Do you think that the "market" of indie porn game is saturated?

[Joshua Tree]

I wasn't serious... even if shock value may be important in a business.

That stunt did more damage to NSFW games on steam than anything tbh. Steams content of NSFW stuff keeps growing. That "rape play" put such a negative spotlight to it more than anything. That being said there been games over at steam that got the same for being excessive violent, school shooting themes and what not. If the creators of that "rape play" game, had gone with another tittle and toned it down, I doubt none would flinched. It was put there for shock value more than anything.

 

[Joshua Tree]

Do you live under a rock? Turned out the whole "rape day" game thing was a psyop by bad people in the government trying to get laws passed to regulate games. He wasn't a game developer at all he's a Senior Airman in the military. A False flag, where the government did it, and then blames it on "gamers" bullshit.

Here you go again. Any actual facts to that? I'm quite skeptical to a lot of things, but damn man, you like the king of conspiracy theories.

@

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"In a prior FAQ post, however, the developer warned: 'If people want my game to not exist... their best offense in my opinion would be to not talk about me, and not give me free press.

'If both my game is banned and I am banned, then I will ensure that a content platform for all kinds of legal, quality porn games exist.'

So the creator would want to ensure there will be a platform where his (and other's) games exist. That doesn't sound much like want to regulate anything.

Also, what a person does in real life, next to creating adult games and what not, doesn't mean jack shit. How many creators of adult games here want to slap their real name on their products? There is a reason why pseudonyms is used, and it's not limited to just the adult industry.

 

[sickybee]

i think once again depends on their audience and genre

 

[SeventhVixen]

You will never see such as Electronic Arts, Activision etc to start make adult games. It just not money in it, at least not the money they chase. Adult games become to small a niche for them. Not to far fetched to think some game studio could rise to start production of "good" adult games. Problem is more they would be prone to handle everything from funding, publishing and distribution themselves. That would require a whole other level of commitment, and funding required than some indy dev doing it s a hobby in their spare time. Game studios kinda seek publishers as a safety net, to avoid have to do all that stuff and focus on actual game development. In the process also give up their soul and at large part creative control.

Big companies go where the money is.

When games were destined to adults, you could see a lot more adult content on them. (Most of time not explicit, but hot) Some of the most mainstream and successfull games of some years were of adult content.

Now games are not destined to adults (Well, as majority, I'm not gonna explain all that, all of you see youtube for sure xD), But that's not the big companies goal.

Society has changed in two major ways since those days (late 80's and early 90's): A more protective society for the underage, and entertainment meant for the grogginess of the society where it achieves most it's effect, young man.
So we have the strange constructs like Excesive Fast Violence of peniless characters and lens flares butts.

I think the raise of SJW means the peak of this prude age, and the situation is gonna revert sonner or later. Small things like adding nipples in games in hyped games, help. (Damn, nothing worst than if you cannot even see in a narrative and in no a sexual way a dead nude body, it's just innatural)

Some minor companies are trying to left that 2000's veil in the past, returning to adult gamers the adult content in the mainstream games.

Meanwhile I'm not myself interested in the mainstream industry changes, I just wanna make my part and make a game that apart from a game, is sexy.

 

[DawnCry]

I will be simple, there is no saturation at all, the only thing that is saturated are the copy pastes that try to earn money by making the same thing a thousand people did before without even the tiniest innovation.

Create a more unique concept and develop from there, there is a risk of failure but there is a higher chance of success.

Another point is the investment you do in the game, did you risk money by buying assets? are you actually expending full time to try to achieve your dream?. Half-assed efforts usually get you nowhere.

That's all, if you do the same as all those before you and don't even invest in it yourself... why would others actually do it?

 

[Joshua Tree]

Big companies go where the money is.

When games were destined to adults, you could see a lot more adult content on them. (Most of time not explicit, but hot) Some of the most mainstream and successfull games of some years were of adult content.

Now games are not destined to adults (Well, as majority, I'm not gonna explain all that, all of you see youtube for sure xD), But that's not the big companies goal.

Society has changed in two major ways since those days (late 80's and early 90's): A more protective society for the underage, and entertainment meant for the grogginess of the society where it achieves most it's effect, young man.
So we have the strange constructs like Excesive Fast Violence of peniless characters and lens flares butts.

I think the raise of SJW means the peak of this prude age, and the situation is gonna revert sonner or later. Small things like adding nipples in games in hyped games, help. (Damn, nothing worst than if you cannot even see in a narrative and in no a sexual way a dead nude body, it's just innatural)

Some minor companies are trying to left that 2000's veil in the past, returning to adult gamers the adult content in the mainstream games.

Meanwhile I'm not myself interested in the mainstream industry changes, I just wanna make my part and make a game that apart from a game, is sexy.

There is still those that make games for adults. Like CDProjektRED with their Witcher series and the upcoming cyberpunk 2077. Bioware used to have a touch of it in their games, but ever since they ended under the umbrella of Electronic Arts they just degraded and most of the talent that did work there left the studio. Before some start "but there is no porn in those games". Games with adult theme doesn't equal porn.

The adult industry is bigger as ever before as whole, it's so big its eating itself. Everyone with a webcam can be a porn star and so on. Due to ever increasing competition it keep invent more and more crazy shit to attract audience, along with the fact the audience get kinda immune (if anything) to the same stuff over and over. The early porn games from the adult industry came with the introduction of the CD, and was little more than FMV's. I think few wanted to take a leap of fate with something bigger due to cost vs returns.

In the more main stream game industry we had game series such as the Larry games from Sierra that could be said to be the very first graphic adult themed games. Many years later you had such as Deep Silver release their "Singles" games, and you had that Playboy the mansion, 7sins and a few others, but none of these had such content you find in today's games by indy devs etc.

Nudity and sex is wrong, blow someone's head off is not. Go figure, the world is fucked up

 

[polywog]

Here you go again. Any actual facts to that? I'm quite skeptical to a lot of things, but damn man, you like the king of conspiracy theories.

@

You must be registered to see the links

"In a prior FAQ post, however, the developer warned: 'If people want my game to not exist... their best offense in my opinion would be to not talk about me, and not give me free press.

'If both my game is banned and I am banned, then I will ensure that a content platform for all kinds of legal, quality porn games exist.'

So the creator would want to ensure there will be a platform where his (and other's) games exist. That doesn't sound much like want to regulate anything.

Also, what a person does in real life, next to creating adult games and what not, doesn't mean jack shit. How many creators of adult games here want to slap their real name on their products? There is a reason why pseudonyms is used, and it's not limited to just the adult industry.

"The game rape day was analyzed by experts in cyber-crime. Meta data revealed that the game was made on a government server, using government assets that are not available to the public. In a live interview, the alleged game developer was unable to answer the most basic questions about the game engine, things he would have known if he had actually made the game himself. Conclusion: He's a scapegoat like Lee Harvey Oswald. The game was actually made by the government, and used in an attempt to manipulate public opinion."

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[Hadley]

We are definitely saturated with bad or mediocre Games, but really great Games are still quite rare. When I think about Games that could be put on Steam and get good Reviews/Make Money I can't think of more than a Handful.

 

[grtrader]

Guys, so many game as released almost everyday, what's going on?
There is tons of VNs.
Will this competition increase the quality or it will destroy the production (and the developers)?

The market by no means is saturated. We live in a global market. All one needs to do to expand is add different languages to a game to reach more viewers.

As for how this will effect quality. It can go either way. Take Porn and Cam modeling. Those markets are actually saturated. The effect of which hasn't been positive depending on your point of view. Has the quality gotten better not but the level of depravity has increased drastically. In fact it seems to be on a downward spiral of who can up the next person with the more depraved thing or be the more slutty and so on.

For the girls the money really hasn't gotten better if anything its gotten worse. The average cam model counting the hours they work producing everything and the work to stay in shape, get ready for shows, promote... makes less than minimum wage.

So it depends on readers and developers. If readers demand a better product developers will have to rise to the challenge or fail.
If readers don't make a demand developers can simply make a choice to do better than their competition and try and refine their product. It's like any art or media you have to choose a target audience and appeal to it. If you try and appeal to everyone you will appeal to a lot less. That's usually were artists writers fail trying to appeal to to many people or large of audience.

However with something like a VN you can create story lines that appeal to multiple types of people and remain separated from the other story lines or share parts in various areas that it is appropriate. That way the story goes the way of the liking of the reader. That's a good bit different from a book or a movie that only has one type of plot.

 

[polywog]

Inexperienced game makers think "I'll make a game just like _____ and I'll make just as much money as they do"

The same logic that fast food chains use when building their restaurants. McDonalds builds right across the street from Burger King, thinking "we'll take away half the money they are making"

Build your restaurant where there are no restaurants, and you will make more, or specialize in something different that people want. Patreon street is saturated with fast food burgers, but people are craving tacos, pizza, seafood... diversity.
You can make money peddling hot dogs anywhere, but you can make more serving lobster and steaks.

 

[Joshua Tree]

View attachment 298344

"The game rape day was analyzed by experts in cyber-crime. Meta data revealed that the game was made on a government server, using government assets that are not available to the public. In a live interview, the alleged game developer was unable to answer the most basic questions about the game engine, things he would have known if he had actually made the game himself. Conclusion: He's a scapegoat like Lee Harvey Oswald. The game was actually made by the government, and used in an attempt to manipulate public opinion."

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Don't really know what the Charles Manson meme got anything to do with things. A public outcry to regulate games is nothing new. The "Hot Coffee" thing for GTA created a huge outcry. In the old Fallout games (F1&2) children was censored out of the games in some countries. Games such as Manhunt and Carmageddon had politicians go haywire.

In England, the Britts have to get a pornpass to get on adult sites. Water is wet, sky is blue, so what else is new?

So where is the reference to this live interview? It must exist some place right?

Here have another interview @

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[forbidden101v]

I'd say in the case of VN's and RPGM porn games it's very saturated. Anything else isn't nearly as common to come across as they require more effort and skill in the programming aspect and even most of those aren't that good. I've played a lot of bad porn flash games over the years. Personally theres lots of room for improvement but theres quite a lot of this attitude "Oh im just in it for a quick buck." or "It's just porn it doesn't deserve effort." which really pisses me off because while you might have a great artist they try to pass off some poorly barebones game as something worth playing just because it has porn in it when really I should of just stuck to making a cg set if they were going to make a game that would make someone want to commit suicide from playing it and then you have a bunch of people trying to hop on this patreon bandwagon while trying to use an EA tactic aka as little effort for as much money as possible. If the market wants to show any major growth beyond this patreon stuff we need more creators and publishers that actually give a damn about what they produce but I don't think thats going to happen because "it's just porn".

 

[HopesGaming]

I feel that it has always been saturated.

The first ones were the big bois. Golden age games that got tons of patrons.
Then it exploded with copy-paste of those games.
Since then it has been a constant flow of games. Even back when I released there were tons of games above and below my thread.

Think one of the main reasons is that people underestimate what it takes to create games. And underestimate how brutally honest the player base can be. And some of them with their brutal demands.

But it balances it out. Tons of new games but also tons of abandoned games.

 

[Joshua Tree]

I feel that it has always been saturated.

The first ones were the big bois. Golden age games that got tons of patrons.
Then it exploded with copy-paste of those games.
Since then it has been a constant flow of games. Even back when I released there were tons of games above and below my thread.

Think one of the main reasons is that people underestimate what it takes to create games. And underestimate how brutally honest the player base can be. And some of them with their brutal demands.

But it balances it out. Tons of new games but also tons of abandoned games.

Well, that work a bit both ways. A fast way to burn yourself out is to like promise new content for your fans/patreons on a monthly basis. You see often on this site alone people start compare creators ability to push out good content and frequency of. Hardly anyone stop to think about what hours and work it take to do said content, and what rl obligations and such the creator have beside of working on the game. I think a lot of these abandoned games is not always because the lack of quick cash/funding, but due to the creator lose interest/get burned out.

 

[HopesGaming]

Well, that work a bit both ways. A fast way to burn yourself out is to like promise new content for your fans/patreons on a monthly basis. You see often on this site alone people start compare creators ability to push out good content and frequency of. Hardly anyone stop to think about what hours and work it take to do said content, and what rl obligations and such the creator have beside of working on the game. I think a lot of these abandoned games is not always because the lack of quick cash/funding, but due to the creator lose interest/get burned out.

That is very true.
But the only time you can lose interest and feel burned out is if your project is not a passion project.
Many do copy paste and then do not get the interest they hoped for. This gives them an empty feeling of working on something they do not burn for and hence they *burn out*.

Another factor is the pressure. Notice all the talk about *milking*. The truth is- only the top 1% is in a place where they are able to *milk*.
The rest is in a constant fight on trying to keep their patrons. One month delay can be a huge blow.
Yet many expect new devs to be able to release in the same schedule as the top 1% that are in a place in which they can work fulltime on their project.
If this new dev is not releasing on the same rate as the big guys (due to real life work and obligations) he or she is now a milker. This hurt their reputation and hence their patrons. Then they either lower quality and go for quantity to be able to handle it. Or, like most, they abandon it.

The pressure of a new dev who is not in a place where he can feel the *reward* yet means they tend to give up.

 

[Joshua Tree]

That is very true.
But the only time you can lose interest and feel burned out is if your project is not a passion project.
Many do copy paste and then do not get the interest they hoped for. This gives them an empty feeling of working on something they do not burn for and hence they *burn out*.

Another factor is the pressure. Notice all the talk about *milking*. The truth is- only the top 1% is in a place where they are able to *milk*.
The rest is in a constant fight on trying to keep their patrons. One month delay can be a huge blow.
Yet many expect new devs to be able to release in the same schedule as the top 1% that are in a place in which they can work fulltime on their project.
If this new dev is not releasing on the same rate as the big guys (due to real life work and obligations) he or she is now a milker. This hurt their reputation and hence their patrons. Then they either lower quality and go for quantity to be able to handle it. Or, like most, they abandon it.

The pressure of a new dev who is not in a place where he can feel the *reward* yet means they tend to give up.

In that regard, being a new creator etc, maybe it would be best to just take your time and tinker on your project before release first release. Kinda help when the introduction is a bit more than 5 min demo with 10 different images etc. Then release it with a nice introduction about yourself and how often updates can be expected. Think its better to be up front in that regard. Tbh, I think its better to not set any time frames or promise any release dates and such. If your work is good enough it will stand on its own merits and you will gain followers. The pitch fork mob is quick to rally once someone break their release dates and such.

 

[polywog]

The first ones were the big bois.

Porn games of the 1890s?

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[HopesGaming]

In that regard, being a new creator etc, maybe it would be best to just take your time and tinker on your project before release first release. Kinda help when the introduction is a bit more than 5 min demo with 10 different images etc. Then release it with a nice introduction about yourself and how often updates can be expected. Think its better to be up front in that regard. Tbh, I think its better to not set any time frames or promise any release dates and such. If your work is good enough it will stand on its own merits and you will gain followers. The pitch fork mob is quick to rally once someone break their release dates and such.

That will not work. How long and well received the first release do not change the demands and the milker comments.
In fact, having a great first release means bigger playerbase which means more demands.
Being transparent does help and every dev should be transparent. With that said- it's not a solution. It's more of a softener.
Having no ETA is not a workable solution either as the playerbase will make their own ETA based on how the other games release (and most of the time how the top 1% that work fulltime releases their game).

This is all from personal experience combined with a lot of communication with fellow devs.
And this is coming from someone who (in my opinion, hehe) has the best player base out there.
Majority of my playerbase is understanding and always positive. Love to communicate with them.
I had a sickness period which caused a delay. Many were supportive but there were also many who gathered the pitchfork. There was even a guy who demanded my patreon to be closed while others demanded that I should not receive any income anymore.
All it takes is to ignore those guys and focus on the majority of the player base who indeed are supportive.
But every dev is different. I've seen many times devs who buckles under the pressure. Some become aggressive in their posts. Some get extremely negative and hostile, leave the forum or in a lot of cases- gives up.

There is no solution to negativity. There will always be people who yell milker and calls a dev lazy. Compare them to the top 1% and so on.

The only way a dev can survive is by changing himself/herself. Don't let emotion control you. Stop getting pressured and just enjoy the ride.
Being lax is actually an advantage in this world, heh.

@polywog
The big bois of our little niche market. Not the big bois of the whole porn industry

 

[polywog]

That will not work. How long and well received the first release do not change the demands and the milker comments.
In fact, having a great first release means bigger playerbase which means more demands.
Being transparent does help and every dev should be transparent. With that said- it's not a solution. It's more of a softener.
Having no ETA is not a workable solution either as the playerbase will make their own ETA based on how the other games release (and most of the time how the top 1% that work fulltime releases their game).

This is all from personal experience combined with a lot of communication with fellow devs.
And this is coming from someone who (in my opinion, hehe) has the best player base out there.
Majority of my playerbase is understanding and always positive. Love to communicate with them.
I had a sickness period which caused a delay. Many were supportive but there were also many who gathered the pitchfork. There was even a guy who demanded my patreon to be closed while others demanded that I should not receive any income anymore.
All it takes is to ignore those guys and focus on the majority of the player base who indeed are supportive.
But every dev is different. I've seen many times devs who buckles under the pressure. Some become aggressive in their posts. Some get extremely negative and hostile, leave the forum or in a lot of cases- gives up.

There is no solution to negativity. There will always be people who yell milker and calls a dev lazy. Compare them to the top 1% and so on.

The only way a dev can survive is by changing himself/herself. Don't let emotion control you. Stop getting pressured and just enjoy the ride.
Being lax is actually an advantage in this world, heh.

@polywog
The big bois of our little niche market. Not the big bois of the whole porn industry

Peep show arcades is where it all began. and remember a nickel for 2 minutes. adjusted for inflation 5 cents is a few dollars today.
1971 porn games made a come back, first VHS machines, then Laserdisc later on.

Then the gambling got into it. Big money in strip poker.

Today and for the foreseeable future, it's all about VR. People pay big bucks to virtually fuck their favorite celebrities.

 

[khumak]

That will not work. How long and well received the first release do not change the demands and the milker comments.
In fact, having a great first release means bigger playerbase which means more demands.
Being transparent does help and every dev should be transparent. With that said- it's not a solution. It's more of a softener.
Having no ETA is not a workable solution either as the playerbase will make their own ETA based on how the other games release (and most of the time how the top 1% that work fulltime releases their game).

I think most people are pretty understanding as long as they know what's going on. If most games are on a 1 month dev cycle but it takes you 6 weeks to produce the kind of upate you want to do and commit to that instead, I think fans will get used to that and accept it. It's when a dev commits to a 1 month cycle, does a few updates that sort of meet that, then the next one takes 6 weeks, then 8 weeks, then no info or update for 3 months, etc. That's the kind of thing that really gets people riled up because everyone's thinking it's been abandoned. Not talking about you specifically, just devs in general. There will always be the troublemakers and haters, gotta have a thick skin.