Others Going Deeper [Beta 2.1] [NRFB Games]

[Rosen King]

Me five days ago: "Oh man, today's Tweet is taking twenty minutes longer than usual. I hope it's something big and exciting and--"

Um... Okay... I want to say "this definitely won't be in the game", but there's a flying dildo that fucks people's ears, so...

Yeah sure she's pretty, but you probably shouldn't stare for too long...

Speaking of fish, I'm getting a "realistic fish news anchor from Spongebob" vibe from this one. Definitely feels off compared to the rest of the game's art style. I'm guessing she has some sort of natural charm or hypnotic aura? Oh, or maybe this is actually a cursed portrait that acts as a trap in the dungeon. That would explain the difference in art style.

We've got a problem solver here

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Well that depends. Am I playing a male character? Then it will solve all of her problems (but only mine). Am I playing a female character? Then she has no need for any dick, ever.

When you have to tutorialize but you're a game in active development

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askfdsasd. So even after waiting for this new update, there's still a key feature around this mechanic that you're probably still not gonna tell us until it's ready.

But ooh, I see that what was the finger-snapping icon in an earlier image is now a pocket watch. So I guess it does refer to taking her in and out of trance.

And dang, Raine really doesn't want to do anything, does she? The only thing she has any drive to do is relax, but even that's less than half full. Oof, I know the feeling.

Gosh, I wonder what players could possibly end up doing with this ability...

Blah blah voyeurism content. More importantly, is that spell's icon a needle with a heart on it? The implications!

 

[NRFB]

Me five days ago: "Oh man, today's Tweet is taking twenty minutes longer than usual. I hope it's something big and exciting and--"

Sometimes I forget to use the scheduler.

Um... Okay... I want to say "this definitely won't be in the game", but there's a flying dildo that fucks people's ears, so...

It's a shitpost... Unless I end up adding a fishing minigame, then all bets are off.

askfdsasd. So even after waiting for this new update, there's still a key feature around this mechanic that you're probably still not gonna tell us until it's ready.

I could probably set some expectations here, although it's less to do with this thing specifically. This is basically just a case of "I'm already spending an unhealthy amount of time on dev work and I should probably cut myself off on including even MORE mechanical stuff in here." The stuff in that button isn't strictly necessary right now, so like it says, don't worry about it. As a result of this cut, I can say that the next handful of days I only need to do bug testing and some more written content, as the mechanical changes for the update are basically done (save further bug fixes):


This update has been very mechanically extensive on the back end in some ways that might not be immediately obvious when you're just playing it. Having reworked everything in the camp menu to use an event bus system similar but not the same as (and therefore not entirely able to be copied from) the one already in use by the dungeon map, I can now essentially have any arbitrary scene or effect happen in response to any event or happening in camp. Add on to that a system that allows you to measurably change character's desires which should have an effect on their personalities and the curses to drive things to further extremes and you can hopefully see that the directions that content can expand are near limitless. At the very least, I'm much more limited in my time to write the content than I am in directions it can go.

The intention with the game being in alpha has always been to focus on getting the gameplay systems and framework in place before the content. Once most or all of that is in place, the game can move on to a beta phase where it can focus almost exclusively on bulking up on content, although I know that's less satisfying for people who enjoy the sexing stuff and want more of it now. It probably also limits the number of people willing to jump on in support at the moment, but I think this is a smarter approach for the health of the game as a project. I guess what I'm saying is:

"Will there be new sexual content in this update?" - Yes
"Will there be sexual content between the main character and the knights in this update?" - Some, probably
"Will there be enough new sexual content to satisfy people?" - No, but let's be honest, is there any way that this can be a yes? People will always want more, and more is still coming, promise.

Blah blah voyeurism content.

I'll blah your blah >:V

 

[Barnabas Collins]

I'm on the 7th or 8th dungeon, is there any adult content? Only thing so far I've seen are gazer nude pixels.

 

[Rosen King]

The intention with the game being in alpha has always been to focus on getting the gameplay systems and framework in place before the content. Once most or all of that is in place, the game can move on to a beta phase where it can focus almost exclusively on bulking up on content, although I know that's less satisfying for people who enjoy the sexing stuff and want more of it now. It probably also limits the number of people willing to jump on in support at the moment, but I think this is a smarter approach for the health of the game as a project. I guess what I'm saying is:

Oh sure, I'm definitely not expecting huge amounts of content in this update. I know that *real* game development doesn't work the way people have come to expect from Patreon-driven Ren'py games, and I honestly hate that the Patreon model pretty much only supports that kind of thing, to the point that people throw a fit and start dropping support if a developer takes the time to work on anything other than a monthly content drop. If this update was all about getting the mechanics down and then having no events with it, I'd completely understand. ...Well, I guess it'd be an issue if there was so little content that the mechanics themselves were basically non-functional, at which point there's not really a point to even releasing that update, but you know what I mean.

But I was really just saying, "What dat button gonna do?" Followed by, "We're not gonna find out until it's done, are we? This is gonna keep nagging at the back of my mind until then." Waiting for things to be done is one thing, but waiting to find out how something's gonna work is another.

I'll blah your blah >:V

Tell you what. When you're able to manipulate a character's exhibitionism trait to the point where they become sensitive to your scrying and feel compelled to put on a show while you watch, *then* I'll give a crap about voyeurism content. (Although maybe it doesn't even count as voyeurism at that point. More like a private cam show, really.)

I'm on the 7th or 8th dungeon, is there any adult content? Only thing so far I've seen are gazer nude pixels.

Well, that really depends on what you consider "adult content", because the gazer stuff is still NSFW, and there's several other scenes in the game along those lines, including one enemy event involving a character masturbating. (The next update looks like it'll include at least one more instance of that being visible.) As noted in the post immediately above yours, the game is still being developed largely on the mechanical side of things, so there's not a ton of sexual content yet. But if you're expecting something other than "pixels", you might be in the wrong place.

But if you wanna see some teasers of stuff that's coming, you can check

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.

 

[TheCowofEternalFlame]

The intention with the game being in alpha has always been to focus on getting the gameplay systems and framework in place before the content. Once most or all of that is in place, the game can move on to a beta phase where it can focus almost exclusively on bulking up on content, although I know that's less satisfying for people who enjoy the sexing stuff and want more of it now. It probably also limits the number of people willing to jump on in support at the moment, but I think this is a smarter approach for the health of the game as a project.

I recognize I may be in the minority here, but this is actually exactly why I'm so excited for this game. It's clear you actually care about making this game mechanically interesting/entertaining and not just a vehicle for porn. Like don't get me wrong, I look forward to the porn aspect of this game being expanded upon, but the fact that this game has actually solid gameplay is what's really going to keep me coming back for more.

 

[NRFB]

I recognize I may be in the minority here, but this is actually exactly why I'm so excited for this game. It's clear you actually care about making this game mechanically interesting/entertaining and not just a vehicle for porn. Like don't get me wrong, I look forward to the porn aspect of this game being expanded upon, but the fact that this game has actually solid gameplay is what's really going to keep me coming back for more.

And I appreciate this.

Something that I like to believe is that there is a demographic of people who would like new/complex adult games. Thing is that I can only believe it because those people for the most part aren't being visibly catered to by a majority of the games out there in this scene. Plenty of ero-games are high quality in a lot of ways, sure, but most of them stick to very similar sorts of gameplay patterns compared to one another. There's not necessarily anything wrong with that, but as success stories start to spawn imitators or inspire similar games, people start to get their own expectations for how things should work and what they should get out of a game in development (as Rosen King mentioned above).

I think I'm in a position and have the skills necessary to deliver something unique to this demographic of (hypothetical) people who will enjoy it, although whether or not aiming for this group will be financially sustainable in the long term remains to be seen. There has been a good amount of effort on my part to still make the game playable without diving too deep into the mechanics so that people outside of that target audience can hopefully still enjoy it somewhat, but I'll never be able to match up with the huge range of different expectations/desires that people will come into a porn game with (an even wider range than the expectations of regular video game players, and much less explored/understood too).

Even if the game doesn't get big enough to make enough money to support me though, I'll definitely feel better having done it and taken the chance than not. Also the game is already fun, so that's an accomplishment on its own that you can't really take away from me.

Seriously. I even got to sit down and play a full run of 10 floors yesterday (fixing any bugs I found while I went). I liked it quite a bit, although it definitely felt too easy. There's still a lot to do and a lot to add and it takes time, but yeah.

Turns out I'm a fan of this game and am quite excited about it too. Who would have guessed?

 

[Minishotgun]

-snip-

In short, people don't know what they want, even if they think they do, until they see it.

i'm just glad there are still people out there trying to make a original game, regardless if it's gonna be a huge success or not. as ya said yourself, usually it takes a pioneer to try something new to find success, cash, and a wave of imitators. the mainstream industry is overtaken by risk-averse busybodies who churn out the same game every 3 years than to take a risk and try something new.

so i'll say this, even if it's on a pirate website for porn games, we need more people like you on the gaming sector, people who want to take risks and make a game the way they want to, who do it in the name of creative freedom. who have a story to tell or a world to show! those who wanna be pioneers and trendsetters. and not follow the money or the newest fad!

as the old saying goes, "you miss 100% of all shots you don't take". so stay strong, be steadfast. finish the game in your image, and i'll cheer your on from the sidelines all the way to the end.

 

[Rosen King]

I think I'm in a position and have the skills necessary to deliver something unique to this demographic of (hypothetical) people who will enjoy it, although whether or not aiming for this group will be financially sustainable in the long term remains to be seen.

Well, you can count at least a second person in that hypothetical demographic. Maybe not for some of the specific aspects of the dungeon crawling, but for the general sense of preferring a mechanically interesting game with erotic elements rather than a generic porn vehicle. Particularly when it comes to mind control mechanics, which by its nature is the kind of fetish that focuses on what's "under the hood", so to speak. Simply having a picture of a woman staring off into space only goes so far.

Unfortunately, maybe this is just bias from personal experience, but I think the kind of people that fall into the "mainstream" have an easier time supporting what they like compared to other people. Let's just say that the reasons I have so much trouble finding what I want are the same reasons I don't have a lot of money to throw around on stuff like this.

That being said, I think the ideal way to monetize a game like this is to straight up sell it rather than relying on subscription services like Patreon. Although I guess that ship's already sailed.

the mainstream industry is overtaken by risk-averse busybodies who churn out the same game every 3 years than to take a risk and try something new.

Nah, screw that. It's perfectly fine for a dev to keep making the same kind of game as long as everyone else isn't making the same thing. The real problem is when "trying something new" turns out to just be retooling it to become the same damn thing as everyone else. As I always say, it's better to have a game exactly like one from twenty years ago than a game exactly like twenty from one year ago. The most important thing is diversity, which means what we need isn't new trends to follow, but to stop being strangled by trends in general. Whether that means making something wholly original or contributing to a neglected genre that's been around for ages.

Of course, that's just the problem with the "AAA" gaming industry. The lack of diversity in porn games isn't about seeking out trends or avoiding "risk", it's just that it's something easy enough for amateurs to do. Ren'py + 3D scene software + Patreon = monthly income. It doesn't take a strong foundation or tons of start-up cash to start making those kinds of games. And there's nothing inherently wrong with that, as long as people don't start setting ridiculous expectations of other games being made as easily.

Uh oh, mom mode kicked in.

Hmm... This seems somewhat different from the previous example with the Masochism curse. Although I could be wrong, since that appears to be an entirely new icon underneath. (Unless it's Pity, whose icon I've still never seen.)

Yeah maybe grouping up all the knights is too strong right now, but what if...

Advice for any aspiring dungeon builders out there: Windows. Your dungeon needs windows.

(Also, for what it's worth, I never tend to group up the knights myself. Efficient exploration trumps cheesing, in my book. Although that's a big reason why masturbation has been such a problem, as it basically means a guaranteed corruption break unless one of the other girls drops what she's doing and sprints across the dungeon to stop her from diddling.)

It's a shitpost... Unless I end up adding a fishing minigame, then all bets are off.

Bruh, if you make a game with a fishing minigame *and* mind control mechanics, it just might be my favorite game. Though it's not exactly a peanut butter and chocolate situation where one just makes the other better. That wouldn't make any sens-- Wait. No. Now I want a game where you can catch a mermaid and then brainwash her into being your pet. Though you'd need to have your own private lake for her to live in... Or one of those rich person giant indoor aquariums that links to a private pool. Just... as long as it doesn't mix in the "living furniture" fetish and make her think she's one of those singing wall-mounted fish.

 

[TankHunter678]

It's a shitpost... Unless I end up adding a fishing minigame, then all bets are off.

Make a fishing trap, can "hold" one girl at a time in a fishing loop. One of the catch results could be a mermaid or scylla pops up for some sexy time with the girl.

 

[Rosen King]

Lucette lap pillow...

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In her armor? The Inquisitor must really be desperate for some knight waifu if he/she is willing to use a metal pillow. To say nothing of what this says about how Lucette sleeps.

Nothing special to post today other than me saying: "Update tomorrow"

 

[Rosen King]

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Edit: Oh yeah... I probably should have brought up this request before the update came out, so it could have been included. It'd be really nice to have the "autoplay new events" option not reset to being turned off when starting a new run. Particularly when there's a new update with new events (although it seems this update doesn't add new dungeon events, aside from the ones that were previously bugged).

Edit 2: Ey, first bug report. I'm pretty sure I didn't take the "give hints to ally-specific events" upgrade when starting this new run (I briefly clicked it, saw I didn't have enough points, and then clicked it off for now), but I'm still seeing those hints. (Or at least a few of them. I'll see what happens when I select that upgrade in my next run.)

Edit 3: Hmm... With twice as many time slots, and each slot taking the same amount of time to get through (even sleeping now just has you waiting through twice as many "tick tocks"), it'd probably be best to have an option to skip straight to Daytime and head into the dungeon at any point while in camp.

 

[NRFB]

I did report the thread to have it promoted on the site and such it just hasn't happened yet. The links in the OP are updated though.

Edit: Oh yeah... I probably should have brought up this request before the update came out, so it could have been included. It'd be really nice to have the "autoplay new events" option not reset to being turned off when starting a new run.

ight, I'll keep it in mind.

Particularly when there's a new update with new events (although it seems this update doesn't add new dungeon events, aside from the ones that were previously bugged).

It has a couple of new threats but barely any new events for previous threats.

Edit 2: Ey, first bug report. I'm pretty sure I didn't take the "give hints to ally-specific events" upgrade when starting this new run (I briefly clicked it, saw I didn't have enough points, and then clicked it off for now), but I'm still seeing those hints. (Or at least a few of them. I'll see what happens when I select that upgrade in my next run.)

Oh, actually I thought I removed the hints to ally-specific events option because there aren't enough events to justify it. That option doesn't actually do anything right now. Whoops. Not a big enough deal to do anything about it but I'm sure people will end up confused by it.

 

[fdgftrtrwr]

Gow fast to get sex content in this game?

 

[Rosen King]

(There was another edit that you might have missed due to simul-posting.)

Just to double-check, the newly-fixed Binding Rope "constrict" event isn't supposed to have a picture of the "lewd pose" it mentions yet, does it? If so, it doesn't show up. Kinda hard to be sure what's absent because of bugs and what's just not finished. Speaking of which, the Aphrodisiac Dart trap doesn't seem to have an event at all.

Hmm... This might be a bit overpowered, but could there perhaps be an option to have a knight default to fleeing any threat they encounter instead of stopping to address it? For balance purposes it might be necessary to make this not work in dark rooms (thereby making it just a convenience feature that can already be achieved by manually selecting "flee" every time you encounter something), although part of the reason I want to do this is so that Elli can make use of all her exclusive and favored skills like Grace, Stealthy, Dodgy, Tactical Retreat, and Finish Line to dance through the dungeon and speedrun to the stairs. Not even for gameplay reasons, I just like the visualization of it, and it feels thematically appropriate from her. Maybe for balance reasons there could be some kind of penalty for hitting a dead end while doing this (imagine if she took injury damage because she speedran right into a wall), although I don't know how you could design that to only target people who are doing that... Perhaps disabling the feature in a dark room and forcing you to face the threat unless you have an Elli-exclusive (or requiring a high dexterity and Stealthy) skill? Then the penalty for that skill could be "receives injury damage and stunned for two turns if the knight enters a dark room with only one entrance/exit with auto-flee active".

Oh, actually I thought I removed the hints to ally-specific events option because there aren't enough events to justify it. That option doesn't actually do anything right now. Whoops. Not a big enough deal to do anything about it but I'm sure people will end up confused by it.

Well, on the subject of "I don't know how much is intentional and how much isn't, are there supposed to be scenes that aren't listed as "???" but are part of the list because you thought they "didn't need hints"? Because the bath events are completely absent until you see them. On that note, are there any events to be seen by "join the knight in what they're doing" yet, or is that just a waste of time at the moment? I'm sure eventually it won't need any hints because the answer will simply be, "Yes, there's an event for each," but for now we have no way of knowing what is or isn't there.

Edit: Hmm. After manually choosing to sleep when there were only three time slots left, I get an event about having fallen asleep while researching and getting woken up too early. Not sure if this is a bug or not, but I don't have the option to sleep when there are two time slots left, so I wouldn't be surprised if the option to sleep with three slots left if a mistake left over from doubling the time slots.

 

[NRFB]

it'd probably be best to have an option to skip straight to Daytime and head into the dungeon at any point while in camp.

Probably, although it wouldn't even get any use until you've got so much stuff from new game+ that you're running out of stuff to do... Which I understand probably does, in fact, apply to you.

Just to double-check, the newly-fixed Binding Rope "constrict" event isn't supposed to have a picture of the "lewd pose" it mentions yet, does it?

It does not.

Speaking of which, the Aphrodisiac Dart trap doesn't seem to have an event at all.

There's no disarm event, there should be a single text box of an 'event' for getting hit by it.

Elli scouting

It mostly falls under ally ai improvements which is a thing that I want to have eventually, yeah.

Well, on the subject of "I don't know how much is intentional and how much isn't, are there supposed to be scenes that aren't listed as "???" but are part of the list because you thought they "didn't need hints"?

Other than the baths, no, but now that you mention it I'm not sure what the logic was behind not having the bath scries on the list.

On that note, are there any events to be seen by "join the knight in what they're doing" yet, or is that just a waste of time at the moment? I'm sure eventually it won't need any hints because the answer will simply be, "Yes, there's an event for each," but for now we have no way of knowing what is or isn't there.

No, but also time spent together is not time wasted. How are you going to become good friends with the knights with that kind of attitude?!

 

[Rosen King]

Probably, although it wouldn't even get any use until you've got so much stuff from new game+ that you're running out of stuff to do... Which I understand probably does, in fact, apply to you.

It would also be useful to people who just... don't want to do any research, or something. There's always gonna be people who want to skip past some of the content to get to other parts. They might want to do one or two things in camp and then jump straight back into the dungeon.

Kinda like that person who asked how fast to get to any sexual content in this game, which I do intend to answer once I've actually played far enough into this update.

No, but also time spent together is not time wasted. How are you going to become good friends with the knights with that kind of attitude?!

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...Oh hey, that spell icon I couldn't figure out was for "Gardening". Wait, that thing was supposed to be a FLOWER? Yeah, no, I still don't-- Oh. OHH. The extra-thick border is supposed to actually be part of the flower itself. Yeah, I'm no artist myself, but I feel like this breaks some kind of general rule about how to properly use outlines and negative space or... something. I have to really force myself to see it as part of the flower instead of just looking at the white part inside.

Alright, third floor unlock, let's go! ...Typo. "It's not just you that catches the what such a thing implies either." Also, I think "And that the knights seemingly just going along with it" might be a grammar issue as well. (I'm... just gonna assume everything with the witch do be intentional.)

...This might just be my own mistake, but I'm pretty sure I never learned "Foreboding" from the Witch, but it's suddenly in my spell list when I went back to camp. I could be wrong, though.

 

[molitar]

So has this game characters improved or they still the stupidest people ever in any fantasy? Oh there is a curse that has some tattoo on me but I am not concerned about it at all. Also there is no reason for them to remain after they found out all the negatives there is NOTHING forcing them or keeping them to go down.. the story makes no sense.. oh looks like we got a curse and we are over our heads.. maybe we should go back to town and do some investigation.. no they are like the absolute stupidest adventurers it makes them feel so damn fake!

In AD&D it was treasure that motivated them to search but this stupid game has no motivation but a dream that promises them nothing. It's just plain dumb the story needs to be written better for a reason to be there.. something that means they can't turn around.. but it has no motivation so I was unmotivated to even play it.

 

[The Anax]

This looks interesting to me. I am curious, though, if the character(s) become corrupted/mind controlled, is it a game over, or is this meant to be played where I am the corruptor and can twist the heroes into my dark slaves?

 

[Rosen King]

So, uh... My "Nulls" are still there in the research log. The changelog mentioned that that should be fixed.

Edit: I'm going to include a copy of my meta-progress save file so you can properly bugtest it in case you don't already have a file in that state. ...Urk, give me a sec. Site won't let me upload that file type directly.

So has this game characters improved or they still the stupidest people ever in any fantasy? Oh there is a curse that has some tattoo on me but I am not concerned about it at all. Also there is no reason for them to remain after they found out all the negatives there is NOTHING forcing them or keeping them to go down.. the story makes no sense.. oh looks like we got a curse and we are over our heads.. maybe we should go back to town and do some investigation.. no they are like the absolute stupidest adventurers it makes them feel so damn fake!

In AD&D it was treasure that motivated them to search but this stupid game has no motivation but a dream that promises them nothing. It's just plain dumb the story needs to be written better for a reason to be there.. something that means they can't turn around.. but it has no motivation so I was unmotivated to even play it.

That sounds like a you problem. They're servants of a religious order (well, two religious orders) who received a revelation from their Goddess telling them to do their sacred duty of eradicating the dungeons that spring up unnaturally like a tumor. The game spends like five paragraphs elaborating on why this isn't just some random dream and is very clearly recognized as a divine edict. And it's not like there's going to be any information outside the dungeon that they don't already have, since it's unnatural to begin with and in the middle of nowhere. It makes perfect sense within the context. If you've ever played D&D, you've surely encountered *much* dumber reasons for people to power through a dungeon, not to mention an entire character archetype based on the idea of, "I don't do this for the treasure, I do it because my God told me to." To say nothing of other porn games.

I am curious, though, if the character(s) become corrupted/mind controlled, is it a game over, or is this meant to be played where I am the corruptor and can twist the heroes into my dark slaves?

Mostly the former, though you can be a bit of a corruptor yourself. You're a "good guy" who's trying to help your three allies get through the dungeon without being corrupted, and have access to your own type of mind control to help them overcome that corruption. How ethically you choose to use that power, however...


Edit: Oh yeah, there's another "bug" I noticed a while back that I kind of don't want you to fix unless you add an alternative way to do it, but it's worth noting regardless. If you set a character to "leave" but have their destination set at their current room, they'll just do nothing and let the monster/trap keep hitting them without resisting. At least until they get stunned or tranced or something else that resets their AI.

 

[The Anax]

Ah, ok, thank you! I was hoping to be the Dungeonmaster and using the monsters to corrupt the heroes. Leave it to me to see things from the reverse! Mwa ha ha ha!