allanl9020142

Well-Known Member
Aug 23, 2018
1,309
2,091
I think there's a misunderstanding.

Not having freeroaming does not necessarily imply using different locations for different branches.

DPC could have had Episode 9 in the same exact location, with the same exact rendering and the same exact dialogues that could have been reused among multiple branches, but just sparing us the useless effort to do forced clicks here and there like trained monkeys.

I mean, at the first part of free roaming of Episode 9 your tasks are
- find your sword
- talk to Jamie
- talk to Sally
- talk to Rusty
Plus the optional tasks
- Talk to Zoey
- Talk to Derek
- Talk to the Girls

To carry out these tasks you have to explore the mansion in order to find things and people.

This exploring could provide a little ( 5% - 10% max ) more fun than normal playthrough on the first run, but it's just a trained monkey chore when replaying to explore different branches.

Besides, it's just an illusion of freedom of exploration, because those tasks MUST be completed in order the game to progress, and the order in which you chose to perform them is irrilevant.

So it would be much better if the exact same rendering and dialogues with their choice menu were presented to the player in a fixed order in normal playthrough rather than forcing the user to click here and there to activate them.

Then the already seen contents would be completely skippable with Fast Forward.

Instead, between one FF and the other, we are forced to click here and there like trained monkeys. Possibly with the "darkness effect" like in the "haunted mansion" which makes sense ONLY THE FIRST TIME.

Giving up freeroaming, DPC would have had less coding effort, since freeroaming is just more complicated than a plain sequential playthrough branching only after menus... which is the basic way to use Ren'Py.

Freeroaming:
- for the Dev is more complicated to code
- for the Player might slightly improve the first run experience while significantly worsening all the subsequent replays.

---

Since we have 5 major branches and the vast majority of players would like to see them all (but without each time re-solving already solved puzzles...) a better user experience would be achieved if (alternatively):

1) a variable is memorized in "persistent" so that once the player has "found the sword" or "found the keg tap" or "found character X" he is not expected to redo these chores over and over in the next gameplays and he is directly jumped to the SKIPPABLE diaolgues

- OR, if option 1) is too technically complicated -

2) freeroaming is just dropped at once! In this way coding is simpler, and user experience is golobally better for the vast majority of us that would like to play all the 5 branches but give up because of the forced clicks to redo already done chores over and over...
Hmm, so is what you're saying is that it's a matter of HOW to do these big events that include everyone rather than individual events for specific characters vs free roams in general?

If so, then I think I agree with that. It doesn't really seem like that much of a time sink in regards to still images. It'll still take the same amount of time to pose and render them. Plus, if it's all in the same location the assets will all be the same and he was already going to need to write/plan those scenes out anyway in free roam. Also yea, from a glance it really does seem like it'd take less coding effort. There's an argument made that he just copied and pasted code from other free roams but seems kind of iffy. He'd still have to sort through it to make it all works and add things that are relevant to that episode's free roam.

I don't want to put words in Takkatakka 's mouth but it seems like his argument is that it's not a matter of HOW to do the big events that encompass all the characters. It's more that DPC uses the big events to cover all the possible branches without having to do it in different settings, choosing assets, etc for smaller, individual events. Like the water park with Maya and Josy or restaurant date with Bella.

But what you're saying is that DPC could still do the big events rather than the individual events and it's just a matter of the method he uses, right? I'm just trying to make sure we're all on the same page here.
 
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Hahn1900

Well-Known Member
Jan 3, 2021
1,497
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I want to see some mysteries solved, mostly:

- who posted Cathy's picture,

- who blackmailed Chad,

- what's the link between Jill's family and MC's mother,

- who are MC's grandparents,

- what happened to Bella's marriage,

- why Jill and Bella are so close,

- who the hell is Priscilla (the woman Burke called after he dismissed Maya in episode 9),

- who really knocked up Arieth?

- who put the cameras in DIK's mansion,

- who cheated in the exams? will there be consequences?

- will Tybbie marry his beloved watermelon?
So i agree that we need serious progress overall... but i dont demand "conclusion" on so many levels, cause there are still at least 6 episodes left. But we need progress... just played the Jill path again (Jill path is my favorite love route, Josy my favorite girl) And i mean, fuck... MC pinned the picture of jill AND his mom on the same fucking wall near each other and isnt even aware thats the same building in the back :D Thats just... i cant even talk about it.

So we need ANYTHING in that regard, and if its just that MCs asks some questions. I dont need answers, but man... DPC needs to remove the blinders from MCs eyes.

So point for point

- Cathy picture... dont think we will get something there until Cathy returns. I dont think this will be the case until the end of Season 3. I would say, its ok, cause revealing the traitor who stole the laptop is a big thing and i cant imagine it will be revealed before the start of season 4. MAYBE at the very end of season 3, but even then it feels to soon for that. But some "investigation" in that regard has to be done. Cause lets face it, so much shit was going on already but pretty much everythign was just dropped without mentioned again in a dialogue... thats just odd.

- Chad blackmail... well, yeah, at least some talk about it has to be done. Like... MC asks Chad "hey man, whats going on with you, i know everything, and i think thats the reason why you assaulted me, so... talk to me" or something like that, especially since its possible to be "cool" with him along the way.

- link between Jills and Lynettes family, yeah we need some REAL infos here, i mean... come on MC, look at the pictures... and of course, it has to be done that he meets Jills parents. So there is no way around it to get something here. If this is not solved or at least seriously touched, it would be ridiculous. But its a Jill Path only thing. Without being on her path there is not the picture taken, no meeting with her parents and so there is no link so far between their familys for now that could come up. For that DPCs needs to add something more. But it could be easily done even without Jills path. Like Jill could meet with MC in his room (no need for her being on the love route for that, they are friends no matter what) and see the picture of his mother.

- MCs grandparents? Should pretty much be solved with the Jills family link. Especially considered the picture taken of Jill compared to Lynettes picture.

- Bellas merriage... another "blinders" case regarding MC... starting a serious relationship with Bella without even talking about that felt really off to me. Which is the reason why the Bella path is my least favorite. It doesnt make sense to me for now... fooling around with her? yep, anything more than that? At this point? Doesnt work for me. This should have been a solved case long ago, at least with ep 8 before getting serious with her. It already feels to late now, but yeah, DPC has to give us something here, not a whole solution, but at least something.

- Jill/Bella relationship... ahhh... i dont know... that needs some boiling up for now. If you choose Bella but dated Jill at the same time (aka Heartbroken Jill Route) its going down a potential threesome route or at least competing route here. So for that the Jill/Bella relationship will be important. Other than that? Why should the MC care? So its not something that will be touched now i think. And doesnt need to be touched for now. Iam curious, but its not something that matters that much for now.

- Priscilla at least needs an introduction i think. Maybe in the end at the episode... my guess? She is a Burgmeister.

- who really knocked up arieth... well, i couldnt care less, but it will be a baby with at least 9 heads. Lets face it, half the college could be the father. Fuck i only can rule out MC and derek so far :D But as ia said, i couldnt care less. And only a DNA test will clear this up. Buuuut.... well... for that it takes more or less 100 different tests? :D Dont think that will happen ;)

- cameras... we will not get a solution here, this is something that will be revealed near the end of the game. But of course, it has to be a huge topic in ep 10. and some actions have to take place to "secure" the dik house.

- exams and cheating... well... i always wondered... whats the point in the tests and so on? Will there ever be any consequences if you cheat, or fail? Only for that i made some playthorughs where i always cheated and one where i always failed... most of the time i used the walkthrough of course. And, i never played a single playthrough with minigames disabled, so... are there even any tests if you disable the minigames? OF course the midterm exam is a major choice, its always there. So yeah, it should be solved in ep 10 cause classes are starting again. So far i never saw any difference if i failed classes or were good in them, i didnt matter so far... which is a little disappointing.

- tybalt and his melon.... well... i couldnt care less, sorry, the whole character doesnt give me anything, not even to joke about. The only time i enjoyed something regarding Tybald in the game was during his presentation if you hit his teeth out and made a dick-pic beforehand. Thats about it. All the other times, i couldnt even laugh at him. Dawe is much more fun to mock. I need a tybalt break.
 

allanl9020142

Well-Known Member
Aug 23, 2018
1,309
2,091
Your post is very interesting, some people hate the freeroams since they either just want to skip to the lewds scenes (use the gallery) or hate repeating the same tasks many times (a fair complaint)

While it's true that repeating tasks on freeroams, specially in ones as big as the party in episode 9, gets tiring and boring after a few times they (freeroams) are a way to do different paths without having to make fully diferent paths.

If there wasn't any freeroams, every single path would demand specific scenes that while would be simpler to code, would demand more planing in writing, choosing assests, posing and rendering.

Updates are already talking a full year to make, imagine the wait times if DPC had that extra work, it would simply be too much.

Now, your suggestions aren't bad, if we had the option to skip those repeating tasks it would surely help people who want to see all paths.
I might be misinterpreting things but it seems like he's saying "Keep the big events that encompass all the branches instead of individual events with each branch, just lose the free roam part". So in this case, free roams aren't synonymous with those big events. It's more about the method on how to do them.

So instead of "Go get the sword" and clicking around to find it. It could just be "The party started: I found my sword, did this, did that." Then using conditional statements to have you jump to the corresponding path label and you go from there.

Although except for maybe the writing and choosing assets part, I'm still not entirely convinced it'd take that much longer for individual events. I think Halloween was an exception and he'll go back to smaller free roams/individual events with each branch in Ep 10.

I think a better solution would have been to just NOT make those mandatory tasks part of the free roam. It seems like that's people's main gripe. In some cases, free roams allow more freedom and flexibility in regards to optional tasks that can change the story a little. Otherwise, a menu would be popping up every minute like "Take picture with Riona: Yes or No", "Take picture with Quinn: Yes or No" all while being on someone else's path like Sage. Or his only other option would be to just skip all that variability entirely.
 

Joshy92

Devoted Member
Mar 25, 2021
11,738
26,516
The best thing about the poly relationship between me, Josy, Maya, Riona & Sage
Is the fact that we will all love each other equally
It won't be a harem because that implies a leader

We will all be together in a very loving & equal relationship
We will make every important decision as a family
 

DanMotta

Active Member
Dec 7, 2022
517
887
I like that many characters have their own agenda (some more than others), and that their whole world doesn't revolve around the mc. Knowing past relationships etc. does add to that mix of information. For players that have sided with Quinn, knowing that Vinny (finally one of the main antagonists) was her previous boyfriend, or at least that they fucked, does complicate things, in an interesting way. Will it matter? Don't know. But I like that it's there. We don't need every characters' entire sexual history, but there are some that could matter.
THE only virgin with no hint of having fucked anyone before mc IS Bella; That is a virgin woman lol. Who wants to play a game with virgin girls, All girls on college should fuck. I find it funny how men wants to belittle women based on their sex life. They have the rights to fuck as much as us and they have the right to have a past sexy life lol.

I prefer a woman with experience and who knows how to fuck than a woman who can't even give a proper blowjob.
 

allanl9020142

Well-Known Member
Aug 23, 2018
1,309
2,091
Ok, but if you don't want to have a boss, you still have to work in a way that attracts customers.

The assumption that if piracy didn't exist people here would be forced to pledge on Patreon is wrong.
Not with one year or more per episode and a minimum pledge of $5 that makes a minimum price of $60 per single episode, that is $600 for Episode 1 to 10 and what? At least $1000 for all the four seasons???

Come on!
Those prices are just for a few wealthy people. Regular people can't afford such an expense for a VN, not even for the best one.

With these monthly fees and this development speed (slowness), should he smack piracy down he just would remain with the same patreons he has today (minus those he bans) and he would not earn a cent more.
Eh, you could always just only pay for Patreon during the month the update releases. That's what I used to do. It's like what $25 once a year for part of a game? Easier on the wallet and still more than fair for the dev in my opinion.

Plus, it's not that I even care about the wait all that much anymore. I've grown kind of indifferent to it. I just want it to not suck when it does come out. Otherwise, just kind of feels like a lot of hot air and nothing of substance.

And to clarify, I don't think Ep 9 sucked that's not what I'm saying at all. I definitely didn't like it and I still dread the thought of replaying it but I didn't like Ep 8 more. It was just way too hyped up for what it was. Both before and after the release. The giant free roam was hell but what I didn't like more was that a lot of the relationships and story lines didn't progress that much or hit the pause button.

What I mean by "not sucking" is that I don't want the writing to get worse. Ep 8 lowered my expectations and Ep 9 more or less confirmed my lowered expectations. As long as it doesn't get any worse, I'll consider it a good update. I'm not going to McDonald's and expecting real chicken in my chicken nuggets. Same logic. Everyone's here thinking I'm complaining about Chick-Fil-A and being disappointed about not getting a steak. Nah, I'm talking about a lower standard entirely now. I'm just saying it's going to be a decent meal if I don't find a hair in my McChicken.

Maybe I shouldn't have said "not sucked". I probably should've said as long as it's "decent".
 

allanl9020142

Well-Known Member
Aug 23, 2018
1,309
2,091
That's what I'm saying though and I've got no qualms in saying it. :ROFLMAO:
I've more or less made my peace with it. Doesn't mean I want to play it again (even though I'll have to at some point) which makes me indifferent to Ep 10's release date since I still have the huge barrier of Ep 9 to hurdle over. But free McDonald's is free McDonald's. I'm not paying them Chick-Fil-A prices anymore. No, sir.
 

ZenoMod

Well-Known Member
Nov 12, 2022
1,163
1,441
I don't want to put words in Takkatakka 's mouth but it seems like his argument is that it's not a matter of HOW to do the big events that encompass all the characters. It's more that DPC uses the big events to cover all the possible branches without having to do it in different settings, choosing assets, etc for smaller, individual events. Like the water park with Maya and Josy or date restaurant date with Bella.

But what you're saying is that DPC could still do the big events rather than the individual events and it's just a matter of the method he uses, right? I'm just trying to make sure we're all on the same page here.
Yeah, exactly.

Episode 9 could be redone with exactly the same setting and using exactly the same renderings and dialogues.
Just avoiding the forced clicks to progress from Scene A to Scene B when those scene are obliged to progress in the game.

If I must to talk with Jamie, Sally, Rusty in order the story to progress, I'd prefere that the scenes representing those three dialogues comes automatically one after the other, not that I am forced to navigate the entire mansion to find where they are... This roaming looking for this or that character is not "free" roaming at all: it is actually a forced roaming because you must find the three characters and talk to them.

About the optional tasks in the phone, it would be better if "talk to X" were clickable and clicking it made the talking scene display, instead of forcing again another navigation in the mansion to find the character.

---

During the party many characters change room, which is cool... What is not cool is that the player during the party is forced to explore all the mansion (at least) three times just to find where DPC decided to place each character in this phase of the party.

That wouldn't be bothersome if it had to be done ONCE, but since to play all five main branches you have to do it FIVE TIMES plus many other times for the sub-branches... it's just uselessly booooring.

Remember we can START Episode 9 on 5 branches:
1) Sage
2) Bella
3) Jill
4) Josy & Maya
5) Others

and for each of these 5 main branches, Episode 9 gets more than one sub-branch according to the decisions made in Episode 9.

Besides you can be on each of the 5 main branches with different affinities (and this affects what you can or cannot choose in Episode 9), so even the 5 starting main branches actually has sub-branches themselves.

---

So if you want to see all the contents you have to play Episode 9 at least fifteen times if not more (I played it a few times and still I have some locked scene in the gallery)... and at each run having to explore the whole mansion three times just to look for characters and see mostly already seen contents il just boring.

Without freeroaming the same exact scenes would automatically come one after the other and so they would be automatically skippable via Tab key which would stop just at menus and if a new choice (or another save using as start of Episode 9) leads to new contents.

This way seeing all contents of all possible branches/sub-branches would be quicker and so more enjoyable.
 
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