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Neralyst

New Member
Oct 27, 2018
13
22
tl;dr this vn tells a different story than other games. If you're expecting to balance stats and screw every girl in the game and make a harem, then you'll be disappointed.
I would have been happy with just Melissa and Megan, which is what I was aiming for in the game. Yes he did an amazing job of making characters you could connect with. However, if I wanted a dark story I would turn on any news station. I don't therefore I avoid it like the plague. With Acting Lessons I didn't even get the choice. Seemed like a great game for the first 5 episodes and with the trait choices I thought at least one of the options would allow for a good ending. Tragedy happens enough in real life, what is so wrong about people wanting a game that makes them feel warm and fuzzy at the end? Prime example is The Lancaster Boarding House, Chloe's ending was MAGNIFICENT!!!

Point is different people have different preferences when it comes to games and entertainment. But to not even give us the choice to save them even is too cruel. At the very least give us a heads up hey someone you learn to love in this game will die a tragic death. Then those of us not into that sort of thing could have avoided it.

On a different note, I would like to know if the dev would be willing to go back and retroactively add a good path for a price. If so, how much would it cost? I am not rich by any means but would be willing to support him on patreon if he is willing to do so. Surely others that feel like I do would follow suit.
 

Enyos

Active Member
Mar 29, 2018
889
6,353
btw y this game is not trending ? this game is genius even tho. the creator of this is killing me :(
It's ranked #7 in overall ratings on this site. It was ranked #1 until episode 7 released, then a lot of people got very upset and changed their ratings to 1 star.
On a different note, I would like to know if the dev would be willing to go back and retroactively add a good path for a price. If so, how much would it cost? I am not rich by any means but would be willing to support him on patreon if he is willing to do so. Surely others that feel like I do would follow suit.
This was the Devs vision, and he's expressed that there will be no changes. He's already started working on his next project, named BADIK, although it's been stalled until he completes the final chapter of Acting Lessons.
 
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asus

Newbie
Feb 11, 2018
69
32
It's ranked #7 in overall ratings on this site. It was ranked #1 until episode 7 released, then a lot of people got very upset and changed their ratings to 1 star.
ok maybe because tht u need to choose megan or mellisa and theirs no other option to avoid the tragic , in my opinon at least they make a way or a walkthrough to avoid tht .. i will becoming a patreon if they make playthrough tht both of them will be alive i know its impossible but i hope they
 
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Neralyst

New Member
Oct 27, 2018
13
22
It's ranked #7 in overall ratings on this site. It was ranked #1 until episode 7 released, then a lot of people got very upset and changed their ratings to 1 star.
This was the Devs vision, and he's expressed that there will be no changes. He's already started working on his next project, named BADIK, although it's been stalled until he completes the final chapter of Acting Lessons.
Then I guess I will move on forget about episode 6 onward and consider anything added afterwards to be the "Highlander 2" of the VN.
 
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RogueKnightUK

Co-Writer: Retrieving The Past
Game Developer
Jul 10, 2018
925
2,449
That's not fair to @Rook2099--or to @Vordertur, for that matter; those two are conducting a masterclass in literary criticism here. They aren't belittling the story, they're taking it seriously, and they're doing the exact backwards of trolling those with whom they disagree.
Unfortunately not everyone takes criticism well, no matter how thoughtfully and constructively is is presented. There has been far too much dismissal of valid criticisms with claims by the moronic that all critics merely wanted a fap and can't handle feelings. Ironic, since the ones who cannot handle or express the subtleties of mixed feelings are the idiots making such statements.

I have both praised and criticised the game. Because it has very good parts, and it has parts that could use a lot of improvement. But there are a noticeably loud and sizeable faction visible throughout the discussion that seem to believe anyone not absolutely and purely praising the game and it's author are either not understanding nuance and fine points, not being reasonable, or can't handle feelings. Sadly, they alone can't see the irony and hypocrisy in that.

I rated the game 4 stars of 5, and haven't changed that rating.

I love that Dr PinkCake is likely to be as much of a movie-buff as I am, and borrowed so beautifully and well some of the 'tricks' of cinematography, not least in having some beautifully meaningful 'cuts' from scene to scene borrowed straight out of movie-making. The scene where the MC is talking about Liam and the scene 'cuts' to the bar and the "Drink! Drink! Drink!" line is straight out of the movies. So is another Liam scene where Liam is showing off his car and claims to be a responsible driver, and the next moment the scene cuts to that awesome shot of him speeding like a demon, and the wonderful array of reactions to that from each occupant of the car.

I hadn't seen a VN use that idea before, and it was done so extremely well - really playing to the idea of a VN as a visual media.

But my mind is not so small and boolean that I can't love that aspect and still notice how hollow and shallow the various villain characters are, throughout the entire game. Dick is a cardboard cutout of a character, with no depth, and only viewable from a single angle. Peter is even worse, with not even a clear trope to his character. And Leah?
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I'm old enough and experienced enough to even say exactly why the positive characters are so beautifully rich, and the negative characters so completely lifeless and shallow: you have to empathise with even the villains. Ask any actor and they'll tell you that unless you can empathise with a character, you can't give them life. Alan Rickman was asked by young family members once why he always plays villains. He replied "I don't play villains. I play interesting and complicated characters". And that is why Alan Rickman has always played such strong and fascinating villains - he knows that everyone is the hero in their own mind's story, and plays them with compassion for their viewpoint.

It's an understandable and not uncommon mistake for a rookie writer, and I very much believe that having made it will enable the writer to do so much better in future games. But that is still something that absolutely should be criticised and pointed out in order for that to happen.

The same is true of other elements of the game. There are flaws. Of course there are, this is Doc's first major work. And it is the duty of anyone who wants to see Doc thrive, grow, and reach his potential in future games to help point out those flaws, help him consider what he could have done differently, and how, even if only making him ponder those questions himself to find his own answers.

Those who instead act as if there is nothing he could improve, nothing he could consider, nothing he could grow from, are the ones truly threatening his future, and stifling his growth.
 

Nekura

Member
Dec 5, 2017
448
639
ok maybe because tht u need to choose megan or mellisa and theirs no other option to avoid the tragic , in my opinon at least they make a way or a walkthrough to avoid tht .. i will becoming a patreon if they make playthrough tht both of them will be alive i know its impossible but i hope they
Not likely to happen, you'll just have to make your choice like everyone else. I suggest having multiple saves, then you can kinda save both.
 

asus

Newbie
Feb 11, 2018
69
32
Not likely to happen, you'll just have to make your choice like everyone else. I suggest having multiple saves, then you can kinda save both.
u can save them both?
how ? d u have save on it?
are u sure u can save them both?
 

RogueKnightUK

Co-Writer: Retrieving The Past
Game Developer
Jul 10, 2018
925
2,449
u can save them both?
how ? d u have save on it?
are u sure u can save them both?
He's saying that by playing with saves you can have one version where you save one, and one where you save the other, so as a player saving both in that way.

Of course, the reality is that whichever you save, they are permanently scarred by not just losing a friend, but being a part of the reason that the friend was not the one saved, so in that respect, you can't save either of them.
 
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Enyos

Active Member
Mar 29, 2018
889
6,353
anybody here have melissa wallpaper?
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We haven't seen the final episode yet, so there's no telling exactly what will occur without some sort of clairvoyance. The one is gone, but we don't know the fate of the other (yet) in the 22 available endings.
 
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Vordertur

Member
Jul 21, 2017
208
575
And just in case there's someone with a low enough IQ to say "Yeah, but that's because she's crazy", crazy people still have logic - it just isn't based on reality as sane people see it.
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I'm old enough and experienced enough to even say exactly why the positive characters are so beautifully rich, and the negative characters so completely lifeless and shallow: you have to empathise with even the villains. Ask any actor and they'll tell you that unless you can empathise with a character, you can't give them life. Alan Rickman was asked by young family members once why he always plays villains. He replied "I don't play villains. I play interesting and complicated characters". And that is why Alan Rickman has always played such strong and fascinating villains - he knows that everyone is the hero in their own mind's story, and plays them with compassion for their viewpoint.

It's an understandable and not uncommon mistake for a rookie writer, and I very much believe that having made it will enable the writer to do so much better in future games. But that is still something that absolutely should be criticised and pointed out in order for that to happen.
Right. I mean, both Dick and Peter (And ha ha, how obvious are those names, right? are pretty 2-dimensional cardboard villains. Which, you know, wouldn't be that bad except that they're placed in roles that are kind of important to the plot and to the characters. Peter is Melissa's stepdad, Dick is Rena's boyfriend. These aren't really "background" characters. They're relatively major supporting characters, and it's a little glaring that they're written so superficially. Which makes me think.

If they're written so intentionally shallowly because we're not intended to feel anything but hatred towards them, it's almost like they're decoys put there to draw attention away from the "real" baddie of the game. But that, in and of itself, is also kind of... not good technique. I'm not saying that background characters don't exist or that "one-shot" characters don't get put into works of fiction, but that to take a character that has legitimately strong connections to your main cast, and use them only as red herrings to draw attention away from your real villain is a pretty cheap tactic.
 

fzaner

Active Member
Dec 27, 2016
586
656
oh come on guys it's absolutely lovely how things going here, it would be so typical if the game ended vanilla, what devs did is new thing and fucking great... "just stop giving my melissa hard time" and im okey with killing the rest :coffee::giggle:
 

Acrodin

Newbie
Oct 31, 2017
28
61
Just discovered this game a few days ago and absolutely LOVE it! So bummed with the way EP6 ended though.
I'm not sure how I feel about EP7 ... I like the direction the game is going, but I felt EP7 was a bit short.
Would like to have seen more decision making scenes.
 
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RogueKnightUK

Co-Writer: Retrieving The Past
Game Developer
Jul 10, 2018
925
2,449
If they're written so intentionally shallowly because we're not intended to feel anything but hatred towards them, it's almost like they're decoys put there to draw attention away from the "real" baddie of the game. But that, in and of itself, is also kind of... not good technique. I'm not saying that background characters don't exist or that "one-shot" characters don't get put into works of fiction, but that to take a character that has legitimately strong connections to your main cast, and use them only as red herrings to draw attention away from your real villain is a pretty cheap tactic.
Personally, I think they are written without depth because Doc didn't want to feel anything but hatred of them. He didn't want to understand and empathise with their perspectives, their motivations and justifications. As I mentioned, it is a common beginner's mistake.

Writing believable characters is generally held to be one of the harder parts of writing. That's not because it isn't very easy to just write about people you like and know well enough to capture their reality. It's because pretty much any story is going to have conflicts and that means there has to be another side. Most stories will have a villain, and writing a believable villain, being able to make that character feel just as genuine as the ones you love, that's the mark of a great writer.

It's harder than you might think, because on one level, the only reason Dick and Peter are vile human beings is because the writer needs them to be. If the characters have no depth, no reality then that's simply done. But if you invest empathy and compassion into the characters enough to give them motives, feelings, aspirations, well, you can actually feel a bit of guilt over what you alone as the writer are making them do and be. Not to mention that it can be harder to find why a real person would ever do that thing, what possible situation and circumstance was needed, compared to the idiots "because... plot!"

My advice echoes the meaning of what Rickman's approach was. Don't write villains. Write characters, and have some of those characters have valid reasons for doing bad things.

There's a movie that consistently gets rated at the top end of every list of "Greatest Ever Movies" - "The Godfather". It wasn't the first gangster movie. But until that movie, gangsters were always portrayed as bad guys doing bad things. The Godfather instead features a pretty good hero protagonist into this dark world, one who tries, mostly, to do the least bad thing that is necessary. The result is, of course, a masterpiece of cinema. Because it tells a story we can all resonate with - a story about how good intentions can be corrupted, and about how high ideals can be tarnished and bent by the pressure of pragmatic reality. Pretty much all of us know that reality. We've seen at least many of our dreams slip away, be stripped away, by the realities of life, and despite our intentions.

Writing meaningful characters, especially in the darkest roles, is the hallmark of all good movies. What would Star Wars be without Darth Vader? How about Rickman's beautiful performance in "Die Hard"? Without a really good 'villain' of the piece, no story can ever be great.

Like I said before: every man is the hero of his own mind's story.
 

Rook2099

Newbie
Oct 18, 2018
55
125
ok maybe because tht u need to choose megan or mellisa and theirs no other option to avoid the tragic , in my opinon at least they make a way or a walkthrough to avoid tht .. i will becoming a patreon if they make playthrough tht both of them will be alive i know its impossible but i hope they
I am thinking easiest fix would be to be letting
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Does not need many changes, and give choice as to who and what is most important. Game is of choices. Other reason why that scenario is failure.


Not likely to happen, you'll just have to make your choice like everyone else. I suggest having multiple saves, then you can kinda save both.
No that does not make sense. Problem is that there are two real and strongly holding relationships in game. The girls, and MC and Liam. Many will disagree with my view,
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That is, as I am discussing before, a problem.

Ending will be very hard to make good. PinkCake has to
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I do not having much hope.

AL right now has story at point where even before Leah, nothing matter anymore. No matter what is happening, survivors broken, and unless 8 is as long as entire rest of game, there is not enough time to make fixing believable.

Just discovered this game a few days ago and absolutely LOVE it! So bummed with the way EP6 ended though.
I'm not sure how I feel about EP7 ... I like the direction the game is going, but I felt EP7 was a bit short.
Would like to have seen more decision making scenes.
No more choice at all. 8 will be completing choice from all other episode.
 
4.60 star(s) 823 Votes