etc etc etc etc ? It would be too big a gamble to see it materialize.
Although the last thing I put may change, we don't know yet...
As for development times and progress, I do care, if something WIAB gave me is the possibility to follow the step by step of the creative/productive process of an avn, it worries me? not in the case of WIAB, since I accepted that it is a slow project that will be done as Ocean keeps wanting to do it. I follow other avn's in the same way, but those other avn's are the main focus of their developer, and the "demands" are different (note the quotation marks).

What I mean about blender: Ocean says experiment, but he's been experimenting at least a year, with results. His early blender versions of Sasha were not great, but they weren't far off, the one of Zara was fantastic. Sure it's a still, but again I don't think he's been sitting still on it. I don't think he's going to risk worse animations than he has already in Ch1 (which are still better than a lot of AVN's). I believe he is understating the situation, to give himslef an out if he doesn't meet his own standards with Blender. He only has to do one to find that out. If the first animation doesn't get him excited, he'll probably switch back from then.

But as some point in the dev cycle, he'll have to take time to do it in blender, because he wants the extra features it offers. There is never a good time to take away dev time to experiment, at least this way he's being productive while experimenting rather than doing throw away exercises, fingers crossed.

For progress, what I meant is that outcome can arrive in any form. If it's continually delayed, it's not an outcome, yet, or yet. SO it needs to eventuate. The longer he leaves a product to eventuate, the further it slips from people's minds (until you show them another Katie render ). So in this sense, the tools and metrics are less important to me than the sense of development goals (releases). For a patreon, the process is more important, as they are supporting the process. I'm intruigued but I'm also a sucker for Katie renders, and suddenly I can wait another two weeks. Ocean doesn't get my money until delivery though, so outcome in WiaB's dev time is far more critical than for SG right now, and make WiaB much less of a side project.

Regards the bifurcation of renders to all permutations, to some extent, the optional sex scenes worry me less than the clothing. Clothing means the whole game needs optional renders whenever Dana or Mila are present, in classrooms etc. And extra 50 renders and different animations for sex scenes are less work than every animation with say Dana will have 4 variations, two for clothes and two for body sizes in every render she's present. Then two different options for each of those options if Katie has clothing options. I don't want dressup doll simulator 2024 to arrive in 2040 and all my meaningful choices boil down to which colour teal sets off Katie's eyes...

 

[sorco2003]

What I mean about blender: Ocean says experiment, but he's been experimenting at least a year, with results. His early blender versions of Sasha were not great, but they weren't far off, the one of Zara was fantastic. Sure it's a still, but again I don't think he's been sitting still on it. I don't think he's going to risk worse animations than he has already in Ch1 (which are still better than a lot of AVN's). I believe he is understating the situation, to give himslef an out if he doesn't meet his own standards with Blender. He only has to do one to find that out. If the first animation doesn't get him excited, he'll probably switch back from then.

But as some point in the dev cycle, he'll have to take time to do it in blender, because he wants the extra features it offers. There is never a good time to take away dev time to experiment, at least this way he's being productive while experimenting rather than doing throw away exercises, fingers crossed.

For progress, what I meant is that outcome can arrive in any form. If it's continually delayed, it's not an outcome, yet, or yet. SO it needs to eventuate. The longer he leaves a product to eventuate, the further it slips from people's minds (until you show them another Katie render ). So in this sense, the tools and metrics are less important to me than the sense of development goals (releases). For a patreon, the process is more important, as they are supporting the process. I'm intruigued but I'm also a sucker for Katie renders, and suddenly I can wait another two weeks. Ocean doesn't get my money until delivery though, so outcome in WiaB's dev time is far more critical than for SG right now, and make WiaB much less of a side project.

Regards the bifurcation of renders to all permutations, to some extent, the optional sex scenes worry me less than the clothing. Clothing means the whole game needs optional renders whenever Dana or Mila are present, in classrooms etc. And extra 50 renders and different animations for sex scenes are less work than every animation with say Dana will have 4 variations, two for clothes and two for body sizes in every render she's present. Then two different options for each of those options if Katie has clothing options. I don't want dressup doll simulator 2024 to arrive in 2040 and all my meaningful choices boil down to which colour teal sets off Katie's eyes...

I'm not going to agree... there are propitious moments to experiment, and this is not one of them. From January to mid May was a spectacular window of experimentation, there was no WIAB and he had to wait for the SG renders, then he had to wait for the approvals... there was plenty of time to experiment.

For the branch, I was not talking about the sexual scenes, but the common scenes, if the player is in the Dana chubby path in open relationship with Miru and chasing Katie, all of them are going to have costume variation? and the same scene but only chasing Katie? or Katie Zoey? that's what I meant... and without counting those scenes they are also going to have the variant if you are in a vanilla path or ntr path

 

[BobTheDuck]

I'm not going to agree... there are propitious moments to experiment, and this is not one of them. From January to mid May was a spectacular window of experimentation, there was no WIAB and he had to wait for the SG renders, then he had to wait for the approvals... there was plenty of time to experiment.

For the branch, I was not talking about the sexual scenes, but the common scenes, if the player is in the Dana chubby path in open relationship with Miru and chasing Katie, all of them are going to have costume variation? and the same scene but only chasing Katie? or Katie Zoey? that's what I meant... and without counting those scenes they are also going to have the variant if you are in a vanilla path or ntr path

Oh right, we're saying the same thing regards the render branchings then, same concern. No one needs 10GB per chapter (if SG S2C1 is a normal legnth of ~2500 for the playthrough, with each girls path's as options, and Ocean's anticipating up to 2/3rds of the renders of S1 for S2C1 BEFORE doing clothing mods... well damn. 10GB per chapter it is). Animations become the biggest problem in some ways - the animations will either show the 'Ocean' canon of a scene, or he needs to render all the options that might be present for every animation in the normal part of the story.

Regarding experimenting - how do we know he wasn't experimenting with blender then? He was trying to lead that friend's GF through learning it, I'm sure he learned from the process and had exercises then. I'm not reading too much into the word experiment, because every creative project I do, there are experiments, trying new things. I am certain he has regular professional development time for the actual nuts and bolts experiments - when he talks about boob physics and lighting, it's because Ocean is experimenting - the lighting one shows he's experimenting with lighting in blender, pretty sure the boob physics is in blender too. At some point he has to trust his blender skills on a proper job, and not just have them for tests, and there is never a time that will be good. It's always be more convenient and efficient to do what you already know. I do understand the concern as to it spending more time for a project that blows out its time budget regularly.

 

[LHDLLB]

Let's separate things, and I start with what can be clearer. Blender: Animations is different from still renders. He himself said he was going to experiment, not me. So that point should not be debatable.
Next, I fully agree with what you say about the branch, and we can say that in WIAB is even worse than in SG, each LI in WIAB has by default two paths (vanilla and ntr) and to that we add that each of the LI has all possible combinations in the open relationship, how many exclusive renderings will there be only for Katie? he will dress her differently for only Katie, Katie Zoey, Katie Zoey Miru, Katie Zoey Leia (if this still exists), Katie Leia Miru (idem), etc etc etc etc ? It would be too big a gamble to see it materialize.
Although the last thing I put may change, we don't know yet...
As for development times and progress, I do care, if something WIAB gave me is the possibility to follow the step by step of the creative/productive process of an avn, it worries me? not in the case of WIAB, since I accepted that it is a slow project that will be done as Ocean keeps wanting to do it. I follow other avn's in the same way, but those other avn's are the main focus of their developer, and the "demands" are different (note the quotation marks).

Is confirmed that every LI will have a Netorare path ? I was under the assumption that only some of them have one, others would explore others kinks as Netori or Sub/Dom relationships.

 

[sorco2003]

Is confirmed that every LI will have a Netorare path ? I was under the assumption that only some of them have one, others would explore others kinks as Netori or Sub/Dom relationships.

At this point I can only say, nothing is confirmed at all. There was an answer from Ocean that said yes but in the discord purge it was lost (the answer said that the ntr paths were not all the same, that is, what is known so far only applies to Miru, but that the other LI having other circumstances made the ntr path to be different, he gave as an example Leia, who is actually single) And here NTR works as generic , for example Gina's path would be netori or sharing or bull (and again, everything can change, we haven't talked about the ntr paths for a long time).

 

[Dr.TSoni]

We no longer have certainties

 

[LHDLLB]

At this point I can only say, nothing is confirmed at all. There was an answer from Ocean that said yes but in the discord purge it was lost (the answer said that the ntr paths were not all the same, that is, what is known so far only applies to Miru, but that the other LI having other circumstances made the ntr path to be different, he gave as an example Leia, who is actually single) And here NTR works as generic , for example Gina's path would be netori or sharing or bull (and again, everything can change, we haven't talked about the ntr paths for a long time).

The lack of clarification is sometimes frustrating,but thanks for the answer.

 

[RNasc4444]

We no longer have certainties
View attachment 4026716

Did we ever though? Anywhere in Ocean's work I mean...

Don't worry I'm not gonna go on another rant that contains the word "fluid"... I've triggered yossa enough for one day

Plus I think I'm gonna use "entropy" in my next analogy. Feeling like "fluid" is played out already

 

[yossa999]

Did we ever though? Anywhere in Ocean's work I mean...

Don't worry I'm not gonna go on another rant that constains the word "fluid"... I've triggered yossa enough for one day

Plus I think I'm gonna use "entropy" in my next analogy. Feeling like "fluid" is played out already

Frankly, I would rather get triggered by the release announcement.

As for the certainty... The only thing that can grant you some certainty is an insurance policy. Any insurance agent will confirm this to you.

 

[Turret]

As for the certainty... The only thing that can grant you some certainty is an insurance policy. Any insurance agent will confirm this to you.

Good one! But it is a fact that Ocean´s messages have become more vague over time. Yes, you cannot get 100% assurance in a development process, but his posts had more hard info content in earlier times.
Another thing and one I am much more riled up over is his rather new tendency to change characters just for the heck of it. Ocean has caught a real heavy dose of "Verschlimmbessern", which means trying to fix something and making it worse with this attempt. We had so many great looking characters in old Wiab ch.6 and new Wiab ch.1 and now one by one Ocean ruins them. One of the worst is new Helen, who went from hot Milf to Sumo wrestler. And the list goes on, Leia and Daphne (preview)with their new absurd bolt on tits, Dana, even Miru with the new boner-killing breast piercings.
Pfuideibel! (Very problematic to translate fittingly, but it should be obvious that it is NOT a label you give something you like)

These things in addition with Ocean´s kowtowing to Patreon on the storylines to keep SG save changed my stance on Wiab and SG quite much. Once I was quite invested in anything new about the two games, now I am more "nice to know".