VN Ren'Py Where It All Began [Ch. 3 Full] [Oceanlab]

[BobTheDuck]

I find this scene really funny, but I can't fault William too much, who would not want it ?

Mona thing... Yeah, is not great but as was said I don't think is the crazier thing in this game, how the hell does Leia goes from anorexic kid mob boss ?



I think this is a very fair assessment, young William seems inconsequential at best and his behavior until now does not seems that he changed much, he does seem genuine in his desires to right the wrongs he did though so at least he knows he was a complete ass.



I have talked about it before but trying to make sense of the timeline gives me headache, now I am just rolling with it.

Not to defende William, but while what he did was terrible, what Leia did was 10 times worse, she went full psycho on Mon and spent a year (?) calling her cumdump. While William has a excuse of acting on instinct and with out thought, what Leia did was thought through and meticulous, truly evil. I also don't want to make too much assumption over Monica, while he does is the victim in this situation I don't think that a single character in WiaB is "pure" and I think that we will find out that there is more to Monica than just the naive teenage that William did wrong.

I think that scene is brilliant, precisely because is shows how immature William is. Everyone has written him off as a jerk, but the reality is he was just too young. Leia might be his twin but the onset of maturity still happens differently for different genders. Still a jerk, but mostly an ignorant one than a malicious one.

...until Mon. I'm sure there are other events, like what he did to the bullies. As far as Leia and William being adopted or foster kids, that is a perfect way to develop their pettiness, as maladjusted foster kids, who resent being outsiders. I really think that's the way Ocean will go, with the tension with Katie being the natural born daughter, while William and Leia feel the need to protect their separate identity.

And although there's crazier things, if Helen and Dylan went for it on the kitchen table infront of kids, would they be cool hosts for a 9 year old's party? Kat's friends are going to be mostly her age, not William's classes age. Katie is shown as the youngest in the Zane household, and she I think is older than Kat (Katie is the bibi, because she's younger, and William and leia use it to torment her, Katie is at an advanced stage of her course, while Kat seem to be closer to the start).

I'm not a fan of Leia, I get what the story is doing with her, and it makes sense. William might go back for nostalgia, but my William's going to spend far more time rebuilding bridges with Katie and Mon than with Leia.

I also think it's possible that Mon is only "impure" in the sense, William has corrupted her and she tried to bury it. I honestly do think she's mostly pure ...well other than being a police officer that's friendly with an outlaw family....

 

[LHDLLB]

I think that scene is brilliant, precisely because is shows how immature William is. Everyone has written him off as a jerk, but the reality is he was just too young. Leia might be his twin but the onset of maturity still happens differently for different genders. Still a jerk, but mostly an ignorant one than a malicious one.

...until Mon. I'm sure there are other events, like what he did to the bullies. As far as Leia and William being adopted or foster kids, that is a perfect way to develop their pettiness, as maladjusted foster kids, who resent being outsiders. I really think that's the way Ocean will go, with the tension with Katie being the natural born daughter, while William and Leia feel the need to protect their separate identity.

And although there's crazier things, if Helen and Dylan went for it on the kitchen table infront of kids, would they be cool hosts for a 9 year old's party? Kat's friends are going to be mostly her age, not William's classes age. Katie is shown as the youngest in the Zane household, and she I think is older than Kat (Katie is the bibi, because she's younger, and William and leia use it to torment her, Katie is at an advanced stage of her course, while Kat seem to be closer to the start).

I'm not a fan of Leia, I get what the story is doing with her, and it makes sense. William might go back for nostalgia, but my William's going to spend far more time rebuilding bridges with Katie and Mon than with Leia.

I also think it's possible that Mon is only "impure" in the sense, William has corrupted her and she tried to bury it. I honestly do think she's mostly pure ...well other than being a police officer that's friendly with an outlaw family....

Oh I agree, Young William while a complete jerk it is born out of immaturity rather than malice, and that scene shows it perfectly. And I laugh hard every damn time. Even Mon event can be excused, while not justified, is clear that himself was going through
a lot and he never intent to things go the way that they did, and was a series of events that lead to it and I still maintain that the worst part of it was Leia's doing. About the family situation, I agree, it is the path that makes more sense and I don't hate it, it works in many different levels... I just hate the precedent that it opens, makes me loses trust, for the rest we have to wait and see how much this change will impact the story.

I loved Leia since the OG, and do more now, find her a fascinating character even if not exactly original. While Katie, was just uninteresting to me, can't not say exactly why but she never clicked with it. I like New Katie more though, and while she still is not high on my list she is not low either, curious to see how her path evolves and how much we can fuck - or not- her relationship with Zoey.

English is not my native language and sometimes I can't quite find the right words, I don't think that Mon is a bad/evil person as Leia certainly is. She just is present as too much innocent, and I am suspicious of that, because I think that there is no innocents in this story, I think that we will learn that everyone has a skeleton that will come out sooner or later, and the more innocent a person is bigger the skeleton. Now I might just be reaching here and Mon truly is what she appears, I dutiful cop that fights for what is right and was done wrong by William and Leia, I just am not completely sold on this idea yet, maybe Helen incident was meant to Leia and Mon had a hand in it. I don't know. I just am a little suspicious that is all.

 

[BobTheDuck]

Oh I agree, Young William while a complete jerk it is born out of immaturity rather than malice, and that scene shows it perfectly. And I laugh hard every damn time. Even Mon event can be excused, while not justified, is clear that himself was going through
a lot and he never intent to things go the way that they did, and was a series of events that lead to it and I still maintain that the worst part of it was Leia's doing. About the family situation, I agree, it is the path that makes more sense and I don't hate it, it works in many different levels... I just hate the precedent that it opens, makes me loses trust, for the rest we have to wait and see how much this change will impact the story.

I loved Leia since the OG, and do more now, find her a fascinating character even if not exactly original. While Katie, was just uninteresting to me, can't not say exactly why but she never clicked with it. I like New Katie more though, and while she still is not high on my list she is not low either, curious to see how her path evolves and how much we can fuck - or not- her relationship with Zoey.

English is not my native language and sometimes I can't quite find the right words, I don't think that Mon is a bad/evil person as Leia certainly is. She just is present as too much innocent, and I am suspicious of that, because I think that there is no innocents in this story, I think that we will learn that everyone has a skeleton that will come out sooner or later, and the more innocent a person is bigger the skeleton. Now I might just be reaching here and Mon truly is what she appears, I dutiful cop that fights for what is right and was done wrong by William and Leia, I just am not completely sold on this idea yet, maybe Helen incident was meant to Leia and Mon had a hand in it. I don't know. I just am a little suspicious that is all.

Some very nice perspectives. I think when we hear what is said at Leia's house (presumably the opening scene of the next chapter), we'll get some more background. Also further reminiscing with Gina and Dana will reveal some of Leia's meanness towards anyone she suspected of trying to take what she considers hers. Interesting how she seems to respect Miru, even before the fight, there was just awkwardness and coldness, but I don't recall any directed malice. As a character I find her interesting, as a LI not so much, even in the old version, she seemed more in love with the past than with William in a way, it seemed more about living out her longed for fantasy. I like Katie, because there is the tension without any expectation, and William and her can't seem to either stay angry at each other, ignore each other, and they keep pretending the other is evil, while stealing glances.

I think if we look at Mon being a friend of the Zane's from childhood (why was she at Kat's party otherwise? WHy do they consider her part of their circle?), and that Leia sent William because she wants William to now seduce Mon, either completely innocent or nefarious mastermind could work. My only thing against her utter innocence is the blind eye she turns to the Zanes - sure she grew up with them, but she knows without doubt Joe's in prison, and Leia's doing very questionable things. If she were squeaky clean, she'd be staying away from difficult friendships that could tarnish her career. But Abigail is Helen's friend, so maybe she's working for Abigail to keep a low key eye out for trouble. I don't think she's a plant by the shadowy elites pulling strings, most likely colluding with Abigail off the books to keep Helen safe.

 

[Verbalvonitcomet]

Excellent story so far. Great renders, and a compelling storyline. I noticed that the last update was in January, I hope that the Dev. is Ok. Just curious about how things are shaping. I don't want to come off as one of those, when is the next update. I know that the Dev. has a life and I put no pressure on Art.

 

[sorco2003]

Excellent story so far. Great renders, and a compelling storyline. I noticed that the last update was in January, I hope that the Dev. is Ok. Just curious about how things are shaping. I don't want to come off as one of those, when is the next update. I know that the Dev. has a life and I put no pressure on Art.

You wrote enough to deserve a real answer, this is the secondary project (in every sense, although it was the first to be born) of the developer. Given that circumstance, and having lost the patreon page, the development that was already slow, let's say it became a little slower. We suppose in the optimistic vision that in December there will be an up date, this new up date will be released for Steam as early access.

 

[Verbalvonitcomet]

You wrote enough to deserve a real answer, this is the secondary project (in every sense, although it was the first to be born) of the developer. Given that circumstance, and having lost the patreon page, the development that was already slow, let's say it became a little slower. We suppose in the optimistic vision that in December there will be an up date, this new up date will be released for Steam as early access.

Thanks for the reply znd I will be looking to steam for updates.

 

[Maviarab]

While Katie, was just uninteresting to me, can't not say exactly why but she never clicked with it. I like New Katie more though, and while she still is not high on my list

 

[cmonn]

update when?

 

[BobTheDuck]

update when?

Hasn't changed from last time you asked. There's also a reply on this page 3 posts up to someone already answering this exact question.

 

[Dr.TSoni]

...until Mon. I'm sure there are other events, like what he did to the bullies. As far as Leia and William being adopted or foster kids, that is a perfect way to develop their pettiness, as maladjusted foster kids, who resent being outsiders. I really think that's the way Ocean will go, with the tension with Katie being the natural born daughter, while William and Leia feel the need to protect their separate identity.

But while this explains their pettiness it makes it more confusing why William should care about Helen's fate

 

[BobTheDuck]

But while this explains their pettiness it makes it more confusing why William should care about Helen's fate

Because she raised him, regardless of whatever label is on their relationship. Some people can't wait to run from their parents, some people are indifferent to blood ties, and some people blood relations flip a switch. Everyone approaches all their relationships differently. I mean why does William care about Daphne? They're equally not related - they shared for.mative experiences (that we're yet to find out). There are years of formative experiences that William shared with Helen and Dylan. Dylan gets all teary about William being back (I'm still taking the relationship change on the face value that Ocean's not going to change renders, just script to accomodate) for example, just like William gets all teary about calling Daphne.

We have barely seen any of the formative experiences or hat them explained, I don't see any major obstacle to William caring fiercely about Helen.

 

[CWIPS]

Does the game really start with Miru and the MC sitting at home or is that just the latest chapter? I don't see links to download any prior chapters in the OP?

 

[BobTheDuck]

Does the game really start with Miru and the MC sitting at home or is that just the latest chapter? I don't see links to download any prior chapters in the OP?

Yes, that's the opening scene.

Edit: provided you mean their gun fight in their apartment that ends up with a sex scene.

 

[CWIPS]

Yes, that's the opening scene.

Edit: provided you mean their gun fight in their apartment that ends up with a sex scene.

Yep, that's it. Thanks, the way the story is working out showed there was a lot of backstory and that's not even counting he and Miru together, so I thought there was something I was missing and was scratching my head at the OP. Cheers!

 

[RNasc4444]

But while this explains their pettiness it makes it more confusing why William should care about Helen's fate

What do you mean?!?!?!? She's his and Leia's landlady! Isn't that enough? They were allowed to live rent free in a nice house with strangers that took care of them. Can you imagine the financial burden alone for 2 young kids? I wouldn't give Jabba my kidney or anything but I'd gladly drop by and stay at the house again for a few weeks to help out.

Even though she's not actually disabled or anything and can still do everything she was doing before... Even though there really isn't anything I could do for her... Even though we aren't related... Even though...yeah I dunno. Beats me honestly, I can't make sense of it. Let's go with what Bob said. Suspension of disbelief and the power of love can explain anything

 

[Dr.TSoni]

Because she raised him, regardless of whatever label is on their relationship. Some people can't wait to run from their parents, some people are indifferent to blood ties, and some people blood relations flip a switch. Everyone approaches all their relationships differently. I mean why does William care about Daphne? They're equally not related - they shared for.mative experiences (that we're yet to find out). There are years of formative experiences that William shared with Helen and Dylan. Dylan gets all teary about William being back (I'm still taking the relationship change on the face value that Ocean's not going to change renders, just script to accomodate) for example, just like William gets all teary about calling Daphne.

We have barely seen any of the formative experiences or hat them explained, I don't see any major obstacle to William caring fiercely about Helen.

This theory implies a certain sense of non-belonging which in turn implies a certain lack of family relationship

What do you mean?!?!?!? She's his and Leia's landlady! Isn't that enough? They were allowed to live rent free in a nice house with strangers that took care of them. Can you imagine the financial burden alone for 2 young kids? I wouldn't give Jabba my kidney or anything but I'd gladly drop by and stay at the house again for a few weeks to help out.

Even though she's not actually disabled or anything and can still do everything she was doing before... Even though there really isn't anything I could do for her... Even though we aren't related... Even though...yeah I dunno. Beats me honestly, I can't make sense of it. Let's go with what Bob said. Suspension of disbelief and the power of love can explain anything

 

[BobTheDuck]

This theory implies a certain sense of non-belonging which in turn implies a certain lack of family relationship


View attachment 4047072

Non-belonging? Really? I'd say I'm promoting the opposite - there is that saying "home is where the heart is". Consider the friendship of GIlgamesh and Enkidu, or the reason Oedipius fled his foster parents. Not all affection in the world is one size.

 

[RNasc4444]

Non-belonging? Really? I'd say I'm promoting the opposite - there is that saying "home is where the heart is". Consider the friendship of GIlgamesh and Enkidu, or the reason Oedipius fled his foster parents. Not all affection in the world is one size.

Despite all my joking around I can kinda see both sides but we'll have to see how Ocean deals with it. I'm gonna play from the start again when the next update drops and I'll give my honest opinion after.

Given what we know right now and Ocean's track record, I think this is gonna go the way SG went with the MC and Nami's relationship. A complete shitshow devoid of any common sense, logic or continuity. But hey maybe he rewrites the script for this one and we won't be forced to turn off our brains to enjoy the story

I'm still puzzled regarding this decision though. To retain the sibling bond between Willi and Leia but detach it from the rest of the family. What is the point? There is no shot he removes Leia from the LI list, right? Some patrons would be furious, no? I personally don't care, Leia interests me about as much as Jabba the Mute does, but I still want the damn story to be grounded and logical.

 

[Maviarab]

What do you mean?!?!?!? She's his and Leia's landlady! Isn't that enough? They were allowed to live rent free in a nice house with strangers that took care of them. Can you imagine the financial burden alone for 2 young kids? I wouldn't give Jabba my kidney or anything but I'd gladly drop by and stay at the house again for a few weeks to help out.

Even though she's not actually disabled or anything and can still do everything she was doing before... Even though there really isn't anything I could do for her... Even though we aren't related... Even though...yeah I dunno. Beats me honestly, I can't make sense of it. Let's go with what Bob said. Suspension of disbelief and the power of love can explain anything

There is no shot he removes Leia from the LI list, right?

In my own personal opinion, the fans of this are already at stretching point. While I also don't care too much about Leia (as a LI)...he will kill this VN completely if he goes that route and honestly, with all his anti-incest future-proofing of late, I'll say it again, there really is only...one logical conclusion....

 

[Dr.TSoni]

Despite all my joking around I can kinda see both sides but we'll have to see how Ocean deals with it. I'm gonna play from the start again when the next update drops and I'll give my honest opinion after.

Given what we know right now and Ocean's track record, I think this is gonna go the way SG went with the MC and Nami's relationship. A complete shitshow devoid of any common sense, logic or continuity. But hey maybe he rewrites the script for this one and we won't be forced to turn off our brains to enjoy the story

I'm still puzzled regarding this decision though. To retain the sibling bond between Willi and Leia but detach it from the rest of the family. What is the point? There is no shot he removes Leia from the LI list, right? Some patrons would be furious, no? I personally don't care, Leia interests me about as much as Jabba the Mute does, but I still want the damn story to be grounded and logical.

The whole package, although I'm not sure about starting again (although I probably will)