4.60 star(s) 308 Votes

Smarmint

Well-Known Member
Mar 23, 2019
1,254
4,911
Nobody can ever say what percentage of subscribers for Chasing Sunsets, and other games, are due to exposure on F95. It could be 20% it could be 70%. Unless you do an experiment with the same game, with different title, and promote one on F95 and somehow keep one from showing up here, and analyze the difference after 2 years, nobody will ever know.

My sense, is that F95 serves to give a game a lot of initial publicity, an initial batch of subscribers and leads to word of mouth, and then it shows up on other adult gaming news sites, fans start talking about it on other social media after playing it from here, and after it gets big enough, by then maybe it accounts for a smaller and smaller percentage of new subscribers. Certainly all of the dozens of games I've supported over the years, every one, accept for a single game, I found out from here. Even 5 users from here a month is money the dev didn't have before. It certainly isn't zero.

Many devs would disagree, I am sure, but if games were never here or other gaming download sites, there would be a lot less people willing to pledge on Patreon. If the only way to play a game from start to finish is to pledge hundreds of dollars per game (plus with no certainty it will ever be completed), very few people would do that.

I personally think Stone Fox is burning his bridges by staying away. I only support devs that have a good attitude and are willing to interact with the community. There are 20 or 30 games here I really, really, like, and I have to pick which ones I think deserve the most support. If a dev seems like a cool approachable person, can take constructive criticism, and enjoys shooting the shit with his fans, even those who don't subscribe, it gives me a good feeling about supporting them.

Devs that are prickly with criticism, complain about their fans, and nitpick when their games show up here, and are upset when fans give help when they are stuck in their games, they could have the greatest game ever, but they don't get my support. I'd rather support a dev with a rough around the edges game, with imperfections, but the dev really has heart and passion about what they do, and seems chill with the fans. I think a lot of supporters here share this general philosophy.

Walter Victor is a stand up guy, that always tries to help the community. If you've been here awhile and seen him on other threads, you know what I mean. Maybe he bent protocol a bit, but he was just trying to help the fans here by posting a bugfix that wasn't available otherwise. For Stone Fox to make that some kind of unforgivable sin, well, he was looking for a reason.

I appreciate Stone Fox and team for his excellent game. One of the best, in my opinion. But for better or worse, creative types can be a prickly bunch.
 
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RNasc4444

Active Member
Aug 16, 2022
777
3,064
Would you like to see my Steam library? The only thing there that wasn't pirated first is Half-Life 1&2, because I was able to add my original CD keys. Been burned too many times. When I have money, good works get rewarded.
Good to know I'm not the only one. That's my MO for every game. My very first AVN was Melody, took me like 3 months to finish but I enjoyed it quite a bit. First thing I did after finishing it was to buy it to support Mr Dots as it was worth my money. Been doing it ever since. I don't think I ever installed any of the AVN's I bought on steam. I just keep them hidden in my library.
 
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DirtyMario

Jumping bitches since '85
Donor
Jul 19, 2017
1,266
4,118
I don't think I ever installed any of the AVN's I bought on steam. I just keep them hidden in my library.
Naturally. The people I play CS with (many of them RL friends) don't need to know I read AVNs.
That's the same level of not giving a fuck as the people that promote their favourite porn stars on Facebook or Twitter, where friends & family can see it. I'm gone but I'm not quite that far gone yet.

Anyways I hope Stone Fox Studios doesn't waste too much time on convoluted counter measures because that will most certainly do nothing, as the multi billion dollar video game industry can tell you.
 

bozoplace

Active Member
Dec 7, 2019
539
411
So......

Any talk regarding this game?

thoughts.............................

50 to 500 words here is just banter
 

Francis Blast

Newbie
Feb 2, 2018
88
197
Would you like to see my Steam library? The only thing there that wasn't pirated first is Half-Life 1&2, because I was able to add my original CD keys. Been burned too many times. When I have money, good works get rewarded.
Why would it be relevant? No one doubted that some supporters originated from here. And the fact that you paid for Chasing Sunsets doesn't make the idea that 90 % of their support comes from f95 less laughable.
 
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Ilhares

Engaged Member
Aug 19, 2019
2,924
11,189
Why would it be relevant? No one doubted that some supporters originated from here. And the fact that you paid for Chasing Sunsets doesn't make the idea that 90 % of their support comes from f95 less laughable.
It would be relevant because you made it so. You said the 'virtuous pirate' argument was crap and wanted proof. I asked if you wanted to see my library as evidence. There was nothing in your post about any specific percentage of this particular game's fans or patronage.

A lot of people go in for piracy first these days. I absolutely don't purchase everything I've pirated, just the stuff that is worth it due to actually being of interest to me. Hell, I've got Stellaris on both GOG and Steam as a result (admittedly, it was on sale). I used to play the shit out of that one, it was definitely worth the money for my time invested.

My statement was, however, factually incorrect. I do have a few games that were gifted to me, like Cyberpunk and the latest Battlefield, which I had refused to spend my own money on for any reason.

For a game like CS, I'd really rather just walk up to SFS and hand them cash in hand. Screw the taxes and nonsense, just put money right into their hands/pockets. I could skip 40% of the game's content(characters) so far and still be rather satisfied with it, I think. They've done a great job. I'm looking forward to what else they have in store.
 

Ilhares

Engaged Member
Aug 19, 2019
2,924
11,189
Can't say I'm surprised grandpa. :illuminati:
To quote Firefly, "I never married."

I don't mind younger, I just don't find her attractive to look at (facially). Body's nice. Admittedly, part of it may be due to my age - because I consider consequences, something I rarely did when I was a hormonal 16-year old. Knock up the mother? No big deal. She's pretty, and she's already got the family thing going on, she'll probably reconnect with her husband, no big deal.

Knock up the daughter? Great. Now I might have an ugly kid, and an unattractive wife who gets too clingy. Hard pass, friend!
(Jaye, on the other hand, well.. I'm willing to ruin my future for her)
 

Francis Blast

Newbie
Feb 2, 2018
88
197
It would be relevant because you made it so. You said the 'virtuous pirate' argument was crap and wanted proof. I asked if you wanted to see my library as evidence. There was nothing in your post about any specific percentage of this particular game's fans or patronage.

A lot of people go in for piracy first these days. I absolutely don't purchase everything I've pirated, just the stuff that is worth it due to actually being of interest to me. Hell, I've got Stellaris on both GOG and Steam as a result (admittedly, it was on sale). I used to play the shit out of that one, it was definitely worth the money for my time invested.

My statement was, however, factually incorrect. I do have a few games that were gifted to me, like Cyberpunk and the latest Battlefield, which I had refused to spend my own money on for any reason.

For a game like CS, I'd really rather just walk up to SFS and hand them cash in hand. Screw the taxes and nonsense, just put money right into their hands/pockets. I could skip 40% of the game's content(characters) so far and still be rather satisfied with it, I think. They've done a great job. I'm looking forward to what else they have in store.

I guess this is a misunderstanding.
The virtuous pirate argument applies to the idea that the majority of Stonefox supporters come from this very forum.

I don't care that you did buy the came. As mentioned, it was never denied that some of us indeed paid for it.

I'm a pirate. I paid for Chasing Sunset. Stonefox doesn't owe me anything for that. I'm still a fucking thief. We all are. It's not because something is crap that you have the right to steal it. Nothing you can say will change that.

So, yeah, I wasn't talking about you but about the whole "Devs owe us, we're helping them by stealing their game" argument and this kind of post in particular :

https://f95zone.to/threads/chasing-sunsets-v0-7a-stone-fox-studios.62625/post-9318576
 

DirtyMario

Jumping bitches since '85
Donor
Jul 19, 2017
1,266
4,118
Knock up the daughter? Great. Now I might have an ugly kid, and an unattractive wife who gets too clingy. Hard pass, friend!
(Jaye, on the other hand, well.. I'm willing to ruin my future for her)
No matter if mother or daughter, safe to say the ugly genes would come from my side :HideThePain:

Didn't go for the daughter either but it's not a superficial thing, I think she's pretty cute. It was kind of a rushed introduction and I don't know her well enough to be sure about her motives, with the whole "nut inside" thing and all.
Cucking her dad is always the preferred option in any case.
 

Ilhares

Engaged Member
Aug 19, 2019
2,924
11,189
I'm a pirate. I paid for Chasing Sunset. Stonefox doesn't owe me anything for that. I'm still a fucking thief. We all are.

It's not because something is crap that you have the right to steal it. Nothing you can say will change that.
Software/Movie Piracy is not theft.

Nobody has lost something as a result of my piracy (well, okay, a few bytes of bandwidth here and there, but I pay for that anyway). This is a false argument. It's like movie studios claiming they lose billions to piracy. No, they don't. They just didn't earn as much as they wanted to. This is part of the system they use to completely screw the people who made/own the movie (and music, for that matter) out of money, because of "no net profits" and the like, after you account for advertising, distribution, etc.

There are laws that govern against what I do, but if it were theft, they'd hit me for grand larceny, not copyright infrigement. And they do it on the copyright side of things specifically because it is not theft. In a world where replication of everything has virtually zero impact (zero production cost, zero distribution cost), you cannot really claim losses due to 'theft', because it in no way diminishes the original. All those actors and stage hands have already been paid.

Granted, if I don't pay SFS for their game, they would have a diminished income as a result, but I have committed no thievery.
So, yeah, I wasn't talking about you but about the whole "Devs owe us, we're helping them by stealing their game" argument and this kind of post in particular :

https://f95zone.to/threads/chasing-sunsets-v0-7a-stone-fox-studios.62625/post-9318576
I can't argue with you on that - whether I bought something or not, they don't *owe* me anything, beyond what I got when I paid for it. I made that decision based on what was seen, not a nebulous promise of what's to come in the future (which is why I don't do pre-order nonsense).

And one day, hopefully soon, I'll not be living in my car again, and I'll have even more disposable income to pass around to these guys for a bit. I know I certainly feel indebted to our boy RPDL for at least a couple hundred so far, he's really stepped up and filled that NOPY absence that F95 relies so heavily upon.
 

Francis Blast

Newbie
Feb 2, 2018
88
197
Software/Movie Piracy is not theft.

Nobody has lost something as a result of my piracy (well, okay, a few bytes of bandwidth here and there, but I pay for that anyway). This is a false argument. It's like movie studios claiming they lose billions to piracy. No, they don't. They just didn't earn as much as they wanted to. This is part of the system they use to completely screw the people who made/own the movie (and music, for that matter) out of money, because of "no net profits" and the like, after you account for advertising, distribution, etc.

There are laws that govern against what I do, but if it were theft, they'd hit me for grand larceny, not copyright infrigement. And they do it on the copyright side of things specifically because it is not theft. In a world where replication of everything has virtually zero impact (zero production cost, zero distribution cost), you cannot really claim losses due to 'theft', because it in no way diminishes the original. All those actors and stage hands have already been paid.

Granted, if I don't pay SFS for their game, they would have a diminished income as a result, but I have committed no thievery.
I can't argue with you on that - whether I bought something or not, they don't *owe* me anything, beyond what I got when I paid for it. I made that decision based on what was seen, not a nebulous promise of what's to come in the future (which is why I don't do pre-order nonsense).
Let's agree to disagree.
You download and use for free a product that is not free.

You can argue as much as you want, but this isn't right. You have to accept it.
If anyone thinks it's right or that they are justified to do so, they are wrong.

And yes, I'm doing it myself, I'm a piece of shit, and I made my peace with that.

Hey, you two, could you discuss this via private messages, please? Or maybe in another thread with this specific topic?
Not without dinner first, at the very least.
But I'm done. This discussion is pointless and tiresome.
 
4.60 star(s) 308 Votes