QSP Abandoned Jack-o-Nine-Tails [v2.2.3] [Old Huntsman + Community development]

[way2co0l]

Some of the non-district-resident NPCs who buy slaves allow you to negotiate the price, which adds another layer of possibilities on the income side.

Yeah I've seen that though I'm working to build my brand up a bit more first as the wiki states bartering with a weak brand is usually more harmful than good which makes sense. My brand is currently C which isn't bad, and I'll likely be taking advantage of the negotiations whenever I have to sell to them that way, but I've basically committed to selling this slave at auction so I can see for myself what kind of worth I can get from the effort. I don't yet have a plan for the slaves that will follow but that is potentially something I'll look to take advantage of as it would appear to be highly worthwhile on the whole.

You may have to skip some battles to avoid losing her when she becomes a champion. She will stay if she has devotion than fear.

Yeah this is something I've been meaning to ask about. Is it a set number of battles before they become a champion and can become free, or is it tied to the slave's fame from winning those battles? Because I saw in the changelog that the number of fights to reach S+ rank was increased, so wasn't 100% sure if that changed how quickly you'd face the prospect of losing your champion. Ultimately I thiiiiink I'll be ok on this front. I don't think she's very far off from obedience and the devotion shouldn't be very far off behind that and her fear is minimal and can probably be eliminated entirely pretty easily.

Were you mostly keeping her on moderate portion or on restricted?

I had her on moderate most of the time. I did restrict her for a little bit early on when her endurance was low and didn't have the energy (or willingness) to do enough to work it all off and she was getting precariously close to jumping beyond slender. But once she started fighting and letting me personally train her in fighting more myself (I'm A in both, working my way to S) I had her on moderate and she started burning through those calories way too fast for my comfort. I put her on generous for awhile even while she was still slender, because I liked having the extra cushion before she became bony, but eventually I let her drop to model and have just been more carefully managing from there. She's currently restricted because she's halfway towards jumping back up to slender so I'm going to burn some of that back off once her energy returns from the last arena fight and then return her to moderate for simpler training.

What would we need to do to create another "right way" in your view? What makes a certain way "right"? Money management has two sides, income and expenses. I gave examples of various ways you can minimize expenses or get income. That seems like multiple ways to me.

By better sense of progression, do you specifically think C- or C+ rating should have a higher value?

Again I really don't mean to be critical in any way. I get that people simply have different visions for things sometimes and you guys have tailored the extreme difficulty based on your vision for that, and I have absolutely no doubt that you've put a lot of time and thought into all of it, so I'm not trying to shit on that in any way shape or form.

But yeah, my personal vision and perspective on things differs from yours on these points.

I personally don't feel there are many good options on extreme and that I basically need to prioritize girls that can be used as gladiators in order to allow myself to feel like I'm making any kind of real progress. With the time pressures you're facing from weak stats and low cash reserves (loans exist but you better have a plan that would result in making gains that justify that lost money) means you really don't have much luxury to aim for C or B rated slaves on the merit of simply recouping the value from their sale anyway. You can focus on guild contracts or trying to sell some cheap D slaves, but again you're going to need to be using them in the arena on the side to mitigate their expense along the way.

In those early stages there are simply no other viable paths to mitigate those expenses in any other way, and NOT doing so is simply making it harder on yourself in the long run. You start way too weak and untrained to have any hope of fighting in the fogs to make money, and all of the cow/pig/egg options are all gated behind rent which basically increases your expenses by a HUGE margin. Like... Feeding my slave is probably averaging me around 40 per decade, and feeding myself at the HIP to maintain the gains I've made to my strength cost another 30. Add in occasional spa visits, gifts, dates, ect but then balanced out by the area winnings means ultimately I'm losing between 40-60 a decade. Usually closer to 40, but I've been gifting ambrosia to satisfy my promises for a gift so that jumps it closer to 60.

But when you compare that to the costs of renting in outcast district which gives free access to the barn so you can take advantage of those other opportunities, you're faced with much more overhead on top. First there's the direct expense of rent, combined with the forced increase to your standard of living which appeared to be a direct cost of 40 as best I could tell. It lets you cut back on spa visits to be sure, having access to an assistant is incredibly helpful, and the happiness that having such easy access to cleanliness has, not regarding your slave, but her willingness to accept things with you now that you yourself aren't walking around filthy is also a huge plus.

But the price.... The price of it all.... It appears to me that I'd be paying being 320-340 per decade to gain access to said barn, not counting costs for surgeries, or the time it would take to train your slave to fulfill any of the sorts of roles that would result in those kinds of incomes, and it just becomes clear to me that it's not something you can feasibly do very early in the game.

Which brings me back to the arena. It feels like it's all gated behind the arena, and you basically have to use it because you're just making it harder on yourself if you don't. Which also requires you to either get lucky with a slave that's already gifted enough to fight in the arena for a good while like you did in your playthrough example I linked to before, or else you'll have to put time and effort into training her up so she can like I'm doing in my current playthrough. But that's also why I'm still 40 days in with a disobedient slave that was actually more amenable to training than my first slave which only took 27 days. I feel like I've been forced to take this route to more easily absorb the costs of holding onto her longer so I can go for a better rating and get myself out of this negative loop.

I do personally feel the prices for C- and C+ slaves are too low in relation to D's and B's, and while I understand why you do it that way, I personally think it makes that a far less viable path forward. Your best bet is to do like you've suggested before. Train guild contracts, have them fight in the arena a few times as those first few fights are easy, build your guild rank up in the process, and use it to allow you to eventually bring 2 fighters to the events. I'd like to have other options that make sense, and personally I feel C- should pay at least 50 more, and C+ should probably pay 200 more to make those more attractive stepping stones, but that's just me.

But the thing is, even if you adjust those prices, it doesn't change the fact that the game is weighted towards the gladiatrix arena route. You either use it, or you struggle unnecessarily. I think the game's biggest weakness is not having other viable sources of income (proficiency wise) keeping things gated behind energy and training so it's not so easy to just do all the things at once. To let your artists perform on the street or at the bar. Your assistants to take on secretarial roles. Jobs that sap their energy so you have to sacrifice on being able to train them as much, and could even reflect badly on you if they're too rebellious or too unskilled to do a good job.

I mean, sure, I understand the argument that these businesses would prefer to just buy the slaves themselves, but finding well trained slaves can be difficult and sometimes you have to supplement your shifts with less skilled labor for a paltry wage. But ultimately it would allow the player to pursue different playstyles that don't require you to follow the same logic path to success. That's my perspective on it. lol

 

[way2co0l]

We’ve been thinking about introducing a new guild-sponsored event once per decade where you test your slave against rival guild members’ slaves in a choice of contests: cooking, alchemy, witchcraft, dance, music or painting.

To make it more immersive, we could simulate the rivals’ slaves developing over time and you would see some of the same ones appear in multiple contests.

It would have a rule that only slaves of the same rating can compete against each other, and there would be a lifetime limit of five competitions per slave, so that the participants wouldn’t be able to always put their best slave but instead need to keep bringing new ones.

This would also give us a framework for adding more interaction with other guild NPCs, with event chains, special missions and the like.

Definitely an interesting idea and not one I was thinking of. I could see why you'd want to go this kind of route though as it would be the most similar to the arena route so more familiar to everyone. I still think my personal preference is skill based jobs that sap energy, can negatively effect brand, and who's pittance for wages would be based entirely on skill. Like, to send a miserable f skilled secretary should have her sent right back home. D skilled might make 2 sparks a day, maybe 3 if in a great mood, maybe 1 if in a terrible mood and use up a full star of energy, and each rank increase similarly increasing her pay. An S+ rated secretary might earn as much as 10 a day with a good mood for example. It still would require energy which would limit your ability to train her as quickly, likely decrease her mood from being exploited, and could negatively effect your reputation and probably only very small if any chances of improving it. I'm leaning more towards none. The fame is for the arena which would make it more special.

Yes, that would require a bit of a rebalance in terms of the economy in general and probably require better potential purse earnings from the fights... Like the first fight having a purse of 50 makes sense because it's insanely easy to win it, but as each fight gets more difficult and the risks of losing your slave increase, so should the potential purse from it. Plus you get the fame from it, and the ability to do other side jobs throughout the week, albeit you'll have a tough time with that considering the huge energy drain from the fights and you needing to invest so much of her time and energy into training her for her fights to avoid losing her means she's less likely to have the spare energy or mood to do anything else, and if she does, it probably won't be at a very high level.

Again, just my thoughts. I understand it wouldn't be simple but I do think the game would be better off with it.

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

Yeah this is something I've been meaning to ask about. Is it a set number of battles before they become a champion and can become free, or is it tied to the slave's fame from winning those battles?

There are five tiers of opponent for non-champions, and defeating the fifth tier makes your slave a champion. If you lose a battle and the slave doesn't die, they have to repeat a lower tier.

I personally don't feel there are many good options on extreme and that I basically need to prioritize girls that can be used as gladiators in order to allow myself to feel like I'm making any kind of real progress. With the time pressures you're facing from weak stats and low cash reserves (loans exist but you better have a plan that would result in making gains that justify that lost money) means you really don't have much luxury to aim for C or B rated slaves on the merit of simply recouping the value from their sale anyway.

Have you considered taking a loan shortly before you run out of your savings (presumably with your slave-in-training already at least C- or C+) and using the extra budget to get her up to B- or B+?

You can focus on guild contracts or trying to sell some cheap D slaves, but again you're going to need to be using them in the arena on the side to mitigate their expense along the way.

Aside from guild rep allowing you to have multiple arena battles per decade, it is also an insurance policy to be able to take a guild contract for prepayment if you are a little bit short on funds. But you have to complete the contract to regain that option. Selling high enough ratings at auctions also raises guild reputation, and you can make more sparks that way.

The other benefit of contracts is that they can give you high-quality slaves without paying market price. You can start a contract, get the prepayment and a slave with great potential, immediately complete the contract by turning in another slave you've already trained (maximizing the speed bonus), and keep the new one. You only need to acquire one slave independently to start a cycle like this.

all of the cow/pig/egg options are all gated behind rent which basically increases your expenses by a HUGE margin. Like... Feeding my slave is probably averaging me around 40 per decade, and feeding myself at the HIP to maintain the gains I've made to my strength cost another 30. Add in occasional spa visits, gifts, dates, ect but then balanced out by the area winnings means ultimately I'm losing between 40-60 a decade. Usually closer to 40, but I've been gifting ambrosia to satisfy my promises for a gift so that jumps it closer to 60.

If your strength is above B+, pub food isn't any better than canned food, except that it can be cheaper. Switch to $1 meals or decide it's not worthwhile saving 1$/day by spending half an energy star to go there.

Ambrosia is a very high expense in the early game. You can fulfill your promise with a $1 sweet treat or $2 bouquet. The slave might not be happy about it, but you can compensate for that with a smaller amount of sparks.

But when you compare that to the costs of renting in outcast district which gives free access to the barn so you can take advantage of those other opportunities, you're faced with much more overhead on top. First there's the direct expense of rent, combined with the forced increase to your standard of living which appeared to be a direct cost of 40 as best I could tell. It lets you cut back on spa visits to be sure, having access to an assistant is incredibly helpful, and the happiness that having such easy access to cleanliness has, not regarding your slave, but her willingness to accept things with you now that you yourself aren't walking around filthy is also a huge plus.

But the price.... The price of it all.... It appears to me that I'd be paying being 320-340 per decade to gain access to said barn, not counting costs for surgeries, or the time it would take to train your slave to fulfill any of the sorts of roles that would result in those kinds of incomes, and it just becomes clear to me that it's not something you can feasibly do very early in the game.

Your secretary can reduce the bill. Your egglayer alone can bring in up to 270$ per decade (up to 180$ without a farmhand). Subtract food cost of up to 7$ per day. If you have a fiend, the egglayer's costs go to zero (if there's enough supply), so the 100$ cost of acquiring a fiend pays for itself from that alone. You can also obtain one cheaper.

Having a fiend also improves the profit margin for cow milk, but even without a fiend it can break even on the feeding cost at average lactation level or turn a modest profit at higher lactation level. So adding a cow is a small up-front cost that eventually pays for itself, even if you don't sell the cow to the public animal farm (although selling the cow would be a good idea if you are trying to maximize your income).

Which brings me back to the arena. It feels like it's all gated behind the arena, and you basically have to use it because you're just making it harder on yourself if you don't. Which also requires you to either get lucky with a slave that's already gifted enough to fight in the arena for a good while like you did in your playthrough example I linked to before, or else you'll have to put time and effort into training her up so she can like I'm doing in my current playthrough. But that's also why I'm still 40 days in with a disobedient slave that was actually more amenable to training than my first slave which only took 27 days. I feel like I've been forced to take this route to more easily absorb the costs of holding onto her longer so I can go for a better rating and get myself out of this negative loop.

I guess you didn't like the "disposable slave" strategy I outlined earlier, which is both more profitable and avoids teaching your current slave how to fight back before she's obedient enough not to do it.

I do personally feel the prices for C- and C+ slaves are too low in relation to D's and B's, and while I understand why you do it that way, I personally think it makes that a far less viable path forward. Your best bet is to do like you've suggested before. Train guild contracts, have them fight in the arena a few times as those first few fights are easy, build your guild rank up in the process, and use it to allow you to eventually bring 2 fighters to the events. I'd like to have other options that make sense, and personally I feel C- should pay at least 50 more, and C+ should probably pay 200 more to make those more attractive stepping stones, but that's just me.

The question for me in setting the pricing is how much additional time does it take to go from one rating to the next. The largest challenge on extreme difficulty is the disobedient phase. Once you get to D-, it becomes much easier. You can start using drugs, too. Are you using drugs?

But the thing is, even if you adjust those prices, it doesn't change the fact that the game is weighted towards the gladiatrix arena route. You either use it, or you struggle unnecessarily. I think the game's biggest weakness is not having other viable sources of income (proficiency wise) keeping things gated behind energy and training so it's not so easy to just do all the things at once. To let your artists perform on the street or at the bar. Your assistants to take on secretarial roles. Jobs that sap their energy so you have to sacrifice on being able to train them as much, and could even reflect badly on you if they're too rebellious or too unskilled to do a good job.

Along these lines, I think the gladiatrix route is currently too easy. Why is it that you can make any random girl (almost) into an arena champion?

I mean, sure, I understand the argument that these businesses would prefer to just buy the slaves themselves, but finding well trained slaves can be difficult and sometimes you have to supplement your shifts with less skilled labor for a paltry wage. But ultimately it would allow the player to pursue different playstyles that don't require you to follow the same logic path to success. That's my perspective on it. lol

I don't think many businesses would accept unskilled labor. Maybe the brothel, just for the "newness" factor. No skill required, just a pretty face. Some customers even prefer it that way. But, if the slaver wants the brothel to actually teach the slave anything, the slaver should pay the brothel for the lessons, just like a tutor.

 

[way2co0l]

Ok trying my first race, and there are 2 sections of string blades.... How the heck do you instruct your girl to bend down? I have only the same options as every other point in the race. Crack whip, manage reins, and draw reins. I don't see any options during any segment, either at the blades segment or any point before it to tell her to.

I've been trying every combination and so far the only way I managed to do it was if I drew reins at every stage from start of the race all the way through both blade segments. If I tried to speed up or manage the reins at any point, she dies. Is it just a matter of poor obedience and skill? Or am I missing something here.

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

Is it just a matter of poor obedience and skill? Or am I missing something here.

It’s a speed and maneuverability check. So yes, it’s a matter of obedience and skill, and possibly the chariot weight too. How did you configure the chariot?

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

just wondering but what's the best way to raise obedience when you first get a slave?

Depends on a lot of things. Have you played through the tutorial? Do you understand the factors that go into obedience?

 

[kirto12]

Depends on a lot of things. Have you played through the tutorial? Do you understand the factors that go into obedience?

I've played through the tutorial and mostly understand the factors that go into raising obedience.

what I'm mainly wondering is what are to best ways to raise the obedience / lower the disobedience of slaves that have a high pride stat such as wilhelmine from the tutorial practical exam who starts off very rebellious when you first get them.

 

[way2co0l]

There are five tiers of opponent for non-champions, and defeating the fifth tier makes your slave a champion. If you lose a battle and the slave doesn't die, they have to repeat a lower tier.

Yeah I just found that out when I tried to have her fight again so reloaded. I have my answer, and that means no more gladiatrix funds for me for at least 2 decades.

Have you considered taking a loan shortly before you run out of your savings (presumably with your slave-in-training already at least C- or C+) and using the extra budget to get her up to B- or B+?

Well, remember I'm still early game, and while I cheated in extra funds to give myself a cushion so I could actually have a little bit of time to learn the harder mechanics without immediately going broke, if I tried to do that with the sparks you have available on extreme difficulty, I'd wind up needing to take a loan very early on. 200 sparks really isn't a lot to work with. If you accept a guild contract then you spare yourself having to pay for her, and an arena battle or 2 can let you go for a few decades if you're exceptionally frugal. But with the low stats you begin the game with, I don't see myself being able to get a slave to a D rating before needing a loan. In this playthrough my first guild contract girl took me 27 days to get to D-, and the amount of funds I spent to do so meant I would have had to have taken a loan to have done it without the extra funds I gave myself. Add a decade minimum to get the point of devotion for C+ and the fact B- requires 2 devotion, and B+ requires 3... I assume with an extra decade required for each... I'm not entirely certain I'd be capable of doing that in the time I'd need to before going bankrupt. Maybe I could with what I've learned but I'm not actually certain.

Aside from guild rep allowing you to have multiple arena battles per decade, it is also an insurance policy to be able to take a guild contract for prepayment if you are a little bit short on funds. But you have to complete the contract to regain that option. Selling high enough ratings at auctions also raises guild reputation, and you can make more sparks that way.

Those are some fair points and a sneaky way to do it of course.

The other benefit of contracts is that they can give you high-quality slaves without paying market price. You can start a contract, get the prepayment and a slave with great potential, immediately complete the contract by turning in another slave you've already trained (maximizing the speed bonus), and keep the new one. You only need to acquire one slave independently to start a cycle like this.

Another good point, but also one you can't do immediately. You'll have to get your feet under you first so you're at least treading water long enough to do it.

If your strength is above B+, pub food isn't any better than canned food, except that it can be cheaper. Switch to $1 meals or decide it's not worthwhile saving 1$/day by spending half an energy star to go there.

This is good to know. I thought the lower quality the food, the quicker it would degrade your strength the larger the difference in required quality was. If that's not the case then I can swap to the cheaper stuff and save 20 sparks a decade. Very good to know.

Ambrosia is a very high expense in the early game. You can fulfill your promise with a $1 sweet treat or $2 bouquet. The slave might not be happy about it, but you can compensate for that with a smaller amount of sparks.

It is, but unfortunately I didn't have any better opportunities to reward her in between fights those weeks. She won the fight, so I promised a gift, failed to have an opportunity to reward her sufficiently before the next fight, and she expected a level 5 reward, plus the promised gift so I figured 2 birds one stone.

Your secretary can reduce the bill. Your egglayer alone can bring in up to 270$ per decade (up to 180$ without a farmhand). Subtract food cost of up to 7$ per day. If you have a fiend, the egglayer's costs go to zero (if there's enough supply), so the 100$ cost of acquiring a fiend pays for itself from that alone. You can also obtain one cheaper.

Having a fiend also improves the profit margin for cow milk, but even without a fiend it can break even on the feeding cost at average lactation level or turn a modest profit at higher lactation level. So adding a cow is a small up-front cost that eventually pays for itself, even if you don't sell the cow to the public animal farm (although selling the cow would be a good idea if you are trying to maximize your income).

Perhaps that's just something I haven't noticed. I was doing the accounting myself as I was using Isabella's energy for other tasks.

But most of what you're talking about here still requires you getting your feet under you first. Like, maybe I'm not communicating what I mean here very well because I don't deny that there are options further down the line you can use to supplement your income for sure. I'm talking about in the very beginning with the limited funds and stats available on extreme. You won't be gaining access to those options for several decades.

I'm talking primarily about the very early game when you're struggling the most and have the least wriggle room to get yourself started. It's during this period where the arena is the only viable source of supplemental income. Other options open up later once you start earning enough to get some wriggle room, able to acquire your own slaves, and even able to afford an apartment. But before that point, options are very very limited.

I guess you didn't like the "disposable slave" strategy I outlined earlier, which is both more profitable and avoids teaching your current slave how to fight back before she's obedient enough not to do it.

I believe you're referring to the option of cryo store your slave for a day, or potentially a decade, while buying another cheap slave for 20 sparks?

On the surface I thought it was a good idea, but in practice I haven't been able to do it. I have not yet been able to buy a slave for any cheaper than 45 sparks, and that prevents it from being an option that'll return any profit. Maybe I've just been unlucky in that regard every time I've tried. It's possible, but my current experience is why I'm not looking at it as a serious option.

The question for me in setting the pricing is how much additional time does it take to go from one rating to the next. The largest challenge on extreme difficulty is the disobedient phase. Once you get to D-, it becomes much easier. You can start using drugs, too. Are you using drugs?

I haven't looked into the drug stuff yet no, as I've been trying to keep my expenses low and I don't know enough about how to effectively use them yet. I'll have to look into that and start using them. I'm sure that like magic, they'll make the whole training process quicker and easier as long as you can afford to use them in the first place.

Along these lines, I think the gladiatrix route is currently too easy. Why is it that you can make any random girl (almost) into an arena champion?

Oh I 100% agree. I feel it's such an advantage that you'd have to be intentionally handicapping yourself to choose NOT to do it. That's why I feel like I'm forced to do it if I want to get myself off the ground in any reasonable timeframe.

I don't think many businesses would accept unskilled labor. Maybe the brothel, just for the "newness" factor. No skill required, just a pretty face. Some customers even prefer it that way. But, if the slaver wants the brothel to actually teach the slave anything, the slaver should pay the brothel for the lessons, just like a tutor.

Oh I agree that if you want the business to teach anything, then you should have to pay. No argument there. But having it so you can bring your slaves in to prostitute them where the brothel effectively takes a major cut leaving you only with the minor profits feels reasonable to me. The same way allowing your artists to perform for tips, your secretary to essentially get a small number of sparks for completing random paperwork for some business, or a serving girl also working for tips would be. I understand you may feel differently on that point, but I personally don't find it that hard to believe that some businesses would be happy with that kind of arrangement.

 

[way2co0l]

It’s a speed and maneuverability check. So yes, it’s a matter of obedience and skill, and possibly the chariot weight too. How did you configure the chariot?

There were a lot of Russian road segments.. like 3 or 4 of them so I went to improve the suspension and the wheels and that was it. Though now that I look at how it's done I think I actually got it backwards. Oops. I'll have to try again with that fixed to see what it changes.

 

[way2co0l]

So curious if anyone has any advice on whether this race was winnable if I did something different or not.

Start>Dragon teeth>Russian road>Straight>Straight>Russian road>concrete jungle>string blade>Russian road>Straight>string blade>end

I wound up adding armor to my sides so I could impact in the concrete jungle while keeping my chariot light at only 6 weight. I started off for speed, managing for the next part, and then braked for the Russian road. Managed reigns again for the next straight portion, and then braked for the rest of the race except for the final stretch. I found that doing anything else got my horse killed. lol. Should I have equipped the chariot differently? My girl just wasn't trained enough? Unlucky course?

Edit to include info on girl. A+ Endurance, but only C temperament and pony training. Still F in pet training if that matters though the wiki doesn't mention it as a contributing factor. I also had 3 pieces of pony equipment.

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

200 sparks really isn't a lot to work with.

If you really embrace austerity, 200$ can last a long time. You can lower food costs to 14$/decade without anything worse than mild starvation. Every other expense is discretionary.

But with the low stats you begin the game with, I don't see myself being able to get a slave to a D rating before needing a loan. In this playthrough my first guild contract girl took me 27 days to get to D-, and the amount of funds I spent to do so meant I would have had to have taken a loan to have done it without the extra funds I gave myself.

What were your biggest expenses?

Add a decade minimum to get the point of devotion for C+ and the fact B- requires 2 devotion, and B+ requires 3... I assume with an extra decade required for each... I'm not entirely certain I'd be capable of doing that in the time I'd need to before going bankrupt. Maybe I could with what I've learned but I'm not actually certain.

Sounds like something worth trying.

Another good point, but also one you can't do immediately. You'll have to get your feet under you first so you're at least treading water long enough to do it.

Suppose you buy your first slave from the market, train to D-, then take a D- guild contract and swap. The cost of acquisition and training of the first slave is offset (if not fully covered) by the speed bonus for early completion of the contract.

It is, but unfortunately I didn't have any better opportunities to reward her in between fights those weeks. She won the fight, so I promised a gift, failed to have an opportunity to reward her sufficiently before the next fight, and she expected a level 5 reward, plus the promised gift so I figured 2 birds one stone.

Just because she thinks she deserves a tier 5 reward doesn't mean you have to give her one.

Perhaps that's just something I haven't noticed. I was doing the accounting myself as I was using Isabella's energy for other tasks.

As I mentioned, Isabella isn't great at accounting when you first acquire her, so you might face some fines if she has to learn on the job. But in the long run, she will save you a lot.

But most of what you're talking about here still requires you getting your feet under you first. Like, maybe I'm not communicating what I mean here very well because I don't deny that there are options further down the line you can use to supplement your income for sure. I'm talking about in the very beginning with the limited funds and stats available on extreme. You won't be gaining access to those options for several decades.

See above.

I'm talking primarily about the very early game when you're struggling the most and have the least wriggle room to get yourself started. It's during this period where the arena is the only viable source of supplemental income.

True. But, supplemental income is not necessary, it's a bonus. And sending your slave to the arena before she is obedient might not be in your best interest, even if it means missing out on 50 sparks. Is it worth "spending" 50 sparks per decade to avoid her fighting back? (Assuming you can't use the "disposable slave" method to have your cake and eat it too.)

I believe you're referring to the option of cryo store your slave for a day, or potentially a decade, while buying another cheap slave for 20 sparks?

On the surface I thought it was a good idea, but in practice I haven't been able to do it. I have not yet been able to buy a slave for any cheaper than 45 sparks, and that prevents it from being an option that'll return any profit. Maybe I've just been unlucky in that regard every time I've tried. It's possible, but my current experience is why I'm not looking at it as a serious option.

Yes, that's what I was referencing. Even if the slave costs 45$, and you have to pay 10$ to tattoo brand her, you still net whatever she's worth to the butcher or Farid, minus 5$.

I haven't looked into the drug stuff yet no, as I've been trying to keep my expenses low and I don't know enough about how to effectively use them yet. I'll have to look into that and start using them. I'm sure that like magic, they'll make the whole training process quicker and easier as long as you can afford to use them in the first place.

Kamra gives +1 energy per day for 2$/day. Low risk, especially for a slave you aren't keeping. Pollen gives +5 energy per day for 2$/day. High risk - if you stop giving her a daily dose after her body gets used to it, she can rapidly lose endurance for a long time. Using these stimulants on the master is similar, but you keep the master forever, so be careful not to overdo it with kamra too. If he starts complaining about not having it, that means he's addicted and you should stop for a while.

having it so you can bring your slaves in to prostitute them where the brothel effectively takes a major cut leaving you only with the minor profits feels reasonable to me

Agree.

The same way allowing your artists to perform for tips

Considering how monopolistic the setting is, there's probably an artists guild that prohibits freelancers.

your secretary to essentially get a small number of sparks for completing random paperwork for some business

Liability if she gets it wrong. Confidentiality. I'm skeptical about this one.

or a serving girl also working for tips

Why would a business want a temp worker when they can have a full-time slave? Even if it's less expense for them initially, they have to expend effort training her, knowing they won't be keeping her, and they are competing with the slaver for her time. She's not committed, they're not committed, the full-time workers see her stealing their tips, no one is happy. Not to mention, why would Rome have a tipping economy? If slaves don't give good service, they die. Sometimes they die anyway, particularly if they are the dish.

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

So curious if anyone has any advice on whether this race was winnable if I did something different or not.

Start>Dragon teeth>Russian road>Straight>Straight>Russian road>concrete jungle>string blade>Russian road>Straight>string blade>end

I wound up adding armor to my sides so I could impact in the concrete jungle while keeping my chariot light at only 6 weight. I started off for speed, managing for the next part, and then braked for the Russian road. Managed reigns again for the next straight portion, and then braked for the rest of the race except for the final stretch. I found that doing anything else got my horse killed. lol. Should I have equipped the chariot differently? My girl just wasn't trained enough? Unlucky course?

Edit to include info on girl. A+ Endurance, but only C temperament and pony training. Still F in pet training if that matters though the wiki doesn't mention it as a contributing factor. I also had 3 pieces of pony equipment.

Unlucky course. The track has few segments where you can maintain speed. Age also matters. Low temperament and pony training are penalties.

You could try putting some sacrificial wheels and/or suspension to maintain more speed over the russian roads.

 

[way2co0l]

Unlucky course. The track has few segments where you can maintain speed. Age also matters. Low temperament and pony training are penalties.

You could try putting some sacrificial wheels and/or suspension to maintain more speed over the russian roads.

Yeah I figured as much. I suppose wheels could have helped me a bit with the early russian roads combined with the extra weight slowing me down so I may have been able to work some more time managing the reins rather than braking them so more speed all in all. Though truthfully I was soooooooooo far behind the others I doubt that would have been enough to change it. I'll try again with the next one.

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

I've played through the tutorial and mostly understand the factors that go into raising obedience.

what I'm mainly wondering is what are to best ways to raise the obedience / lower the disobedience of slaves that have a high pride stat such as wilhelmine from the tutorial practical exam who starts off very rebellious when you first get them.

Are you asking specifically about Wilhelmine? If not, what are the slave's other stats? In general, pride will take care of itself over time, so you don't need to specifically focus on it. It's good to focus on raising taming. Punishments that involve pain or being tied up or confined are good for this. Also reward and punish at the level of merit and guilt to raise awareness.

 

[way2co0l]

Can we get saved outfit sets to also save weapon configurations? I'm constantly having to remove her items every time I need to discipline her only to give them back again when I want her to spar.

 

[way2co0l]

Also, when eating the $3 meal at the HIP, it let's you know that you're no longer hungry, but it doesn't do that when ordering the $1 meal. I've caught myself going back to eat multiple times in a day because I forget if I've done it already or not. lol. Having it indicate that I've eaten already would be nice.

 

[way2co0l]

And coming in second place in the race results in guilt? It was basically a mirror copy of the first one and the only reason she did that well was because all the others failed. But 1st place was waaaaaayyyy ahead of us. I have no idea how to do the races effectively. lol

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

And coming in second place in the race results in guilt? It was basically a mirror copy of the first one and the only reason she did that well was because all the others failed. But 1st place was waaaaaayyyy ahead of us. I have no idea how to do the races effectively. lol

Second place in second race is not bad at all. Especially for a slave who is still learning.

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

Also, when eating the $3 meal at the HIP, it let's you know that you're no longer hungry, but it doesn't do that when ordering the $1 meal. I've caught myself going back to eat multiple times in a day because I forget if I've done it already or not. lol. Having it indicate that I've eaten already would be nice.

It's not telling you that you are no longer hungry because the meal that you ate is not of high enough quality to maintain your strength.

Edit: I misremembered. The most expensive meals at the pub can raise to B+ strength and maintain A+. The cheaper ones can raise to C- and maintain B+. This means that, if you eat a $1 meal with A+ strength, you'll still eat canned food, so it's not the cost savings that I claimed. Your most efficient cost-option would be not eating out (2$/day canned food) and resume $1 meals only if your strength drops to B+. A+ strength is effectively costing you an extra 10$/decade.

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

Can we get saved outfit sets to also save weapon configurations? I'm constantly having to remove her items every time I need to discipline her only to give them back again when I want her to spar.

If we go down this route, we might as well remove the whole concept of the slave using weapons when she fights back. Does she actually need a weapon to win a spar against unarmed slaves? And is all the sparring really worth the calories and energy?