Ren'Py Desert Stalker [v0.16b] [Zetan]

[GetOutOfMyLab]

I disagree with the idea that these would be okay if player had the option, because when they do the ones who don't like sharing, ntr, gangbangs, etc are still upset because, to them, those things are still happening because the choice is there and someone else playing is making that choice, even if they aren't.

oh man...that's some serious psychological issue right there...How are they handling that potentially thousands of other people play these VNs and name the MC after themselves? Everybody is getting a turn at "their" girls.

 

[JoeTheMC84]

I think sometimes it is what the choice implies about the character. For example: In this game, I don;t mind the choices because it doesn't change anything about the characters involved. If the MC wants Aine to blow Igor then it doesn't change her character at all. She is submissive to her dad and is doing what he wants her to.

Now imagine if in a game the player has a choice to suggest that a girl wear a red dress over a black dress to their date. And if you say she should wear the red dress then she blows a guy in the bathroom during y'all's date but if she wears the black dress then she doesn't. That means that that character wants to blow other guys, she is more than willing to and when the opportunity arises, she will unless you babysit her and keep her from doing it. It alters her fundamental character in a deep way. She wants other guys and is just holding back because the MC is making choices that prevent it.

That is why some people are so averse to even "avoidable" NTR/sharing/voyeurism because usually it is done poorly and fundamentally changes the characters involved, making them almost schizophrenic in their actions. Bull-balling the MC but dropping panties for the first other dick that comes by if the MC doesn't stop it. Or other nonsense. Desert Stalker so far has done a great job of maintaining the character's personalities consistently while still allowing for swinging content. It's one of the reasons I really like the game.

 

[GetOutOfMyLab]

Now imagine if in a game the player has a choice to suggest that a girl wear a red dress over a black dress to their date. And if you say she should wear the red dress then she blows a guy in the bathroom during y'all's date but if she wears the black dress then she doesn't

I think I've actually played a couple like this. Really frustrating. Choices should clearly take the player to their desired outcome.

 

[Yngling]

I can see that argument. Though in the scope of the game it can be left in the air after the end of the story as well. letting the player determine in the head how things ago after the final fade to black at the end of the game. Unless the game will persist beyond a certain point the households future as Shani's, independent of her father, isn't needed. Though as I said in the edit of the other post. As long as the player has a say it could be a topic that comes up before the end.

Well, I guess it would be elegant solution.

However Zaton did already hint at retiring (I think when meeting his former mentor) and it is one of the reasons he couldn't postpone Shani entering the zone for longer. I think Zaton was also considering joining the Decayed. If I recall correctly.

The game also already talked about Ain's possible future life paths.

All in all, I think Zaton's retirement may be something that is planned that we see in the game.

 

[Yngling]

What is this take lol?

Maybe you can chalk it up to strength if it's her and one dude in an alley (though even then, what if she's injured? or he gets the drop on her? or he has a gun and she doesn't? etc. etc.), but what if she gets jumped or ambushed by a group of people? Rape isn't just about "strength".

Agreed, avoiding rape is not only about strength, fighting skills, weapons skills etc. It's also about situational awareness, street smarts etc. All things that Shani is incredibly good at.

And yes, IRL it's not always avoidable unfortunately.

However if Shani gets raped in this game, without the player being able to do anything about it, would be one of the very few cases when I would rage-quit this game.

It just does not fit her character. It would be exactly the same as when Zaton himself would get ass raped.

 

[muschi26]

Agreed, avoiding rape is not only about strength, fighting skills, weapons skills etc. It's also about situational awareness, street smarts etc. All things that Shani is incredibly good at.

And yes, IRL it's not always avoidable unfortunately.

However if Shani gets raped in this game, without the player being able to do anything about it, would be one of the very few cases when I would rage-quit this game.

It just does not fit her character. It would be exactly the same as when Zaton himself would get ass raped.

I don’t expect or want that to happen to her either, but it was just the way you phrased that lmao.

 

[goldenface]

That feeling when you discover a game a bit later on in its development and it seems as if the content will never run out but then it finally does...

 

[Ragnar]

People keep bringing up the MC with the raider in the opening but you're ignoring the context. He had just finished his mission; he was safe in the open desert. Shani is in the Zone; were we just saw a guy get brained by an arrow because he was distracted by a conversation, and some people think it would be a good idea and "fit the story" for her to risk stripping down and getting dicked in the most dangerous environment imaginable? With mummies and raiders actively hunting people making noise and random weather effects and other phenomena that can destroy buildings, that sounds like a bad idea to me? And not just all that, but it is also only a day or two after finally confessing her love for the MC?

Edit: Just to be clear, because I think some people might get the wrong idea. *If* later in the game Shani was with the MC and met someone and had the option to pursue something, and we as the player could approve or not, I actually wouldn't care too much. I'd say no and move on, just like all the other scenes like that. But anything in the Zone just seems forced for one. Out of character for two. Super dangerous and oddly timed for three. And lastly, dangerously close to actually NTR because it would happen behind the MC's back without his approval or knowledge. It would basically be the actual Japanese style NTR, girl in relationship, has sex behind MC's back and has feelings for the other person. Shani in no way seems like the kind of girl to betray her father in anyway.

Is Shani in a relationship? My Shani only played a bit with the Queen during the BBQ incident. If she can bang the girl in the zone I say let's go. My Shani is a future Stalker, not another cock sucker for Zaton (He's more than enough of those already).

 

[JoeTheMC84]

Is Shani in a relationship? My Shani only played a bit with the Queen during the BBQ incident. If she can bang the girl in the zone I say let's go. My Shani is a future Stalker, not another cock sucker for Zaton (He's more than enough of those already).

Shani is not a true MC, she is a point of view character at best. One that we can guide into some actions, but there is no "My Shani" in the same way there is a "My Zaton." She is a set character like Aine or the Queen. Zaton can influence their actions, but they are their own characters. And so is Shani. The fact that "Your Zaton" may not have returned Shani's feelings does not mean that in your game she doesn't have them for him. If she were a true MC then Zaton is basically cucking her the whole game because she does feel jealousy about him being with her sister Aine. Just look at their interaction in the main room of the house where Shani almost chokes Aine on Zaton's cock.

Besides that, my main point still stands, having sex in the zone is just out of place. We just saw a guy die because he was having a conversation. Everyone she would run into in the Zone is a best a concern that needs to prove they aren't a threat. And danger lurks around every corner. The very air and land can be fatal... but sure, she could meet someone, trust them enough to bang within a few moments, and just hope a pack of mummies or the raiders we know for a fact are looking for victims aren't walking by. Not to mention she has a clear mission. The Zone isn't a place for her to hangout in and explore and make friends. It's a place to go into, get what she is after, and then get home, thus proving she has what it takes to be a Stalker.

It is highly likely that she will meet someone (probably the female we saw a brief glimpse of), they will team up, probably killing some mummies and maybe even a few raiders, and she will likely need to choose between saving her new friend's life or completing her mission before she leaves the Zone. It would fit with the help/selfish points the player has been giving her, that will likely be used for the outcome if the player skips her content. And if she saves them, they may come back with her, and something could come from it later down the line. But the Zone is no place for sex, it'd be like two soldiers in a trench in WWI banging when the enemy could rush the line at any moment.

Maybe I'm wrong, and a sex scene will happen in a way that makes sense give the context of the Zone... I won't see it because I'd have her turn anything like that down, but, we'll see.

Edit: Also, in my post I did preface my statement with "dangerously close to," and "basically," as I didn't want to make a definitive and declarative statement since it was hyperbolic in some ways.

 

[dolfe67]

Not to mention she has a clear mission. The Zone isn't a place for her to hangout in and explore and make friends. It's a place to go into, get what she is after, and then get home, thus proving she has what it takes to be a Stalker.

I still don't know what she has to do in the zone?

 

[JoeTheMC84]

I still don't know what she has to do in the zone?

One thing we know for sure is that she is looking for something (I forgot what it is, lol) for Zaton's former trainer with the Decayed. If I'm not mistaken, she is also supposed to find something of value for all of Zetan. She has to prove her worth and skill as a Stalker by surviving and finding something worthwhile for her fellow citizens/Queen.

 

[Ragnar]

Shani is not a true MC, she is a point of view character at best. One that we can guide into some actions, but there is no "My Shani" in the same way there is a "My Zaton." She is a set character like Aine or the Queen. Zaton can influence their actions, but they are their own characters. And so is Shani. The fact that "Your Zaton" may not have returned Shani's feelings does not mean that in your game she doesn't have them for him. If she were a true MC then Zaton is basically cucking her the whole game because she does feel jealousy about him being with her sister Aine. Just look at their interaction in the main room of the house where Shani almost chokes Aine on Zaton's cock.

Besides that, my main point still stands, having sex in the zone is just out of place. We just saw a guy die because he was having a conversation. Everyone she would run into in the Zone is a best a concern that needs to prove they aren't a threat. And danger lurks around every corner. The very air and land can be fatal... but sure, she could meet someone, trust them enough to bang within a few moments, and just hope a pack of mummies or the raiders we know for a fact are looking for victims aren't walking by. Not to mention she has a clear mission. The Zone isn't a place for her to hangout in and explore and make friends. It's a place to go into, get what she is after, and then get home, thus proving she has what it takes to be a Stalker.

It is highly likely that she will meet someone (probably the female we saw a brief glimpse of), they will team up, probably killing some mummies and maybe even a few raiders, and she will likely need to choose between saving her new friend's life or completing her mission before she leaves the Zone. It would fit with the help/selfish points the player has been giving her, that will likely be used for the outcome if the player skips her content. And if she saves them, they may come back with her, and something could come from it later down the line. But the Zone is no place for sex, it'd be like two soldiers in a trench in WWI banging when the enemy could rush the line at any moment.

Maybe I'm wrong, and a sex scene will happen in a way that makes sense give the context of the Zone... I won't see it because I'd have her turn anything like that down, but, we'll see.

Edit: Also, in my post I did preface my statement with "dangerously close to," and "basically," as I didn't want to make a definitive and declarative statement since it was hyperbolic in some ways.

Since the moment the player can decide how she acts she becomes more than just a npc. So far there are two scenes like that, with the Queen and in the Zone.

The fact that "Your Zaton" may not have returned Shani's feelings does not mean that in your game she doesn't have them for him.

As far as I know Shani feelings toward Zaton are just admiration and filial love. You can pursue her as Zaton and she will open to sex but if you don't she won't either. It's a player choice not Shani's.

having sex in the zone is just out of place.

I don't think so. Zaton can have sex with many girls under dire situations all the time. Why would the Zone be any different? Because it would be Shani the one getting some?
I sincerely hope the developers will allow us to play with Shani in different ways. One way can be being Zaton's lover and another can be hitting on the Queen for example. Like with Ain, you can share her or don't, your choice.
The Zaton-Shani scene before etering the Zone is out of place imo, because he has been trying to avoid it since the beginning. But I understand how some players can welcome that scene if they want her as just another Harem girl.

 

[JoeTheMC84]

Since the moment the player can decide how she acts she becomes more than just a npc. So far there are two scenes like that, with the Queen and in the Zone.

I didn't say was just like every other NPC but she is not a true main character either. She is not independent in her actions like Zaton is based on player input. The fact that her entire point of view can be avoided is proof of that.

As far as I know Shani feelings toward Zaton are just admiration and filial love. You can pursue her as Zaton and she will open to sex but if you don't she won't either. It's a player choice not Shani's.

Then you weren't paying attention. Even in interaction where the player doesn't pursue romantic actions, she acts romantically toward him.

I don't think so. Zaton can have sex with many girls under dire situations all the time. Why would the Zone be any different? Because it would be Shani the one getting some?

Name one time where he has sex in a "dire situation," at all? Let alone one even remotely close to what she faces in the Zone. He has only had sex in controlled spaces, after a victory, when a situation was resolved, and when he could exert control.

I sincerely hope the developers will allow us to play with Shani in different ways. One way can be being Zaton's lover and another can be hitting on the Queen for example. Like with Ain, you can share her or don't, your choice.
The Zaton-Shani scene before etering the Zone is out of place imo, because he has been trying to avoid it since the beginning. But I understand how some players can welcome that scene if they want her as just another Harem girl.

Shani could die in the Zone. This could be the last moment they see each other and despite the fact that you missed it and didn't return her feelings, she has loved her father her whole life and been jealous of her sister, so yes, the scene at the oasis makes perfect sense. She knows it could be her last chance so she goes for it and her father can return her feels or not. Before the player took over, yes Zaton didn't let her be sexual with him because he didn't want it to distract her from her training, that obstacle is gone now. Because Zaton is the main character and the players avatar, not her.

It's as if you think her being with her father somehow cheapens her as a character. She can be with him without becoming, "just another harem girl," you are falling into the bifurcation fallacy. The option isn't cock-sleeve-harem-girl or badass-stalker-who-fucks-random-people. There is another option... many in fact. She could be a bad ass stalker chick who loves her father and is loyal to him.

 

[JaxMan]

Shani is not a true MC, she is a point of view character at best. One that we can guide into some actions, but there is no "My Shani" in the same way there is a "My Zaton." She is a set character like Aine or the Queen. Zaton can influence their actions, but they are their own characters. And so is Shani. The fact that "Your Zaton" may not have returned Shani's feelings does not mean that in your game she doesn't have them for him. If she were a true MC then Zaton is basically cucking her the whole game because she does feel jealousy about him being with her sister Aine. Just look at their interaction in the main room of the house where Shani almost chokes Aine on Zaton's cock.

My interpretation of the dynamic between Ain and Shani is sibling rivalry more than romantic jealousy. As with a lot of siblings there is a jealousy between them because of the feeling that the parent is spending more time or is more affectionate to the other sibling. Ain even experiences it when the MC goes off and does things with Shani and feels she's being left out. Because of each of their personalities they feel the other is getting more of his attention and that drives it. Even if you don't pursue Shani as a LI she will still feel the same jealousy when Ain gets his attention. You see that even in the scene you describe.

 

[JoeTheMC84]

My interpretation of the dynamic between Ain and Shani is sibling rivalry more than romantic jealousy. As with a lot of siblings there is a jealousy between them because of the feeling that the parent is spending more time or is more affectionate to the other sibling. Ain even experiences it when the MC goes off and does things with Shani and feels she's being left out. Because of each of their personalities they feel the other is getting more of his attention and that drives it. Even if you don't pursue Shani as a LI she will still feel the same jealousy when Ain gets his attention. You see that even in the scene you describe.

That's a fair assessment of the two sister's dynamic. Perhaps I read more romance into the rivalry because of the inherent sexuality of the setting.

I actually think that the MC refusing to use Shani sexually for so long is the most romantic thing he could have done, lol

 

[JaxMan]

That's a fair assessment of the two sister's dynamic. Perhaps I read more romance into the rivalry because of the inherent sexuality of the setting.

I actually think that the MC refusing to use Shani sexually for so long is the most romantic thing he could have done, lol

I think your statement is a pretty accurate assessment about reading more romance in the setting because, after all, the largest genre here is probably daddy/daughter and mother/son sex. I think Desert Stalker has a chance to explore some different themes if they don't get bogged down into the usual tropes.

 

[Hildegardt]

I still don't know what she has to do in the zone?

I still don't get what the whole zone business is supposed to be about. It's like this rite of passage for stalkers, but the first person Shani meets in there is just a normal guy. Then the guy gets shot, which makes it seem the most dangerous thing in the zone is other people, but then I don't understand how that's supposed to be more dangerous than the rest of the world with all the raiders, decayed and hive roaming around.

 

[JoeTheMC84]

I think your statement is a pretty accurate assessment about reading more romance in the setting because, after all, the largest genre here is probably daddy/daughter and mother/son sex. I think Desert Stalker has a chance to explore some different themes if they don't get bogged down into the usual tropes.

You make a fair point. And Desert Stalker is already exploring those other themes. And has been since the start. The MC can already share one daughter as well as other girls, which is a big break from the tropes as is. However, I would argue that both daughters don't need to be sacrificed to the idea of "avoid the cliche." Sometimes a trope is what fits best... that's why it became a trope in the first place.

 

[Hildegardt]

However, I would argue that both daughters don't need to be sacrificed to the idea of "avoid the cliche."

I'd think that the people, who are into the setting and lore of this game wouldn't really see it as a sacrifice.

You seem to be shifting the goal posts to justify your personal preferences. At first you tell us that just because something can be done doesn't mean it should be done, because some people might not be into these things and games are supposed to be a service. Then you tell us that we need to consider the context to see if a scene would make sense or not, claiming that Shani's purity makes sense, even though you acknowledge the "inherent sexuality of the setting".
I don't think you need to do this. I think people understand and share your prefered character arc for Shani. I think what people are arguing is that the worldbuilding would allow for some outright depravity and brutality, which doesn't actually make it into the game. All of the most brutal stuff only happens to unnamed characters for example. Zaton never was in any real danger and there hasn't been a hint of disputing his gigachad status so far.

A lot of people comment on how refreshing the unapologetic nature of the opening scene felt to them. The plot armour of Zaton and his family seems to stand in stark contrast to this.

 

[JoeTheMC84]

I'd think that the people, who are into the setting and lore of this game wouldn't really see it as a sacrifice.

You seem to be shifting the goal posts to justify your personal preferences. At first you tell us that just because something can be done doesn't mean it should be done, because some people might not be into these things and games are supposed to be a service. Then you tell us that we need to consider the context to see if a scene would make sense or not, claiming that Shani's purity makes sense, even though you acknowledge the "inherent sexuality of the setting".
I don't think you need to do this. I think people understand and share your prefered character arc for Shani. I think what people are arguing is that the worldbuilding would allow for some outright depravity and brutality, which doesn't actually make it into the game. All of the most brutal stuff only happens to unnamed characters for example. Zaton never was in any real danger and there hasn't been a hint of disputing his gigachad status so far.

A lot of people comment on how refreshing the unapologetic nature of the opening scene felt to them. The plot armour of Zaton and his family seems to stand in stark contrast to this.

Using the word sacrifice was meant to be hyperbolic to make the point. Sorry if you missed that. I wasn't shifting any goal posts, I was having like, three separate conversations about different (though tangentially connected) issues. Also, shifting goal posts implies I was making conflicting points to try and win some debate. None of that was the case. Even the "goal post" you pointed out (highlighted above) are not in conflict and all build my cumulative stance.

Yes, my preferences can color my words, I don't deny that, but I strive to always be measured and reasonable in my posts. At times though, I know I will lose people in my posts. For example, you seem to think I am arguing to maintain Shani's purity, that is not the case. In fact, in an earlier post I said that outside the Zone (which events happening in the Zone has largely been the one through line in most of my recent posts) it could make sense and I wouldn't have any issue with it or make any statements against it. I just would skip it and move on. But inside the Zone is another story.

But I will happily move on from this topic now. I have made my point. While I'll still address anyone that directly quotes me, I won't initiate any further talk on this topic.