Wasn't talking about Kotick specifically, but the fact game developers have for years been crying crocodile tears about the evil corporate businessmen not letting them make good games, and yet when they were given the chance to make their dream game, a true passion project, most of them ended up delivering nothing, and the few that did "finish" their project just ended pushing a rotting corpse out the door.
Unreal Engine Fallen Doll: Operation Lovecraft [v0.4.9 Cracked] [Project Helius]
- Thread starter monroe
- Start date
- Aug 18, 2018
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AAA publishers in general then, Kotick just happened to have a few choice fuckups from recent memory. The irony of billion dollar studios switching to the exact same development model pioneered by indie darlings because it turned out to be amazing for scams is great.
- Jun 5, 2017
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Almost 10k drop in patreons eh? Well at this rate it won't be too long till they have to abandon denuvo because the cost will outweight the gain.
- Jun 9, 2021
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The Denuvo thing will hit them hard. Just think about it, companies usually go for denuvo to secure sales for the first year of their releases, then drop it afterward. We saw this in many AAA games before but Operation Fallen Doll hasn't even been released yet, they are paying for protection to protect an excuse of an early access game.
- Jun 9, 2021
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Baldur’s Gate 3 did Bear sex before Operation Lovecraft did Galatea Dogging with the homies.
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- Jun 9, 2021
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I have some sad news guys...
ILLUSION Notice of Termination of Activities
Thank you for your continued patronage of our products.
We are pleased to announce that as of August 18, 2023 at 10:00 (Japan time),
We are pleased to announce that we will discontinue the development and sales of ILLUSION products as of August 18, 2023 at 10:00 (Japan time).
We have explored various directions for the continuation of our business, and we regret to inform you that we will not be able to continue,
We regret to inform you that we have decided that it will be difficult to continue our business.
We would like to express our deepest gratitude for your kindness and support over the years and sincerely apologize for the inconvenience this announcement may cause.
Customers who have already purchased and downloaded the game will be able to continue playing it.
Thank you very much for your patronage of ILLUSION products.
ILLUSION Notice of Termination of Activities
Thank you for your continued patronage of our products.
We are pleased to announce that as of August 18, 2023 at 10:00 (Japan time),
We are pleased to announce that we will discontinue the development and sales of ILLUSION products as of August 18, 2023 at 10:00 (Japan time).
We have explored various directions for the continuation of our business, and we regret to inform you that we will not be able to continue,
We regret to inform you that we have decided that it will be difficult to continue our business.
We would like to express our deepest gratitude for your kindness and support over the years and sincerely apologize for the inconvenience this announcement may cause.
Customers who have already purchased and downloaded the game will be able to continue playing it.
Thank you very much for your patronage of ILLUSION products.
The bragging from Helius in the discord over illusion shutting down followed by someone asking him about a seemingly well-known bug only to respond with "did you submit a ticket?"
He must be chinese with this smug, proud behaviour and greed he has.
He must be chinese with this smug, proud behaviour and greed he has.
- Apr 22, 2021
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Damn. Announced right after Steam Summer Sale ended.
Would've grabbed their stuff and get some Steam trading cards had they announced this earlier, but it's obvious why it's done this way.
He's onto the news already? Would be great if screenshot of that could be shared.
Sounds like he really have the audacity to compare themselves to an industry leader. Illusion isn't the best lately, but at least they didn't milk Patreon money endlessly and they delivered complete (albeit buggy) products.
If only Scamlius' money hose could somehow be diverted to Illusion, or any other more deserving game dev.
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- Nov 9, 2022
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Few words of grounded reality to the poeple that still believe in this game.
I just want to point out something that isn't very obvious.
Any Early Access game or Patreon based game that is in the making, has sort of clue if its even possible to finish the game. That clue is the ammount of time it took to release new content in recent time, and the quality of those updates.
So for example if there is some fairly new Early Access game on Steam, and within a year of developement devs released two small updates that arent even 2% of finished game yet - just forget that you're ever going to see that game finished.
It's not like all of the sudden with touch of the magic wand they speed up developement, learn how to code & optimize etc. It is always going to be half assed product that barely works and is in the infinite loop of being decade away from being finished, no matter how many years have passed.
With patreon games like Fallen Doll, Wild Life etc. it's even worse, becouse as long as they keep promise of the impossible dream ( originaly pitched game ) - money will flow. So all of the above applies + greed of milking people who are " Believers " .
This is why only small games made by indie studios are actualy legit and sometimes even very successful. But this ? it's like an oldschool conjob. Magical potion that makes your hair grow. Chicken that knows math.
I just want to point out something that isn't very obvious.
Any Early Access game or Patreon based game that is in the making, has sort of clue if its even possible to finish the game. That clue is the ammount of time it took to release new content in recent time, and the quality of those updates.
So for example if there is some fairly new Early Access game on Steam, and within a year of developement devs released two small updates that arent even 2% of finished game yet - just forget that you're ever going to see that game finished.
It's not like all of the sudden with touch of the magic wand they speed up developement, learn how to code & optimize etc. It is always going to be half assed product that barely works and is in the infinite loop of being decade away from being finished, no matter how many years have passed.
With patreon games like Fallen Doll, Wild Life etc. it's even worse, becouse as long as they keep promise of the impossible dream ( originaly pitched game ) - money will flow. So all of the above applies + greed of milking people who are " Believers " .
This is why only small games made by indie studios are actualy legit and sometimes even very successful. But this ? it's like an oldschool conjob. Magical potion that makes your hair grow. Chicken that knows math.
So Chinese?
Jokes aside, he posted on the discord within the hour of Illusion's tweet/announcement. That's how I learnt that they'd packing up shop, funny that.
I agree, illusion aren't shining saints, but at least their games will keep working with the servers off and probably get new content in the form of mods.
Edit:Shit screenshot but unless he deletes it, feel free to have a browse through their discord. It's amusing to see the latest update was promised, I think 2 weeks ago and it's still not rolled out lol
Tbf I wouldn't put Wild Life in the same bucket as Fallen Doll. I must admit I don't actively follow WL development but every time I look they at least have detailed blogs showing their work and they implemented a sandbox where users can access assets and animations they're using for their campaign.
So I don't doubt that, whatever the rate of development, WL are actually working and will probably eventually put something out. Based on the demo it might be passable and I might buy it at that time.
FD by comparison... fairly certain this is a one man show with Helius contracting out work for assets and for devs like UC to neaten up stuff Helius has fucked up (like his infamous REST-based netcode). There are fairly enormous swathes of this games history where I doubt any serious work was being done, or if it was done it was to such a low standard he's had to redo it.
- Oct 15, 2021
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I am putting them in the same bucket because they are both milking patreon. One is a blatant scammer while the other makes it look like they are making a game while they clearly aren't.
WL's thread is 6(!) years old and yet there is still no game to play, similar to FD. Recently they(WL's devs) switched engine from unreal engine 4 to unreal engine 5 for no reason other than milking patreon. This engine "upgrade" added nothing meaningful to the "game" while making it perform worse for everyone. And now instead of fixing its bad performance caused by the useless engine "upgrade" they keep adding new sex animations to make it seem like they are actually making a game. Btw very recently they decided to add a few broken quests to the "game" after all those years. I can only guess they were losing people on patreon and had to do something other than adding more animations.
- Feb 26, 2019
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Don't think putting these two games in the same groups make sense considering WL devs at least update their game consistently. They were focused on Sanbox game mode previously and are now focusing on the actual campaign which is why the "broken missions" are rolling in. They're adding quests. They always said that was the plan going back as far as couple of years now so it isn't new or a surprise. Also, UE5 does perform like shit, WL devs really do need to get it together with the performance, but UE5 does visually look better and the UE5 version also does add improvements, like the recent navmesh stuff they talked about in one of the recent patreon posts. They are taking a while, but I'd rather them take their time actually making a decent game than rushing out some bs like a lot of games these days.
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- Oct 15, 2021
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Doesn't matter how they do it, they are both milking those patreon cows. In WL's case it has been in development for more than 6 years and so far only sandbox mode exists. The whole "game" is still nothing more than a glorified animation viewer. Sound familiar?
Also I have to disagree with UE5 version looking any better. Maybe you haven't realized yet but shadows are way too god damn dark. Go ahead and put a girl facing the sun during daytime and clear weather(without any clouds) in doggystyle position then look at her from below (ground level), you cannot see shit. I don't remember shadows being this dark in UE4 versions of the game but maybe they were, I can't test it atm. Is this really how a game in 6+ years of development should look like:
And I'm pretty sure navmesh exists in ue4 too.
I wouldn't call 6+ years "rushing". Game development for pc usually takes around between 2 to 4 years. WL's thread itself is 6 years old. At this point they should be rushing but I wouldn't bet on them completing this game anytime soon. We will probably die of old age before we see this game get completed. In my eyes WL is racing with Star Citizen when it comes to development speed, I wonder which will come out first
Lastly, just wanted to write a fun fact that I realized right now, this thread is 4 years old while wl's thread is 6 years old. Yet people are constantly shitting on FD while praising WL. It is amazing what adding a few animations(+useless sandbox) every month can do when it comes to public image of an unfinished game.
- Feb 26, 2019
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Something to consider, WL started in UE4, of course lighting looks more polished in those builds, they spent years tweaking it lol. They've already said they're still tweaking UE5 lighting, that's why the default maps don't look as good as UE4, but if you compare lighting in custom scenes there's a clear visual improvement.
UE4 build doesn't have dynamic navmeshing. That was recently added when they updated to UE 5.2.
I get wanting games to release fast, but like, developers can't just pull a game from their ass lol. If they're working as fast as they can already without being too sloppy, trying to work faster would be rushing and result in releasing trash. You mentioned the average dev time being 2-4 years but look at how games release these days. Buggy messes or full of microtransactions. Clearly we're missing something there.
WL thread has been around since 2019, Fallen Doll's thread (Origins) has been around since 2016. Fallen Doll mostly gets shit because of the development choices Helius made over the years, less so because of the total time the game has spent being developed and moreso because of what Helius chose to do during all the years it has been in development(NSFW campaign, NSFW cancelled and replaced with SFW campaign, back to NSFW campaign rinse-repeat, singleplayer, singleplayer cancelled and now multiplayer only, introduction of gacha mechanics, forced online only, Denuvo, etc).
If sandbox isn't your thing that's okay, but obviously it's liked by the majority of Wild Life's supporters considering that's what has gotten the focus the last few years and has been well received. I can't agree with saying it's useless since you're able to make your own content with it, it's basically a slightly more advanced Illusion game studio mode at this point minus modded clothing and characters. I can see how Sandbox could be disappointing for people not interested in that, but why downplay it? You can see all the stuff people are doing with Sandbox in the WL thread and in the WL server, saying it's useless is just straight up false. You can also see UE5 and UE4 comparisons of WL in the official server. People share remade and updated old scenes from UE4 version to UE5 there. Thanks to sandbox, anyone could go download free user made content and have something new to try out, similar to Vam, meanwhile all Fallen Doll has to look forward to is more gacha grinding and girls to purchase if the game lives long enough.
WL is by no means a perfect game or anything and has its own issues like any other, like I said it has pretty shitty performance atm and some of the models for clothing and hair look trash, but WL is nowhere near being as bad as Fallen Doll for many obvious reasons.
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- Jul 17, 2018
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Are we not including Helius' first game before they rebranded/shifted to FD:OL?
Don't get me wrong, WL is taking its sweet time and I get how that's frustrating.
However WL has significantly more content, even though it is, yes, only sandbox animations, than FD.
What does FD have? Denuvo and MTX?
They're both taking forever to release, yes, but at least WL lets me do things.
Whereas, in the time it takes you to grind out a handful of animations in FD, WL has released another update.
I agree that it sounds like WL might be a little sketchier than I had thought, although again I don't actively follow the game except to check if it's worth buying yet every six months or so, but I would highlight that FD is the older of the two and it has significantly less content by any quantifiable metric.
This thread is 6 years old but this thread, which is realistically the same game, is 7 years old and
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(the oldest I could find) is criticising Helius for slow development 8 years ago!Hilariously in that article Helius is also quoted as saying level design is done, and as you can tell from the above it had already been in development some time at this point. It was just not on Patreon as they didn't allow adult games at the time.
So yeah whilst WL might be of similar ilk I'd say the difference in actual output seems significant. I'm still not going to support WL before they have something I consider playable, a lesson I learned supporting Helius half a decade or so back, but I suspect it will eventually manifest into an actual game whilst FD is just going to die an unceremonious death most likely with him killing the online servers and vanishing.
- Dec 18, 2022
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