VN Ren'Py Karlsson's Gambit [v0.8.1 Part I] [Grym Gudinna Games]

[Stan5851]

From the scene to me it seems Yvette is just a good woman, unlike her daughter. And she is shocked by her daughter's actions. Personally, I see no reason for any of them lying about the slaves being deaf, it serves no purpose. If Veronica wanted to leak the conversation to 3rd party, there are easier ways to do that - bugs, cameras etc. Not some random slave that is supposedly deaf, but in reality is listening in on the convo, and whom we never see again. I think Occam's Razor is the way to go here - it's just the nature of the world they live in and Veronica is so past caring about human life and dignity that she (and everyone else for that matter) would deafen a person just because she can.

But then why would Tess give an answer that allowed for different interpretations?

Err got a sec on my way out to office now so not able to respond again but it might be relevant who said who was deaf and who else was in the room. (I hope I am remembering this correctly heh I was being very precise with it from memory but it's been a while)

After all, if Veronica really did deaf all of her servants, it would make much more sense to give a one-word answer like "She did it." Wouldn't it?

I'm confused now, as well. I thought it was Yvette saying that the slaves were deaf and she was in the know. But as Miles pointed out, it was Elena who stated that fact. So there's 3 possibilities here: (1) Veronica & Yvette are playing a long con to make Elena believe that what she knows is true (2) Veronica has even kept Yvette in the dark to ensure that everyone believes that the slaves are deaf (3) The cleaners are indeed deaf and V is a monster.

Keeping aside that little interaction I have highlighted before, any of these can be true. Only Tess can answer this since only she knows what the characters have or have not done off-screen.

Yeah, I wish I hadn't asked Tess about that. Now we're even more confused. But you're right, there are only three options.

 

[Sharpshooter890]

But then why would Tess give an answer that allowed for different interpretations?

Well that's easy to answer - to mess with us and watch us squirm, that's what I would do if I were in her place. You know, watching neckbeards on a porn forum exhaust themselves with all sorts of theories might be something Miss Tess would do. Or, as she said, she was in a hurry and perhaps misremembered or didn't phrase the response correctly.

 

[Stan5851]

Well that's easy to answer - to mess with us and watch us squirm, that's what I would do if I were in her place. You know, watching neckbeards on a porn forum exhaust themselves with all sorts of theories might be something Miss Tess would do. Or, as she said, she was in a hurry and perhaps misremembered or didn't phrase the response correctly.

Hmm, at least, Tess has never done that before and either understated (if it's a spoiler), or answered quite directly and specifically (if the information in her opinion could already be revealed)..So, I'm inclined to your 2nd option. Well, I can try asking about it on her Discord when Tess has time to chat there.

 

[Kxca]

From the scene to me it seems Yvette is just a good woman, unlike her daughter. And she is shocked by her daughter's actions. Personally, I see no reason for any of them lying about the slaves being deaf, it serves no purpose. If Veronica wanted to leak the conversation to 3rd party, there are easier ways to do that - bugs, cameras etc. Not some random slave that is supposedly deaf, but in reality is listening in on the convo, and whom we never see again. I think Occam's Razor is the way to go here - it's just the nature of the world they live in and Veronica is so past caring about human life and dignity that she (and everyone else for that matter) would deafen a person just because she can.

I found this after going through some very early chapters. The "right now" feels like the deafness was temporary. So either Elena didn't understand it properly (or I didn't). This could have given Elena the impression that V's slaves are permanently deaf while they're only temporarily devoid of hearing. Otherwise, how does Elena know of this, but Yvette doesn't? Making dozens of slaves deaf would be a big operation. Yvette was surprised since she had not heard any of this and just learned from Elena's (erroneous) interpretation. English is not my first language so it could be me misunderstanding here.

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

And getting information via bugs against Veronica will be far-fetched. Why would Veronica have bugs in her own room and leak that? Wouldn't it immediately alarm Dominique or Juliette about who bugged Veronica if it was neither of them? And why they are leaking that, and whether they could trust info from such sources? Using a slave to start a rumor is much more subtle than electronic evidence.

While the simplest solution looks to be the most straight-forward one, this isn't necessarily true in KG. There's a lot of layers to what characters do or say

Yeah, I wish I hadn't asked Tess about that. Now we're even more confused

Unless she gives a clear answer or this is cleared later in the game, I doubt we will be able to close this

 

[Sharpshooter890]

I found this after going through some very early chapters. The "right now" feels like the deafness was temporary. So either Elena didn't understand it properly (or I didn't).

That's a very interesting observation, I missed this on my recent playthrough.

English is not my 1st language either, and I believe it's true for Miss Tess as well. So, even though the writing is excellent (both narrative and grammar), mistakes may happen on occasion. No work of art is infallible (and yes, I do consider games to be an artform).

To sum up my position on the whole deaf slaves business - I think we are ultimately looking for details that are simply not there. I believe the scene serves as an exposition for some plot points as well as a characterisation of the women in the room. Veronica doesn't see slaves as human beings, but only as tools for her wants and experiments, Yvette clearly didn't expect such actions from her daughter (which leads me to believe that her alignment is Good), and Elena simply admits that that's the state of the world they are in.

 

[Maviarab]

I found this after going through some very early chapters. The "right now" feels like the deafness was temporary. So either Elena didn't understand it properly (or I didn't). This could have given Elena the impression that V's slaves are permanently deaf while they're only temporarily devoid of hearing. Otherwise, how does Elena know of this, but Yvette doesn't? Making dozens of slaves deaf would be a big operation. Yvette was surprised since she had not heard any of this and just learned from Elena's (erroneous) interpretation. English is not my first language so it could be me misunderstanding here.

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

And getting information via bugs against Veronica will be far-fetched. Why would Veronica have bugs in her own room and leak that? Wouldn't it immediately alarm Dominique or Juliette about who bugged Veronica if it was neither of them? And why they are leaking that, and whether they could trust info from such sources? Using a slave to start a rumor is much more subtle than electronic evidence.

While the simplest solution looks to be the most straight-forward one, this isn't necessarily true in KG. There's a lot of layers to what characters do or say


Unless she gives a clear answer or this is cleared later in the game, I doubt we will be able to close this

That's a very interesting observation, I missed this on my recent playthrough.

English is not my 1st language either, and I believe it's true for Miss Tess as well. So, even though the writing is excellent (both narrative and grammar), mistakes may happen on occasion. No work of art is infallible (and yes, I do consider games to be an artform).

To sum up my position on the whole deaf slaves business - I think we are ultimately looking for details that are simply not there. I believe the scene serves as an exposition for some plot points as well as a characterisation of the women in the room. Veronica doesn't see slaves as human beings, but only as tools for her wants and experiments, Yvette clearly didn't expect such actions from her daughter (which leads me to believe that her alignment is Good), and Elena simply admits that that's the state of the world they are in.

Right now...in English, would definitely mean...'for' now...temporary.

 

[TessSadist]

I'll leave a few last points but I'm probably not back for a long while to finish this update and other stuff.

I think the next update it will be clear with at least one person who does/does not know about Cole and how that might impact discussion about the Board membership. But might it be fair to say that if at least one Board member does not know Cole is alive, how could he "vote" as a Board member?

Alessandra is kind of a schemer by nature so I wouldn't assume any face value logic with her with everything she does other than that she might have no issues moving around to suit to her needs. (or biding her time to see who is winning)

Also keep in mind people can shift priorities if their knowledge/goals change over time. I know this is a bit nebulous, but just wanted to throw that out there.

Regarding a few other things:

My Patrons have always known how busy I am with other ventures. I've been very clear about that from the very start and have paused Patreon billing three times in the past based on my perception of right/wrong for value. I've never ever deceived anyone about the fact that Karlsson's Gambit for me is a side income stream that doesn't/never will take precedence over my main business and love which I do full-time before I get to KG work. I've also been clear with Patrons to never expect me to turn this into a full-time activity/job, there is simply no way a femdom game of this nature can ever be a financial equivalent to what else I do. I'm also ok with my overall pace -- updates are long but they are pretty big. I don't feel like a bimonthly update of say 500 renders (which is slower than my normal pace I do more than 250 renders a month) is all that useful for getting into the story that well. I have considered a dom/sub split update for a bit of improved speed, but I'm not sure how well that work with Patrons with the side having to wait longer breathing fire on me, hehe.

I will be clear about the piracy issue once and for all -- it's fine to do what you want, I wanted to make clear that a specific poster named Dover is a bad actor that has nothing to do with leaks. He is not a hero because of his character, not because of any leaks he has done or will do. I will not consider any third party leaker a bad actor in that sense. As a PSA, I would still encourage people to make sure at the end they save with a Final Version save even if they play the Test first. (I am telling Patrons the same thing.)

I did leave F95 with what I think were fairly legitimate harassment concerns. The final straw for me was a barrage of messages from someone claiming they would kill themselves if I didn't do X. I think it's fair of me to consider that "crazy" a bit. I've had it much worse on Discord -- particularly with a very specific Chinese guy (who foolishly has given me his real name in a document he sent me which I did not ask for btw) who I genuinely felt sorry for because he was honestly the most sad human being I have met in kind of a "good" (good meaning a combination of background/finances/educational prospects) position in life...I felt great pity for him and really wanted to help him...until the harassment started. But I can't really close down my Discord, so I just have people help me out, etc. I still feel bad for this person to be honest, but I shouldn't have to deal with this either.

I also admit I'm not always a humble person and part of that is how people treat me in day to day life. KG is the one thing that does keep me humble, as it has not come easy for me to do like most things I have tried. But I love the creative process and it helps me in other ways outside of this game...so I keep plugging away.

Regarding the err ears? It's not option 3. There is only one logical reason Elena may have been told this to me? (maybe a minor second one) And would V be willing to deceive her own mother and if so, why?

I have greatly enjoyed reading this thread, it's been a lot of fun! It is unfortunate that I haven't always felt comfortable here, but that has not been the case with anyone posting here recently. (even the critical ones, that is not harassment just opinions)

 

[kinkyshin]

Spoiler: 3 votes for, 3 against

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Spoiler: Yup, V is a monster

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

It's very possible that it's Astrid. Cole being the 7th board member isn't just far-fetched, it's impossible because when Olivia is told that Elena will be giving her board seat to her, she is also told that there are a few others who have multiple parents that were founders. None of the girls besides Veronica fits this category. Astrid would too though.

As for 'imbalance of power' multiple people tell Veronica on different occasions that she could easily take control of the company if she wanted.

Tess tells us who grym gunida is. Even if the second meeting with pat could be explained away. The fact that Pat is meeting with her in secret can't.
As for the votes, I assume it's for the gambit. If it was just for the person, the queen wouldn't be talking about Elena possibly getting what she wants since what Elena wants wouldn't be any of the sisters not named olivia winning it.
Alessandra's not supporting Olivia, the only person currently supporting Olivia other than Elena is Veronica and I believe that's only because she's supporting Kane and what he wants.

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

 

[TessSadist]

Last minor thing I noticed -- I may have made a mistake with a number of living sisters in one piece of dialogue, I wouldn't try to read too much into it and I think I will go back and tweak it if I can remember. (oh no...)

 

[Maviarab]

It's very possible that it's Astrid. Cole being the 7th board member isn't just far-fetched, it's impossible because when Olivia is told that Elena will be giving her board seat to her, she is also told that there are a few others who have multiple parents that were founders. None of the girls besides Veronica fits this category. Astrid would too though.

As for 'imbalance of power' multiple people tell Veronica on different occasions that she could easily take control of the company if she wanted.

Well let's do a simple table:

1. Yvette
2. Veronica (sister)
3. Dominique (sister
4. Alessandra (sister)
5. Juliette (sister)
6. ?
7. Elena (Legal)

There's your 7 board members. Now, thinking rationally, logically and not fantastical conspiracy theory, that leaves Astrid as number 6, not Cole who has zero reason to be on the board (as I've said before).

I've also said before, that with the board meeting for Olivia, it seems (to me) obvious that some if not all know where the missing is...and why. Tess all but confirmed it to me above with her second sentence. Most don't even know Cole is alive or if he is where he is. How can he possibly vote on board decisions when he is exiled (and as of yet, we don't know exactly how Astrid 'suffered'...i think it was motre physically and not legally). There will always have to be 7 votes as 6 votes can and most likely will always end in a stalement.

Elena is giving her seat to Olivia...Olvia becomes the new 7th member and the 6th sister on the board (as it should be).

 

[TessSadist]

It's very possible that it's Astrid. Cole being the 7th board member isn't just far-fetched, it's impossible because when Olivia is told that Elena will be giving her board seat to her, she is also told that there are a few others who have multiple parents that were founders. None of the girls besides Veronica fits this category. Astrid would too though.

As for 'imbalance of power' multiple people tell Veronica on different occasions that she could easily take control of the company if she wanted.

Last msg for a while, but I wanted to recognize that I hoped someone would catch specific dialogue (I thought Cynthia grabbing Nadia's arm was way more obvious about something else) about multiple parents.

 

[Sharpshooter890]

Last msg for a while, but I wanted to recognize that I hoped someone would catch specific dialogue (I thought Cynthia grabbing Nadia's arm was way more obvious about something else) about multiple parents.

Oh, we did notice that, as well as how Nadia behaved in the Red Room and in her suite (with computers and a slave girl). Food for thought.

Anyways, thank you for the game, can't wait for the story to continue! Wish you the best!

 

[Don Sucio]

I will be clear about the piracy issue once and for all -- it's fine to do what you want, I wanted to make clear that a specific poster named Dover is a bad actor that has nothing to do with leaks. He is not a hero because of his character, not because of any leaks he has done or will do. I will not consider any third party leaker a bad actor in that sense.

Man... i´m so confused here, what is the problem with Dover? I don´t know him in real life and my interactions with him here are a few, but what has he done? . I thought he was a leaker and that´s all

 

[Mr. Chatty]

I'll leave a few last points but I'm probably not back for a long while to finish this update and other stuff.

I think the next update it will be clear with at least one person who does/does not know about Cole and how that might impact discussion about the Board membership. But might it be fair to say that if at least one Board member does not know Cole is alive, how could he "vote" as a Board member?

Alessandra is kind of a schemer by nature so I wouldn't assume any face value logic with her with everything she does other than that she might have no issues moving around to suit to her needs. (or biding her time to see who is winning)

Also keep in mind people can shift priorities if their knowledge/goals change over time. I know this is a bit nebulous, but just wanted to throw that out there.

Regarding a few other things:

My Patrons have always known how busy I am with other ventures. I've been very clear about that from the very start and have paused Patreon billing three times in the past based on my perception of right/wrong for value. I've never ever deceived anyone about the fact that Karlsson's Gambit for me is a side income stream that doesn't/never will take precedence over my main business and love which I do full-time before I get to KG work. I've also been clear with Patrons to never expect me to turn this into a full-time activity/job, there is simply no way a femdom game of this nature can ever be a financial equivalent to what else I do. I'm also ok with my overall pace -- updates are long but they are pretty big. I don't feel like a bimonthly update of say 500 renders (which is slower than my normal pace I do more than 250 renders a month) is all that useful for getting into the story that well. I have considered a dom/sub split update for a bit of improved speed, but I'm not sure how well that work with Patrons with the side having to wait longer breathing fire on me, hehe.

I will be clear about the piracy issue once and for all -- it's fine to do what you want, I wanted to make clear that a specific poster named Dover is a bad actor that has nothing to do with leaks. He is not a hero because of his character, not because of any leaks he has done or will do. I will not consider any third party leaker a bad actor in that sense. As a PSA, I would still encourage people to make sure at the end they save with a Final Version save even if they play the Test first. (I am telling Patrons the same thing.)

I did leave F95 with what I think were fairly legitimate harassment concerns. The final straw for me was a barrage of messages from someone claiming they would kill themselves if I didn't do X. I think it's fair of me to consider that "crazy" a bit. I've had it much worse on Discord -- particularly with a very specific Chinese guy (who foolishly has given me his real name in a document he sent me which I did not ask for btw) who I genuinely felt sorry for because he was honestly the most sad human being I have met in kind of a "good" (good meaning a combination of background/finances/educational prospects) position in life...I felt great pity for him and really wanted to help him...until the harassment started. But I can't really close down my Discord, so I just have people help me out, etc. I still feel bad for this person to be honest, but I shouldn't have to deal with this either.

I also admit I'm not always a humble person and part of that is how people treat me in day to day life. KG is the one thing that does keep me humble, as it has not come easy for me to do like most things I have tried. But I love the creative process and it helps me in other ways outside of this game...so I keep plugging away.

Regarding the err ears? It's not option 3. There is only one logical reason Elena may have been told this to me? (maybe a minor second one) And would V be willing to deceive her own mother and if so, why?

I have greatly enjoyed reading this thread, it's been a lot of fun! It is unfortunate that I haven't always felt comfortable here, but that has not been the case with anyone posting here recently. (even the critical ones, that is not harassment just opinions)

Seems like the whole game is a lesser version of yourself, not just your imagination.

Seems like I was right Afterall, no doubt you are getting so much shit in your way, smells like karma to me, don't know how many people you have used/deceived in your real life and this is just a pirate site where everyone has a mask, I always knew it, I just had to find a proof and you yourself have provided it to me.

Oh dont want to say as to plot exactly and maybe way off anyway but more sadistic about direct pain and humiliation and showing it clearly to others like taunting and physical pain and humiliation stuff when younger versus learning to enjoy much more deeper sadism with a friendly smile. At first quietly enjoying emotional suffering and getting off on emotional torture and especially being able to make one trust and rely on you and then betraying them with incredible sadism or making one person turn against another and seeing them both struggle and suffer with it and things like that. Now I would much more enjoy someone confiding in me about being scared for their job or suffering with money problems about their poor life while I'm rich and can enjoy this instead of maybe making someone drink pee or directly hurting someone

I'm a big fan of hers as well except for the drug stuff. From my perspective, I see some of myself in her in that she enjoys messing with people, is very open and aggressive sexually if she wants to be, and tries to do whatever she wants for her own benefit over anyone else. I like her ruthlessness in using other people to get her selfish desires fulfilled. I really live like Jill on the outside and am the "Sweet Princess" type to many that meet me for the first time, but I definitely identify with Quinn on the inside and have a similar ruthless streak to accomplish what I want at times even if I have to run over someone in my way. And I can SO SO SO SO identify with Jill being around guys like Tybalt, very well off and educated, great background and parents, but completely uninteresting, boring, and probably the worst sex partner...

You definitely tried to hide that side of yours after becoming a game developer before that you were obsessed with the words "cuck/beta/incel boy" for pretty much any male protagonist game on this site seems pretty extreme behaviour to me but anyway nothing can be hidden forever.

 

[MilesEdgeworth]

Last msg for a while, but I wanted to recognize that I hoped someone would catch specific dialogue (I thought Cynthia grabbing Nadia's arm was way more obvious about something else) about multiple parents.

To be fair to us, dom players don't have access to the same information as the sub players, so if the secret sibling didn't get revealed in this forum, I doubt dom players would've even noticed the arm grab. Now that subs and doms are working together, we can speculate much more effectively.

 

[Stan5851]

Checkmate, Veronica haters. She's innocent (almost).. .Okay, we've got the ears (not quite, but we know she didn't do it), that leaves the pain and pleasure enhancers...Well..hmm...But you know what I say, it was all done in the name of science!

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

I always felt that Veronica could not be so heartless, this little brilliant girl from the park, whose childhood had been ruined by her demonic father, whose innocent soul had been scarred by Alexander's cruelty and cynicism. But I believed that there must have been a spark of humanity left in the soul of this red-haired, aloof girl. A spark from which would ignite a flame that would devour all her enemies, heal the entire continent, and give life to a doomed world.

Man... i´m so confused here, what is the problem with Dover? I don´t know him in real life and my interactions with him here are a few, but what has he done? . I thought he was a leaker and that´s all

Tess clearly said he's a bad actor. You know, how can I put it? Not everyone can be Brad Pitt or Al Pacino. So Dover.. Dover wasn't as good as those two. (Just kidding)

 

[MilesEdgeworth]

Man... i´m so confused here, what is the problem with Dover? I don´t know him in real life and my interactions with him here are a few, but what has he done? . I thought he was a leaker and that´s all

I assume she's not a fan of either Dover leaking test versions or of Dover using her links to leak

 

[Mr. Chatty]

Man... i´m so confused here, what is the problem with Dover? I don´t know him in real life and my interactions with him here are a few, but what has he done? . I thought he was a leaker and that´s all

Seems like you are getting it if not, I'd only say "manipulation is the worst kind of legal crime", that's why some people use it to guilt trip others to get their way with them, this is only a prime example of that, Dover is just friendly pirate, who only said he might upload the game as soon as it's released, he might have never did it before and he might not do it this time, he doesn't deserved to be called out like this, still he was called out by her and that after she herself said she is well off even without the support from this game still she is pressing a "possible" leak (not one that already happened) in such ferocious manner if this isn't manipulation I don't know what is.

 

[MilesEdgeworth]

Also, I just realized that when Alessandra says and Yvette chides her. She could be talking about Astrid who people are speculating that Seth's death could save Astrid because she's sick or something.

Not too long after that scene she's talking to Pat about getting dom to kill juliette or vice versa.

 

[Don Sucio]

I assume she's not a fan of either Dover leaking test versions or of Dover using her links to leak

I understood that too, but Tess has said she doesn´t have any problem with leakers and piracy, only with Dover , bah whathever, i don´t know Tess and i don´t Know Dover so i just going to ignore this drama and wait for the game

Seems like you are getting it if not, I'd only say "manipulation is the worst kind of legal crime", that's why some people use it to guilt trip others to get their way with them, this is only a prime example of that, Dover is just friendly pirate, who only said he might upload the game as soon as it's released, he might have never did it before and he might not do it this time, he doesn't deserved to be called out like this, still he was called out by her and that after she herself said she is well off even without the support from this game still she is pressing a "possible" leak (not one that already happened) in such ferocious manner if this isn't manipulation I don't know what is.

So you are saying (and Tess) Dover isn´t a leaker, only an impostor who says to be a leaker, right? If this is the case well, i don´t like liars, but if the problem is only Dover leaking i don´t have problems with him...

I remember he said in the last chapter he was going to leak the game, and a few hours later the game was leaked