VN Ren'Py Abandoned Bitch Squad [v0.4.7] [IcarusLabs]

[FatGiant]

I will bite...

I made a post about Ashley here:
https://f95zone.to/threads/bitch-squad-v0-3-0-icaruslabs.120056/post-9961678
with her motivations for her action from her POV.

You can think she is wrong, but she is definitely not irrational in her position.

I may agree with your analysis, but not with your conclusions. She will consciously betray the MC. She will tell Kate everything she knows, and may even try to get more info from Amber or Tommy. Whatever she may have been, she's now an enemy.

I do hope we can drop her, soon, the sooner the better.

So far I've been trying to play Mr. Nice Guy. That ends with this update. I may even go back and drop all these bitches. All those that the Dev will allow me to drop.

The characters are well crafted, enough to provoke strong feelings. In this case, profound distrust and in Annie case, pure HATE, after this update. Whatever else happens in the story in the future I don't want to have anything to do with Ashley, Annie and Amber. When given the promised chance to destroy one of the B5, I will go for Annie. I hope it is really a destruction.

Peace

 

[AL.d]

As a fellow player that also loves the game I would say that your outlook is maybe overly pessimistic.

I read the "I know" differently then you. Apart from it being a Star War reference to Han Solo's reply to Princess Lyia that I found quite funny. It's almost an acknowledgement or acceptance of his love that she previously knowingly repressed.

I would just say the following: Trust the developer that so far has delivered an excellent game.

Our emotions go through ups and downs, but the truth is that the game is not even halfway through (3 out of a possible 8 chapters).

I understand wanting to give the MC a win (and to be fair, he already had some small victories), but I would argue, the victory is so much sweeter after a hard-won battle (towards the end of the 8 chapters).

It's like reading a "A song of Ice and Fire" All the heartache, makes the victories so much sweeter when they occur, but the road to victory should be difficult.

So my advice would be to trust the developer to write his story.

For me it's not really matter of giving him a "win". I just want him to have consistent characterization. Because all the NPCs do (game's strong point). When I have picked every choice that has him balls deep in the revenge path, it doesn't make sense to keep leaving himself open for further backstabbing. His plan should take priority over anything else. He can't be allowing a possible trojan horse like Ashley or Annie close to him. He can't (kinda) rape Emma to show some sort of completely off-character "alpha-ness". We are talking about Kate's best friend, the mastermind rival and leader of college "metoo" movement. Who could convince any committee/court with her magical charm powers. He practically invited them to fuck him over with impunity whenever they want.

He has those moments where he goes from 0(doormat) to 100 (macho dom/rapist) but they seem completely random and unearned. I actually disagree with other posters who thought his behavior towards Kate's father was passive. It's probably one of the few times he actually behaved like a normal sane person.

 

[HentaiKami]

The start doesn't make much sense.... Does MC really own only the cloths he is wearing? He can just pick a new set from his closet, but no.... he's gonna run naked through the living room where a bunch of girls are, only for Emma to take photos, so he can complain about how they totally humiliated him...

You might have missed or skipped the mention that it was the guest room, not MC's room. So there wouldn't be any clothes there, though MC is an idiot in that sense, that he doesn't take the blanket and just wrap it over himself.

 

[hysepReC]

I will bite...

I made a post about Ashley here:
https://f95zone.to/threads/bitch-squad-v0-3-0-icaruslabs.120056/post-9961678
with her motivations for her action from her POV.

You can think she is wrong, but she is definitely not irrational in her position.

You are forgetting:

• The MC's nudes were leaked for a second time and Ashley was there when it happened. Kate and her gang are obviously prime suspects.
• She was under Kate's spell and started hanging out with her before any kind of "reconciliation" happened. I understand Kate is a very charismatic person but one speech is enough for Ashley to take her side over the guy she is supposed to have deep feelings for? C'mon...
• She hides the fact that she's been hanging out with Kate from the MC so she's already lying to him (at the cabin she tells him she doesn't really know Kate when the MC asks her)

This feels like the Annie situation all over again. She even tries to reduce the MC's experience in school as "one bad night gone wrong". When the MC first told her what happened to him, she was angry but now it's like she doesn't even care what he went through and Kate's message is more important than her boyfriend's feelings.

It's frustrating because i want to like Ashley, she's one of the few viable romance options in this game but she's not making it easy.

 

[CaballeroOne]

I will bite...

I made a post about Ashley here:
https://f95zone.to/threads/bitch-squad-v0-3-0-icaruslabs.120056/post-9961678
with her motivations for her action from her POV.

You can think she is wrong, but she is definitely not irrational in her position.

IcarusLabs made very clear that Ashley is a "valley-farm girl". Even her father has stated: "You, my dear princess, are not yet ready to face the cruel and harsh world of the city and its temptations, its bad people, its selfish people".

It is true.
Is she naive? Is she a "golden heart" girl? Is she a girl raised in traditional family values? YES.
So, in the story it is coherent that she is "easy" prey for demagogues and unscrupulous people like Kate, a true sociopath.

Now, if the pretty blonde is in relationship (gf/bf) with MC, I foresee an even rougher conflict between the main character and Kate, because there are feelings between Ashley and MC.

To me, it is very simplistic to say: "Ashley is a traitor, an evil gf". No. She (a "valley girl") doesn't know the "real" Kate, she only knows the appearances of this dangerous demagogue and manipulator.

The fable, IMHO, is like this: the old story between the political Fox and the naïve Sheep.

I love how IcarusLabs builds the story, the subplots and its characters.

Keep up the damn good job!

 

[vogelbeest]

You might have missed or skipped the mention that it was the guest room, not MC's room. So there wouldn't be any clothes there, though MC is an idiot in that sense, that he doesn't take the blanket and just wrap it over himself.

Yeah, saw that later, still doesn't really change much to be honest, even if his own room is downstairs, there should be more rooms upstairs besides the guest room... There really is no reason to assume there's absolutely no clothes available in any other room there, his fathers or his sisters or even just something like a big towel, he could even have taken some sheets of one of the beds... But no, he brings a silly little cushion.

I can understand something like that happening within a setup in a humorous game setting, or it being a dare or whatever and not knowing the livingroom was full of girls... Something like that... But the scene isn't really presented as funny now...
And saying it was due to panic seems off too, he has reasons to feel embarrassed or angry but why panic in such a way he runs off into the danger instead of running away from it?

 

[HentaiKami]

Yeah, saw that later, still doesn't really change much to be honest, even if his own room is downstairs, there should be more rooms upstairs besides the guest room... There really is no reason to assume there's absolutely no clothes available in any other room there, his fathers or his sisters or even just something like a big towel, he could even have taken some sheets of one of the beds... But no, he brings a silly little cushion.

I can understand something like that happening within a setup in a humorous game setting, or it being a dare or whatever and not knowing the livingroom was full of girls... Something like that... But the scene isn't really presented as funny now...
And saying it was due to panic seems off too, he has reasons to feel embarrassed or angry but why panic in such a way he runs off into the danger instead of running away from it?

Iirc the BS were outside of the room pretty much, so if MC didn't want to stay in the room for rest of the night, he would have to have gone through the room with the girls.

 

[vogelbeest]

Iirc the BS were outside of the room pretty much, so if MC didn't want to stay in the room for rest of the night, he would have to have gone through the room with the girls.

The girls were downstairs, he was upstairs, perhaps at one point he needed to go through the room with the girls, but he must have had plenty of options available to do it with some dignity and still chose to go down the stairs, open a door into the room with the girls and run through naked to get to his room... It's just weird lol...

 

[risky0]

Good questions! Answers below, thanks for asking!

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I'm not a vengeful person, I just want justice.
It doesn't fit my sense of justice to sexually abuse Kate and Emma. (disgusting)
What the game gives me on the way to revenge is things like hate sex.
In short, I want them to experience what we experienced throughout the year.
My main enemy is Emma, she's the one who got me into all this shit.
One thing I noticed when we raped Emma is that her stats are progressing positively, is this a mistake? (friend)
I want her to hate me as much as possible.

Now that I'm done with Sarah, I just want to see her humiliated more and more by other people throughout the year.
Things change if she's responsible for the re-leaking of the pictures, as you implied.

Amber is the perfect partner for Mc, but you screwed her up.
You've suddenly turned her into a crazy domiratrix lesbian.
And then you let your heart suddenly soften again.
Do you think such a sudden rise and fall makes sense?

Whatever Ashley finds out among the bitches, she's just another character you ruined for betraying your trust and going behind our backs.
No need to talk about Ashley, she's an idiot.

Annie pretends to be a hurt girl, but she's not afraid to ruin innocent girls' lives for her friends and proudly tell you this.
You're implying that you didn't know your friends were responsible for the leaked photos in high school.
Has this stupid girl forgotten who took the pictures?

A word from Kate made me think a lot.
She said we used to be a fun toy for her.
She admitted that she was partially responsible for what happened to us in high school.

Seeking justice does not mean being the bad guy, please keep that in mind.

Annie and Sarah must first admit how bad what they did was and feel guilty.
On our side they must fight against Emma, Kate and Charlotte.
It's the only way out for them I can find.

I agree with everything other people have said about Mc's character.
There's a potential killer in front of you and you suddenly start talking like you have 50 tons of balls.
Really?

 

[Alfius]

You are forgetting:

• The MC's nudes were leaked for a second time and Ashley was there when it happened. Kate and her gang are obviously prime suspects.
• She was under Kate's spell and started hanging out with her before any kind of "reconciliation" happened. I understand Kate is a very charismatic person but one speech is enough for Ashley to take her side over the guy she is supposed to have deep feelings for? C'mon...
• She hides the fact that she's been hanging out with Kate from the MC so she's already lying to him (at the cabin she tells him she doesn't really know Kate when the MC asks her)

This feels like the Annie situation all over again. She even tries to reduce the MC's experience in school as "one bad night gone wrong". When the MC first told her what happened to him, she was angry but now it's like she doesn't even care what he went through and Kate's message is more important than her boyfriend's feelings.

It's frustrating because i want to like Ashley, she's one of the few viable romance options in this game but she's not making it easy.

OK, Lets go for this analogy:

You HysaepREc, have a friend John that told you about his arch nemesis from school Peter that constantly bullied him.

You fly back home on a business trip and start chatting to the passenger next to you and have a pleasant chat.
Halfway into the trip you find out that his name is Peter and after a bit of interrogation you find out he is The Peter that John told you about. You confront him on John's behalf, and he tells you how much he regrets his behaviour during high school.
You have a really pleasant conversation with him for the rest of the trip where he shows you the pictures of his wife and kids.

You land at the airport, John picks you up and run into you and Peter. Peter greets him and tells John how he started a new chapter in his life. You mentions the past and John tells you it's ancient history and all in the past now.

The next week you and John started chatting and John tells you how he still hates Peter.

Well... You kind of feel in the middle. Your perception of Peter is that he is quite a pleasant guy. John is still your best friend, but you are feeling that he is maybe holding onto this grudge for too long. It's not good for him.


This is Ashley's position. Ashley wanting you to reconcile with members of the BS is totally in character for Ashley. She's been pushing for this since the MC met her (With Sarah and Annie). It's not that Ashley is choosing Kate over the MC. It's that she wants the MC to move on and from her POV, the MC has an irrational grudge against Kate. She is also riled up when the MC want her to not see Kate anymore. No one wants to be controlled like that and be told by their boyfriend/mother etc. who they can and cannot be friends with.

Of course, you are allowed to hate Ashley, and it might very well turn out that she totally betrays you, but I can see her POV and are giving her the benefit of the doubt.
BTW, the MC and his friends are also doing some pretty nasty stuff. Their hands are not clean. Ashley is much purer then either the MC and his friends or the BS. (If she finds out the MC leaked Sarah's photo, she will pretty much freak out and possible dump him). The only redeeming thing going for the MC and his gang, is that anything they have done so far, the BS have done ten times worse.

 

[hysepReC]

OK, Lets go for this analogy:

You HysaepREc, have a friend John that told you about his arch nemesis from school Peter that constantly bullied him.

You fly back home on a business trip and start chatting to the passenger next to you and have a pleasant chat.
Halfway into the trip you find out that his name is Peter and after a bit of interrogation you find out he is The Peter that John told you about. You confront him on John's behalf, and he tells you how much he regrets his behaviour during high school.
You have a really pleasant conversation with him for the rest of the trip where he shows you the pictures of his wife and kids.

I might be remembering wrong but i don't think this is how it happened. Ashley knew who Kate was and what she did before ever meeting her. She knows Kate is manipulative (she tricked the MC) and is still so easily swayed. Also, i don't remember Kate ever apologising or saying she regrets her behavior, just that she wants to move past it. This is a common theme with the bitch squad, they never actually apologise to the MC and just want him to get over it.

Well... You kind of feel in the middle. Your perception of Peter is that he is quite a pleasant guy. John is still your best friend, but you are feeling that he is maybe holding onto this grudge for too long. It's not good for him.

This is Ashley's position. Ashley wanting you to reconcile with members of the BS is totally in character for Ashley. She's been pushing for this since the MC met her (With Sarah and Annie). It's not that Ashley is choosing Kate over the MC.

I disagree. Ashley defends Kate during the argument in the cabin and hangs out with her behind the MC's back despite knowing he hates her, she's already well on her way to choosing Kate over him. Now that Kate knows that Ashley & MC are dating, she will use Ashley as a pawn who will be too stupid to realise she's being manipulated. Ashley wanting MC to make peace with Sarah and Annie is a bit different to Kate because she was actively involved in what happened to the MC.

BTW, the MC and his friends are also doing some pretty nasty stuff. Their hands are not clean. Ashley is much purer then either the MC and his friends or the BS. (If she finds out the MC leaked Sarah's photo, she will pretty much freak out and possible dump him). The only redeeming thing going for the MC and his gang, is that anything they have done so far, the BS have done ten times worse.

Well, i can't deny that. The MC is no angel himself, especially if you choose to go full revenge and sexually exploit/abuse Kate or Emma. I'm just saying that i think Ashley is acting like a shitty girlfriend. She should be taking MC's side even if she doesn't fully agree with him and she definitely shouldn't be going behind his back and hanging out with his enemy.

 

[pablo.1297]

OK, Lets go for this analogy:

You HysaepREc, have a friend John that told you about his arch nemesis from school Peter that constantly bullied him.

You fly back home on a business trip and start chatting to the passenger next to you and have a pleasant chat.
Halfway into the trip you find out that his name is Peter and after a bit of interrogation you find out he is The Peter that John told you about. You confront him on John's behalf, and he tells you how much he regrets his behaviour during high school.
You have a really pleasant conversation with him for the rest of the trip where he shows you the pictures of his wife and kids.

You land at the airport, John picks you up and run into you and Peter. Peter greets him and tells John how he started a new chapter in his life. You mentions the past and John tells you it's ancient history and all in the past now.

The next week you and John started chatting and John tells you how he still hates Peter.

Well... You kind of feel in the middle. Your perception of Peter is that he is quite a pleasant guy. John is still your best friend, but you are feeling that he is maybe holding onto this grudge for too long. It's not good for him.


This is Ashley's position. Ashley wanting you to reconcile with members of the BS is totally in character for Ashley. She's been pushing for this since the MC met her (With Sarah and Annie). It's not that Ashley is choosing Kate over the MC. It's that she wants the MC to move on and from her POV, the MC has an irrational grudge against Kate. She is also riled up when the MC want her to not see Kate anymore. No one wants to be controlled like that and be told by their boyfriend/mother etc. who they can and cannot be friends with.

Of course, you are allowed to hate Ashley, and it might very well turn out that she totally betrays you, but I can see her POV and are giving her the benefit of the doubt.
BTW, the MC and his friends are also doing some pretty nasty stuff. Their hands are not clean. Ashley is much purer then either the MC and his friends or the BS. (If she finds out the MC leaked Sarah's photo, she will pretty much freak out and possible dump him). The only redeeming thing going for the MC and his gang, is that anything they have done so far, the BS have done ten times worse.

Very good analogy, except peter didn't relive past traumas or tell her how much fun she had playing with him, just like kate's bitch did, okay there's still no one to blame for the photo. But they triggered that shit in the past and the poor guy is haunted by it a fucking year later. Ashley saw this, how they laughed at the mc. Honestly if a friend goes and befriends the guy you hate after telling him all the shit he did to you and is still haunting you today, that friend is a piece of shit.

 

[AL.d]

This is Ashley's position. Ashley wanting you to reconcile with members of the BS is totally in character for Ashley. She's been pushing for this since the MC met her (With Sarah and Annie). It's not that Ashley is choosing Kate over the MC. It's that she wants the MC to move on and from her POV, the MC has an irrational grudge against Kate. She is also riled up when the MC want her to not see Kate anymore. No one wants to be controlled like that and be told by their boyfriend/mother etc. who they can and cannot be friends with.

Erm...she did choose though. Unless I am mistaken, she knows everything that happened between MC and the squad. Given that knowledge, there are only two options. If she believes everything that he told her about the past (and with three people saying the same, she should), there is nothing irrational about the grudge. And she actually saw it herself during the second pic leak. What is irrational, is to befriend the people who did all that and think your boyfriend would be fine with it. The other option is that she didn't fully believe everything he (and the other two) told her. Then she shouldn't have been in a relationship with that obsessed liar in the first place! The game doesn't clarify which of the two is her perspective.

I really don't see how it's not a clear and conscious choice of a "camp". It doesn't matter if she ends up compromising his plan or not. Her aproaching Kate's camp is already a betrayal given the knowldege she has. And a dangerous loose end for a revenge-led MC.

 

[Alfius]

Maybe your guys are right about Ashley, it was not the way I perceived it during my playthrough.

I will do another playthrough specifically observing everything from Ashley's POV.

 

[CrazyRabbit]

I think it's way more simple for Ashley ; she did believe everything MC and cie told her but here's the thing : Kate talks really well and, objectively, has a good message.
Helping opressed girls and women, it's a good thing and she sells it really good.

But why does Ashley join her despite what our 3 stooges told her ?
She's gullible as fuck and optimistic to a fault. Remember, she's been advocating on letting go of the revenge since the start ("living good is the best revenge" she said)
With this configuration on that naïve farmgirl, Kate has no problem recruiting and befriending her.

I also do believe that Kate genuinely believes in her cause ; the problem is how many innocent she'll crush without a second thought to get to it.

The real problem (at least to me) with Ashley is that she did all this "undercover" and fails to take into account her boyfriend's feelings (just like Annie) ; she knows what MC, Amber and Tommy had to endure but since the cause is justified, since she is a supreme idealist with naïveté on top and since she believes in "letting bygones be bygones" then she goes to Kate.

She's free to do so, even with my blessing if she just did it in plain view and acknowledging both that Kate isn't a saint and that it's a dick move to MC.

"I know you hate her and that she's a manipulative bitch, but this cause I believe in and I want to contribute. Don't worry, I won't betray you nor will I be friend with a person like her"
There, that's all I needed.
But she didn't. So Ashley goes bye-bye.

Edit : So I do hope we'll have the option of breaking up with her

 

[WastedTalent]

OK, so let me take myself out of it. (I only did that, since people claimed the MC was stupid and no one would act like it)

So my view on Ashley is this.
1) They genuinely fell for each other. (I don't think anyone disputes that)

2) Kate is a pretty exceptional individual. (There are plenty of evidence for this. Loyalty of the BS. The ability of her as a first year to be able to worm her into all kinds of positions of power, did not fall into her lap. She is truly exceptional and a manages to get enormous loyalty from her followers. She is clearly a VERY good public and private speaker and manages to awe people.)

3) Even though Ashley knows about Kate's history with her BF (our MC), she was clearly impressed with Kate's speech and horrified at what the sorority did. So ideologically, she was on the side of Kate. We knew from previous interactions with Sarah, that she is also for giving people a second chance and wants to see for herself if someone is good or bad. That is exactly what she did, and in her judgement, Kate turned a new leaf and is now a good person.

4) Ashley is obviously a naive girl from a small town that believe in the good of people and I think is one of the reasons she likes the mc. She constantly pushes the MC towards reconciliation with Annie, Sarah and now Kate.

5) The fight between the MC and Ashley is 100% spot on. He tells her that she (Kate) is a bad person, but she has just been seeing the opposite at this stage and the MC comes off as petty and vindictive, especially considering that she is under the impression that the MC and Kate have agreed to be civil going forward.

The MC is just anormal guy, being in shit way over his head, trying to stop Kate.
So there! None of my own projection on any of the characters.

Now I would like to know what you wanted the MC to do differently given the following objectives:
1) He wants to enjoy his college life as far as possible.
2) He wants to stop Kate with whatever it is she is planning.
3) He wants the BS to stop bullying anyone in Future again by any means necessary.

And then I will give my re-buffs to your arguments.

Are those the only 3 choices?

 

[robrize2169]

so i have been replaying from the start to change some of my choices and using the mod available i have chosen to see scenes i didn't see before. including Amber dominating Charlotte..MC throat fucking Kate etc. currently at the scene where Emma tries to force MC to jerk off for her. but then he turns the tables on her and dominates her..and she likes it. so. the ch 3 scene where he dominates her and fucks her doggystyle seems more to me like she is shocked by him turning her into a submissive where when she is used to dominating men into doing what she wants. seems to me, going forward, Emma will become MC's submissive whore and he will fuck her anytime he wants, and she will love it. but i think she will keep it to herself. perfect revenge on her for MC imo. as for the others, Icarus posted that 1 of the girls will receive a healthy dose of revenge in ch 4. so. the choice will be ours to choose. and since Annie is the one i despise most next to Emma, Annie will be next on my hit list. as much as i dislike the way the MC was portrayed in the early chapters, i love the revenge route he takes..even though he is too nice to Sarah and Annie so far, revenge will come..and i think in further chapters we will end up finding out that Kate's father murdered Miranda's husband and we will help her prove it and topple daddy dearest and really get some nice revenge on Kate when she finds out her perfect daddy is a killer. just my theory.

 

[Dazzier31]

It's interesting, having just played the game from start to the end of 0.2.5, how you can already see the seeds of what everyone else confirmed for me here: Ashley will be on Kate's side.

You can see it from the moment the Kappa Kai speech happens and she starts clapping, that moment is the one that told me that she was not gonna be a viable option anymore, shame too because I remember fondly her cascade of escalating "No!" when MC tells her what they did.

I am pretty fine with going cold turkey on the traitor. (Also possible interesting bit of foreshadowing that may not be intentional: right after the leaked photos switch and MC is discussing with Tommy and Amber, the moment Tommy mentions that someone had to have warned them, Ashley enters the room. I am not saying she gave them the warning, she didn't know, but I am saying that that was some good foreshadowing that if someone was gonna be a traitor, it was gonna be her.)

Something that could be done to convince MC to stop being so passive, at least towards people who aren't in the B5, is to have a talk with his dad. Dad opening the son's eyes to how the situation is really looking from an outside perspective would be nice ("Son, you are telling me that your girlfriend is being chummy with the girl that ruined your life for the last year and wants you to play nice with her? You know what must be done.")... and yes, this is just an excuse because I am actually kind of interested in how the dad, who is also rich and can be helpful in getting MC involved in the B5 circles to understand their plans better, can join the story.

 

[robrize2169]

i agree on the take on Ashley..if the MC breaks up with her. i hope that a different path will open if she remains your gf. something along the lines of..now i can see if bf is being paranoid or he is really right about Kate trying to manipulate her. if she sees that she is being manipulated then she would be a good ally for mc. however, if MC breaks up with her, then she has no reason to be loyal to him. but she may still find out he was not wrong after all..so many possiblities. can't wait for the next chapter.

 

[drifter139]

It's interesting, having just played the game from start to the end of 0.2.5, how you can already see the seeds of what everyone else confirmed for me here: Ashley will be on Kate's side.

You can see it from the moment the Kappa Kai speech happens and she starts clapping, that moment is the one that told me that she was not gonna be a viable option anymore, shame too because I remember fondly her cascade of escalating "No!" when MC tells her what they did.

I am pretty fine with going cold turkey on the traitor. (Also possible interesting bit of foreshadowing that may not be intentional: right after the leaked photos switch and MC is discussing with Tommy and Amber, the moment Tommy mentions that someone had to have warned them, Ashley enters the room. I am not saying she gave them the warning, she didn't know, but I am saying that that was some good foreshadowing that if someone was gonna be a traitor, it was gonna be her.)

Something that could be done to convince MC to stop being so passive, at least towards people who aren't in the B5, is to have a talk with his dad. Dad opening the son's eyes to how the situation is really looking from an outside perspective would be nice ("Son, you are telling me that your girlfriend is being chummy with the girl that ruined your life for the last year and wants you to play nice with her? You know what must be done.")... and yes, this is just an excuse because I am actually kind of interested in how the dad, who is also rich and can be helpful in getting MC involved in the B5 circles to understand their plans better, can join the story.

if you go back and look at what MC says, his dad's business didn't really take off till MC was in high school. we can also assume that Ashley is easily manipulated and will likely turn against MC for what the B5 tell her going as far as to say that MC was the bully and they were innocent victims until they decided to stop him in high school. bullies like them have a gift for turning others against their victims and painting the narrative of "they aren't as nice as the pretend to be". but only dev knows how this all will turn out so we have to be patient in waiting for the end