VN Ren'Py Jessica O'Neil's Hard News [v0.60] [stoperArt]

[Ed Hardy_32]

Like I said, if the only way to get infos about the game and its development process is to pay, that's the wrong approach. It's terrible marketing and won't help anyone. But I guess some people fail to understand that, so the easiest thing for them is to call that "whining".

But what exactly are you criticizing? That someone doesn't want to post here or answer someone's questions? That someone doesn't sit all day on a pirate forum where most people download games for free and don't reply to their messages? This is what you call bad marketing? It is simple. If you want new information, you have to pay or wait until someone wants to share it here. Otherwise the whole idea of Patreon wouldn't make any sense and the devs wouldn't make any money from their games. And it works the other way too. If you don't like something or someone's behavior, you don't pay any money for it. Apparently, Stoper earns enough that he no longer has to spend a lot of time here and interact with all the users. Besides, I'm sure most of the people here know what JOHN is. And I think that most of them already know more or less how Stoper works and what to expect from him. In my opinion, the problem in this case is not the lack or poor communication of Stoper on this forum, but the long waiting for the next update.

 

[palmtrees89]

But what exactly are you criticizing? That someone doesn't want to post here or answer someone's questions? That someone doesn't sit all day on a pirate forum where most people download games for free and don't reply to their messages? This is what you call bad marketing? It is simple. If you want new information, you have to pay or wait until someone wants to share it here. Otherwise the whole idea of Patreon wouldn't make any sense and the devs wouldn't make any money from their games. And it works the other way too. If you don't like something or someone's behavior, you don't pay any money for it. Apparently, Stoper earns enough that he no longer has to spend a lot of time here and interact with all the users. Besides, I'm sure most of the people here know what JOHN is. And I think that most of them already know more or less how Stoper works and what to expect from him. In my opinion, the problem in this case is not the lack or poor communication of Stoper on this forum, but the long waiting for the next update.

Without F95 and other website's free PR, he would hardly have any supporters at all. I never said that he's supposed to sit here all day, I'm criticizing that he's basically abandoned the platform that made his current income possible after his project became somewhat popular. So yes, I am criticizing the lack of communication as it's the main reason this thread is pretty much dead in my opinion. This might work for other games, but here it doesn't seem to do the trick because the community is currently not big enough. I'm also criticizing previously made statements. Statements which give people hope, who then put their trust into the developer just so they get disappointed when it turns out that it didn't mean anything and it's just empty words (no, I'm not solely referring to the screenshot I took earlier). Obviously without his talent and work nothing here would be possible either, but you get my point hopefully.

Also, pretty much any company working on a product, be it a game or whatever, keeps their community, fans and customers alike informed in some way or another. And that is without having to pay for it. This is what I call a good marketing strategy, because it essentially increases the interest in your product, causing more people to possibly pay for it in the end. One could argue that he's fine with the amount of money his Patreon page generates at the moment, but then we're basically back to what I said above, and that would just be disappointing. If you think the idea of Patreon is to spread information, then I really don't know what to tell you.

Yes, the long wait for updates (against all of Stopers statements on pretty much every update) is another issue I criticize. But that's something his paying customers should be more worried about and not me, the dirty pirate. Doesn't mean I won't mention it, though.

Edit: I understand why some fans and paying customers would call me a hater or a "lonely troll", but that's not my intention. I do love JOHN and I appreciate Stoper's art and the work he puts into this project, but that shouldn't make him immune to criticism. Anyway, thanks for a somewhat reasonable reply, Filip. Wish I could say the same about some other comments, too.

 

[boostedanimal]

he posts development info every 2 weeks or so. I am quite happy with that. but I am guessing most people who whine on this here thread aren't on his patreon. Also, his updates are pretty consistent, and very good quality.

2 updates per year with 10 min gameplay, impressive consistency, indeed, i've been supporting his patreon for quite some time, decided it's not worth it in the end and with how things are going with this update i've been proven that i made the right choice

Without F95 and other website's free PR, he would hardly have any supporters at all. I never said that he's supposed to sit here all day, I'm criticizing that he's basically abandoned the platform that made his current income possible after his project became somewhat popular. So yes, I am criticizing the lack of communication as it's the main reason this thread is pretty much dead in my opinion. This might work for other games, but here it doesn't seem to do the trick because the community is currently not big enough. I'm also criticizing previously made statements. Statements which give people hope, who then put their trust into the developer just so they get disappointed when it turns out that it didn't mean anything and it's just empty words (no, I'm not solely referring to the screenshot I took earlier). Obviously without his talent and work nothing here would be possible either, but you get my point hopefully.

Also, pretty much any company working on a product, be it a game or whatever, keeps their community, fans and customers alike informed in some way or another. And that is without having to pay for it. This is what I call a good marketing strategy, because it essentially increases the interest in your product, causing more people to possibly pay for it in the end. One could argue that he's fine with the amount of money his Patreon page generates at the moment, but then we're basically back to what I said above, and that would just be disappointing. If you think the idea of Patreon is to spread information, then I really don't know what to tell you.

Yes, the long wait for updates (against all of Stopers statements on pretty much every update) is another issue I criticize. But that's something his paying customers should be more worried about and not me, the dirty pirate. Doesn't mean I won't mention it, though.

Edit: I understand why some fans and paying customers would call me a hater or a "lonely troll", but that's not my intention. I do love JOHN and I appreciate Stoper's art and the work he puts into this project, but that shouldn't make him immune to criticism. Anyway, thanks for a somewhat reasonable reply, Filip. Wish I could say the same about some other comments, too.

well said, i've been his patreon and the lack of communication/slow updates are the reason i decided to stop supporting him, it's simply not worth it, 2 updates a year for a total of 10-15 mins gameplay is laughable, if stoper was faster at producing updates and had a proper communication he would be one of the highest earning game developers there is, the quality of his work is superb, but it is what it is, maybe he isn't interested in earning a living off this or he is simply satisfied with where he is at currently, there are also people in life that are happy with having average income and don't strive for more in life. i am not gonna speculate, just my thoughts.

also, i previously said that if he manages to release an update in 2.5-3 month time then i'll consider supporting him again and to me it's a realistic timetable since he said himself that there won't be any side project this time and his updates are quite short so i don't see how it would take more time than this, but based on how things are going and lack of any real update makes me think that if the update is done by december i would consider everyone who is waiting for it as lucky

 

[Ed Hardy_32]

Without F95 and other website's free PR, he would hardly have any supporters at all. I never said that he's supposed to sit here all day, I'm criticizing that he's basically abandoned the platform that made his current income possible after his project became somewhat popular. So yes, I am criticizing the lack of communication as it's the main reason this thread is pretty much dead in my opinion. This might work for other games, but here it doesn't seem to do the trick because the community is currently not big enough. I'm also criticizing previously made statements. Statements which give people hope, who then put their trust into the developer just so they get disappointed when it turns out that it didn't mean anything and it's just empty words (no, I'm not solely referring to the screenshot I took earlier). Obviously without his talent and work nothing here would be possible either, but you get my point hopefully.

Also, pretty much any company working on a product, be it a game or whatever, keeps their community, fans and customers alike informed in some way or another. And that is without having to pay for it. This is what I call a good marketing strategy, because it essentially increases the interest in your product, causing more people to possibly pay for it in the end. One could argue that he's fine with the amount of money his Patreon page generates at the moment, but then we're basically back to what I said above, and that would just be disappointing. If you think the idea of Patreon is to spread information, then I really don't know what to tell you.

Yes, the long wait for updates (against all of Stopers statements on pretty much every update) is another issue I criticize. But that's something his paying customers should be more worried about and not me, the dirty pirate. Doesn't mean I won't mention it, though.

Edit: I understand why some fans and paying customers would call me a hater or a "lonely troll", but that's not my intention. I do love JOHN and I appreciate Stoper's art and the work he puts into this project, but that shouldn't make him immune to criticism. Anyway, thanks for a somewhat reasonable reply, Filip. Wish I could say the same about some other comments, too.

I understand what you mean, but I just can't agree with you. As for the idea of Patreon, I just meant that those fans who pay money every month receive regular messages or other information from Stoper there and can see how the game is progressing. And if someone doesn't like the way Stoper communicates with his fans, or doesn’t do it regularly, you can just stop paying money. It just seems to me that since Stoper himself so rarely adds posts here, it means that he apparently does not need it any more. There are other platforms where he posts regularly, I think. Yes, you are right that marketing, contact with fans is important, but you have to remember that it is not a big company. And this is his game, his product, so I don't understand how I could complain about his marketing strategy (if he has one ). In the end, only he gains or loses from it. So even if thanks to this forum his game has become more popular, I am still able to understand the fact that he doesn't need f95 as much as at the beginning, so maybe that's why he spends so little time on this forum now. But these are just my thoughts.

 

[umby]

Next "update"is for December...i think so.

dreaming costs nothing

 

[PietruccioTheHilander]

Like I said, if the only way to get infos about the game and its development process is to pay, that's the wrong approach. It's terrible marketing and won't help anyone. But I guess some people fail to understand that, so the easiest thing for them is to call that "whining".

I think stoper has always said that he does not care about the gain.
even when I post with simple renders that aren't taken from the game, I always ask him why.
if he publishes some teasers and keeps the interest in the game burning, he will certainly earn more. but he doesn't care.
after all it is his choice, right or wrong; take or leave.

 

[BorgiaBou]

I think stoper has always said that he does not care about the gain.

C'mon man let's not be kids here, i know you a fan of his but please don't try to patronize us, he cares for the money too cuz if he wouldn't care like you say he would put only a symbolic 1 dollar donation on his patreon page or even let this game without any donation at all and that's how you show you don't care about the "gain"...

 

[Tulrek]

Stoper has no obligation to get involved in this thread.
The fact that he was the one who post his own game here means something.
I leave it to you to interpret it.

Find something more constructive than winning for the lack of news.
He doesn't own you anything.

Just be patient or get involved to have access in his discord server where he is more active.

 

[TheUberstuff]

My 2 cents for what its worth. Devs use sites like f95 to advertise their stuff so that people get a taste, I have no issue with that at all, free is good. As long as there are updates of the game for free on this site I don't think anyone should be complaining about the timing or communication of said updates. The only people in my view that the dev should be dedicated to are the people ACTUALLY supporting them on Patreon.

I don't support anyone on Patreon (because my wife would kill me) and while its nice to get communication on updates for games that I like I certainly don't expect it because I am not an entitled brat. I have NO right to complain if I am not helping to ACTUALLY support the game. I appreciate all those people who are able and do support the devs of the various games that I like on here, they are the ones that keep the devs doing their thing. The people I DON'T appreciate are the people who in my opinion jeopardize the continued updates with their whining and complaining when they DO NOTHING to support the dev. Be entitled more for F sake.

 

[chatonbrutal]

I don't think anyone should be complaining about the timing or communication of said updates. The only people in my view that the dev should be dedicated to are the people ACTUALLY supporting them on Patreon.
I certainly don't expect it because I am not an entitled brat. I have NO right to complain if I am not helping to ACTUALLY support the game. I appreciate all those people who are able and do support the devs of the various games that I like on here, they are the ones that keep the devs doing their thing. The people I DON'T appreciate are the people who in my opinion jeopardize the continued updates with their whining and complaining when they DO NOTHING to support the dev. Be entitled more for F sake.

Except those who praise the dev and the game here on this thread, as long as it is positive feedback they are entitled to make comments even though they are not paying anything, right ? And all those damned perfidious criminal scums who do not share the same views as us the "majority" with their negativity and realistic point of view of some aspects of the development, the game and dev to the oubliette! Wow I've never seen such a plurality of opinion since I fled Mao's China!
Listen friend, on the internet when there is a "drama" about something, the more you dictate how people should behave, the more they will be a pain in the ass. Just to take a look at social medias and some thread here to observe it, sometimes it's a f*cking zoo. And some might do more than that just to piss you off for your viewing pleasure and this will lead to more and "drama". So it is best to keep silence and let things cool down smoothly, cause it will, eventually.

 

[umby]

Stoper has no obligation to get involved in this thread.
The fact that he was the one who post his own game here means something.
I leave it to you to interpret it.

Find something more constructive than winning for the lack of news.
He doesn't own you anything.

Just be patient or get involved to have access in his discord server where he is more active.

I personally am fine that he does not give any news about his work. What doesn't suit me are his phony communications and his fake work progression (totally non-existent), as well as his constant postponements and false release dates.

 

[cold_arctus]

I personally am fine that he does not give any news about his work. What doesn't suit me are his phony communications and his fake work progression (totally non-existent), as well as his constant postponements and false release dates.

There is a simple solution for that: Unwatch the thread.

After that you don't need to read his constant postponements and false release dates. Wait until the game shows up on Latest Updates and download it then.

 

[umby]

There is a simple solution for that: Unwatch the thread.

After that you don't need to read his constant postponements and false release dates. Wait until the game shows up on Latest Updates and download it then.

there is a simple solution for this.

better organize work and communication so that everyone is happy.

 

[cold_arctus]

there is a simple solution for this.

better organize work and communication so that everyone is happy.

For pirates on a pirate forum?

If you are a supporter and unhappy with his communication and his workflow then feel free to unsubscribe. No one force you to donate to him.

I know many people that only donate when an update is available and unsubscribe afterwards again. I also know people that donate $100 every month and don't care about the money because they can.

 

[TheUberstuff]

ok praising someone for their work and complaining that they aren't communicating enough or exactly how you want them to are in my view two different things... what I have said about games in the past is something like "love the game hope to see more soon". That message does two things, it praises the work and encourages them to get more out soon. I am not demanding anything or ripping them.

To the people who thing ripping the dev and demanding whatever it is they are demanding if you think that encourages them to get more out sooner rather than later or even to keep putting more content out I will dare say I think that is questionable reasoning at best which tells me one of two things. Either you are just being a troll to troll or you are actively trying to get the dev to stop making the game and hurt those who are PATIENTLY waiting for more updates. Either way please stop acting like children.

 

[Sorrow85]

You must be registered to see the links

Hi, all.
I was sick almost all of last week and that messed up the schedule for my small bonus set. I had to resume working on the game this week, and I'll finish the bonus set in between working on the images for the game. I can't say when it'll be ready, because it depends on how much "free" time I can find while developing the game. But I'll message the link to all $10 patrons for October even if it's not ready by 31st.
Well that's all for now, back to work. Have fun, and thanks for the support.

-----

 

[umby]

For pirates on a pirate forum?

If you are a supporter and unhappy with his communication and his workflow then feel free to unsubscribe. No one force you to donate to him.

I know many people that only donate when an update is available and unsubscribe afterwards again. I also know people that donate $100 every month and don't care about the money because they can.

But come on, you look like his lawyer

 

[dolfe67]

You must be registered to see the links

Hi, all.
I was sick almost all of last week and that messed up the schedule for my small bonus set. I had to resume working on the game this week, and I'll finish the bonus set in between working on the images for the game. I can't say when it'll be ready, because it depends on how much "free" time I can find while developing the game. But I'll message the link to all $10 patrons for October even if it's not ready by 31st.
Well that's all for now, back to work. Have fun, and thanks for the support.

-----

At least it's not covid this time

 

[umby]

At least it's not covid this time

it is still early. usually taken in the cold of December.

 

[Ahx]

Coming from the guy calling criticism "whining". Good job.

when it is non-constructive and sound more like complaining........Yeah some might call it whining.

C'mon man let's not be kids here, i know you a fan of his but please don't try to patronize us, he cares for the money too cuz if he wouldn't care like you say he would put only a symbolic 1 dollar donation on his patreon page or even let this game without any donation at all and that's how you show you don't care about the "gain"...

of course he cares for the money everyone does Borga...developing this game is something he does on the side if i'm not mistaken, if i am(never mind)...it is more like an artwork and a hobby. If you like it then feel free to pledge and take a seat on the front row , no one is stopping you. If you don't like it you can skedaddle.But don't carp his work.You just can't do that. Have a good day man.

Stoper has no obligation to get involved in this thread.
The fact that he was the one who post his own game here means something.

That is how you develop a voice for your product man..there are lot of active people here...oh who we kidding there are lot of active perverts lurking in here , some might still will be perverts and some might will be perverts and patreons. This is like the only place where you can find a mammoth lot of us perverts(which is not much) to march behind you till the end of the release.

I personally am fine that he does not give any news about his work. What doesn't suit me are his phony communications and his fake work progression (totally non-existent), as well as his constant postponements and false release dates.

Hey those were only for his patreons........
Okay let's be serious. Does he make counterfeit bills too.. ...? just say no.