VN Ren'Py Abandoned Another Man's Wife [v1.092] [Too Perilous]

[Pr0GamerJohnny]

WARNING: LONG BLOATED POST, I do appreciate your lengthy reply and discussion

The underlying fantasy of the game is that you and your wife have a strong relationship and you are enticed by the possibility of having sex with another woman. In order to accomplish this, you plant the seed in your wife's brain to open up your marriage to swinging. How you act depends on how much control you do or don't have in how things proceed. Your wife, although reluctant, can find that she enjoys this new lifestyle much more than you may be comfortable with. If this basic fantasy isn't also your fantasy then you are playing the wrong game and the problem is YOU and not the developer. You need to stop being so lazy yourself and do some of your own homework and recognize exactly what game you are playing.

Relevant text bolded. This is the core of so many discussions on this page. This is a fundamentally NTR setup. To claim that this theme/setup governs the enter game, well, the cynic in me wouldn't neccesarily disagree with you - and that's exactly what all the hubbub is about.

I don't know what you're on about with this being lazy and homework business though.

You are NOT a top 20% "in demand" male that everyone complaining about cuckolding in games imagines that they are, or acknowledge that they aren't but want to fantasize about being one. There is dialogue in the bar that establishes that your wife is probably a little out of your league.

Depends on the path. That's the whole point of path diversity, on some paths it's intended you're in the 20%, on some paths it's intended you're on the bottom 20%. Do note that the "out of your league" dialogue only occurs on the low confidence path. For either men or women, all this comes down to boundaries.

1) Does each party clearly communicate their boundaries?

2) Does the other partner respect those boundaries?

3) If the other party doesn't respect those boundaries, does the original partner calmly communicate they can't be in a relationship where habitual overstep of those boundaries occurs?

Ask yourself how all of these questions are answered by the in-game characters.

For 1), the friday night bar talk is done fairly well with MC deciding (Based on player choice) what Steph's boundaries should be. Steph, for her part, doesn't do a great job of communicating her own boundaries on what she's comfortable with the MC doing with Tori, it immediately becomes a conversation full of attacks and defensiveness. It needn't be that, the answer should simply be Steph saying either "Yes MC, I'm comfortable with you having a threesome with someone else under these conditions", or "No MC, I'm not comfortable with that", or "I'm not sure yet MC, let's talk about it more". This boundaries concept completely falls apart during the Tori house segment.

For 2), there's not much discussion on this other than the Sat midday talk where MC mentions he met Amber, and how Steph feels. Still, there's an overall unease of whether each party in the relationship is actually obeying the others boundaries (the whole "well if you do THAT then ill probably call donnie over" - it's not that she's wrong, it's that the whole tonality is off)

For 3), the game is a mess. From Steph's perspective, never is there a calm conversation about times she feels the MC is overstepping her boundaries of comfort. From MC's perspective, you simply aren't ever given the chance to interject, aside from perhaps the recently added "Safe word" fork.

While you're not wrong that many on this forum like to posture as MegaAlphaChadMcThunderCocks, I don't think those types are common in this thread, they're more often found spazzing out in ntr game threads. When people use words like "control" here, I interpret it as a synonym for "set boundaries and communicate overstep of those boundaries", which the MC rarely does.

She will also be meeting other men in this game and comparing them to you, and, depending on how you play, may discover that she likes traits she finds in these men that you don't have.

This refusal of NPC's to all have an underlying desire to be this fantasy fuck doll seems to infuriate a lot of players on this site and when they say there is "bad writing", this is usually what they are talking about.

Except curiously, all of that goes out the window for certain npc characters. Said another way, you're 50% correct that MC is written more realistically; with not all women tripping over themselves to take a ride. But then none of that nuance is applied to characters like Jason.

On what paths does Steph meet Jason and discover she DOESN'T like the traits he brings? On what paths does Steph NOT have an underlying desire to be this fantasy fuck dolll for Jason? There's no path where she's actively turned off, yet there are SEVERAL paths where MC's behavior can cause her to be turned off towards MC.

Again I'll bring up Evakiss, because it reminds me a lot of ORS-style writing. Lena and Ian's attraction is highly variable and very realistic. On the other hand, all the Lena hookup paths with other men (excluding Robert, he's well written) come down to either "fuck his brains out" or "laugh but politely decline". There's rarely active revulsion on her part, whereas many a real life Lena would respond to someone like Jeremy with "what the fuck are you doing trying to go behind your friends back?"

This is what makes a good cuckold game, that everyone has their own motivations that may or may not include you and you have to figure these out. I'm not going to lie, there is a LOT of shitty writing out there for cuckold games, but this game isn't one of them. The main problem I'm seeing here is that people are not understanding the character they are playing in this game and the dynamics between the NPC's. The main character is behaving in a way that, if her were in the relationship with this particular woman for as long as the game says he has been, he would be behaving. He would not be this alpha male asshole telling her what's what. How the game presents their relationship is the dynamic they would have fallen into. The game introduces an element that disrupts that stable dynamic, and dealing with that dynamic is the point of the game. Characters are going to act inconsistently later in the game than they did at the beginning. That is not bad writing, that is the ENTIRE POINT of the game. Dealing with these shifts and attempting to control (or choosing not to control) these shifts is the gameplay.

It's what makes a good cuckold game in 2 out of those 4 categories Grumpy posted above. (NTR; cuckolding; hotwifing; stag/vixen) The problem is many players who prefer the latter 2 subcategories leave feeling misled, because, well, they were. I've long said NTR and sharing are opposites, not bedfellows, and don't belong anywhere near each other, no closer than harem and swinging. The NTR player WANTS to see a betrayal, a story that starts off with a couple seemingly in love, then a flip where everything goes wrong.

In case I wasn't clear though, half of me agrees completely with what you've said, and that the entire point of the game is an ntr setup, and that's all by design from the dev - and should be enjoyed as such in that category. But the dev certainly hasn't marketed it in that way. Just read this game's description from the dev compared to the description for something like "A Promise Best Left Unkept". There's a stark difference.

 

[packard1928]

I would like to see it move more back to a swing game. In the beginning the conversation MC had with his wife were fun and sexy. Now there seems to be more under the covers ( Pardon the pun )

 

[Joshy92]

WARNING: LONG BLOATED POST, I do appreciate your lengthy reply and discussion

Relevant text bolded. This is the core of so many discussions on this page. This is a fundamentally NTR setup. To claim that this theme/setup governs the enter game, well, the cynic in me wouldn't neccesarily disagree with you - and that's exactly what all the hubbub is about.

I don't know what you're on about with this being lazy and homework business though.


Depends on the path. That's the whole point of path diversity, on some paths it's intended you're in the 20%, on some paths it's intended you're on the bottom 20%. Do note that the "out of your league" dialogue only occurs on the low confidence path. For either men or women, all this comes down to boundaries.

1) Does each party clearly communicate their boundaries?

2) Does the other partner respect those boundaries?

3) If the other party doesn't respect those boundaries, does the original partner calmly communicate they can't be in a relationship where habitual overstep of those boundaries occurs?

Ask yourself how all of these questions are answered by the in-game characters.

For 1), the friday night bar talk is done fairly well with MC deciding (Based on player choice) what Steph's boundaries should be. Steph, for her part, doesn't do a great job of communicating her own boundaries on what she's comfortable with the MC doing with Tori, it immediately becomes a conversation full of attacks and defensiveness. It needn't be that, the answer should simply be Steph saying either "Yes MC, I'm comfortable with you having a threesome with someone else under these conditions", or "No MC, I'm not comfortable with that", or "I'm not sure yet MC, let's talk about it more". This boundaries concept completely falls apart during the Tori house segment.

For 2), there's not much discussion on this other than the Sat midday talk where MC mentions he met Amber, and how Steph feels. Still, there's an overall unease of whether each party in the relationship is actually obeying the others boundaries (the whole "well if you do THAT then ill probably call donnie over" - it's not that she's wrong, it's that the whole tonality is off)

For 3), the game is a mess. From Steph's perspective, never is there a calm conversation about times she feels the MC is overstepping her boundaries of comfort. From MC's perspective, you simply aren't ever given the chance to interject, aside from perhaps the recently added "Safe word" fork.

While you're not wrong that many on this forum like to posture as MegaAlphaChadMcThunderCocks, I don't think those types are common in this thread, they're more often found spazzing out in ntr game threads. When people use words like "control" here, I interpret it as a synonym for "set boundaries and communicate overstep of those boundaries", which the MC rarely does.



Except curiously, all of that goes out the window for certain npc characters. Said another way, you're 50% correct that MC is written more realistically; with not all women tripping over themselves to take a ride. But then none of that nuance is applied to characters like Jason.

On what paths does Steph meet Jason and discover she DOESN'T like the traits he brings? On what paths does Steph NOT have an underlying desire to be this fantasy fuck dolll for Jason? There's no path where she's actively turned off, yet there are SEVERAL paths where MC's behavior can cause her to be turned off towards MC.

Again I'll bring up Evakiss, because it reminds me a lot of ORS-style writing. Lena and Ian's attraction is highly variable and very realistic. On the other hand, all the Lena hookup paths with other men (excluding Robert, he's well written) come down to either "fuck his brains out" or "laugh but politely decline". There's rarely active revulsion on her part, whereas many a real life Lena would respond to someone like Jeremy with "what the fuck are you doing trying to go behind your friends back?"


It's what makes a good cuckold game in 2 out of those 4 categories Grumpy posted above. (NTR; cuckolding; hotwifing; stag/vixen) The problem is many players who prefer the latter 2 subcategories leave feeling misled, because, well, they were. I've long said NTR and sharing are opposites, not bedfellows, and don't belong anywhere near each other, no closer than harem and swinging. The NTR player WANTS to see a betrayal, a story that starts off with a couple seemingly in love, then a flip where everything goes wrong.

In case I wasn't clear though, half of me agrees completely with what you've said, and that the entire point of the game is an ntr setup, and that's all by design from the dev - and should be enjoyed as such in that category. But the dev certainly hasn't marketed it in that way. Just read this game's description from the dev compared to the description for something like "A Promise Best Left Unkept". There's a stark difference.

Good points you made there Johnny
You always have well thought out responses to people on this site
I respect that

 

[Grumpy Old Aussie]

Good points you made there Johnny
You always have well thought out responses to people on this site
I respect that

I agree. I try not to get caught up on differences with people over this game. I would point out the dynamics in this game are constantly changing. The mechanics are being tweaked nearly weekly, the characters are constantly changing. Gina's dialogues have changed significantly and with that her personality. Steph was an utter bitch on High Confidence, she has been rewritten several times so that now she is tolerable. Even Suzy has had re-writes so instead of being a bitch she is now a toxic woman. Scenes are constantly changing and added, Friday night has had dialogues added and removed several times, Tori/Jason scene is radically different now and there are more radical changes to come. The developers plans are constantly changing. The current content is not what it will be in the months ahead.

My point is, people are at different stages, most here have played different versions they have been changing so rapidly, some people are up to date with devs plans and many not and so on, all of these things means people will see the game differently. I try to keep that in mind. This game is ridiculously fluid at the moment.

 

[Joshy92]

I agree. I try not to get caught up on differences with people over this game. I would point out the dynamics in this game are constantly changing. The mechanics are being tweaked nearly weekly, the characters are constantly changing. Gina's dialogues have changed significantly and with that her personality. Steph was an utter bitch on High Confidence, she has been rewritten several times so that now she is tolerable. Even Suzy has had re-writes so instead of being a bitch she is now a toxic woman. Scenes are constantly changing and added, Friday night has had dialogues added and removed several times, Tori/Jason scene is radically different now and there are more radical changes to come. The developers plans are constantly changing. The current content is not what it will be in the months ahead.

My point is, people are at different stages, most here have played different versions they have been changing so rapidly, some people are up to date with devs plans and many not and so on, all of these things means people will see the game differently. I try to keep that in mind. This game is ridiculously fluid at the moment.

Probably my biggest criticism of the game
Is that stuff keeps changing
I know they want to tell a good story
But things change so much sometimes it can be confusing to keep track
For me at least
Hopefully they are done with old content now and can focus on the future

Edit - I just saw your comment that they still plan on changing things
Jeez I need to learn to read lol

 

[Grumpy Old Aussie]

Probably my biggest criticism of the game
Is that stuff keeps changing
I know they want to tell a good story
But things change so much sometimes it can be confusing to keep track
For me at least
Hopefully they are done with old content now and can focus on the future

Reached my reaction limit ugh.
OOPS Dev said he has plans to rewrite sections based on my feedback and another guys as well. He wants to remove red herrings he thinks are confusing people and change some areas to be clearer. So more changes ahead. He also has big changes planned for the Tori/Jason scene. It will be very different it sounds like.

I have no doubt once the reveal is out he will want to make more changes if he starts losing too many fans.

Sorry mate.

 

[Joshy92]

Reached my reaction limit ugh.
OOPS Dev said he has plans to rewrite sections based on my feedback and another guys as well. He wants to remove red herrings he thinks are confusing people and change some areas to be clearer. So more changes ahead. He also has big changes planned for the Tori/Jason scene. It will be very different it sounds like.

I have no doubt once the reveal is out he will want to make more changes if he starts losing too many fans.

Sorry mate.

Ahh well I'll still play the game because I do think it's good
I just think it could be even better

P.S. I'm still at my limit too lol

 

[Steve Carter]

WARNING: LONG BLOATED POST, I do appreciate your lengthy reply and discussion
I don't know what you're on about with this being lazy and homework business though.

Some of the responsibility for playing content that you will enjoy is for you to understand what it is you're playing. If I don't like horror movies and go see Friday the 13th part pi to the 23rd power in theaters because I thought it was a movie about a hockey player and I love sports movies, is my dislike of the film the movie's fault for being a horror movie or my fault for not knowing a little something about it before I went to go see it.

Depends on the path. That's the whole point of path diversity, on some paths it's intended you're in the 20%, on some paths it's intended you're on the bottom 20%. Do note that the "out of your league" dialogue only occurs on the low confidence path. For either men or women, all this comes down to boundaries.

1) Does each party clearly communicate their boundaries?

2) Does the other partner respect those boundaries?

3) If the other party doesn't respect those boundaries, does the original partner calmly communicate they can't be in a relationship where habitual overstep of those boundaries occurs?

Ask yourself how all of these questions are answered by the in-game characters.

For 1), the friday night bar talk is done fairly well with MC deciding (Based on player choice) what Steph's boundaries should be. Steph, for her part, doesn't do a great job of communicating her own boundaries on what she's comfortable with the MC doing with Tori, it immediately becomes a conversation full of attacks and defensiveness. It needn't be that, the answer should simply be Steph saying either "Yes MC, I'm comfortable with you having a threesome with someone else under these conditions", or "No MC, I'm not comfortable with that", or "I'm not sure yet MC, let's talk about it more". This boundaries concept completely falls apart during the Tori house segment.

For 2), there's not much discussion on this other than the Sat midday talk where MC mentions he met Amber, and how Steph feels. Still, there's an overall unease of whether each party in the relationship is actually obeying the others boundaries (the whole "well if you do THAT then ill probably call donnie over" - it's not that she's wrong, it's that the whole tonality is off)

For 3), the game is a mess. From Steph's perspective, never is there a calm conversation about times she feels the MC is overstepping her boundaries of comfort. From MC's perspective, you simply aren't ever given the chance to interject, aside from perhaps the recently added "Safe word" fork.

While you're not wrong that many on this forum like to posture as MegaAlphaChadMcThunderCocks, I don't think those types are common in this thread, they're more often found spazzing out in ntr game threads. When people use words like "control" here, I interpret it as a synonym for "set boundaries and communicate overstep of those boundaries", which the MC rarely does.

Having characters constantly and accurately emoting their inner feelings clearly is bad writing. Most people are full of shit, especially with themselves. Having characters say one thing and act another isn't bad writing, it's realistic Having them think they will act a certain way and then they find they act another way, especially in the heat of passion, is absolutely realistic.

Except curiously, all of that goes out the window for certain npc characters. Said another way, you're 50% correct that MC is written more realistically; with not all women tripping over themselves to take a ride. But then none of that nuance is applied to characters like Jason.

On what paths does Steph meet Jason and discover she DOESN'T like the traits he brings? On what paths does Steph NOT have an underlying desire to be this fantasy fuck dolll for Jason? There's no path where she's actively turned off, yet there are SEVERAL paths where MC's behavior can cause her to be turned off towards MC.

So Jason has qualities that Steph likes and treats him differently. I don't see how that is problematic. Having Steph act perfectly consistently with everyone she meets would be bad writing. She will react differently to different people.

Again I'll bring up Evakiss, because it reminds me a lot of ORS-style writing. Lena and Ian's attraction is highly variable and very realistic. On the other hand, all the Lena hookup paths with other men (excluding Robert, he's well written) come down to either "fuck his brains out" or "laugh but politely decline". There's rarely active revulsion on her part, whereas many a real life Lena would respond to someone like Jeremy with "what the fuck are you doing trying to go behind your friends back?"

I don't see what possible faults with Evakiss' game has to do with perceived faults of this game, so I'll just respond to this with dispassionate indifference.

It's what makes a good cuckold game in 2 out of those 4 categories Grumpy posted above. (NTR; cuckolding; hotwifing; stag/vixen) The problem is many players who prefer the latter 2 subcategories leave feeling misled, because, well, they were. I've long said NTR and sharing are opposites, not bedfellows, and don't belong anywhere near each other, no closer than harem and swinging. The NTR player WANTS to see a betrayal, a story that starts off with a couple seemingly in love, then a flip where everything goes wrong.

In case I wasn't clear though, half of me agrees completely with what you've said, and that the entire point of the game is an ntr setup, and that's all by design from the dev - and should be enjoyed as such in that category. But the dev certainly hasn't marketed it in that way. Just read this game's description from the dev compared to the description for something like "A Promise Best Left Unkept". There's a stark difference.

The game was exactly what I thought it was going to be based on the description. Well, I never got the impression that the MC was particularly brilliant, but other than that I don't think the game has lied to me so far.

"Navigate your way through this erotic story as a brilliant young professional whose choices are never just his alone. Join him in adventures reserved for swingers and help him convince his wife that this is a journey they want to take together. But travel this path with care. You are surrounded by women who are as confident as they are beautiful. They will let you make your own choices, but then they will make life altering choices as well. Make good choices and uncover the secret connection between your new lifestyle and other oddities you and your wife encounter along the way. Make poor choices, and watch helplessly as your wife brings the whole adventure to a premature end."

 

[Nafig]

Reached my reaction limit ugh.
OOPS Dev said he has plans to rewrite sections based on my feedback and another guys as well. He wants to remove red herrings he thinks are confusing people and change some areas to be clearer. So more changes ahead. He also has big changes planned for the Tori/Jason scene. It will be very different it sounds like.

I have no doubt once the reveal is out he will want to make more changes if he starts losing too many fans.

Sorry mate.

I'd like to know where the changes in the Tori/Jason scene will lead.
I will describe my vision of this scene. Even at the beginning of the game, Tori is a dubious prize, but when the MC learns about her past, she ceases to be a worthy target. An extremely dubious reward to become the 999999999999 dick stuck in Tori. I don’t think it’s worth striving for such a goal. When you look at the path MC has traveled, you understand that Tori is not worth it.
There is a good comedy called Interstate 60. There is an episode in it where the main character meets someone like Tori. The following dialogue follows:
MS - I refuse, period.
Whore - So you're not a man? Met a real woman and got scared? Are you afraid of embarrassing yourself?
MC - You won't know that, right? If I don't do this, I won't become number two thousand... What else is there? I'll be number one. The ones you will remember for the rest of your life. At night you will think about me, wonder: is it him? My answer is yes. I am your ideal that you never had. Firestarter.
It's a shame we'll never see an MC like this. The life of such an MC is worth following. In AMW, such an answer meant confidence -1000 and “game over”. This game only needs a passive.

 

[Pr0GamerJohnny]

So Jason has qualities that Steph likes and treats him differently. I don't see how that is problematic. Having Steph act perfectly consistently with everyone she meets would be bad writing. She will react differently to different people.

Don't you get it though? You criticize the notion that people would view Steph as a "fantasy fuck doll" instead of a more realistic, dynamic character yet seem cheerfully unburdened when her interactions with other characters are jarringly simple, to the point of caricatures, that's what's problematic.

I'm not advocating for Steph acting the same with everyone, I'm advocating for her not only acting differently with different people, but her attitude towards other people changing based on her relationship with MC.

 

[Nafig]

Don't you get it though? You criticize the notion that people would view Steph as a "fantasy fuck doll" instead of a more realistic, dynamic character yet seem cheerfully unburdened when her interactions with other characters are jarringly simple, to the point of caricatures, that's what's problematic.

I'm not advocating for Steph acting the same with everyone, I'm advocating for her not only acting differently with different people, but her attitude towards other people changing based on her relationship with MC.

In the current version, Steph consistently fucks everyone without missing anyone. What is the difference? Absolutely the same reaction to different characters. Only the attitude towards the MC will be “different”, she will screw everyone else completely inconsistently.

 

[AlexStandal]

Helloooo
Can someone tell me the difference between v1.07a and 1 07d? I missed the 'a' version and now there's a 'd' version.
We're there any new scenes? What changes were there? Where has both the updates taken the story?

 

[asahibito]

Helloooo
Can someone tell me the difference between v1.07a and 1 07d? I missed the 'a' version and now there's a 'd' version.
We're there any new scenes? What changes were there? Where has both the updates taken the story?

1.07 finishes out the visit to Tori/Jason. Subversions a through d are all bug fixes.
EDIT:
I guess not quite true. Dev also sneaked in some dialogue changes in a through d

 

[Dom Toretto]

Can we get the android version of D

 

[BangB420]

Just let the dev finish their game, there are gonna be different routes. Some of you NTR haters are so insecure that any hint of it and you shit the bed screaming about it. So sad to see many devs leave their original vision due the behavior of entitled self-serving whining brats.

 

[Pr0GamerJohnny]

Just let the dev finish their game, there are gonna be different routes. Some of you NTR haters are so insecure that any hint of it and you shit the bed screaming about it. So sad to see many devs leave their original vision due the behavior of entitled self-serving whining brats.

can you rephrase that in a more civil way? i'm proud that this thread has gone on for pages upon pages of discussion without devolving into nastiness.

 

[blkcrow820]

1.07 finishes out the visit to Tori/Jason. Subversions a through d are all bug fixes.
EDIT:
I guess not quite true. Dev also sneaked in some dialogue changes in a through d

Do you mods work ok with 1.07d?

 

[BangB420]

can you rephrase that in a more civil way? i'm proud that this thread has gone on for pages upon pages of discussion without devolving into nastiness.

Literally the thread has pages of people just complaining over and over about the same thing and saying how the dev is shit for including content not suited of their tastes.

 

[asahibito]

Do you mods work ok with 1.07d?

Yes.

 

[Grumpy Old Aussie]

I'd like to know where the changes in the Tori/Jason scene will lead.
I will describe my vision of this scene. Even at the beginning of the game, Tori is a dubious prize, but when the MC learns about her past, she ceases to be a worthy target. An extremely dubious reward to become the 999999999999 dick stuck in Tori. I don’t think it’s worth striving for such a goal. When you look at the path MC has traveled, you understand that Tori is not worth it.
There is a good comedy called Interstate 60. There is an episode in it where the main character meets someone like Tori. The following dialogue follows:
MS - I refuse, period.
Whore - So you're not a man? Met a real woman and got scared? Are you afraid of embarrassing yourself?
MC - You won't know that, right? If I don't do this, I won't become number two thousand... What else is there? I'll be number one. The ones you will remember for the rest of your life. At night you will think about me, wonder: is it him? My answer is yes. I am your ideal that you never had. Firestarter.
It's a shame we'll never see an MC like this. The life of such an MC is worth following. In AMW, such an answer meant confidence -1000 and “game over”. This game only needs a passive.

Where it will end up who knows. I can't tell you, the dev said there will be more branching and that Tori's second game is temporary, and that there will be more changes.

I have to agree Tori is a dubious prize. A damaged woman many men have had who likes to play games with people. Its not very appealing is it.