VN Ren'Py Eternum [v0.7.5 Public] [Caribdis]

[Jormund]

The "one route is the true route" hearkens back to the old-school way of writing VNs and was present in most eroges that aren't your average "school setting with more than a dozen love interests or so and no actual plot except getting laid." Branching paths are pretty rare, with some only "branching" after you've done one route, with the rest being treated as unlocks that pad the VN's overall runtime (e.g. Fate/Stay Night's and Full metal Daemon Muramasa's route structure).

The trouble with branching paths IMO is that for a story that basically spans multiple hours of reading and watching cutscenes play out, having branching paths only adds a lot to the dev time required to make said paths feel "meaningful." It's why AVNs like BaDIK basically take a year per update with only an hour or so of gameplay per route (mayhaps even shorter) because the dev has to take into account the multiple routes that exist in that game as well as the "other stuff" that he likes to add because of personal preference...

/eyetwitches at he remembers DPC's unrestrained fetish of adding minigames to his work

...anyhow, the thing with Cari is that he obviously has a story to tell and he wants to tell that with the idea that all members of the harem have something to contribute to the plot and not just act as love interests that the protagonist can choose to screw. With OIAL he had only succeeded in pulling this off with Lauren and Judie, with certain members of the harem having some contribution to the plot but ultimately fell off when they basically served their purpose...and with some not even contributing anything at all and their inclusion is just because they happen to exist (i.e. Jasmine, Iris).

So with Eternum Cari is basically rectifying this issue by making all of the harem members contribute to the plot for the long haul and that itself is a double-edged sword as you have seen, because if you DON'T play it as intended by the dev you're basically locking yourself out on huge chunks of the narrative by going with a one-girl route as each of the girl's route has some contribution to the overall plot. This isn't like in most modern AVNs where branching paths or choices actually matter. On the other hand, doing it this way allows Cari to basically write meatier updates while balancing everyone's desire for lewds by making at least half of the girls have some scenes per update (and this will increase as time goes on, especially once we start hitting the multiple girls per scene segment of the story).

So at the end of the day, this is basically just Cari knowing what story he wants to write, understanding the shortcomings of going with writing said narrative, but ultimately sticking to his guns as the overall goal is to make the story he wants to make with only him doing most of the legwork and doing so in a timely manner and without having to spend more time than necessary having to write multiple paths and taking into account what choices the player made and the potential consequences for said choices. Granted, there ARE choices that the player obviously has to make that obviously would lead to different outcomes (i.e. who lives and who dies in the Collector whodunit, whose side you chose in the latter half of the Andromeda event), but they likely won't completely affect the overall narrative that Cari wants to make. And that is fine given the type of narrative that Eternum has (which is a long-format narrative and not a choice-and-consequences style of story).

I don't have much to add, you have a point and I already had an idea, I certainly said a system of achievements would increase Cari's work even more, and then it depends on him, in the end we see the story he wants to tell and appreciate it, it's just strange to feel that only I'm not losing anything so I can start taking all the "certainty" choices and moving forward even though I prefer to play "blind" if I do that it would be so penalized losing content, and that's why I can only leave it here, but certainly everything you said is valid and I just want to be able to help directly or indirectly as possible, wanting to support his patreon in the future. But as you said, it's a double-edged sword, where I just feel that I should follow the straight line drawn as it was initially thought by the dev, and going out of it will be penalized even though I would skip a charlote route with pleasure XD.

And with that I'm not saying that any of them are bad so far they are all wonderful and well developed although everyone has their favorites. And in the end, you won't be losing anything, just trying to get everything possible, without being afraid and that takes away a certain weight and I just feel like I'm actually reading a story in a straight line, even if at least like in the game of detective, you can have a certain agency, it's a way around this, and I wouldn't agree with having to end route X to release others.

As I said at the beginning, everything you pointed out is in fact valid, and all that remains is to wait and support and help as possible to deliver the best product as Cari wishes it to be.

 

[Jormund]

The "one route is the true route" hearkens back to the old-school way of writing VNs and was present in most eroges that aren't your average "school setting with more than a dozen love interests or so and no actual plot except getting laid." Branching paths are pretty rare, with some only "branching" after you've done one route, with the rest being treated as unlocks that pad the VN's overall runtime (e.g. Fate/Stay Night's and Full metal Daemon Muramasa's route structure).

The trouble with branching paths IMO is that for a story that basically spans multiple hours of reading and watching cutscenes play out, having branching paths only adds a lot to the dev time required to make said paths feel "meaningful." It's why AVNs like BaDIK basically take a year per update with only an hour or so of gameplay per route (mayhaps even shorter) because the dev has to take into account the multiple routes that exist in that game as well as the "other stuff" that he likes to add because of personal preference...

/eyetwitches at he remembers DPC's unrestrained fetish of adding minigames to his work

...anyhow, the thing with Cari is that he obviously has a story to tell and he wants to tell that with the idea that all members of the harem have something to contribute to the plot and not just act as love interests that the protagonist can choose to screw. With OIAL he had only succeeded in pulling this off with Lauren and Judie, with certain members of the harem having some contribution to the plot but ultimately fell off when they basically served their purpose...and with some not even contributing anything at all and their inclusion is just because they happen to exist (i.e. Jasmine, Iris).

So with Eternum Cari is basically rectifying this issue by making all of the harem members contribute to the plot for the long haul and that itself is a double-edged sword as you have seen, because if you DON'T play it as intended by the dev you're basically locking yourself out on huge chunks of the narrative by going with a one-girl route as each of the girl's route has some contribution to the overall plot. This isn't like in most modern AVNs where branching paths or choices actually matter. On the other hand, doing it this way allows Cari to basically write meatier updates while balancing everyone's desire for lewds by making at least half of the girls have some scenes per update (and this will increase as time goes on, especially once we start hitting the multiple girls per scene segment of the story).

So at the end of the day, this is basically just Cari knowing what story he wants to write, understanding the shortcomings of going with writing said narrative, but ultimately sticking to his guns as the overall goal is to make the story he wants to make with only him doing most of the legwork and doing so in a timely manner and without having to spend more time than necessary having to write multiple paths and taking into account what choices the player made and the potential consequences for said choices. Granted, there ARE choices that the player obviously has to make that obviously would lead to different outcomes (i.e. who lives and who dies in the Collector whodunit, whose side you chose in the latter half of the Andromeda event), but they likely won't completely affect the overall narrative that Cari wants to make. And that is fine given the type of narrative that Eternum has (which is a long-format narrative and not a choice-and-consequences style of story).

and in fact, I disagree with this talk of only 1 true end of many, since for me the ending that I got and wanted in my run will be what counts for me.

The only point I currently have is that there is only 1 right answer here to take it in just one way so as not to lose anything at the end and I would only leave it if the girl in question I don't like. and as much as this should be a good thing, because I'm not missing anything I can like and see the hapy end of all including the ones I liked the most or not, I also feel that well there is only 1 correct answer at the end and if I leave them I will be just losing.

 

[Dorfnutter]

and in fact, I disagree with this talk of only 1 true end of many, since for me the ending that I got and wanted in my run will be what counts for me.

Just mentioned that because that's how Cari did it with his past game, where

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and how "meatier" it felt compared to the solo endings...not to mention the fact that Eternum references a few things from said end, with one event that happened there being referenced in Orion's introductory monologue.

And given that Cari has already mentioned that the harem end is once again being planned for Eternum as the "meatier" ending...



(Pic sauce:

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)

...yeah, the chances of him pulling the "harem end will be acknowledged as the true end in the next game" card all over again is pretty high.

Again, you can discount that if you want, but don't be surprised if Cari chooses to go that route in the eventual next game. /shrugs

 

[Elhemeer]

Soowwwwy....
View attachment 2846355

Spoiler: Awwwww ...

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[Dylan741]

Spoiler: Awwwww ...

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Spoiler: ^______^

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[Elhemeer]

The "one route is the true route" hearkens back to the old-school way of writing VNs and was present in most eroges that aren't your average "school setting with more than a dozen love interests or so and no actual plot except getting laid." Branching paths are pretty rare, with some only "branching" after you've done one route, with the rest being treated as unlocks that pad the VN's overall runtime (e.g. Fate/Stay Night's and Full metal Daemon Muramasa's route structure).

The trouble with branching paths IMO is that for a story that basically spans multiple hours of reading and watching cutscenes play out, having branching paths only adds a lot to the dev time required to make said paths feel "meaningful." It's why AVNs like BaDIK basically take a year per update with only an hour or so of gameplay per route (mayhaps even shorter) because the dev has to take into account the multiple routes that exist in that game as well as the "other stuff" that he likes to add because of personal preference...

/eyetwitches at he remembers DPC's unrestrained fetish of adding minigames to his work

...anyhow, the thing with Cari is that he obviously has a story to tell and he wants to tell that with the idea that all members of the harem have something to contribute to the plot and not just act as love interests that the protagonist can choose to screw. With OIAL he had only succeeded in pulling this off with Lauren and Judie, with certain members of the harem having some contribution to the plot but ultimately fell off when they basically served their purpose...and with some not even contributing anything at all and their inclusion is just because they happen to exist (i.e. Jasmine, Iris).

So with Eternum Cari is basically rectifying this issue by making all of the harem members contribute to the plot for the long haul and that itself is a double-edged sword as you have seen, because if you DON'T play it as intended by the dev you're basically locking yourself out on huge chunks of the narrative by going with a one-girl route as each of the girl's route has some contribution to the overall plot. This isn't like in most modern AVNs where branching paths or choices actually matter. On the other hand, doing it this way allows Cari to basically write meatier updates while balancing everyone's desire for lewds by making at least half of the girls have some scenes per update (and this will increase as time goes on, especially once we start hitting the multiple girls per scene segment of the story).

So at the end of the day, this is basically just Cari knowing what story he wants to write, understanding the shortcomings of going with writing said narrative, but ultimately sticking to his guns as the overall goal is to make the story he wants to make with only him doing most of the legwork and doing so in a timely manner and without having to spend more time than necessary having to write multiple paths and taking into account what choices the player made and the potential consequences for said choices. Granted, there ARE choices that the player obviously has to make that obviously would lead to different outcomes (i.e. who lives and who dies in the Collector whodunit, whose side you chose in the latter half of the Andromeda event), but they likely won't completely affect the overall narrative that Cari wants to make. And that is fine given the type of narrative that Eternum has (which is a long-format narrative and not a choice-and-consequences style of story).

For this and about 75% of the posts from

(and Dylan741's super-hug)

*This message has been brought to you by "FARL" (Fappers Against Reaction Limits)*

Second, I could only get through about half of your thesis blue_vaito, mostly because the vibe I was getting from it was:

"This is a fun game. I'm enjoying it. But it's not how I would make the game. Can you, dev, change the game so it's how I would like the game to be? Thanks, 'kay, bye!"​

Maybe that's not what you intended, and maybe if I hadn't just woke up (which says something about me that I'm visiting F95Zone first thing in the morning, I suppose) I'd have got more out of it, but that's one of the things that gets my BP up so I had to stop reading.

On the other hand, you looked like you were being mostly polite about it, so even though it's usually an auto-list offense (in my head) I feel like you're not intending to be a Troll™, so I'll just wish you well and hope you enjoy the rest of your experience here.

 

[Ellyx]

The "one route is the true route" hearkens back to the old-school way of writing VNs and was present in most eroges that aren't your average "school setting with more than a dozen love interests or so and no actual plot except getting laid." Branching paths are pretty rare, with some only "branching" after you've done one route, with the rest being treated as unlocks that pad the VN's overall runtime (e.g. Fate/Stay Night's and Full metal Daemon Muramasa's route structure).

The trouble with branching paths IMO is that for a story that basically spans multiple hours of reading and watching cutscenes play out, having branching paths only adds a lot to the dev time required to make said paths feel "meaningful." It's why AVNs like BaDIK basically take a year per update with only an hour or so of gameplay per route (mayhaps even shorter) because the dev has to take into account the multiple routes that exist in that game as well as the "other stuff" that he likes to add because of personal preference...

/eyetwitches at he remembers DPC's unrestrained fetish of adding minigames to his work

...anyhow, the thing with Cari is that he obviously has a story to tell and he wants to tell that with the idea that all members of the harem have something to contribute to the plot and not just act as love interests that the protagonist can choose to screw. With OIAL he had only succeeded in pulling this off with Lauren and Judie, with certain members of the harem having some contribution to the plot but ultimately fell off when they basically served their purpose...and with some not even contributing anything at all and their inclusion is just because they happen to exist (i.e. Jasmine, Iris).

So with Eternum Cari is basically rectifying this issue by making all of the harem members contribute to the plot for the long haul and that itself is a double-edged sword as you have seen, because if you DON'T play it as intended by the dev you're basically locking yourself out on huge chunks of the narrative by going with a one-girl route as each of the girl's route has some contribution to the overall plot. This isn't like in most modern AVNs where branching paths or choices actually matter. On the other hand, doing it this way allows Cari to basically write meatier updates while balancing everyone's desire for lewds by making at least half of the girls have some scenes per update (and this will increase as time goes on, especially once we start hitting the multiple girls per scene segment of the story).

So at the end of the day, this is basically just Cari knowing what story he wants to write, understanding the shortcomings of going with writing said narrative, but ultimately sticking to his guns as the overall goal is to make the story he wants to make with only him doing most of the legwork and doing so in a timely manner and without having to spend more time than necessary having to write multiple paths and taking into account what choices the player made and the potential consequences for said choices. Granted, there ARE choices that the player obviously has to make that obviously would lead to different outcomes (i.e. who lives and who dies in the Collector whodunit, whose side you chose in the latter half of the Andromeda event), but they likely won't completely affect the overall narrative that Cari wants to make. And that is fine given the type of narrative that Eternum has (which is a long-format narrative and not a choice-and-consequences style of story).

I couldn't agree more with your post and knowing that Caribdis works mostly solo on his game, I don't even know how long an update would take him if he was multi-branching like some others AVN, given the quality he puts into it.

Overall I think it's a great AVN even with a "linear" story with well-written characters and some effort in building some kind of "lore"(with a lot of references too). The story has everything it takes to be a good Harem AVN (because despite the "solo" endings the game is clearly structured like that) which is a well-balanced story between humor/seriousness/obscenity.

(and thank you for your long posts it helps me train my English for my thesis and my exams )

 

[Jormund]

For this and about 75% of the posts from
View attachment 2846542
(and Dylan741's super-hug)

*This message has been brought to you by "FARL" (Fappers Against Reaction Limits)*

Second, I could only get through about half of your thesis blue_vaito, mostly because the vibe I was getting from it was:

"This is a fun game. I'm enjoying it. But it's not how I would make the game. Can you, dev, change the game so it's how I would like the game to be? Thanks, 'kay, bye!"​

Maybe that's not what you intended, and maybe if I hadn't just woke up (which says something about me that I'm visiting F95Zone first thing in the morning, I suppose) I'd have got more out of it, but that's one of the things that gets my BP up so I had to stop reading.

On the other hand, you looked like you were being mostly polite about it, so even though it's usually an auto-list offense (in my head) I feel like you're not intending to be a Troll™, so I'll just wish you well and hope you enjoy the rest of your experience here.

I want to apologize if I gave off that "troll" vibe or something, and at no point did I just want to throw it at Dev and say he should do X or Y even more so which are choices, I just wanted to share my thoughts and some thoughts after I play, sharing my experience which was completely positive I must say and I look forward to contributing in the future with patreon possibly when I can and waiting for the full game to come out, so I just brought this little thought that came to me in these parts, and I wanted to leave it here if Carl wants to take note of any of this and can contribute I don't know just like I said it was just a few things that I felt while playing.

So I left my raw opinion even though I tried to point out that even though I only highlighted these considerations about some parts of the game I enjoyed reading everything with pleasure, I look forward to more and I feel that in a way Cari has not only improved a lot as in the "game of detective" or with the "alien" it gives you a lot of agency and was a way to bring a sense of "heaviness" even if it doesn't affect the main narrative.

Just like Dorfnutter, mentioned above and I was able to exchange an idea with him, and I agree that only this detail would change a lot in everything, as this is also a choice of Cari himself. And without knowing it, it seems that I superficially scratched something more controversial and older, and that apparently is a reason for "hate" as I saw it very superficially, I just want to apologize and avoid being seen like that, mainly with Dev who on the one hand I just wanted to leave my thoughts post game, it might seem like an "attack" or like you said "Can you, dev, change the game so it's how I would like the game to be? Thanks, 'kay, bye!", and that's it something i would like to pass on just like anything stressful for everyone, it really wasn't the intention, and also as mentioned english is not my primary language so i apologize if there was any misinterpretation as well.

As I said, I don't know how far the extension of all this goes, and the last thing I draw is to bring hate, or contribute to it, even bringing this vision that may have already been built from other previous experiences of mine, or just genuine thoughts.

I am very verbose, and I write large texts to say so little that I feel bad for making you read all of this, even more so with my average English.

 

[hu lover]

I want to apologize if I gave off that "troll" vibe or something, and at no point did I just want to throw it at Dev and say he should do X or Y even more so which are choices, I just wanted to share my thoughts and some thoughts after I play, sharing my experience which was completely positive I must say and I look forward to contributing in the future with patreon possibly when I can and waiting for the full game to come out, so I just brought this little thought that came to me in these parts, and I wanted to leave it here if Carl wants to take note of any of this and can contribute I don't know just like I said it was just a few things that I felt while playing.

So I left my raw opinion even though I tried to point out that even though I only highlighted these considerations about some parts of the game I enjoyed reading everything with pleasure, I look forward to more and I feel that in a way Cari has not only improved a lot as in the "game of detective" or with the "alien" it gives you a lot of agency and was a way to bring a sense of "heaviness" even if it doesn't affect the main narrative.

Just like Dorfnutter, mentioned above and I was able to exchange an idea with him, and I agree that only this detail would change a lot in everything, as this is also a choice of Cari himself. And without knowing it, it seems that I superficially scratched something more controversial and older, and that apparently is a reason for "hate" as I saw it very superficially, I just want to apologize and avoid being seen like that, mainly with Dev who on the one hand I just wanted to leave my thoughts post game, it might seem like an "attack" or like you said "Can you, dev, change the game so it's how I would like the game to be? Thanks, 'kay, bye!", and that's it something i would like to pass on just like anything stressful for everyone, it really wasn't the intention, and also as mentioned english is not my primary language so i apologize if there was any misinterpretation as well.

As I said, I don't know how far the extension of all this goes, and the last thing I draw is to bring hate, or contribute to it, even bringing this vision that may have already been built from other previous experiences of mine, or just genuine thoughts.

Thank you for being cordial. I would give you a "like" for that post, but unfortunately I am out of ammo, and have to wait the next day because it brings up a message prompt saying that I have to wait the next day to add more likes for posts.

 

[Jormund]

I couldn't agree more with your post and knowing that Caribdis works mostly solo on his game, I don't even know how long an update would take him if he was multi-branching like some others AVN, given the quality he puts into it.

Overall I think it's a great AVN even with a "linear" story with well-written characters and some effort in building some kind of "lore"(with a lot of references too). The story has everything it takes to be a good Harem AVN (because despite the "solo" endings the game is clearly structured like that) which is a well-balanced story between humor/seriousness/obscenity.

(and thank you for your long posts it helps me train my English for my thesis and my exams )

In a way, train mine too, and I appreciate that you have seen my view like this, as I realized from Dorfnutter's post that apparently a discussion close to this one does not have a positive track record and I would never have wanted to bring it up that way.
And in short I'll still prefer a good one, not just a good one great linear story as the author intended, and him being able to bring his best, and also realize his own improvement since his previous works.
than he is going to do something with several ramifications and it can become mediocre not being able to work well on the whole or forcing himself to something that would consume him more. In this case, it is much better for him to be able to bring his vision, so that everyone can appreciate and develop all the characters well for his entire audience, also in the way he would like, as much as he has problems with harens, it is only when they are not well developed, and here this is far from being the case.
Giving to see a considerable improvement in the treatment of the characters and feeling that everyone is contributing equally at least, where in his previous work once in a Life time it was possible to notice + only the two sisters, who were in fact the main focus and the others in the harem they may have been sidelined, and not have had a function other than existing.

and that's all already amazing and if it's just one person actually alone having to do all that I just hope that everything can work out and he can just get better so he can bring what he really wants to life in the best way possible.

 

[hu lover]

Nice it seems the reaction limit is finally over
View attachment 2846736

Thank goodness.

 

[Elhemeer]

I want to apologize if I gave off that "troll" vibe or something, and at no point did I just want to throw it at Dev and say he should do X or Y even more so which are choices, I just wanted to share my thoughts and some thoughts after I play, sharing my experience which was completely positive I must say and I look forward to contributing in the future with patreon possibly when I can and waiting for the full game to come out, so I just brought this little thought that came to me in these parts, and I wanted to leave it here if Carl wants to take note of any of this and can contribute I don't know just like I said it was just a few things that I felt while playing.

So I left my raw opinion even though I tried to point out that even though I only highlighted these considerations about some parts of the game I enjoyed reading everything with pleasure, I look forward to more and I feel that in a way Cari has not only improved a lot as in the "game of detective" or with the "alien" it gives you a lot of agency and was a way to bring a sense of "heaviness" even if it doesn't affect the main narrative.

Just like Dorfnutter, mentioned above and I was able to exchange an idea with him, and I agree that only this detail would change a lot in everything, as this is also a choice of Cari himself. And without knowing it, it seems that I superficially scratched something more controversial and older, and that apparently is a reason for "hate" as I saw it very superficially, I just want to apologize and avoid being seen like that, mainly with Dev who on the one hand I just wanted to leave my thoughts post game, it might seem like an "attack" or like you said "Can you, dev, change the game so it's how I would like the game to be? Thanks, 'kay, bye!", and that's it something i would like to pass on just like anything stressful for everyone, it really wasn't the intention, and also as mentioned english is not my primary language so i apologize if there was any misinterpretation as well.

As I said, I don't know how far the extension of all this goes, and the last thing I draw is to bring hate, or contribute to it, even bringing this vision that may have already been built from other previous experiences of mine, or just genuine thoughts.

I am very verbose, and I write large texts to say so little that I feel bad for making you read all of this, even more so with my average English.

Thank you for being cordial. I would give you a "like" for that post, but unfortunately I am out of ammo, and have to wait the next day because it brings up a message prompt saying that I have to wait the next day to add more likes for posts.

*This message has been brought to you by "FARL" (Fappers Against Reaction Limits)*

 

[hu lover]

View attachment 2846793
*This message has been brought to you by "FARL" (Fappers Against Reaction Limits)*

Spoiler: Not sparta

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The fapper community will rise again

 

[Takkatakka]

/Imagines sleeping with Charlotte with this awaiting Orion

View attachment 2846317

...

Me:

View attachment 2846325

If they're natural they are allowed to hang a bit. That really isn't the problem with her, in my opinion. She is just very arrogant and completely overestimating her beauty.

 

[Elhemeer]

Spoiler: Not sparta

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The fapper community will rise again

*This message has been brought to you by "FARL" (Fappers Against Reaction Limits)*

Okay, 2 hours of forums is enough, time for breakfast and sunlight ...

 

[Dorfnutter]

If they're natural they are allowed to hang a bit. That really isn't the problem with her, in my opinion.

/looks at this post

...

/looks back at the scene



/imagines Cari making a scene with her just for the lulz

...

/sighs and lies down on the road

View attachment I3cE5nHi_V1.mp4












(yes I'd rather have my head crushed than see those abominations of hers swaying about because you know Cari will go through the extra trouble of animating that just for hilarity points and I don't want to scar my mind with that, thank you very much)

 

[Takkatakka]

/looks at this post

...

/looks back at the scene

View attachment 2846830

/imagines Cari making a scene with her just for the lulz

...

/sighs and lies down on the road

View attachment 2846843












(yes I'd rather have my head crushed than see those abominations of hers swaying about because you know Cari will go through the extra trouble of animating that just for hilarity points and I don't want to scar my mind with that, thank you very much)

I stand with what I wrote.

I found most "artificially enhanced" tits look a lot worse than natural ones that hang a bit. Just my personal taste.

 

[Ellyx]

View attachment 2846830

Yeah the shadow on the picture is enough to imagine how they looks

 

[Dorfnutter]

I stand with what I wrote.

I found most "artificially enhanced" tits look a lot worse than natural ones that hang a bit. Just my personal taste.

I mean there's "natural sag" and then there's "holy wrinkled noodles batman" sag (which Charlotte is implied to fall under)...but sure you do you man. DX

 

[Son of Durin]

Please don't quarrel.

I facepalmed for two reasons: it's a really bad dad joke, and I didn't come up with it first!