Others Going Deeper [Beta 2.1] [NRFB Games]

[BABPEEG]

I technically COULD have a separate option in character selection for being a penis haver or a boobs+vag haver. I wouldn't slide futa in that way, but I need certain sets of genitals for sex scene CG parity. All the pronouns are set up as wildcards in the data that get filled in at run time (%PLAYERGUYGIRL%, %PLAYERHISHER%, etc), based on the player's sex currently. It would be less convenient to split things, but obviously not impossible.
Though aside from femboy Male 5 and tomboy Female 5 I don't imagine it feeling very appropriate to have the options not be tied together? IDK, I guess I should ask what use case you were looking at having this happen in.

As long as the girls can have dicks I'm happy.

 

[blue_krystal]

I technically COULD have a separate option in character selection for being a penis haver or a boobs+vag haver. I wouldn't slide futa in that way, but I need certain sets of genitals for sex scene CG parity. All the pronouns are set up as wildcards in the data that get filled in at run time (%PLAYERGUYGIRL%, %PLAYERHISHER%, etc), based on the player's sex currently. It would be less convenient to split things, but obviously not impossible.
Though aside from femboy Male 5 and tomboy Female 5 I don't imagine it feeling very appropriate to have the options not be tied together? IDK, I guess I should ask what use case you were looking at having this happen in.

I mean none of the portraits really show the Inquisitor's body so even for M/F 1-4 I don't think being able to mix and match genitals/bodies and faces/sexes would be much of a problem, more customisation options is always nice. But yeah basically what BABPEEG just said.

 

[Rosen King]

As long as the girls can have dicks I'm happy.

But yeah basically what BABPEEG just said.

Well, the dev does intend to implement "futanari" in some (hopefully optional) fashion, so there's that. If nothing else, I'd expect some sort of NG+ option for the Inquisitor to have a passive dick-growing spell in their spell list, which could add new options to the female sex scenes that would display the "male" images. Though I'm pretty sure they also aim to have something that can apply to the knights somehow...


In other news, Tweet Time! Not a lot of them this month.

Feed him

Anything but a chest mimic, right? Because that would be cliche. (Speaking of cliche: Don't put your dick in that.)

Adding a couple of things for rewatching scenes that people were asking for.

Yass! I'm guessing that gender selector is only there when looking at the notes from the main menu? Makes sense.

I also got excited for a sec about what I thought was a "Mode" option, but that's just "Mods".

Actually thinking about it, it's not that much of a gamble at all, is it?

Just giving the Witch more miscellaneous things to say when you visit her. People like that, I'm pretty sure.

Wait a minute... Proselytizing about big hats? Could it be? The Witch was secretly an agent of Eschahn all along! I was deceived by the fact that her hat actually works with her outfit! I mean, Eschahn's hat works with her outfit, but only because tackiness is the entire theme there. (I enjoy mean-girling Eschahn.)

 

[Rosen King]

Tweet time! And we've got some interesting ones this time, with the update presumably coming soon.

haha yes

Pink shop! But... What does she do? The background looks like the same one from the dream, so the knights probably aren't around for this. Really, you'd think Coraline would be the one handing out temporary corruption as currency instead of the Witch. I'm guessing from that curse mark, whatever she's "selling" is gonna be Eschahn/corruption-themed. Maybe an easier way to get specific curses on the knights? Maybe this would even be the only source of certain "dealbreaker" curses like futa and scat that wouldn't be forced on you through normal gameplay?

(I also like how "haha yes" has become the "hello world" of the modern era.)

"Permanent" Corruption

Eyyy, that's one thing off the to-do list that's been there for a while. Now to deal with stat points... To this date, I have still never seen a knight shrug off the localized aurora.

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(It's a video, so I can't just post it here.)

Huh. What could this possibly be? Technically, it shows an Eschahn curse mark getting replaced with a symbol of Melos, but that symbol is also just the "completed research" icon, so I don't know if that's really intentional. The pink box suggests this is related to Coraline's "shop", but that definitely doesn't look like an animation that plays when you just buy something. Could it be... some sort of achievement system? Does Coraline give us a series of objectives to complete and reward us for them? Not so sure I trust a shopping list from a zealot of corruption... But then again, with the UI showing an Eschahn symbol disappearing, maybe it's not so sinister? Maybe we're actually contributing to "saving" Coraline...? I suppose it's not out of the question if this is the same update that introduces a way to reduce permanent corruption (which may or may not be connected to this animation in the first place).

 

[RagueltheUFO]

So I was wondering what is the requirement to trigger the Elli "Pride/Vainglory" scene. It says if the two girls are training then it should happen but when I pick train for Elli, she goes to one area and Raine goes to another to train. They will not be in the same area because they are training on different things.

 

[NRFB]

Tweet time! And we've got some interesting ones this time, with the update presumably coming soon.

MECHANICALLY I have (almost) everything I want to add working. The writing for content part though... Hahaaaaa (my anti-depressants stopped working please help)

"dealbreaker" curses like futa and scat that wouldn't be forced on you through normal gameplay?

Maaaan, you really gotta put those two things in the same category like that?

Technically, it shows an Eschahn curse mark getting replaced with a symbol of Melos, but that symbol is also just the "completed research" icon, so I don't know if that's really intentional.

I mean I had to pick that texture specifically for it to show up there so it's pretty intentional.

So I was wondering what is the requirement to trigger the Elli "Pride/Vainglory" scene. It says if the two girls are training then it should happen but when I pick train for Elli, she goes to one area and Raine goes to another to train. They will not be in the same area because they are training on different things.

I know it is possible to have this event happen manually (I have done it before) but it is probably more unlikely/difficult than it should be. It has to do with the (probably more complicated than it needs to be) system that determines ally camp activities. Basically when an activity is decided on (in this case it would be training), the ally also determines if they want to do that thing socially (if possible, which it is for training). They then negotiate between each other, comparing plans and willingness to do things socially versus alone and looking for the best location(s) to do that so that everyone ends up as satisfied as possible. If one ally wants to be social and one doesn't and there is more than one location where the activity can occur, then the two will remain separate, so no event.

All that to say, the thing that determines the willingness to Train while in camp is the ally's current desire for Growth, while the thing that determines if an ally will want to be social is the current desire for Community (note these are both the CURRENT values, not the drives). Having those at higher values will make the setup for the scene more likely to occur. With that said though, I will PROBABLY eventually look into adding some system to bias the logic towards reaching a particular decision if doing so would result in a new event happening, because this one in particular is not that easy to set up, which is probably annoying.

 

[Rosen King]

Maaaan, you really gotta put those two things in the same category like that?

I mean, it's a broad category... Furry is my usual go-to example, as I find that it's the most egregious thing that people tend to forget to tag (out of tags that are commonly blacklisted/searched for), but I don't expect to see a furry curse simply because of how much work it'd be. Scat is the second place my mind goes because I like to tell people, "Always remember to tag your shit, and ALWAYS remember to tag your shit." And I could see there being an entirely avoidable scat curse/scene in this game. Easy to add, important to be able to avoid.

I mean I had to pick that texture specifically for it to show up there so it's pretty intentional.

I meant in the sense that it could have been chosen to represent Melos, or it could just represent completion. I don't think we have a Syra-themed or Eschahn-themed completion icon yet. Though, come to think of it, we should probably expect to see the latter at some point, considering that Coraline already has one...

the thing that determines the willingness to Train while in camp is the ally's current desire for Growth

That explains why it took me so long to trigger. I was beefing up their Triumph drive because I figured this was about kicking each other's asses. I mean, that totally was the subject of the scene itself, so needing an unrelated drive to trigger it is pretty tricky.

 

[NRFB]

That explains why it took me so long to trigger. I was beefing up their Triumph drive because I figured this was about kicking each other's asses. I mean, that totally was the subject of the scene itself, so needing an unrelated drive to trigger it is pretty tricky.

Every camp activity (other than sleeping) satisfies two desires at once, so Triumph would also technically work. Although because of the ratio between between how much it satisfies the two, Growth would be much more likely to be the cause for an ally choosing to train.

 

[Rosen King]

Update time? Nope. Just Tweet time.

Yup, I sure am writing... something.

Of course. It was only a matter of time until feet stuff. I wonder why it's ??? though? I don't think that's typical for a monster, and this doesn't seem to be an existing character... And wait, is that the research log? Eh, that part may not be relevant if this was just taken from the "gallery".

Me when behind and trying to squeeze out some more scenes before update time and also think of tweets. (Alpha-15 probably this weekend)

Y'know, these girls should learn how to be more lucid in trance. I'm sure they'd get a lot of mileage out of it. Maybe we can incorporate it into Lucette's "meditation training". (Also, yay, more best girl.)

Still finishing some things up and doing some testing. Let's go for tomorrow!

Should we tell her that the "flying dick thingies" were most likely created by a mad scientist conducting experiments which, if the Witch is to be believed, could tear the fabric of Eschahn's being apart from within? That seems like something Coraline would be concerned about.

I should have started doing all the work for a release an hour ago but I'm still finding (small) bugs. I think it would be wisest to take another day to fix things, as unfortunate as it is. So again, but this time more, let's go for tomorrow!

Boo. Oh well, at least it means a release with no new bugs, right? ...Yeah, I'm gonna get my bug report form ready for tomorrow.

 

[RagueltheUFO]

I think I found another glitch before the update and its annoying me.

So the Shelter Curse will still appear on a character who has denounced it. It won't show it as a status element but the spider icon still randomly shows up after resting. There was nothing in the room that suddenly triggered the spider icon and I was just ":/"

This happens with Scatterbrain and Idle Hands too but very rarely. Heck, Idle Hands sometimes becomes a permanent status effect even if you remove the curse.

 

[grahegri]

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[NRFB]

Y'know, these girls should learn how to be more lucid in trance.

I've been finding this somewhat restrictive on the writing side but at the same time it can also be good because making the ability to trance too good can lead to a lot of "well why doesn't the main character just _" type questions, if that makes sense.

Boo. Oh well, at least it means a release with no new bugs, right? ...Yeah, I'm gonna get my bug report form ready for tomorrow.

I didn't know you had lost so much faith in me.

I think I found another glitch before the update and its annoying me.

Thanks for reminding me about this. I was able to slip it in.

So the Shelter Curse will still appear on a character who has denounced it. It won't show it as a status element but the spider icon still randomly shows up after resting. There was nothing in the room that suddenly triggered the spider icon and I was just ":/"

This happens with Scatterbrain and Idle Hands too but very rarely. Heck, Idle Hands sometimes becomes a permanent status effect even if you remove the curse.

Dunno what spider you're talking about but otherwise this is basically because compulsions are implemented as status effects and were not removed when the associated curse was removed. In most cases the compulsion would then hang out until being triggered again, where they then would or wouldn't be removed depending on the exact implementation of the specific compulsion. It's also worth pointing out that Idle Hands uses the same masturbation compulsion status effect as Aphrodisiac does, so all 3 allies generally have some amount of that hanging around in their brains.

 

[Rosen King]

Update time!

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is there any way to replay the tutorial without starting a new game?

Probably not, although it should be noted that each "run" in this game should be relatively short and you can try the tutorial again on New Game+. If you die (or choose the "abandon run" option in the menu), you'll be able to start over while still carrying over some of your progress.

I didn't know you had lost so much faith in me.

I mean... *Gestures at bug reports*

 

[Privitarium]

Pretty neat shop, I like that sleep now has a function rather than being just a tax.

Will also add to previous report that assigning "perm.corr to temp.corr" to Lucette also affected Raine instead. Might be common to all knight-selective options in the new shop.
Also a typo of "subtlty" in the 3rd dream that should be "subtlety".
Don't know if it was just luck or if the drop rate has changed, but I had a three or more floors give me 8+ scrolls (starting from floor 10 I think).

 

[Minole]

Hi, I dropped in a while back to ask if a mobile port was even possible, let alone on the radar. Iirc the response was that it's theoretically possible but would be very low priority.

I just wanted to ask if that's still the case, or has the game and scope evolved beyond there being a possibility or any level of priority at all?

 

[Roxos]

Just a little comment. The fluff is not exactly to my tastes but the game is an absolute blast! The mechanics and execution are very well thought through and the game was enjoyable even disregarding the ero stuff.

 

[NRFB]

One of Coraline's chats seems to be cut off. It was... Dammit, it's not there anymore. But it took up the whole chat space and "ended" with a comma.

"I'm just saying that you can't be held morally accountable for anything that happens between people in a dream, y'know?"
I actually remember checking if this would fit because it's the longest chat message and I guess I didn't notice the missing y'know.

I think the criteria for getting ankle-bit by the Hungry Room is off. I've been letting Raine get attacked for like 20 turns now, with her active Reflex being 8, and she only gets licked or spit at. The first event I saw from the room was the ankle bite, though, and it was when Elli was in a pretty good state... Did you maybe put >22 Reflex instead of <22?

Looks like I did.

Y'know, while we're on the subject, how about just telling the total number of spells in the current version?

Presently:
Skills: 116
Curses: 37
Spells: 69 (haha sex number)

Ack, could you not have the Witch's text change while I'm in the middle of reading it? Especially when there's already a "make the Witch's text change" button. ...And *especially* when they don't loop so I can't see the one that I missed.

I could probably slow down the rate of automatic chat switches. Originally, there was no chat button at all and you would have just had to wait if you wanted to see more, so I kept the time between new chats relatively small.

...Goddammit. There doesn't seem to be a way to rewatch the scenes leading into the Experiments plotline. Actually, there doesn't seem to be a way to rewatch any of the scenes from that plotline. That should probably be addressed.

I'm not sure where to put them, but other than that, sure.

Back to Coraline, I REALLY hope there's a NG+ option to make her tasks available from the start,

Not from the start, but go to new game+ menu, page 3

...So, uh, is there a way to check which tasks you have active? That's gonna be kiiiinda important if you're not allowed to even go back to the dream until after you've completed them. ...Wait, I see the option in the dungeon now. Although I don't see an option to check in camp, which is still pretty important since some are only done in camp.

Check your own status button.

I mean... *Gestures at bug reports*

I'm actually feeling pretty okay about this update since there was nothing so big that it has required me to make and upload a new version. Typos suck but are whatever. The Coraline options being applied to the wrong character thing is unfortunate and I'll have to look into it, but it isn't a HUGE deal. I guess that's kinda setting the bar a little low still, but I at least feel vindicated in taking the extra day to fix things.

Pretty neat shop, I like that sleep now has a function rather than being just a tax.

This is how I feel about sleep in real life too

Hi, I dropped in a while back to ask if a mobile port was even possible, let alone on the radar. Iirc the response was that it's theoretically possible but would be very low priority.

I just wanted to ask if that's still the case, or has the game and scope evolved beyond there being a possibility or any level of priority at all?

The state of other ports
Mac: Would require notarization from apple in order to not get blocked from running, so no. (apparently you can just play the game through wine anyway)
HTML5/Web: The exported game is too large of a single file to host on itch. The game data is all put into a .pac file, but for web hosted games itch has a limit of no singular file being over 200MB. I would need to figure out external hosting I think? I have some doubts that a web version would even run particularly well though.
Android: Exporting to an apk and installing on my own phone seems to work, but when opening it the game simply fails to start (blank screen). I'm probably doing things incorrectly in the export process but the actual documentation for this is already spotty on top of me not knowing anything about apps and mobile development in general.

So aside from Mac which I'm just saying "no" on, the others are still at a level of "on the radar, but I've only made attempts, struggled, and failed to get them to work so far"

Just a little comment. The fluff is not exactly to my tastes but the game is an absolute blast! The mechanics and execution are very well thought through and the game was enjoyable even disregarding the ero stuff.

 

[Rosen King]

Will also add to previous report that assigning "perm.corr to temp.corr" to Lucette also affected Raine instead. Might be common to all knight-selective options in the new shop.

The skill point seems to work, at least. ...Until it suddenly doesn't. Wha? I definitely just watched one get given to Lucette and not Raine, but then the one from the following night went to Raine. Okay, this is something weird.

I'm actually feeling pretty okay about this update since there was nothing so big that it has required me to make and upload a new version. Typos suck but are whatever. The Coraline options being applied to the wrong character thing is unfortunate and I'll have to look into it, but it isn't a HUGE deal. I guess that's kinda setting the bar a little low still, but I at least feel vindicated in taking the extra day to fix things.

For the record, I'm mostly joking. There will always be bugs, and its worthwhile to take the time to fix the ones you can. It's certainly not a low bar to be glad that a newly-added mechanic isn't completely broken in its first release. I was just teasing about the fact that you can never get them all.


On an unrelated note, I just had a thought about Coraline, and the fact that her whole "seductress" angle seems to conflict with the rest of her character. Is it possible that she's actually emulating Elli? Maybe she was always a shy (but horny) girl who had trouble asking for what she wanted, and was grateful for Elli's forwardness. Then when she became a follower of the goddess of desire, she started asking herself, "What would Elli do?" (And somehow she came up with "pretend a nurse's cap is a mitre" as an answer.) This could become an interesting angle if/when she discovers that Elli wouldn't have become a follower of Eschahn (at least on her own). But maybe I'm headcanoning this too hard based on what kind of character I want Coraline to be.


...Oh! I just had an idea of something that could be done with the Task system, although maybe you already had something like this in mind. Remember that whole "partially scripted chunks of floors" system? I'm not sure if that was ever used outside of the Reference Poltergeist (I definitely noticed how it always yeets the knights into a dead end Hole of Nothing), but maybe Coraline could offer "Marks" as one of her tasks, which would cause a scripted encounter on the next floor. This would be a good excuse to include some tougher, more unique monsters that aren't as RNG-based, but which also don't have a good reason to be part of a story-related event.


Just encountered a bug, although I feel like I heard someone report this before? When switching between curses while a knight is in your tent, even if they're not in trance, the "perform action" button becomes usable again.


Another likely bug, skills with the "had X happen more often than other allies" requirement seem to be reversed. Both Flagellate and Trouble Attraction have two knights who meet the requirement, and have been in that state for two floors, so it's not likely that they just have equal numbers.


Alright, run complete. That's all for-- Aaaaaaand my Research Notes on the main menu are now blank. Not sure if this was related to opening the NG+ menu and not starting a run after that.

 

[NRFB]

...Oh! I just had an idea of something that could be done with the Task system, although maybe you already had something like this in mind. Remember that whole "partially scripted chunks of floors" system? I'm not sure if that was ever used outside of the Reference Poltergeist (I definitely noticed how it always yeets the knights into a dead end Hole of Nothing), but maybe Coraline could offer "Marks" as one of her tasks, which would cause a scripted encounter on the next floor. This would be a good excuse to include some tougher, more unique monsters that aren't as RNG-based, but which also don't have a good reason to be part of a story-related event.

Well don't ruin the surprise for people... Although this kinda thing was more or less hinted at in the cutscene anyway.

Alright, run complete. That's all for-- Aaaaaaand my Research Notes on the main menu are now blank. Not sure if this was related to opening the NG+ menu and not starting a run after that.

Aw, and I was in a good mood too. Actually this isn't that surprising. There is some jank in setting up the research notes menu on the main menu specifically when there is no save game to load. I have to do some weird stuff to mimic the data structure that would normally have been supplied by the save game file, and even then it will end up not having absolutely EVERYTHING that an actual save game has in it. I did try to cover the edge cases, but I guess I missed something.
If you're worried though, it shouldn't have touched your actual metaprog file, so everything you've unlocked should still be there when you start up a new run.

 

[RagueltheUFO]

I caught two things that I think are weird bugs.

Anonymity prevents anyone from scrying the knight. The description does not mention at all that you cannot scry them on a space. Just that it doesn't affect the space they are on. A strat I use is to scry after everyone is on the stair case so I can give them a charge for the next floor (or if I have the magic skill that takes the charge and reduces exhaustion/injury/lust it just makes it easier on the next floor). The red glow just shows around the knight and it rejects me from using the skill even if multiple knights are present.

The other is about Coraline. NG+ and had her show up immediately. Cutscene is skipped but apparently, the scene where she talks to you the first time will still happen after the original requirement preventing you from taking her quests. I wasted a dream night man.

A question that I had though is Lucelle's new scene. Because the scene of Elli investigating the last team happened on my first playthrough and will not play for NG+, is there a way for this scene to be triggered since nothing seems to be getting her to actually get to that point.