HTML Female Agent [v1.20.1p] [Crushstation]

[LeGustavoJerome]

I'm seriously considering trying to do a text version of the kind of game you've described. That would be a very unique and intriguing game, methinks. I don't have the tools/know-how to build something as pretty as some of the elements Crush has integrated, but I might be able to avoid the numerous pitfalls that have sunk this game. Or...maybe I'll just dream of writing it and never get around to it. Idk.

You should totally do it! I get how you feel about avoiding the pitfalls. I've looked into this game's code and it is borderline broken. I can't write or draw to save my life but when it comes to Sugarcube 2 (the 'engine' Female Agent uses) I'm confident I can do way better than anything Crush has done.

 

[MidaHanna]

Funny how Crush will once again work on the lifepath, then come here and whine that people are "trolling him" because he's found a "reason" to not work on Bangkok, yet again.

 

[DrFaker(exSmut3D)]

Diet system and now focus on lifepath, son am dissapoint.
Guess I'll stop checking for updates for about 5 months, hopefully I'll forget about the game.

 

[slkasdjf]

If this works, or comes close to working, it'll prove that we can advance the story every few weeks, not every few months.

Wouldn't it be possible to test this by, you know, advancing the story? Not to mention, this isn't even a good test - the lifepath has been worked on for the last 2.5 years. Crush should know exactly what needs to be done on it. Even if this is a success, Bangkok is going to have very different challenges than the prologue.

 

[asdfasdf12341234ACSACA]

Wouldn't it be possible to test this by, you know, advancing the story? Not to mention, this isn't even a good test - the lifepath has been worked on for the last 2.5 years. Crush should know exactly what needs to be done on it. Even if this is a success, Bangkok is going to have very different challenges than the prologue.

Unfortunately that would make too much sense, it's clearly better to do (another) training exercise so that the new content can come perfectly the first time around (except it won't and will need rework, like everything in life).

But hey, as long as you can write a "lessons learned" post for every one of these exercises, everything's a success, right?

 

[GodlessXVIII]

Just had a thought, that maybe this kind of perpetual allowance of money for development of passion projects is leading to witting or unwitting development hell.

Be it massive projects like Star Citizen or smaller ero ones like Malise and the Machine, or even ones with actual regular updates but permanently stuck in early access like Trap Quest. The lack of deadlines, the security of monthly financial support, the close-knit protective community that springs around the creator/game, all of it seem to hamper development in quite a few cases.

Maybe in those cases, the deadlines imposed by either fixed budget or publisher directives are needed constraints for art to get made and not veer into cushy endless finetuning.

As I said, it could be witting or unwitting, but there's certainly a pattern.

Edit : grammar

 

[portrapoodle]

Anyone got the character creator demo?

Anyone got it?

 

[Odin's Eye]

Just had a thought, that maybe this kind of perpetual allowance of money for development of passion projects is leading to witting or unwitting development hell.

Be it massive projects like Star Citizen or smaller ero ones like Malise and the Machine, or even ones with actual regular updates but permanently stuck in early access like Trap Quest. The lack of deadlines, the security of monthly financial support, the close-knit protective community that springs around the creator/game, all of it seem to hamper development in quite a few cases.

Maybe in those cases, the deadlines imposed by either fixed budget or publisher directives are needed constraints for art to get made and not veer into cushy endless finetuning.

As I said, it could be witting or unwitting, but there's certainly a pattern.

Edit : grammar

This is actually a well-known phenomena within the creative arts industry - be that game development, comics or book writing. Some of the best/most liked stories and ideas happen because the creator(s) are put on deadlines and forced to get a finished product out there. Just like how some sags/series can end up taking over a decade to complete because the author has enough credit/big enough name/making enough money that they don't have to pump out the next book this year to make ends meet (I'm looking at you George R Martin!).

It's also considered to be the basis of the shody development cycles of companies like EA, Konami and even SI (somewhat in their FM series) have fallen into where the people in charge turn the deadline = genius concept into 20 hour work days and barely put-together game engines that have to be patched twenty million and one times just to avoid crashing on the intro screen.

I absolutely agree with you that the constant stream of income puts a lot of the indie developers in this 'take it easy' mindset even if they don't realise that it's happened. The really annoying thing is that Patreon has a way around this where some content providers only charge when they produce x amount of content per month (and then some even have that charge maxed at y amount per supporter in order to not take the piss during productive months).

What saddens me is that there are some content makers who are legit struggling (Youtubers or fiction writers) because even in the current climate, they are still only charging their supporters for when they actually release something.

Back to the point - Yes, I truly beleive that some content creators absolutely need a way to be held accountable for dragging things out and not releasing content if they've got to the stage where supporters are funding their art. Something like that would have meant Bangkok in some form or another would have been released months ago.

 

[Deleted member 2776827]

Can't wait for the release of the Street-Food™ Engine in late 2022 that is going to ease writing for the main part of this game.
Almost thought that I would have to play through Bangkok without knowing if my character is vegan or not
Glad to know that this secret agent/prostitute game got it's priorities straight

 

[asdfasdf12341234ACSACA]

Back to the point - Yes, I truly beleive that some content creators absolutely need a way to be held accountable for dragging things out and not releasing content if they've got to the stage where supporters are funding their art. Something like that would have meant Bangkok in some form or another would have been released months ago.

They already have that. Patreons are free to drop their support. Nobody's forcing them to pay up, and, quite frankly, the perks aren't even worth it so I doubt any of them are paying up just for the perks and not to "support the development".

As far as accountability, it's all on them for believing the developer's well intentioned posts a fifth time. They're (seemingly) happy paying for what they're getting

 

[Odin's Eye]

They already have that. Patreons are free to drop their support. Nobody's forcing them to pay up, and, quite frankly, the perks aren't even worth it so I doubt any of them are paying up just for the perks and not to "support the development".

As far as accountability, it's all on them for believing the developer's well intentioned posts a fifth time. They're (seemingly) happy paying for what they're getting

But that moves the accountability onto the supporters. It changes from "I have to do this in order for x people to give me money," to "I'll panic if these people stop giving me money."

There is also the issue of how easy it is for people to not cancel subcriptions. This happens constantly whether it's that sports/movie package bought for a month and never turned off, the Netflix account that barely gets used, or Patreon subscriptions for a dollar or two that's barely considered. And the sunk cost fallacy on top of this.

My point is that once a large enough supporter base is created, it's nigh on impossible to completely break it as long as a content creator keeps an open dialogue.

 

[GodlessXVIII]

Absolutely agree on the need for accountability Odin. And you're right that "constraints make for better art" is well known.

I guess my post was trying to allude to the fact that, knowingly or not, the crowdsourcing model has enabled a few projects (and a few creators) to skirt by on some good early content or concept, and then endlessly spinning a tale of development and soon-to-come releases.

I don't want to be too accusatory regarding this game here, but the cases of Star Citizen or Malise and the Machine are text-book examples of mismanaged projects dragging on for years' worth of crowdsourced funds.

When time mismanagement becomes this profitable, you can't help but be suspicious.

 

[prodigy]

You literally bend backward to justify him. Why work if you do not need to? As far as you know he could commission initial code to someone and that's it. For few grands investment he could have sustainable income that surpass it. I'm not saying that it is the case but your defence of him is on borderlands of simping.

 

[laddiestlad]

to add to that, reputation means fuck all when it comes to porn, be it games, art and whatnot
so many devs and artists are absolute scumbags and yet their patreons and subscribestars and whatnot are thriving because the majority of people are stupid
just look at the comments under some of the bigger games on this website; people are unable to do a simple search, people are unable to read posts not even 5 (F I V E) posts above their own to get answers to their questions, people willingly make excuses for devs that scam you etc, people go on autistic rage fits about non-existant NTR/cuck/lesbian/gay shit etc
and these are the ones "smart" enough to know of this forum, imagine the amount of people that have no idea about that and subscribe to these peoples patreons

post will probably be deleted cus off-topic but still

 

[Deleted member 2776827]

I've got to cut in here now. It makes no sense to scam people out of money when you have a good idea for a game. The only reasons to not follow through are:
1) you are incapable (you don't have the technical skills/knowledge to build the game/ got stuck) or
2) you are extremely lazy and want a free ride.

Seeing as it would be hard to prove either of these is the case for crushstation, it means that likely it's not any sort of intentional scam and it's not suspicious at all. In fact a lack updates/progress is only detrimental in the long term. Reputation means *everything* when you have income that relies on others opinion of your competence/ability and ideas.

It's self sabotauge to not follow through with a good idea/game. Following through means you increase your social capital. People say "this is a developer who delivers; and delivers good content/ideas".

As well if you can make 1 successful idea, then you can easily do it again. If I was greedy and all about money I'd be pumping out story content like crazy, finish this game in 2 years. And then start a new game with the same assets/engine, and make it about a teacher and then make story for that. 1 success under my belt already just makes more people throw money at me.

So the idea that this is a scam?... it would then have to be the dumbest scam I ever saw. Partly because it's totally unnecessary. The talent is there to finish the game and then make 10 more.

Crush can code, he has a dev team, we know he can write. Finishing the game means he can start fresh new ideas that will be just as popular, there is nothing to lose if he finishes, he gains reputation, 1 game under the belt, probably more money/supporters etc. As well as satisfaction to continue on a new idea because after a year or two on a game you can get bored of it.

Literally everything you just said is false
I mean literally
None of it is true

 

[GodlessXVIII]

"Eh...speaking as a backer, I wouldn't describe the game as a scam, but the end result is not too different from one. Right now they have an amazing funding model where they can continuously get funding from very, very dedicated players without having to compromise on any features - but software dev being what it is, this means that they can effectively feature creep forever and never get any closer to releasing a game."

Quoting a post from elsewhere. Try to guess how many other projects this could apply to.

 

[DbatRT]

ebindebin
Assassin’s Creed?
Ubisoft simply parasitizes on one concept and idea, each game has the same thing, questions on the map, activities, outposts and juggernauts.

Minimal changes from game to game, and yet the popularity is almost not falling, maybe you are wrong after all?

 

[laddiestlad]

have you actually played any of the last assassins creeds or are you just spouting opinions you heard on reddit?
the last few assassins creeds changed their gameplay quite a bit because, guess what, people got tired of the same game and the sales were bad
they also slowed down the development of them because the devs didn't want to do it anymore and because, again, the games stopped selling as well as they originally did, only when they switched the formula it sold better again
same with far cry

the outpost and unfuck the map my climbing a tower thing is their signature, why would they change it?

 

[Odin's Eye]

have you actually played any of the last assassins creeds or are you just spouting opinions you heard on reddit?
the last few assassins creeds changed their gameplay quite a bit because, guess what, people got tired of the same game and the sales were bad
they also slowed down the development of them because the devs didn't want to do it anymore and because, again, the games stopped selling as well as they originally did, only when they switched the formula it sold better again
same with far cry

the outpost and unfuck the map my climbing a tower thing is their signature, why would they change it?

Not to derail this thread further but Ubisoft's change in how they create AC games is not a good show of a dev changing. I have a love-hate relationship with the company just like I do with EA (love a lot of the games that they make, hate how they influence the development of them). UB's Prince of Persia games were almost pure copy-paste of each other mechanics wise with one small incrimental improvements from the advent of tech/skills. The Assassins Creed games were exactly the same up until Conor's story where people made their voices heard how utterly fed up of it they were. The company was lucky that a throwaway (in their eyes) side-system of sea battle caught the fans' attention enough to then build a new game around.

But they are notorious for keeping mechancis across games even when people are fed up of it and having the game's stories be the differentiating factor - Just Cause franchise, Watch_Dogs, Far Cry, AC etc.

That's not to say these are bad games. It's highlighting how a developer can latch on to a system and milk it dead and then beat its corpse bloody regardless of how it might impact player enjoyment.

Sorry, I had to get that out there.

 

[asdfasdf12341234ACSACA]

ebindebin
Assassin’s Creed?
Ubisoft simply parasitizes on one concept and idea, each game has the same thing, questions on the map, activities, outposts and juggernauts.

Minimal changes from game to game, and yet the popularity is almost not falling, maybe you are wrong after all?

Okay, but they actually put a game out with a different historical setting, a game you can play from start to finish.