VN Ren'Py Being a DIK [v0.10.1] [DrPinkCake]

[ffive]

What is false? First, I never denied that playing through Interlude allows to have a more nuanced Zoey.

I was referring to this part:

Even if the Interlude's plot were any good per se, it would be bad because of it's totally meaningless to the main plot -- and proves this is the fact you can skip it in almost in its entirety

Skipping the plot of Interlude means you miss out on a number of possible Zoey flag combinations. And it's way too premature to say that these combinations you can only obtain by playing through the Interlude will be "totally meaningless to the main plot" -- that you miss out on getting them does not prove anything in this regard.

 

[4lpaca]

Taste is one thing quality is another... But because of those who don't know the latter and think Shakespeare is the same thing as "50 Shades of Grey" -- because it's all "taste" -- we're in the cultural state we're in...

 

[shazba]

What is false? First, I never denied that playing through Interlude allows to have a more nuanced Zoey. But, even if I said so, this wouldn't be far from the truth because, in the end, it's just a matter of score points: ok, you play through the interlude and each action adds or subtract a Zoey's DIK point, but, in the end, all your actions will be forgotten and what will be recorded is the final result -- Zoey is or isn't DIK:

if zoey_dk >= 0:
    $ zoey_dik = True
elif True:
    $ zoey_dik = False

And, of course, playing through the Interlude allows you to not calm down Emma but don't be vengeful (thus you get $ emma_calm = False & $ emma_cluck = False) which is not possible when you skip the interlude. But that's all. You can have a more immersive experience, but that's all will be recorded for posterity...

I was referring to this part:

Skipping the plot of Interlude means you miss out on a number of possible Zoey flag combinations. And it's way too premature to say that these combinations you can only obtain by playing through the Interlude will be "totally meaningless to the main plot" -- that you miss out on getting them does not prove anything in this regard.

There are only like 5 variables in the entire Interlude (not counting the temporary variables used to branch each choice). Two of them are for the Interlude only:

• emma_joke = If Zoey jokes with Emma about her tats when they first meet, Emma responds a little differently when Zoey is getting her own later on.
• epi_blue_hair = If Zoey encourages the bartender to dye her hair, we see the bartender with blue hair later on.

Then we have the only variables that are intentionally carried through to later episodes:

• emma_calm = Determines whether or not Emma and Zoey are friends at the end of the Interlude.
• emma_cluck = Determines how badly their friendship ended.
• zoey_dik = summarizes Zoey's personality

The "zoey_dik" flag makes sense, she'll either be a bit more thoughtful, or not.

But the other two? Hopefully the only reason they come into the subsequent episodes is when Zoey tells the mc about some shit that went down. She's surely gonna explain her topless pic on Rooster, and it makes sense that she'd say, "But I got the bitch back" or whatever.

But yeah, if you skip the Interlude and just go with the "Calmed her down" or "Took her phone" options, Zoey's actions and attitude are aligned.

Although I didn't mind the Interlude, I really don't want that drama with Emma spilling into the future episodes. I wouldn't put it passed DPC to give the Interlude cast a cameo role down the track, but like, is there anyone on the planet who wants that (unless Jenna comes to visit, that'd be fine ).

I say the Interlude is bad because it's meaningless, it's not information necessary to the main plot, it changes the POV in the middle of things without no excuse except "it's my vision!" (ok, visionary...); for one to believe Zoey still liked the MC's and at the same time decided to move to SF because she was sad and saw an add on the Internet, one needs a crane for the suspension of belief. Thus the plot has no coherence, fails to grab the attention of everyone who's not interested in those slice-of-life craps. And more... Even if the Interlude's plot were any good per se, it would be bad because of it's totally meaningless to the main plot -- and proves this is the fact you can skip it in almost in its entirety, jumping directly to the part when you (i.e., Zoey) flushes her former friends phone; and you do this to set the only three variables that matter in the Interlude:

I'm gonna go with your entire opinion is flawed for a very major reason:

It's an interlude.

It's literally not meant to be relevant to the main story. That's the point of an interlude. It's a break between acts.

If the Interlude was meant to be an episode, then it would be bad for all the reasons you've stated. But it's not an episode, it's an interlude, and it suits its purpose of an interlude well enough - a break from the main story.

Whether you wanted it or not, that's a matter of taste.

 

[Darkwen]

There are only like 5 variables in the entire Interlude (not counting the temporary variables used to branch each choice). Two of them are for the Interlude only:

• emma_joke = If Zoey jokes with Emma about her tats when they first meet, Emma responds a little differently when Zoey is getting her own later on.
• epi_blue_hair = If Zoey encourages the bartender to dye her hair, we see the bartender with blue hair later on.

Then we have the only variables that are intentionally carried through to later episodes:

• emma_calm = Determines whether or not Emma and Zoey are friends at the end of the Interlude.
• emma_cluck = Determines how badly their friendship ended.
• zoey_dik = summarizes Zoey's personality

The "zoey_dik" flag makes sense, she'll either be a bit more thoughtful, or not.

But the other two? Hopefully the only reason they come into the subsequent episodes is when Zoey tells the mc about some shit that went down. She's surely gonna explain her topless pic on Rooster, and it makes sense that she'd say, "But I got the bitch back" or whatever.

But yeah, if you skip the Interlude and just go with the "Calmed her down" or "Took her phone" options, Zoey's actions and attitude are aligned.

Although I didn't mind the attitude, I really don't want that drama with Emma spilling into the future episodes. I wouldn't put it passed DPC to give the Interlude cast a cameo role down the track, but like, is there anyone on the planet who wants that (unless Jenna comes to visit, that'd be fine ).



I'm gonna go with your entire opinion is flawed for a very major reason:

It's an interlude.

It's literally not meant to be relevant to the main story. That's the point of an interlude. It's a break between acts.

If the Interlude was meant to be an episode, then it would be bad for all the reasons you've stated. But it's not an episode, it's an Interlude, and it suits its purpose of an interlude well enough - a break from the main story.

Whether you wanted it or not, that's a matter of taste.

but what if Emma revenge fucks Mc if you take her phone? I mean she kind of prettier then Sandy

 

[shazba]

but what if Emma revenge fucks Mc if you take her phone? I mean she kind of prettier then Sandy

Take that the fuck back! TAKE IT BACK!

Emma's tats are fucking revolting . Sandy's are tapestry of life .

How can you compare:

Spoiler: This work of art!

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to

Spoiler: this... this abortion!

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[Darkwen]

Take that the fuck back! TAKE IT BACK!

Emma's tats are fucking revolting . Sandy's are tapestry of life .

How can you compare:

Spoiler: This work of art!

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to

Spoiler: this... this abortion!

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Sure Sandy is pretty but Emma doesn't have a spider on her face I do not like spiders one little bit and Em has better boobs. But sandy does have one thing over Emma the Nicole 3some

 

[CheesusRice]

There are only like 5 variables in the entire Interlude (not counting the temporary variables used to branch each choice). Two of them are for the Interlude only:

• emma_joke = If Zoey jokes with Emma about her tats when they first meet, Emma responds a little differently when Zoey is getting her own later on.
• epi_blue_hair = If Zoey encourages the bartender to dye her hair, we see the bartender with blue hair later on.

Then we have the only variables that are intentionally carried through to later episodes:

• emma_calm = Determines whether or not Emma and Zoey are friends at the end of the Interlude.
• emma_cluck = Determines how badly their friendship ended.
• zoey_dik = summarizes Zoey's personality

The "zoey_dik" flag makes sense, she'll either be a bit more thoughtful, or not.

Is that really it? Originally I was okay with the Interlude because it gives a look into what kind of person Zoey is and help us set up if she is a 'Dik' or' Chick' but if those are the only one's carried over it's kind of pointless to have an entire 'episode' just for her.

Plus, actually thinking about it the entire concept for the Interlude is kind shit. Now we, the player, know exactly what happened and as the MC it might be hard to make unbiased decisions when it comes to her because we know for a fact

Spoiler: Interlude spoilers

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[ffive]

Now we, the player, know exactly what happened and as the MC it might be hard to make unbiased decisions when it comes to her because we know for a fact

Spoiler: Interlude spoilers

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It's actually knowing the facts that should help one to make unbiased decision; since you can make whatever decision you think MC should make without being deluded yourself about the circumstances.

 

[BeingADikDik]

What player choices do feel are canonical?

Sometimes, the way DPC writes the choice options, I feel like we're meant to pick one over the other. For example:

In Ch. 3 after asking Jill on a date and saying goodbye to our dear friend Tybalt, MC can either 'Go See Bella' or 'Ignore Bella'. The wording of the choice 'Ignore Bella' could have been written differently. For example 'Go See Bella' vs 'Visit Derek' (or whatever alternative action). Based on this, I feel that the player is meant to 'Go See Bella' no matter whether they are DIK or CHICK, pursuing others or not, etc. I firmly believe this to be a canonical story event.

Similarly, for CHICK players, I feel that DPC wants the player to pursue Jill while also on Josy and Maya's path because the throuple will become a fouple as a means for him to atone for the choice in Acting Lessons. This is canonical and must be so. Why else would DPC make Josy cum so quickly, and Maya struggle to handle MC's awesomeness, if not to have a third girl to satisfy on those lustful nights?

 

[луна]

What player choices do feel are canonical?

Sometimes, the way DPC writes the choice options, I feel like we're meant to pick one over the other. For example:

In Ch. 3 after asking Jill on a date and saying goodbye to our dear friend Tybalt, MC can either 'Go See Bella' or 'Ignore Bella'. The wording of the choice 'Ignore Bella' could have been written differently. For example 'Go See Bella' vs 'Visit Derek' (or whatever alternative action). Based on this, I feel that the player is meant to 'Go See Bella' no matter whether they are DIK or CHICK, pursuing others or not, etc. I firmly believe this to be a canonical story event.

Similarly, for CHICK players, I feel that DPC wants the player to pursue Jill while also on Josy and Maya's path because the throuple will become a fouple as a means for him to atone for the choice in Acting Lessons. This is canonical and must be so. Why else would DPC make Josy cum so quickly, and Maya struggle to handle MC's awesomeness, if not to have a third girl to satisfy on those lustful nights?

View attachment 2174787

Josy+Maya+Jill= a dream come true.

 

[CheesusRice]

It's actually knowing the facts that should help one to make unbiased decision; since you can make whatever decision you think MC should make without being deluded yourself about the circumstances.

Maybe I'm using biased/unbiased wrong but as the MC we shouldn't know for a fact what happened with Zoey after she left besides what little the 2 messaged each other about before that died down. We should be as in the dark about what happened as the MC but now we have this info that will affect what we choose when dealing with her, maybe I'm wrong but that's super biased.

Personally I'd rather it be a mystery as to her actions after she left and surrounding the picture.

 

[wakkawalla]

Josy+Maya+Jill= a dream come true.

if you mean sharing a common grave i agree

 

[ename144]

lol ok let's bite since I'm bored.

Interlude what does it bring? well let's take a look at the early chapters of season 1 when Bella questions us about the MC's past and he gives a brief story about his only friend who he had many of his firsts in life, kiss, sex, etc. So what's the point of this brief look to the MC's past? to understand where his emotional situation is, he never defined what he had with Zoey, this explains many of his immature reactions when dealing with relationships and gives DPC an excuse for writing those sudden "hissy fits" of the MC.

Let's then take a look at his future interactions with the main girls, he obviously doesn't want another Zoey situation where the girl leaves him with no closure, notice the advice he gives Sage about getting closure, something he wished he had done but couldn't because Zoey left him. The point of the interlude is to give an introduction to S3, to Zoey who will be probably a new emotional challenge for our MC and wether the writing is good or bad, that's just depends on the person, I don't find it a master piece of writing, but I get where it's coming from and what it will probably mean for the future of the story, if you like it fine but if you don't there's no need to write a thesis and go all MY GOD THIS SUCKS SO BAD, SUCH A TERRIBLE WRITING, that's your opinion, no need to escalate, call others out or start dramatic takes if other person likes it. So chill my dude.

I suspect that was the idea: the MC knows he needs to make things with his chosen girl official because he doesn't want to repeat what happened with Zoey. But - IMHO - DPC completely fucked it up. He was so focused on the twists he took his eye off the ball.

First, the MC doesn't decide to make his relationship (or lack there of) official because of Zoey, he does so because he saw John Boy/Elena and Tommy/Heather at breakfast one day. He never mentions or thinks about Zoey during the crossroad, and of course we can't make the connection ourselves because DPC didn't want to introduce her properly before her splashy return. So instead of seeing the MC grow from his experiences, we get an awkward railroad to a 'major choice' which we then need to headcanon into being about Zoey to justify her sudden prominence.

But second and more importantly, if the MC really did learn from his experience with Zoey, then her return is going to be a massive nothingburger because his relationship with her was hopelessly shallow. The two may have spent a lot of time together (relative to the LIs), but they never put much thought into the relationship. Zoey was happy to ghost him for his own good, and the MC has clearly moved on by the start of Season 2.

That's not to say he wouldn't have mixed feelings about seeing her again, but I very much doubt the positives would come close to the negatives - at least if he picked one of the LI branches. After all, Zoey was his only relationship. If he's decided the new relationship with one of the LIs is important enough to make official, Zoey is the yardstick he'd be using to make that determination; there's no reason to worry unless he's at least as serious about the new girl as he was about Zoey. In that case Zoey's return is effectively an opportunity to trade two birds in the hand for one in the bush (somewhat literally if you're on the M/J branch). That's not going to be compelling drama.

I've said before and I'll likely say again (at least until Episode 9 finally comes out): the time to bring Zoey back was either before the crossroads or later in season 3 once the MC's branch falls apart on its own. In either of those cases Zoey would serve as a catalyst, prompting the MC to think about what he really wants out of his current situation. As is, Zoey simply interrupts a supposedly important decision in the middle of making it. That undercuts the decision and annoys anyone who wanted to see the original situation play out.

The fact that it also added ~2 months to the effectively development time of Episode 9 so we could watch Zoey aimlessly bum around San Diego doesn't help, of course.

Wouldn't call it pointless, it's a sorta way for DPC telling you "hey this route is about to escalate to something", up to you if keep fooling around or stay with Sage 'till the end. Sure, you can have fun with those you mentioned and make the MC keep looking like an hypocrite, in that regard DPC doesn't punish the player enough for that, yet...

I think that's precisely the problem: instead showing us a situation that would make the MC want to escalate his relationship with Sage, DPC just told us it happened. The fact that some MCs would be perfectly happy as a rebound guy is simply ignored.


EDIT:

What player choices do feel are canonical?

Sometimes, the way DPC writes the choice options, I feel like we're meant to pick one over the other. For example:

In Ch. 3 after asking Jill on a date and saying goodbye to our dear friend Tybalt, MC can either 'Go See Bella' or 'Ignore Bella'. The wording of the choice 'Ignore Bella' could have been written differently. For example 'Go See Bella' vs 'Visit Derek' (or whatever alternative action). Based on this, I feel that the player is meant to 'Go See Bella' no matter whether they are DIK or CHICK, pursuing others or not, etc. I firmly believe this to be a canonical story event.

I agree about going to see Bella. And yet DPC still gave us the choice. Why? If the game is so obviously biased in favor of that option, why give us a half-assed opportunity to do otherwise? Similarly, for those MCs who have gone out of their way not to pursue several girls, why then insist we play through the MC's pointless navel-gazing about who to date at the end of Episode 8? We've obviously already made the choice.

Personally, I think DPC just can't help himself. He likes to add choices, but he isn't willing to abide by the limitations those choices should impose on his story. This eventually undercuts both the story and choices, but in the heat of the moment the allure of cosmetic choices is too shiny for him to ignore.

 

[shazba]

Sure Sandy is pretty but Emma doesn't have a spider on her face I do not like spiders one little bit and Em has better boobs. But sandy does have one thing over Emma the Nicole 3some

Yeah, it's pretty much all about the threesome.

Also, in case you haven't noticed, I like that li'l spider.

Is that really it? Originally I was okay with the Interlude because it gives a look into what kind of person Zoey is and help us set up if she is a 'Dik' or' Chick' but if those are the only one's carried over it's kind of pointless to have an entire 'episode' just for her.

Plus, actually thinking about it the entire concept for the Interlude is kind shit. Now we, the player, know exactly what happened and as the MC it might be hard to make unbiased decisions when it comes to her because we know for a fact

Spoiler: Interlude spoilers

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It's actually knowing the facts that should help one to make unbiased decision; since you can make whatever decision you think MC should make without being deluded yourself about the circumstances.

The idea of the mc not knowing something that we know isn't entirely new. We've got a lot of insight into Quinn's dealings that the mc hasn't (which is weird since the mc is telling the story... )

 

[ffive]

Maybe I'm using biased/unbiased wrong but as the MC we shouldn't know for a fact what happened with Zoey after she left besides what little the 2 messaged each other about before that died down.

Ahh, but that's the thing -- we are not the MC. The decisions we make for him and actions we make them take, these don't have to align with our own preferences, and it's better if we can make them with more knowledge. Much like i might decide the MC in some particular playthrough is interested in relationship with one of the girls i don't personally like all that much, just to see the way the story goes in such case, i can also decide that MC made certain decision about Zoey "because he doesn't have full picture" even though personally i do have this full picture. It doesn't require me to be ignorant about what the situation was really like.

 

[COACHRIDDLA]

Fake? View attachment F7EF8D7C-1AC4-44A0-860B-C814A543F77E.webp

 

[lipe2410]

Josy+Maya+Jill= a dream come true.

I change Jill for Nicole in this equation easily. But some things are to good to happen even in fiction

 

[луна]

I change Jill for Nicole in this equation easily. But some things are to good to happen even in fiction

The hope is the last thing we lose.

Spoiler

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[shazba]

What player choices do feel are canonical?

Sometimes, the way DPC writes the choice options, I feel like we're meant to pick one over the other. For example:

In Ch. 3 after asking Jill on a date and saying goodbye to our dear friend Tybalt, MC can either 'Go See Bella' or 'Ignore Bella'. The wording of the choice 'Ignore Bella' could have been written differently. For example 'Go See Bella' vs 'Visit Derek' (or whatever alternative action). Based on this, I feel that the player is meant to 'Go See Bella' no matter whether they are DIK or CHICK, pursuing others or not, etc. I firmly believe this to be a canonical story event.

Similarly, for CHICK players, I feel that DPC wants the player to pursue Jill while also on Josy and Maya's path because the throuple will become a fouple as a means for him to atone for the choice in Acting Lessons. This is canonical and must be so. Why else would DPC make Josy cum so quickly, and Maya struggle to handle MC's awesomeness, if not to have a third girl to satisfy on those lustful nights?

View attachment 2174787

I agree about going to see Bella. And yet DPC still gave us the choice. Why? If the game is so obviously biased in favor of that option, why give us a half-assed opportunity to do otherwise? Similarly, for those MCs who have gone out of their way not to pursue several girls, why then insist we play through the MC's pointless navel-gazing about who to date at the end of Episode 8? We've obviously already made the choice.

Personally, I think DPC just can't help himself. He likes to add choices, but he isn't willing to abide by the limitations those choices should impose on his story. This eventually undercuts both the story and choices, but in the heat of the moment the allure of cosmetic choices is too shiny for him to ignore.

Even being offered the choice to "Go see Bella" isn't guaranteed.

There's a counter that weighs up Bella's opinion of the mc, it made up of the following:

• MC tries to kiss Bella in the car (she actually likes that... +1)
• MC offers to pay for Bella's meal (she likes that +1)
• MC is doing OK in class (Bella likes that +1)
• MC is doing really well in class (Bella really likes that +2)
• MC peeked at Bella when she was changing back in ep2 (she doesn't like that -1)
• Beth is angry at the mc for his jokes about the food from either ep1 or ep2 (Bella doesn't like that -1)
• MC is wearing the DIK helmet (Bella doesn't like that -1)
• Troy mentions the fight (whether mc win or loses the fight, Bella really doesn't like that -2)

If the sum of the above conditions is below zero, Bella tells Jill she doesn't like him but he's still better than Tybalt, but that also means your chances with Bella are gone.

Basically if your mc behaves as a DIK (doesn't offer to pay for Bella, fucks around in class, peeks on her changing, wears the helmet and gets into fights), you're gonna be well under the cutoff.

So to me, that choice is far from canon.

There are clear choices to end the relationships (or not pursue them) at various times. There has to be clear choices, otherwise we get shoehorned into a permanent relationship in the game that we don't want.

• With M&J, regardless of the mc's affinity and if the girls like him, the mc can choose to be just friends with them.
• With Sage the mc can shoot her down numerous times (she is a persistent woman!)
• With Jill you can choose to "Fight for Jill" or not.
• And with Bella you also get the option. Although I felt like I didn't know what I was getting in to when I chose "Go see Bella". Maybe it should have been "Go see Bella to see if you can get into her pants".

But all that bullshit said, my point is I don't feel anything is canon. Everyone has their likes and dislikes, and there are characters and scenes that seem "right" to them. Others disagree. To DPC's credit he has captured characters that resonate with different player's personalities and it makes them feel they are on the right path.

You want the MILF path, Bella is canon. You want the virgin path, Jill is canon. You want the experimental path, it's the throuple for you. You want trouble, it's Quinn. You want hassle free sex and fun, that used to be Sage (now she's complicating things).

I think the game represents all the characters fairly equality, meaning it's the players own interest that tips the scales as to what feels canon, rather than DPC's bias in the presentation.

Fake? View attachment 2174810

Nope, it's not fake. Check out the previews so far.

https://f95zone.to/threads/being-a-dik-interlude-season-3-dr-pinkcake.25332/post-8269074

 

[ename144]

Even being offered the choice to "Go see Bella" isn't guaranteed.

There's a counter that weighs up Bella's opinion of the mc, it made up of the following:

• MC tries to kiss Bella in the car (she actually likes that... +1)
• MC offers to pay for Bella's meal (she likes that +1)
• MC is doing OK in class (Bella likes that +1)
• MC is doing really well in class (Bella really likes that +2)
• MC peeked at Bella when she was changing back in ep2 (she doesn't like that -1)
• Beth is angry at the mc for his jokes about the food from either ep1 or ep2 (Bella doesn't like that -1)
• MC is wearing the DIK helmet (Bella doesn't like that -1)
• Troy mentions the fight (whether mc win or loses the fight, Bella really doesn't like that -2)

If the sum of the above conditions is below zero, Bella tells Jill she doesn't like him but he's still better than Tybalt, but that also means your chances with Bella are gone.

Basically if your mc behaves as a DIK (doesn't offer to pay for Bella, fucks around in class, peeks on her changing, wears the helmet and gets into fights), you're gonna be well under the cutoff.

So to me, that choice is far from canon.

To me, there are clear choices to end the relationship at various times. There has to be clear choices, otherwise we get shoehorned into a permanent relationship in the game that we don't want.

• With M&J, regardless of the mc's affinity and if the girls like him, the mc can choose to be just friends with them.
• With Sage the mc can shoot her down numerous times (she is a persistent woman!)
• With Jill you can choose to "Fight for Jill" or not.
• And with Bella you also get the option. Although I felt like I didn't know what I was getting in to when I chose "Go see Bella". Maybe it should have been "Go see Bella to see if you can get into her pants".

But all that bullshit said, my point is I don't feel anything is canon. Everyone has their likes and dislikes, and there are characters and scenes that seem "right" to them. Others disagree. To DPC's credit he has captured characters that resonate with different player's personalities and it makes them feel they are on the right path.

You want the MILF path, Bella is canon. You want the virgin path, Jill is canon. You want the experimental path, it's the throuple for you. You want trouble, it's Quinn. You want hassle free sex and fun, that used to be Sage (now she's complicating things).

I think the game represents all the characters fairly equality, meaning it's the players own interest that tips the scales as to what feels canon, rather than DPC's bias in the presentation.

I don't particularly disagree about there being no real canon, but how is that relevant to the question of why we get some of these choices in the first place? The fact that even an MC who never won Isabella over still gets to call her Bella and worries about his relationship with her just underscores the point: too many of the choices DPC gives us are ultimately decorative and not only never contribute to a larger picture, they actively obscure it.