HTML Abandoned Dubious Practice [v0.3] [Dubious Developers]

[Zaq Reman]

I'm still surprised there are some people who start playing a bimbofication game with all extreme it implies, and at the end say "Ooh please, I don't like bimbos characters. Let me have the choice not to bimbofy them, I don't like extreme".

Are you serious, guys ????

It's as if I was coming on a sissification game and ask if it was possible to not have a boy becoming a girl because I don't like that. Or walking into a KFC asking if I can have a BigMac.


If you don't like extreme body modifications, some like me love it. Even more when it's something rare in these kind of games, because of people like you who always want the same soup : incest, no extreme, no NTR (it's even a meme here on F95Zone...).

I loved stage 4 transformations in Dubious Practice. It is what I was playing for : girls becoming corrupted to the point of becoming slut/goth/bimbo epitomes of what they could be. Even, and I should say "especially", if it's not realistic : adult games are here to bring fantasies,.
You don't like bimbos ? You don't like heavy body transformations ? Fine. Don't play Dubious Practice. 90 % of the other games here on F95zone should respond to your kinks. But, for onece there is something DIFFERENT here, please don't try to make it generic.

To the developers : thanks, and please continue to do what you love and what you planned for this game, without listening to people who aren't accepting fetishes different from what they like.
Difference is good. Fitting into the same mold than everything else is bad.

Uh, all I said is I'd like variety. All 3 options have the exact same body at stage 4 just with different hair and clothes. Also you can't get mad at people saying they're expecting something the game isn't when transformation isn't a tag and there is nothing in the OP to suggest that the training is going to all be variations on bimbofication.

 

[Ambarino]

The red text is extremly hard to read for me. Any way to fix that?

 

[gregers]

There is nothing planned like that at the moment, but I am not against the idea. My main concern is that this would likely end up involving some form of cheating/NTR on at least one path, and people react very strongly to this kind of stuff. In fact, I'm surprised I have not yet gotten complaints for showing Alex having sex with someone else in v.0.2

I wasn't crazy about it, but it wasn't worth making a fuss about, especially as it fit the game's overall theme of bimbofication. I did raise an eyebrow at this being taken even further in 0.3 though, with Alex talking in details about how she's been up all night getting banged by every Tom, Dick, and Harry (but mostly Dick).

It still doesn't hit my personal definition of NTR, as her fucking around is clearly in accordance with the MC's aims and wishes for her development, but it may not be to everyone's taste.

 

[Fiddlesticks 3DX]

Hey folks, Fiddlesticks here. As some of you may know, I took over the art and renders for Dubious Practice a few months back. Most of the renders in the game at this stage are made by myself (specifically all of Alex's Stage 4 looks), but there are quite a few "legacy" scenes (mostly sex scenes) made by UltSpi and Mysterious Stranger (the previous artists) that I've yet to get around to redoing. Those will be done piecemeal with each update.

Anyways, I dropped in to say thanks for playing, and I'm glad you're all enjoying the game! Any and all the feedback is always appreciated! I've been reading through some of the comments, and there's a few points I'd like to address and get some more info on, if possible.

Alex, Stage 4, Manipulation
I think the general consensus among everyone is that Alex's Stage 4 Manipulation is very "meh". Myself and Cassie are also in agreement about this, and we've decided to redo her look for that stage, particularly her face.
The idea was that Alex would become something like a Stepford Wife; the picture-perfect Beverly Hills housewife with flawless features and dressed to perfection. To that end she would have gotten a nose job, facelift, etc. Thing is, Stepford Wives and "Stepfordization" aren't my thing at all, and it looks like I might have gone a bit overboard trying to compensate.
That being said; is it just the face and expression that you guys find flawed, or is it the overall look in general? The outfit, hair, pose, etc? Or is it the whole "Stepford" style that doesn't appeal to you? I'd like to know exactly what needs reworking, otherwise I could end up making her... worse.

Stage 4 is Too Extreme
A few folks have said that Stage 4 "goes too far" or is too extreme (for Domination, Seduction, and Manipulation). This is actually kind of surprising to me, because "extreme" bimbofication, transformation, and body-modification - boobs the size of yoga balls, lips that look like slugs, absurdly-thing waits, etc. - is a real turn-off for me, and is something I actively try to avoid!
So I'd really like to get some details on exactly what it is about Alex's Stage 4 (again, across all routes) that you guys find or consider extreme? Are Domination Alex's lips too plump? Are Seduction Alex's tits too big? Are the outfits too much?

Not Enough Variety
Another point I'm curious about. Similar to the previous question, I'm wondering what exactly everyone has in mind when they think of "variety". Myself and Cassie were going for different "flavors" of bimbo (a party slut Bimbo, a submissive goth Bimbo, and a trophy wife Bimbo), but it seems other folks have different ideas of "variety". Is it that Domination Alex's lips should be the biggest out of the three to reflect her oral fetish? Should Seduction Alex's tits be the biggest out of the three to reflect her "look at me!" Wild Child persona? This is actually already the case, but the differences may not be pronounced enough.

Anyway, if you guys can give me some feedback on those points, it'd be a great help! And if you have any other questions, feel free to ask. I actually have the next two weeks off work, so I hope to do some touch-ups based on the feedback while I have the time.

On final note; Me and Cassie are doing this in our spare time, and we're mostly doing it for fun because we both love "bimbos" and "bimbofication". I know that may not appeal to everyone's tastes, and some folks might prefer the corruption or transformation aspects, but "Bimbofication" is the direction we're going with for the game, and that's set-in-stone. Big Titty Sluts will be the main focus, and while there will be some not-so-big-titties, the Slutty bimbos will play a central role in the game.

 

[Fiddlesticks 3DX]

Liking what I'm seeing so far but I wish I could change the font colors, the blue you're using for domination and the protagonist does not contrast well with that dark background.

I'll speak to Cassue about this, but coding/programming isn't my area sadly, so I can't say if we'll be able to do much, if anything.

Honestly, while I'm enjoying the new artwork for Liz and her "sexy secretary" look; I find the Stage 4 looks for Alex a bit much.

Players had a good range of options, they could change looks and behaviours to match their preferences. Me? The look of Dom Stage 3 was clicking with me.

Problem is, as soon as you hit Stage 4, you're forced into this bimbo fetishism track. And that doesn't interest me. I don't like being forced into a fetish I don't click with.

So I guess, I'm hoping for some more options in the future. I know we'll get more clients, and that's amazing. But I'd still like Alex to stay "natural" as it were. Or minor surgery at the most. And maybe be able to mix and match behaviours. It's odd to me that I can't have a seductive, submissive sex-slave. The 4S girls = best girls!

Bimbos & Bimbofication are pretty much the main focus of the game, so nothing is going to change on that front, sadly. I'm glad you enjoyed Alex's Stage 3 Domination look, but I understand if you felt her Stage 4 was too much. As I mentioned in my previous comment, I'm going to collect some feedback and see if there's some areas I might be able to touch up. So feel free to let me know if there's anything in particular you think could be changed.

Agreed somewhat on the swerve, it might be nice to have some variety between the routes for future characters instead of all ending up at the same body type. That said, if the creators find that type so hot that the journey to it is the reason they're making the game, I get it being non-negotiable, and I'd likely still be interested in future updates either way.

Can I ask what you mean by "variety" and "same body type" exactly? Is it that Domination Alex's lips should be bigger than the other two for example to emphasis her oral fixation? Or that Seduction Alex's tits should be bigger to emphasis her "Look at me!" wild child persona?

I did the manipulation route first, currently doing dom route but didn't finish yet.

My feelings on the stage 4 manipulation is that it's not a good upgrade. This route is basically a trophy wife route. I mean bimbos could be a trophy wife I guess, but the whole concept was to be a girl that rich men would be proud of to show off. Bimbos are not exactly that I think... Bimbos would just be some sugar baby or side chick they fuck. Their trophy wives would be the more classy bombshell type. Breast implants are fine. The dress is fine. The lips are going too far imo.

Can someone post a pic of the other 2 routes in spoilers?

The Stage 4 Manipulation look is going to be redone, the face in particular. Do you have any ideas or references images for what you think would make a better "trophy wife"? Can't promise it'll be an exact copy, but it'll give me a reference point I could use to improve her!

 

[Fiddlesticks 3DX]

Yea, this is my gripe with all bimbo games lol. Their bimbo forms look way worse 99% of the time. I am conflicted on the bimbofication fetish I guess. As a corruption lover, I like what bimbofication symbolizes. A permanent signifier that the chick is done for. She ain't going back and is fully corrupted. At the same time, I really don't like the aesthetics of full on bimbos. Transition stage bimbos are pretty good, but as soon as they go full bimbo, they just look like a monstrosity. The dom route stage 3 is a super hot goth chick. Stage 4 dom route is...

I guess I didn't know this was a bimbo game. Didn't have the tag and the first preview pic showing the 3 routes didn't really hint at bimbo. The journey to get to that stage was really good though. I'll keep playing when new girls are added.

This is a reoccurring thing I find in most TF material, and it's no fault of the developers really. There's always that perfect point where you wish you could hit finish and enjoy the model at their peak, but the theme of TF means carrying them over to that extreme climax where things just end up looking visually absurd, and sadly the urge to trash the model and move onto a new target for TF takes hold. It comes with the genre I guess.

Funnily enough, "extreme" bimbofication, transformations, and body-modifications are a huge turn-off for me; boobs the size of yoga balls, lips that look like slugs, absurdly-thin waists or crazy-huge hips, etc. I actively avoid that in all my renders, even stuff not for Dubious Practice. I was actually approaching the limit of what I'm comfortable doing when I did all of Alex's stage 4 designs!
I like to keep the proportions realistic and believable. As if you could easily imagine this chick being a real-life Instagram model or pornstar... or a mixture of both, which is my favorite.

If there's any areas in particular you guys feel is too overboard (lips, tits, outfits, expressions, etc), feel free to let me know, and I'll see if I can touch up the renders!

 

[gregers]

Hey folks, Fiddlesticks here. As some of you may know, I took over the art and renders for Dubious Practice a few months back. Most of the renders in the game at this stage are made by myself (specifically all of Alex's Stage 4 looks), but there are quite a few "legacy" scenes (mostly sex scenes) made by UltSpi and Mysterious Stranger (the previous artists) that I've yet to get around to redoing. Those will be done piecemeal with each update.

Anyways, I dropped in to say thanks for playing, and I'm glad you're all enjoying the game! Any and all the feedback is always appreciated! I've been reading through some of the comments, and there's a few points I'd like to address and get some more info on, if possible.

Alex, Stage 4, Manipulation
I think the general consensus among everyone is that Alex's Stage 4 Manipulation is very "meh". Myself and Cassie are also in agreement about this, and we've decided to redo her look for that stage, particularly her face.
The idea was that Alex would become something like a Stepford Wife; the picture-perfect Beverly Hills housewife with flawless features and dressed to perfection. To that end she would have gotten a nose job, facelift, etc. Thing is, Stepford Wives and "Stepfordization" aren't my thing at all, and it looks like I might have gone a bit overboard trying to compensate.
That being said; is it just the face and expression that you guys find flawed, or is it the overall look in general? The outfit, hair, pose, etc? Or is it the whole "Stepford" style that doesn't appeal to you? I'd like to know exactly what needs reworking, otherwise I could end up making her... worse.

Stage 4 is Too Extreme
A few folks have said that Stage 4 "goes too far" or is too extreme (for Domination, Seduction, and Manipulation). This is actually kind of surprising to me, because "extreme" bimbofication, transformation, and body-modification - boobs the size of yoga balls, lips that look like slugs, absurdly-thing waits, etc. - is a real turn-off for me, and is something I actively try to avoid!
So I'd really like to get some details on exactly what it is about Alex's Stage 4 (again, across all routes) that you guys find or consider extreme? Are Domination Alex's lips too plump? Are Seduction Alex's tits too big? Are the outfits too much?

Not Enough Variety
Another point I'm curious about. Similar to the previous question, I'm wondering what exactly everyone has in mind when they think of "variety". Myself and Cassie were going for different "flavors" of bimbo (a party slut Bimbo, a submissive goth Bimbo, and a trophy wife Bimbo), but it seems other folks have different ideas of "variety". Is it that Domination Alex's lips should be the biggest out of the three to reflect her oral fetish? Should Seduction Alex's tits be the biggest out of the three to reflect her "look at me!" Wild Child persona? This is actually already the case, but the differences may not be pronounced enough.

Anyway, if you guys can give me some feedback on those points, it'd be a great help! And if you have any other questions, feel free to ask. I actually have the next two weeks off work, so I hope to do some touch-ups based on the feedback while I have the time.

On final note; Me and Cassie are doing this in our spare time, and we're mostly doing it for fun because we both love "bimbos" and "bimbofication". I know that may not appeal to everyone's tastes, and some folks might prefer the corruption or transformation aspects, but "Bimbofication" is the direction we're going with for the game, and that's set-in-stone. Big Titty Sluts will be the main focus, and while there will be some not-so-big-titties, the Slutty bimbos will play a central role in the game.

I mean no insult when I say that this seems pretty heavily inspired by Ye Olde Inner Bimbo, but with more of a focus on gradually corrupting a limited cast of characters rather than many immediate transformations (and using Daz renders instead of real porn).

I think one of the strengths of that game was seeing your bimbofication efforts reflected in wider society leading to an impression that this was happening at a significant scale; this game on the other hand has so far focused on one-and-a-half characters (the full paths for Alex and more limited content for Liz/Buffy): This means that the player gets to know those individual characters much better and form more of a bond with them, but the world at large feels pretty empty so far. I think the game will really come into its own once you start filling out the city a bit more.

I played through the domination path with Alex and didn't find it particularly extreme content-wise. It's a fairly established part of the genre that the end-state of the girls will tend towards unnatural proportions, which may not be particularly beautiful per se but underline their sexual objectification. A game like Deviant Discoveries has a similar issue, with naturally attractive girls being transformed into something more degrading and sexualized, and that game thread is full of similar complaints.

 

[Fiddlesticks 3DX]

I mean no insult when I say that this seems pretty heavily inspired by Ye Olde Inner Bimbo, but with more of a focus on gradually corrupting a limited cast of characters rather than many immediate transformations (and using Daz renders instead of real porn).

I think one of the strengths of that game was seeing your bimbofication efforts reflected in wider society leading to an impression that this was happening at a significant scale; this game on the other hand has so far focused on one-and-a-half characters (the full paths for Alex and more limited content for Liz/Buffy): This means that the player gets to know those individual characters much better and form more of a bond with them, but the world at large feels pretty empty so far. I think the game will really come into its own once you start filling out the city a bit more.

I played through the domination path with Alex and didn't find it particularly extreme content-wise. It's a fairly established part of the genre that the end-state of the girls will tend towards unnatural proportions, which may not be particularly beautiful per se but underline their sexual objectification. A game like Deviant Discoveries has a similar issue, with naturally attractive girls being transformed into something more degrading and sexualized, and that game thread is full of similar complaints.

No insult taken! Honest to God, I've never actually played Inner Bimbo or Deviant Discoveries. Dubious Practice was the first "Bimbofication" game I discovered, and my joining up was as much wanting to stretch my creative muscles on something new (I've only been making 3D renders for little over a year).

So, without spoiling too much of what we have planned for the future, we are planning on filling out the game world a lot more; more characters obviously, as well as more locations, and occasionally some interconnected stories. The gradual changes aren't going to go unnoticed by the locals, and this will open up new locations, new characters, new stories, etc. That's quite a way's off yet though.

Yeah, as the focus of the game is "Bimbofication", some large proportions are to be expected. I try hard to avoid going extreme or "unnatural" though, because that's a huge turn-off for me personally; I try to keep the proportions realistic and believable. What you've seen across all of Alex's Stage 4 routes is the limits of what I'm comfortable doing. There is one character who will go pretty... extreme, but she will be a side character with one path and a very short story. More details on her in the... next update, if I remember right.

The sexual objectification and degrading... Some characters or paths will go down this route, and others will just discover total bliss and a sense of freedom or purpose in their newfound sexuality. Domination Alex for example will literally get off on being used like an object or a plaything, but Seduction Alex will be all about living it up and fucking for the thrill of it, while Manipulation Alex finds a new sense of purpose and happiness in being a dutiful, devoted housewife... with big tits. All of these will be shown in additional sex scenes in future updates. Rest assured, Alex isn't going to disappear just because she's reached the end of her transformation and is no longer a client! She'll be sticking around!
This is one the things we're aiming for with the variety between each path and each character. The intention is to not have every character just be a "dimwitted caricature slut who fuck and suck because she's told to".

 

[elmicho]

this looks interesting

 

[Zaq Reman]

Funnily enough, "extreme" bimbofication, transformations, and body-modifications are a huge turn-off for me

I think the disconnect you're seeing is that everyone's definition of extreme is personal. What's mild to you is way too extreme to some people, and many of them will probably never enjoy this game. There are also some messaging issues; you don't seem to be the thread owner so you couldn't fix that, but within the game itself there's no mention of "bimbo" anywhere that I can see. It's not obvious from the name, and there's no fetishes list on either the splash page or game guide, and also with the prologue choice only one of them has immediate obvious effects on your assistant. So right now someone could get pretty far in thinking that bimbofication might at most be part of one route, or an optional add-on, rather than the main focus with the routes being sub-flavors.

There likewise may be a messaging issue on the end goal here, when the game guide says "The goal of this game is to mold your clients according to your perverted whims in order to improve their life - both sexually and in general." (emphasis added) that kind of conflicts with what some have been saying about the point being these women ending up ruined (which I suspect is more accurately the goal based on the stage 4 dialogue and your comment about it being right at your own limit).

As far as my comment on variety, all 3 of the Stage 4 variations look to me like the have the exact same "mods", or at least near enough that I find myself wondering if I'm imagining any slight difference. I think if you were intending them to read as different you're currently too subtle about it. I will admit with this part it's hard to keep out my personal biases, which are that basically any lip expansion looks like too much to me, and the Stage 4 tits are not so far they're a turn-off but definitely past what I'd call ideal.

Ultimately I think this issue is one of presentation and what the goal is of the game: the intro and guide suggest one thing, Stage 4 and your comments here suggest another. It'd be helpful to clarify things (moreso in the game than in the thread): is the expectation going to be that all characters/routes arrive at a body similar to Stage 4 Alex? If not what's the range? And likewise for the presentation of it, like in that triumphal moment of seeing each character's end state, what thought is meant to be what sends the player over the edge? That this woman will never have a normal life because anyone looking at her will know she's just a fuckdoll? That she can now live her best life? Or more likely again, what's the potential range, and how much does it vary within characters vs between them?

 

[Dubious Developers]

There likewise may be a messaging issue on the end goal here, when the game guide says "The goal of this game is to mold your clients according to your perverted whims in order to improve their life - both sexually and in general." (emphasis added) that kind of conflicts with what some have been saying about the point being these women ending up ruined (which I suspect is more accurately the goal based on the stage 4 dialogue and your comment about it being right at your own limit).

This is important to me so I need to push back a bit on this. But, to be frank and blunt: if you think these women are "ruined," then the problem is with you, not the game. I put a lot of emphasis in this game that every transformation ends up being a net positive for these women from their point of view. They are happier and feel their life is more fulfilling. If you do not believe that any woman can be happy being a "fuckdoll", as you say, well then we'll just to agree to disagree.

Now, don't get me wrong. This game is mostly male fantasy. I try to be as wholesome as I can, but at the end of the day, this is a slutification game with a hypnosis machine. These are not real women, they are characters, so they don't act realistically. And I understand if that turns some people off. Heck, it turns my best IRL friend off. But the goal of the game is not to destroy these women life. It's to improve them through sluttification.

So I see no contradictions between what is written in the game guide and what happens in Stage 4. Alex's life is improved, no matter what path you choose. If this angle turns you off, again, this is a totally valid argument, but then the game is just not for you. We are open to tweaking things based on feedback, but at the end of the day, this is a hobby for us, so yeah, it will reflect our tastes.

There are also some messaging issues; you don't seem to be the thread owner so you couldn't fix that, but within the game itself there's no mention of "bimbo" anywhere that I can see. It's not obvious from the name, and there's no fetishes list on either the splash page or game guide, and also with the prologue choice only one of them has immediate obvious effects on your assistant.

So I went and double-checked the "Genre" section in the thread's main post. Bimbofication and Body Modification are both in there. I don't know how clearer or more explicit I can be.

 

[youpla]

And likewise for the presentation of it, like in that triumphal moment of seeing each character's end state, what thought is meant to be what sends the player over the edge? That this woman will never have a normal life because anyone looking at her will know she's just a fuckdoll? That she can now live her best life?

The big problem, with statements like this one, is that you tend to think that players will be turned off by the final results because they would think that last transformation is not realitisc, hence all the questions :
- Will the girl be happy like that ?
- I cannot imagine she will live her full life wthout people thinking of her as a monster.
- Is she really addict to cum ? That can never happen... She will end in an asylum.
- Her boobs are out of proportion, it's not realistic

Etc etc...
The most notable thing in the last messages on this topic was some people asking to also work on the world, making it accept the bimbo style (just like in Inner Bimbo), becasue he could not imagine bimbos living in our realistic world.

Frankly...
WHO CARES ???

It's fantasy !!
I prefer a game whose focus is on the characters, and not on trying to build something too much extrapolate, unbelievable in the long term and that would ask too much work for almost nothing between each update.
How people in the "game world" will react seeing Sub Alex ? I don't care : what is important is working on the "small circle" of characters, not considering all the consequences. If, anytime a fantasy occurs, justifications and explanations must be brought, no game would exist.
Let the developers do their thing. Yes it's unreal... but that's why it's so exciting !! The premises are not realistic, there's no use in thinking too much over it.

Personally, imagining a woman crazy enough to modify her body like Alex in Sub Path 4, and considering drinking gallons of sperm to have orgasms, non stop... It's enough to arouse me. Considering how the world around her would react, or if it's politically correct, or if she lives in a world where bimbos and cum drinking slut are seen as the new models for young girls... I DON'T CARE AT ALL.

 

[Dubious Developers]

I mean no insult when I say that this seems pretty heavily inspired by Ye Olde Inner Bimbo, but with more of a focus on gradually corrupting a limited cast of characters rather than many immediate transformations (and using Daz renders instead of real porn).

I think one of the strengths of that game was seeing your bimbofication efforts reflected in wider society leading to an impression that this was happening at a significant scale; this game on the other hand has so far focused on one-and-a-half characters (the full paths for Alex and more limited content for Liz/Buffy): This means that the player gets to know those individual characters much better and form more of a bond with them, but the world at large feels pretty empty so far. I think the game will really come into its own once you start filling out the city a bit more.

I played through the domination path with Alex and didn't find it particularly extreme content-wise. It's a fairly established part of the genre that the end-state of the girls will tend towards unnatural proportions, which may not be particularly beautiful per se but underline their sexual objectification. A game like Deviant Discoveries has a similar issue, with naturally attractive girls being transformed into something more degrading and sexualized, and that game thread is full of similar complaints.

So, unlike my artist, I actually have played both Inner Bimbo and Deviant Discoveries and, yeah, they are both huge inspiration for this game. So yeah, if you didn't like those, you won't like this. I actually really like the end transformations in Deviant Discovery, so yeah I should not be surprised our game is receiving the same complaint.

I agree that the world at large feels empty, and that we need more character. We wanted to focus on Alex first so as to understand what each client will need. She was our tutorial client, but for the players and for us as creators. Now that her training is done, we plan on leaving her be for at least one update and coming back to her later. In the meantime, we'll start introducing the new clients and getting them ready for the training to start. So that should improve the game world significantly. I do like how the city change to reflect your action in Ineer Bimbo, and yeah, I'd like to eventually have the same thing happen in Sunny Valley. But it will probably take a while.

 

[youpla]

Now, don't get me wrong. This game is mostly male fantasy. I try to be as wholesome as I can, but at the end of the day, this is a slutification game with a hypnosis machine. These are not real women, they are characters, so they don't act realistically. And I understand if that turns some people off. Heck, it turns my best IRL friend off. But the goal of the game is not to destroy these women life. It's to improve them through sluttification.

There. It's what I was trying to say. It's as simple as that.

 

[Dubious Developers]

Alright, for a more general feedback:

As Fiddlestick said, we hear you about Stage 4, and so I highly encourage you to provide Fiddlesticks with the details he asked for. The more specific you can be, the more we can see if there are some tweaks we can do. Now is the time to speak up, though, because once we start making sex scenes with Alex Stage 4, it will be too much work to redesign her. Now, we can't promise everyone will be happy with the result, because we won't acquiesce to every requested change (especially since some are mutually exclusive) but we will listen.

However, it seems I need to be clear here: slutification/bimbofication and physical transformations are the core of the game. The whole point of using CGI renders instead of real porn is so we can have the girls change in radical ways without the limitations of real porn. So yes, every client in the game will go through plastic surgeries and radical changes. Not all of them will get the same surgery nor will they have the same style, but they will all end up as sluts.

And unfortunately, allowing you to "freeze" the character at stage 3 is not going to be possible. If I did that, then every further sex scene with that character is going to need even more renders to account for the new options. I wish I could allow you to mix and match the stages and the paths at your heart's content, but we simply do not have the ressources to do so, nor am I good enough with coding to do that.

I'm sorry if anyone felt "bamboozled" by the game or felt like we did not communicate what the game was clearly enough. But I hope things are clearer now. I know this will turn some people off, but unfortunately, I cannot please everyone.

 

[gregers]

Alex, Stage 4, Manipulation
I think the general consensus among everyone is that Alex's Stage 4 Manipulation is very "meh". Myself and Cassie are also in agreement about this, and we've decided to redo her look for that stage, particularly her face.
The idea was that Alex would become something like a Stepford Wife; the picture-perfect Beverly Hills housewife with flawless features and dressed to perfection. To that end she would have gotten a nose job, facelift, etc. Thing is, Stepford Wives and "Stepfordization" aren't my thing at all, and it looks like I might have gone a bit overboard trying to compensate.
That being said; is it just the face and expression that you guys find flawed, or is it the overall look in general? The outfit, hair, pose, etc? Or is it the whole "Stepford" style that doesn't appeal to you? I'd like to know exactly what needs reworking, otherwise I could end up making her... worse.

As Fiddlestick said, we hear you about Stage 4, and so I highly encourage you to provide Fiddlesticks with the details he asked for. The more specific you can be, the more we can see if there are some tweaks we can do. Now is the time to speak up, though, because once we start making sex scenes with Alex Stage 4, it will be too much work to redesign her. Now, we can't promise everyone will be happy with the result, because we won't acquiesce to every requested change (especially since some are mutually exclusive) but we will listen.

I'm nitpicking, but since you've brought it up yourselves: I'd expect the Manipulation variant of stage 4 to be the most classically beautiful of the three (the 'Stepford Wife' type, as Fiddlestick put it), but to me the effect is the opposite. Especially the face, where the Seduction path has the more attractive variant (less wide mouth, more defined cheek bones). Fiddlestick's mentioned above that you were going to redo her face anyway, so probably you're already aware of this.

I'm not crazy about the emphasis on pink (reads more Paris Hilton/baby doll type than classy Stepford Wife to me), but that seems to be locked in throughout her development on that path. The pearls are a nice touch (maybe something longer, say a matinée length instead of a choker, to draw the eye to her cleavage), as are the other accessories, but maybe a slightly more elaborate dress would class her up a bit.

(Obviously these are just first impressions offered off the top of my head and you should ignore any and all of it as you see fit.)

 

[Rosen King]

So I went and double-checked the "Genre" section in the thread's main post. Bimbofication and Body Modification are both in there. I don't know how clearer or more explicit I can be.

The critical issue here is that the game is presented as something with multiple routes that each have different ends appealing to different fetishes, and at no point (even in the game itself, up until shortly before stage 4) is it made clear that "every route is just another flavor of bimbo". It's only logical for people to assume that bimbofication is just one of the routes, especially when the very first choice in the game (what to do with Elizabeth) seems to pretty clearly be between "bimbo" and "not bimbo" options.

If a genre tag is present, that just means it exists somewhere in the game, not that it's the primary focus. There's a reason a big portion of my post history is me going into threads for games tagged with Mind Control and asking if it's a major focus or just something that pops up in one or two scenes for plot reasons. There are dozens of games on this site with a Bimbofication tag that don't have it as the primary focus (which I know from firsthand experience, being a mind control fetishist who doesn't like bimbos). When something is the primary focus, it should ideally be telegraphed within the game's description, or at least mentioned in the developer's notes or something. And the game itself - some internal monologue during the intro where the protagonist explains his taste in women would go a long way.

I'll be the first to say that a game should stick to the developer's original vision and people shouldn't ask it to turn into something else, but there was definitely a communication issue that kept people from knowing what that vision was. I'm usually pretty good at getting a sense of what direction the developers want to take a game, so it's really telling that even I was blindsided by this despite playing through every prior update.

 

[Synizer]

I'll try and give a bit more detailed analysis on what feels wrong about the stage 4s, while also using Deviant Discoveries as a somewhat reference of what end stages should be.

For starters as I said before they feel like they're skipping a step. In deviant discoveries the alteration of their bodies was a mid stage and even then they didn't go from their normal body proportions into the extremes each stage usually added a bit more to that's transformation, so it felt like a gradual thing. Stages 1-3 here are all style altering, with stage 2 being a generic slutification before choosing your path. So really it does feel like there should be Stages 1-2 to loosen them up and begin steering them down their paths and then a further 3 stages once in a path to get to their end.

As for how the renders for stage 4 look, they're not bad but there are some off putting things.

Dom - For some reason her head in this one looks a bit off, the eyes aren't the same shape that they should be as well as her actual head shape up til that point has been quite square but now looks oval and thinner, this could all be down to her opening her mouth to lick her lips but it still looks a little off to the point that it doesn't really look like Alex anymore. Also this is more a perference thing but not a great fan of the hair, seems like a downgrade from the stage 3 and with an oral fetish you really want the longer hair for something to grab and use as leverage ;p.

Manip - Yeah the lips make her look like the Joker but considering they are in line with how the others mouths look I have no idea how to give her bigger lips without that being a horrible consequence. As for how she looks compared to stage 3, in stage 3 she looks like she's going to make an excellent trophy wife, she's standing up straight, has a load of dignity and is looking extremely lady like then compared to stage 4 she doesn't even look like the same person anymore. She's shorter for one for some reason but that's neither here nor there as she's seemingly lost that ladylike edge that she'd be the queen bee bimbo of the stepford wives. Anyway if you do end up redoing her I think focusing on that more Queen Bee aspect to her could make her absolutely legendary.

Sedu- I gotta admit seeing this one was the most disappointing, not because it wasn't good, believe me I think it's the best looking out of the lot of them because you can still see it's Alex even with her extreme body changes. I was disappointed because it's gone the very generic Harley Quinn look. I did then take a look at the 'alt' looks for stage 4 and while the other alts for 4 are I think considerably worse than the ones we've been given, Alex's alt Sedu I think is almost spot on and I kinda dig the effect of taking her original outfit and just altering it at each stage slightly to fit more with her new outlook. Not to mention the size of her boobs being more realistic make it look great. So that would be the suggestion for Sedu, more in line with the alt but keep the face exactly how it is because you hit the ball out of the park with it.

Anyway to both dev and artist I will say I'm always excited to see this when it appears in updates as really we lacking in games such as this and even though you're doing this in your spare time it's already of a higher quality and love than 90% of the games that people churn out. So don't let peoples critistism get you down what you've both made here so far is a game I will remember for a long long time, and I'm pretty sure that when another game like this comes along people will be quoting this as a game that inspired them.

 

[gregers]

In deviant discoveries the alteration of their bodies was a mid stage and even then they didn't go from their normal body proportions into the extremes each stage usually added a bit more to that's transformation, so it felt like a gradual thing.

A minor point, but from a story standpoint it's easier to do the gradual physical transformation in DD, where it can be handwaved as a result of the drugs, than in this game, where it would involve the character having several rounds of invasive cosmetic surgery within a few weeks of each other.

Not that you couldn't write your way around that, but it is a complication.

 

[Synaxis]

Did you go back to the office and call her in for a session? That's how you trigger it.

Anyway, I agree that it feels like every route suddenly merged into a bimbo route. It's one thing if the game was always meant to be a bimbofication game, but considering that the premise from the start was to branch off into different routes to turn your victims into different archetypes, having them all end up as some variation of the bimbo archetype is certainly a disappointment.

Yeah, I've been calling her for multiple sessions and nothing happens.