VN Ren'Py Abandoned Altered Erotales [v0.3] [T-Wizard]

[Larry2000]

I think you're in the minority. Most people wouldn't avoid a good game due to optional ntr, and the devs get to put ntr in for the ntr lovers and loyalty/harem paths for the loyalty/harem lovers, thus satisfying both crowds. It's a win-win for everyone. Making it purely NTR or purely loyalty would just be akin to making a kinetic novel, and why would devs purposefully make a financial decision to their own detriment and avoid branching paths?

Although with all those girls there I'm surprised the dev thought ntr and urination would draw more attention to his new game, instead of harem, which it almost certainly is and which undoubtedly draws a bigger crowd

I strongly disagree with you. Not because NTR is the point of all evil, but there is a much more detrimental reason to a story than simply not being vanilla enough and that's time. If I play a game with a Harem path or another path with multiple girls that each have a different ending and it's all vanilla, I'm down to play through multiple paths like a traditional Japanese VN. However, if the game is split between a Harem path or an NTR path, that is 50% or more content I'm missing out on. Also, even if it's just 20%, that causes longer updates as well as narrative fractures. I don't know a single game besides Babysitter (which I didn't think was very good because of it) where an NTR game could split its game properly between them. Even Babysitter's updates were SUPER short with long times in between because of it. Now, the story in the end, ended up flopping and I can't prove if it was the many fractured paths or different character personalities that came from it, but I can at least say that multiple paths is a factor.

All that said, if you're talking about adding a few optional NTR scenes, then I mostly agree with you. Those can be unobtrusive. But I will disagree with saying:

Making it purely NTR or purely loyalty would just be akin to making a kinetic novel

That's why a game like Being A Dik, Radiant, and basically every high profile games on this site and patreon are bad right?
The other side of a vanilla route is NOT NTR. It can be a lot of things. Family issues, Anxiety, Loss, Existentialism, for the Macro. A bad date, jealous of a friend's car, mad about someone leaving them at a party, sad they lost a bet, for the Micro. Those are just examples I pulled out of my ass in 15 seconds. Imagine a good writer/creator with much more time?

 

[juan palote]

You don't have to be in a relationship for it to be considered NTR.
View attachment 1335649
It says "Romantic Interest" not "Girlfriend" or "Significant Other"

What can i tell, to me it doesnt, but i have seen some NTR tags being removed because the LI wasnt in a relationship with the MC

 

[hobobobb]

Hi Everyone!
I apologise for being absent for most of the day. I do have my day job as well...
I wasn't quite expecting quite so many posts on here in just the first 24 hours lol.
But even if there are times I go silent due to juggling other things I will eventually read your comments and such so I can have a better understanding of people's opinions or concerns. I make games because I enjoy it. I want to make many games but I also want to be able to grow as a developer. So I will always take everyone's comments into consideration.

Okay so I think it would be a good time to try and clear the water a bit and talk about the elephant of concern in the room.
I know for many NTR is a scary thing, but right now there technically isn't NTR based on what the definition would be. Girls are not getting involved with other male characters currently. There are some choices that are the beginning path towards NTR. Some events that you might decide to force a girl to go flash her bra at another guy.

The main reason I wanted to add the NTR tag for initial release was I wanted people to understand it was going to be a thing or eventual thing. I am sure if I didn't and then went to second or third release and misled people with NTR at that point probably would not be so good.

Now, I wasn't expecting that this would open pandora's box to this degree. Risky move on my part for my first project. (I knew should have done the teacher one first... WIP...)

But I also understand that I should have done a better job making things a little more clear.

So I would like to leave it on a positive note that after taking everyone's comments into consideration I will be going back to change some of the code and creating an option early on which will be a one time switch to turn NTR on of off. I believe that will probably be the best way and then from whichever path you go from there you will have zero risk of NTR if you do not like that. And if you do... All the power to you. I will have this change implemented as of version 0.2 which I am currently hard at work on with more content and all the like. So until next time.

Have a magically erotic day.
T-Wizard

Do yourself a BIG favor T-Wizard, and put a comment on the first post stating that you're going to have an NTR toggle switch, and it's probably a good idea to indicate that the switch will make NTR avoidable, not just skippable.

Put it in BIG, colorful. bold letters, the center of page 1.

You will save yourself dozens of "NTR Avoidable?" posts later on.


Best of Luck

 

[gigan]

TWizard
I found a little mistake in the script.rpy file.In the line 1183 is written eve instead E who say the text line.So you become an error in the game.I attach you the traceback file for that and a fixed script file for that text line.And could be it that on the screenshot should be written Not, now instead Now, now?
And a little hint for you: incest and patreon is not a good idea to do.Maybe change the releationship to like Landlady for the moms and for the dads Landlord and Roomate for the sisters

 

[hobobobb]

Yeah, we could use more tags in F95 because there are many situations that dont fit the NTR tag that are as gamebreaking for a lot of people

I have been saying this for years, but we need a tag for "Future LI being fucked by someone else" for example

Agree, F95 needs this tag as badly as it needs an "Only MC gets any action" Tag.

That would literally redefine how many people search for projects to play and $upport.

 

[Larry2000]

Agree, F95 needs this tag as badly as it needs an "Only MC gets any action" Tag.

That would literally redefine how many people search for projects to play and $upport.

On VNDB there is a tag called "Sex with Others" one of the most useful tags in existence. If a game has been tagged properly, this can be the most helpful one. Most VN's don't have NTR. NTR EVEN in Japanese media is pretty foreshadowed by the type of game it is so it's easy to avoid straight up NTR. However, gray situations of NTR are harder to pin point. "

You must be registered to see the links

" lets you search for this. Not only that, but it's also a character marker so,

You must be registered to see the links

, in this case you can see what the character is and in role you can get an idea to why because she's a prostitute. There is also a tag called "

You must be registered to see the links

" which is both a general and character specific trait that sometimes even more helpful. It at least confirms that there isn't a single path where the girl interacts with anyone else besides the MC. The general tag puts a blanket on all Heroines/LI's in the game and says "No one but the MC" gets any.

 

[sevendustkorn1008]

Good for you, I'm not that curious.

Cool. Then you don't need to be curious about it. But why campaign to change the gaming experience for others? Seems highly unnecessary. Let people enjoy their gaming experience. It doesn't actually affect you one way or another.

I'm not going to follow a route with NTR (first because I don't see more than one ending in games, and second, since I don't like NTR it would be stupid of me to follow it). But the truth is that I don't care if a game has NTR as long as it can be completely avoided (and if possible in an easy and well explained way so as not to be able to arrive at it by mistake)

That's respect right there. Your solution is win-win for everyone involved.

Same can be said for the person quoting my post with he NTR based game in his signature. This is a "pot calling the kettle black" thing. The dev has come in now and explained how its going to work. Though I am sure the pro crowd like that guy that always comments on anything I do when it it comes to ntr will still quote "his" ntr side.

No, I don't just come out and argue for the sake of argument. I ignore most anti-NTR posts. We never get anything constructive by replying to, "NTR? That's an automatic ignore for me," or something similar. The only time I jump in is when people campaign to change the game because you're just doing to much at that point. The insinuation you made in your comment of not adding an NTR tag so devs can get "real" constructive criticism is just begging for trouble. Surprise NTR is just about the worst thing you can do to people on this site. Add the tag early and avoid any problems in the future. There would be no "war" if people didn't make complaints about there being "yet another NTR game". People gotta learn to just live and let live.

 

[TWizard]

TWizard
I found a little mistake in the script.rpy file.In the line 1183 is written eve instead E who say the text line.So you become an error in the game.I attach you the traceback file for that and a fixed script file for that text line.And could be it that on the screenshot should be written Not, now instead Now, now?
And a little hint for you: incest and patreon is not a good idea to do.Maybe change the releationship to like Landlady for the moms and for the dads Landlord and Roomate for the sisters

Thank you so much for pointing that out. I will get that fixed. As for the incest I am working to change it so that it will be landlady or roommate and then adding an incest patch.

 

[SeveredRealms]

"NTR? That's an automatic ignore for me,"

Please stop tagging my posts if you dont like what I say ignore it.

 

[sevendustkorn1008]

Please stop tagging my posts if you dont like what I say ignore it.

Like I said, I don't reply to those posts. Those are a waste of time. I responded to something very specific you posted that wasn't that. I thought you were a reasonable person that I could discuss things without you getting offended, but I guess that's not the case. I'll just add you to the ignore list if it means that much to you.

 

[bruce555]

Cool. Then you don't need to be curious about it. But why campaign to change the gaming experience for others? Seems highly unnecessary. Let people enjoy their gaming experience. It doesn't actually affect you one way or another.


That's respect right there. Your solution is win-win for everyone involved.


No, I don't just come out and argue for the sake of argument. I ignore most anti-NTR posts. We never get anything constructive by replying to, "NTR? That's an automatic ignore for me," or something similar. The only time I jump in is when people campaign to change the game because you're just doing to much at that point. The insinuation you made in your comment of not adding an NTR tag so devs can get "real" constructive criticism is just begging for trouble. Surprise NTR is just about the worst thing you can do to people on this site. Add the tag early and avoid any problems in the future. There would be no "war" if people didn't make complaints about there being "yet another NTR game". People gotta learn to just live and let live.

Sure ... you're a demigod and I'm a mere mortal, I can't say my opinion, sorry let's all enjoy this nice optional NTR ...

 

[Kalsan]

Man i dont know way people complain about people expressing they opinion, no one here has a knife put to the dev's neck, no one here has threatened the dev to change its content. The dev is free to do what he wants, what is more, I am happy that he does what he likes because that way he is more likely to deliver quality content. But regarding that two ntr-harem routes would be a win-win I have to disagree. Among the problems that this brings is the fragmentation of the story and chaos that this will bring to the narrative, which makes it more likely that the writer will make mistakes in the coherence of the story. Another important problem is the update speed, although the developer finds the so elusive balance between update time and quality, the problem is added that fans see the update reduced by 30-50% because let's not fool ourselves, most of them will only play one route. Also putting both ntr-harem content as equally popular is too naive. Examples of games that try to implement these two routes and succeed are few, but there are many that fail. I know it is very nice to follow ideals, to think that you are going to be the full-fledged exception but the truth is that sometimes you have to find a compromise between what you want to do and what the world wants to see. Although there are facts that support me, the decision is of the dev of course, and I will play the game too the end if the ntr is totally optional, but if someday I make a game I will never put ntr because it is not worth it, It will bring more bad things than good.

 

[SeveredRealms]

But regarding that two ntr-harem routes would be a win-win I have to disagree.

Could not agree more with everything you said in your post and its much the same thing others are saying as well. The biggest problems we are seeing it the pro crowd coming in here and literally jumping through hoops justifying the ntr aspect and how great it is. I have seen so many games fail when they try to appease both sides. Last check I have over 2.75tb's of games on my storage drive. I am also writing and rendering my own based off what I see people like and dislike. If people liked ntr as much as people like non ntr and avoidable ntr games i would have possibly thrown some in but the fan base isnt there for that not to mention I am no fan of the genre. I see what people like. I see what causes wars in threads....

I wont have that in my game or the thread for my game when its released. I as before give this dev credit for warning people with the tag and even more credit for throwing the switch in to turn it off but as you said to what effect will it hurt the games dialog as it never really fits unless the dev splits the game and entire story line is written specifically for each path so one doesnt bleed into the other.

 

[xuan quang]

when ever vanilla crowd see a NTR game or potential NTR one, they immediately pressure the dev into abandoned it. I would love to see an Unlimited pleasure like game with actual ntr and vanilla equally for once, but maybe it's too much to ask

 

[juan palote]

when ever vanilla crowd see a NTR game or potential NTR one, they immediately pressure the dev into abandoned it. I would love to see an Unlimited pleasure like game with actual ntr and vanilla equally for once, but maybe it's too much to ask

There are plenty of NTR games. The main problem is when a Dev tries to make NTR and Harem, which doesnt really make that much of a sense and i have never seen working.

And also some people are worried because a lot of the games that tried making NTR and Non-NTR at the same time failed and the game ended up suffering.

Guess we will have to see what happens with this one, but the precedents arent good.

 

[titouille313]

This game kinda reminds me of ecchi sensei. Art seems less creative qulitative, but seems promising.

 

[darkdepths]

Shouldn't this whole NTR discussion stop here?
The dev already explained what he plans to do and the comments are more a debate on principles and have hardly anything to do with the actual game.

 

[Samsami]

God i hate NTR

 

[Shipfan66]

Le sigh... I ain't gettin into that mess again. I'll jsut hold my peace and hope the purge comes soon. Not taking another karma hit for getting a post removed as part of an ntr argument cleanup. Y'all do you; I'm jsut gonna play the game and have fun with it. That's what I'm here for, after all.....

 

[SeveredRealms]

Shouldn't this whole NTR discussion stop here?
The dev already explained what he plans to do and the comments are more a debate on principles and have hardly anything to do with the actual game.

Yes this whole debate is over the dev explained that its avoidable form the start so enough fighting about it.

Le sigh... I ain't gettin into that mess again. I'll jsut hold my peace and hope the purge comes soon. Not taking another karma hit for getting a post removed as part of an ntr argument cleanup. Y'all do you; I'm jsut gonna play the game and have fun with it. That's what I'm here for, after all.....

See reply to the other person I quoted. Subject dropped the dev has handled it.