So loop 3 isn't going quite how I wanted... But I'm making do. The superior Chosen that's shown up is the remaining member from loop 1. Sadly, they had 3 Tier 2 breaks so I had no ability to get them on a Distortion Path... But! I have been doing well at driving a wedge between all of the Chosen. I have a different one on the Tempt path, and the last day I played through ended with a 15 turn orgy that I cut short after 3 turns for 7 extra EE, seeing how I had generated enough Trauma to get 1 Tier 3 break on each of my Chosen. Now its about maximizing efficiency to get them ready for Tier 4 breaks. I think I'm gonna try and focus on getting Hypnosis breaks specifically. Two of them are at Tier 3 Deviancy((?) I don't remember if that's what that vulnerability is called) and the other, I believe it's Mayhem the Superior Chosen, has a Tier 3 Dignity break. Devotion is geared for both Hypnosis and Parasitism so I don't actually need a commander body for it, either. Unfortunately Tyrant isn't performing as well as I had hoped, but that might be due to lack of expertise gained so far. A synthesis commander was more effective. Oh, and I've gotten good EE rewards from both the Interview and the "Vacation" so I'm feeling pretty good about this loop so far.
Java Corrupted Saviors [Release 58] [CSDev]
- Mar 7, 2019
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I actually haven't had the chance to play lately. Went to play some regular games but I'll come back around to this eventually! This game fries my brain a bit with the strategizing and early/mid game planning so it's actually a bit exhausting to play, in a good way!I hope things went well! Did your low-cost forsaken help out in your loop? Pain may have her minor's broken but eventually those later breaks will pay off if you manage to flip her relationship with Midnight to bitter enemies with that EE burst.
So I've been running into a serious problem on my run now that I've gottone Tier 3 breaks, and I've noticed this on my previous loops. The Chosen are so god damn fickle about when theyll use Fantasize and it's back breaking at times. I'll have my Tempted Chosen all by herself unsurrounded while the other 2 are capture/surrounded and she JUST SITS THERE FOR 20 FUCKING TURNS. Not a single fantasize. It's so frustrating, and I have no idea if I'm doing something wrong, or what. I have less than 5 days left until the final battle and I'm trying to put a wedge between Decree (Tempt) and Mayhem (Superior), but neither of them are using Fantasize at the rate I need them to.
So I got around that hurdle by sheer luck and reloading a save 5 times... There were 2 times where Decree literally never used Fantasize the entire fight... I just don't understand...
- Aug 24, 2018
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I have noticed 2 things:
- they will not fantasize when all of their trauma multipliers are 0.
- they need 10k (the range may be different) and some trauma to fantasize. do note that they heal fast in the turn they don't use it, and sometimes they heal too much and get out of this range
- Oct 14, 2020
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My worry about adding other ways to get punisher effectiveness percentage is that the requirement for T4 breaks would have to be increased (or the gains nerfed) in order to keep the same level of difficulty, and that would have the potential to make the game more grindy instead of less. I want the sinful moves to still be the main way that punisher effectiveness percentage is increased, because it presents the player with a choice. You can stop the Chosen from using the sinful moves (by using unupgraded Commanders against Detonate-users, or by surrounding Slaughter- and Striptease-users before their allies) in order to avoid their powerful effects, but this puts the targets' corruption on hold. And the more the sinful moves hurt you, the more progress you gain in their users' corruption, because both the effects and the corruption speed depend on how high the target's circumstance damage is.
There isn't exactly a cheat to do this right now, but you should be able to reset the game day to an earlier number in order to effectively take as long as you want.
It's nice to see the roster export function getting used. As for further customization, the portrait system is meant to sort of hold everyone over until more text customization options can be added.
This is probably a result of a minor bugfix I did last release which was meant to stop the Chosen from using Fantasize even when all their trauma multipliers were literally at x0. I hadn't realized that my previous balancing of their Fantasize odds was affected by the bug, and so now that the bug isn't there, they're a bit too reluctant to use the move. It'll be tweaked in the next version.
However, until then, I can at least share the logic they use for deciding whether to use Fantasize, since you can still get them to use it with some effort. As with all adaptation moves, they're more likely to use it when the associated circumstance damage (PLEA in this case) is higher. This is because the move is more powerful when the associated circumstance damage is higher. And for Fantasize specifically, they like to use it when they have unbalanced trauma damage. So, if one trauma is at Lv 2 damage and another is at Lv 0 damage, they're much more likely to use Fantasize to try to keep the Lv 0 at Lv 0.
The problem is that the main difficulty resides in the grind itself and lack of information. Reducing the grind is going to make it easier, this is why your Easy Mode has a cheat to unlock the achievements which includes knocking off 75% of the requirement to achieve T4 breaks in the first place right?
Because hitting 1000% is quite grindy, even if you use cheat engine to modify values so you can achieve the requirements for high level fantasize, striptease, or slaughter corruption procs. Once you understand how those procs work, because the game does not do a good job explaining them, the difficulty goes away and the grind sets in. It becomes easy to control the party to keep them locked down but it becomes a problem of herding them to do what you want them to enough times over enough battles.
Though hell, half of my main suggestion involves basically throwing on Bad Ends for the Heroines at double what is needed for a T4 break and throwing things in to ease the grind a bit and to give a bit more control. Also depending on how you look at it, the suggestion also in a sense makes things harder because you need to manage the corruption not just because some of the adaptions can be annoying* but because if you want a Forsaken that would not be effectively useless (You have exposure weaken Forsaken, so maxing out exposure triggering the Unchosen Bad End would result in a very weak Forsaken), be shall we say uninteresting (a Doll/Vessel of the Demon Lord may be able to emulate implanted personalities but its still an empty shell the player can choose to inhabit and training would likely not be as fun for some), or you simply do not get a Forsaken you can train and use in combat (Broodmother or Bio-Power Cell Bad Ends).
Though honestly one thing you could do if you wanted to raise difficulty while you lower grind would be rather simple: give the Magical Girls the ability to actually help each other when they are taken captive.
Lets use Hypnosis as an example. Conceptually Hypnosis grows in strength through repeated use on the target, so the Hypnosis commander raising Hypnosis percent every turn it holds a Magical Girl Captive makes sense. The counter to this would naturally be that if both Magical Girls are not surrounded and not a hated enemy of the one captive they would blast an escape route for their friend to escape from the brainwash ball that is the commander. Sure that would momentarily slow down the elimination of demons and thralls, but that is Magical Girls for you. They will often times put their friends and teammates over eliminating minions when possible as each combat capable magical girl is going to make the process faster overall.
Same thing with Drain, the commander being focused on a single target makes it open to a combined counter to free the one being drained. Same with impregnation. Parasitism could be countered with a combined spell to force the commander out of the costume.
This is actually why most magical girl porn games feature the Magical Girls either not working together, being solo to begin with, or the villain attacks in multiple places to split them up... which could be an option for Forsaken, sending them out on simultanious attacks following their own judgement according to personality thus allowing you to isolate one magical girl to focus your torment on at the cost of not being able to inflict breaks on the other magical girls.
*(I avoid causing slaughter altogether because I am playing to see Magical Girls get corrupted into lewd messes, striptease is a non issue because it happens most when you are setting up tempts and a tempt is a tempt each one is going to reduce the minimum needed for the next and the final battle regardless of the damage done during it)
Waiting for T4 breaks is the worst part of the game imo. It feels really passive and like you don't have any control over it. You just sit around and wait and hope the girls use their moves. It should be one of the most exciting parts of a run, with you having almost completely corrupted the girls, but it's just a slog/grind. I'm even the type that likes a lot of grinds (Like the average japanese rpg game grind), but I don't enjoy it here.
- Aug 24, 2018
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While I do understand the point, it also could be a good idea to have another way to increase the T4 by doing something. In my opinion, the one that needs this the most is the Pain T4 as detonating requires resources that you could use to gain more ANGST.
It could be done by visiting the chosen, and doing something in exchange to increase the %. Naturally, it would have something to it like reducing the ANGST by a large amount or giving something to the chosen in the next battle (no captures, faster eradication, etc).
In any case, the forsaken work is a second option for now, but I would like another option later down the line.
I agree that T1 and T2 are by far the most interesting. I feel like T3 and T4 are much grindier by comparison. Not sure what could be made different about them though.
You have some control...
Slaughter and Striptease activate once per surround so long as the one doing the move is not surrounded or captured. So you can capture one girl which will mean you get a decent surround when they get out of capture and then capture a different girl while you put the first one in a surround. This will result in the girl you ignore if they are applicable to use Slaughter or Striptease to activate said abilities. Then you just repeat while ignoring the girl you are boosting using Slaughter or Striptease on.
Fantasize as pointed out by the dev has a chance to kick in when trauma is heavily imbalanced.
ANTI/PAIN is triggered per capture.
Of course this has problems of its own, since you will have limited surrounds that you can achieve before extermination and evacuation is complete, you have limited captures to work with and the explosion eats up an extra capture.
I know how they work, thanks. I meant up until that point, the game is about controlling the girls story/gameplay wise, but the T4 break is often just letting them do what they want. It kind of breaks the immersion/focus of the game is what I'm saying. You usually spend your time trying to lock the girls down and torment them up till that point, that make sense. Sitting around and waiting for them to use their moves against you doesn't feel like the gameplay up to that point or like a logical way for the MC to act. It starts to feel like you're metagaming instead of actually playing the game naturally, if you understand what I mean. You need to intentionally let some girls free and allow them to spam their moves at you, instead of the usual "Torment the girls" goal of the earlier breaks. If you didn't know how it worked, that isn't something you'd ever consider doing because it doesn't make any sense outside of "that's just how the game is made".
I'm trying to think of an example of that in popular games but I can't think of any off the top of my head. Wolf's Dungeon had similar problems with that though if you're familiar with that game. Where sometimes you had to intentionally go and lose to some random mob to advance the story. It's kind of like that. It goes against common sense and what you've done up to that point. Without a guide or dumb luck, you'd never advance. It might not be as extreme here, but it's the same feeling.
The moves the girls unlock at T3 are fine, I just don't think the T4 break should revolve around them using those moves. The girls up till that point are already often violent, so it's not like that's really needed for the final step of the corruption. Rather it seems like they're lacking loyalty to the MC at that point. I think the T4 break should focus more on that angle.
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I remember playing release ~21-23 and having fun with it, but for the life of me I can't figure out how to get the ball rolling in current version.
I managed to break two Core vulnerabities from one chosen (reach lvl 2 PLEA and INJU) by day ~10-15, but even that required 5 point commander for each, making it a net loss evil energy-wise.
I managed to break two Core vulnerabities from one chosen (reach lvl 2 PLEA and INJU) by day ~10-15, but even that required 5 point commander for each, making it a net loss evil energy-wise.
If you haven't broken the same vulnerability for whoever has it as a minor then breaking a core should give 8 energy, so it should be positive. Also, remember that an important part of breaking vulnerabilities is that it allows for more sinful downtime actions, giving faster evil energy generation, not just a lump sum.
Also it's not really possible to tell what you should be doing differently without you going into more detail about what you're doing now.
Also it's not really possible to tell what you should be doing differently without you going into more detail about what you're doing now.
Looking at the overall corruption progress, it was the +2 breaks, rather than the T1 core vulnerability. So a net loss, sadly.
As for what I'm doing... Well, that's the problem: nothing worthwhile it seems.
The heroine statlines are currently:
#1
FEAR 1 / HATE 4
DISG 4 / PLEA 1
PAIN 3 / INJU 1
SHAM 2 / EXPO 2
#2
FEAR 2 / HATE 2
DISG 1 / PLEA 3
PAIN 1 / INJU 4
SHAM 3 / EXPO 1
#3
FEAR 4 / HATE 0
DISG 1 / PLEA 3
PAIN 2 / INJU 2
SHAM 1 / EXPO 3
With #1 I can get 3 round surround ready before #3 arrives. I can use HATE to increase all damage, but I never have enough time to capitalize on that. She has 3x the total angst compared to the other two, since she seems to be the only reasonable target to start fights with.
With #2 I honestly can't figure out anything useful to do. Takes too many turns to increase DISG/PAIN for a surround and SHAM needs something else to get a good enough surround to get anything useful done with the high INJU vulnerability.
With #3 I can get 2-3 round surround with FEAR and PAIN if #1 is still surrounded. I've tried to go 3 round surround on #1 => 3 round surround on #3 => 4-5 round surround on #1, but it's always one round away from happening, pretty much.
When using commander I mostly tried 4-5 turn Mania with two captures to stack EXPO on the other two to stack circumstance modifiers on the one I'm trying to break. Think I tried PAIN commander to directly capture #2 when she shows up, but again, that doesn't really end up accomplishing much.
I'm probably missing something glaringly obvious here, but I don't remember having this hard time with the game when I last really played. I didn't win then either, but at least it didn't feel like I'm completely stuck doing no meaningful progress.
As for what I'm doing... Well, that's the problem: nothing worthwhile it seems.
The heroine statlines are currently:
#1
FEAR 1 / HATE 4
DISG 4 / PLEA 1
PAIN 3 / INJU 1
SHAM 2 / EXPO 2
#2
FEAR 2 / HATE 2
DISG 1 / PLEA 3
PAIN 1 / INJU 4
SHAM 3 / EXPO 1
#3
FEAR 4 / HATE 0
DISG 1 / PLEA 3
PAIN 2 / INJU 2
SHAM 1 / EXPO 3
With #1 I can get 3 round surround ready before #3 arrives. I can use HATE to increase all damage, but I never have enough time to capitalize on that. She has 3x the total angst compared to the other two, since she seems to be the only reasonable target to start fights with.
With #2 I honestly can't figure out anything useful to do. Takes too many turns to increase DISG/PAIN for a surround and SHAM needs something else to get a good enough surround to get anything useful done with the high INJU vulnerability.
With #3 I can get 2-3 round surround with FEAR and PAIN if #1 is still surrounded. I've tried to go 3 round surround on #1 => 3 round surround on #3 => 4-5 round surround on #1, but it's always one round away from happening, pretty much.
When using commander I mostly tried 4-5 turn Mania with two captures to stack EXPO on the other two to stack circumstance modifiers on the one I'm trying to break. Think I tried PAIN commander to directly capture #2 when she shows up, but again, that doesn't really end up accomplishing much.
I'm probably missing something glaringly obvious here, but I don't remember having this hard time with the game when I last really played. I didn't win then either, but at least it didn't feel like I'm completely stuck doing no meaningful progress.
Each doubling of angst is +1 damage, so 3x the angst only means either 1 or 2 more damage. You should definitely not feel constrained by that. I would not target #1 here, generally it is easier to break chosen who take more circumstance damage rather than trauma damage, so I'd actually look at #2.
Also, I never use non-plain commanders. A plain commander with 2 extra duration and 1 extra capture should be 5 evil energy and ought to do very well against #2. I'd go hate, injury, pleasure, exposure. Use the second capture on whoever shows up first of the other two and make sure you get their exposure up.
Try it and tell me how it goes.
Also, I never use non-plain commanders. A plain commander with 2 extra duration and 1 extra capture should be 5 evil energy and ought to do very well against #2. I'd go hate, injury, pleasure, exposure. Use the second capture on whoever shows up first of the other two and make sure you get their exposure up.
Try it and tell me how it goes.
I did already end up finishing the first campaign attempt (well, passing through the last ~10 days to refresh with cheat mode on), but I did try the start you suggested after a few test fights with maxed out commander to see what I can do with that one. Definitely gets the ball rolling much better than what I've been doing so far, so thanks for that. I'll probably toy around with most upgrades bought for a while and then try again without cheats later on.
- Mar 7, 2019
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While I do agree that T4 breaks are a bit much, especially Slaughter, Fantasize, and Striptease due to their inability to be targeted and must be manipulated, the actual theme of "loyalty" doesn't apply until they become Forsaken so this would be jumping the gun a bit. Due to these three T4 needing us to leave them alone and let them use it, they can overlap, and conditions to unlock them are fairly similar. This is, I believe, where a problem in T4 breaks in their current iteration lie.
I think it would be better if Fantasize was something that happened while captured or surrounded. As in, she clearly gives into what is happening to her. Unfortunately, it's current iteration would make Fantasize actually ridiculously overpowered and make it impossible to actually damage off late game if it applied its effects while being surrounded. I wonder how difficult it would be to have Fantasize apply it's buff after the surround? Maybe a 1-turn delay so that they can be resurrounded? An upper-limit to the buff per surround? Just my 2 cents.
So.. for the new Forsaken Punishers, how do I trigger them? I had thought that having the target Chosen at 1000% for Parasitism, assigning the attacking Forsaken to Publicist, then capturing the Chosen with that Forsaken would trigger it, but apparently not.