Ren'Py Abandoned Lab Rats 2 [v0.51.1] [Vren]

[Evangelion-01]

Ah, but that's never the tone of the complaints though. The backlash is almost always because it's a kink they're not into. I'm turned off by NTR but you don't see be crying about it's optional inclusion - meanwhile I watched a person have a breakdown over the mere idea of Lily's breasts getting bigger.

Wasted time is perfectly fine as long as it's wasted serving the right people and LR2 being a sandbox game it is genuinely hard to waste dev time so long as there's something to click towards.

I'd say that depends on both the fetish in question and the audience you compare.
I know that for most games the Discord is a toxic fevering ground for hardcore fans and complainers that lead to situations like yours... fair enough NTR has the same effect on people comeing here more often than not.

I still consider my scenario more accurate most of the time though

 

[Heml0ck]

screenshots (techdemo) look like too much smoothing on the chars. Lost detail or something.

The images lack "texture." The lighting is like a creepy horror movie.
But I assume the lighting can be adjusted easily enough. I guess more variety could be worth it.
If he can make the models look "human," that would be reassuring. Make one good looking example.

 

[bloodbus]

The images lack "texture." The lighting is like a creepy horror movie.
But I assume the lighting can be adjusted easily enough. I guess more variety could be worth it.
If he can make the models look "human," that would be reassuring. Make one good looking example.

Yeah they must've been quick renders to see if they can be worked with. That's what I'm hoping anyway

 

[Nobodyinthefree]

These are a couple screenshots from the new version. Vren said its still a work in progress (can't even talk to Stephanie b/c her rendered outfit crashes the game). Personally I'm not a fan but I think the purpose was that this would allow for more diverse characters/clothing. Also the UI runs about 75% worse in this build, granted it is still listed as a "tech demo".

It looks even worse... Oh dear god, what is he thinking?

 

[themagiman]

My favorite thing about this site is how volatile optional content is
"We're adding a feature that is very easy to opt out of and won't otherwise affect your experience should it not be to your tastes"
"NOOO! FUCK! I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU'RE RUINING THE GAME LIKE THIS! I HAD SUCH HIGH HOPES FOR THIS PROJECT I'VE PASSIVELY FOLLOWED WITHOUT SUPPORTING AND NOW IT'S ALL CRASHING DOWN AROUND ME! I... I don't think either of us will survive... Tell my mother I... love... her..."

It's more about people just don't like the stuff you do

 

[dalzomo]

Starbuck directly asked Vren if he'd want her to write content for vanilla while he experiments with Live2d and he didn't really respond to it. He did suggest he'd start a github and wondered what kind of commits he'd even allow though. But yeah Starbuck really loves some of those LR1 characters, especially Alexia, so I think she'd do a wonderful job with it. The only complaint I've seen about her writing is that it doesn't play up how evil MC actually is. Fair enough I guess

Yeah, I would actively dislike if Starbuck's writing became anything close to officially adopted. I have nothing against them as a person, but all of their romances are too lovey-dovey and definitely clashes with vanilla LR1 and 2 as written by Vren. If Vren set it up that mod writers' content was added to the game I would probably ask that a way to opt-out of it was added, or else comment it out myself. I think the vanilla and mod characters and content should remain distinctly separate

As for the mod's mechanics and code, I would also caution Vren against letting that be added without extreme oversight, since it's so bloated and buggy and many changes have been made to the mechanics to "fix" a perceived problem that doesn't properly weigh the consequences. Too many cooks. It's why I dropped the mod so long ago and haven't looked back. Vren's code isn't perfect and his releases aren't bugless, but I'm usually able to address them quickly and have no problems until the next one. And since he's open to suggestions on how to improve the mechanics, I'm optimistic about them getting better over time as well. I just think HE should be the one who implements any changes so that he retains full knowledge and control of the project. I'm his patron, not the mod's

As usual, my negative opinion of the mod is going to be interpreted as hate but that's not the case. It is just different, and I don't enjoy it and want to continue to have the choice to avoid it

 

[Evil Twin Skippy]

These are a couple screenshots from the new version. Vren said its still a work in progress (can't even talk to Stephanie b/c her rendered outfit crashes the game). Personally I'm not a fan but I think the purpose was that this would allow for more diverse characters/clothing. Also the UI runs about 75% worse in this build, granted it is still listed as a "tech demo".

I think he's hit square into the uncanny valley. The hands, knees, and elbows look photorealistic. The detail is very subtle (except where the skin seems to render as porcelin.) The hair and clothing looks computer rendered (i.e. too much detail). The faces, on the other hand, have enough detail that expressions start to matter. And he doesn't seem to have the expression engine laid in quite yet. And the default expression is a thousand yard stare.

If the game as solely about the graphics, I'd say this is an interesting technology demo. But honestly, the game play is mainly the theater of the imagination painted by the dialogs in the game. The graphics could be emoticons or silhouettes (or the random trippy crap monks would scrawl into the margins of illuminated manuscripts.)

But I do get that Vren is really a graphics guy at heart, and most of his "pay" is the fun in programming. (Speaking as a programmer myself.)

 

[Evangelion-01]

But I do get that Vren is really a graphics guy at heart, and most of his "pay" is the fun in programming. (Speaking as a programmer myself.)

Given the replies here and the demands for better Graphics for years now I'd rather assume this is Vren's attempt to pacify these supporters and draw in more that shyed away for those old models so far

 

[lewd_gamer_31415]

If the game as solely about the graphics, I'd say this is an interesting technology demo. But honestly, the game play is mainly the theater of the imagination painted by the dialogs in the game. The graphics could be emoticons or silhouettes (or the random trippy crap monks would scrawl into the margins of illuminated manuscripts.)

I disagree. LabRats is more fun than most games to me because you can SEE the changes your serums induce. I have played a number of games where your ability to change things is limited to "Previously her stats page said Breasts: Small, but now it says Breasts: Huge" and that does not have the same effect as the visuals changing. (Especially when the game has portraits that never change.)

 

[XulOnTuesday]

As for the mod's mechanics and code, I would also caution Vren against letting that be added without extreme oversight, since it's so bloated and buggy and many changes have been made to the mechanics to "fix" a perceived problem that doesn't properly weigh the consequences. Too many cooks. It's why I dropped the mod so long ago and haven't looked back. Vren's code isn't perfect and his releases aren't bugless, but I'm usually able to address them quickly and have no problems until the next one. And since he's open to suggestions on how to improve the mechanics, I'm optimistic about them getting better over time as well. I just think HE should be the one who implements any changes so that he retains full knowledge and control of the project. I'm his patron, not the mod's

As usual, my negative opinion of the mod is going to be interpreted as hate but that's not the case. It is just different, and I don't enjoy it and want to continue to have the choice to avoid it

As someone who recently started working on the mod, I completely understand what you mean.

 

[lewd_gamer_31415]

If nothing else, I might contribute code just to make the game more performant.

 

[Strec]

Given the replies here and the demands for better Graphics for years now I'd rather assume this is Vren's attempt to pacify these supporters and draw in more that shyed away for those old models so far

Patreon games often start do die when the dev break his plan and rules due to too much pressure.

The graphics whe sufficient to finish the game (at least the gameplay, I don't speak of the "stories") before changing the graphic core, security is always the better choice when you have something working, modifying a central part of code is always a big and dangerous challenge.

 

[swagfiend]

For an early example it doesn't look bad, lighting goes a long way to how 'good' a model looks, improvements there would go a long way. Also faces still suck, but that's not Daz that's just an experience thing.

 

[Haranador]

Different work in terms of art assets - you have to be very careful with texture size and mesh complexity in a 3d engine compared to throwing pre-rendered images on the screen. Also yes, the code would be a complete rewrite since Unity is C# (or JS), not Python. But it would need a large lift to get back to the features that RenPy gives for free. That is, Unity is much more barebones than Ren'Py.

I mean, yes, but the whole point of this update was to move away from throwing pre-rendered images on screen. And from what I can devise from Vren's Patreon it seems this isn't going particular well.
RenPy does what it's supposed to do well, but LR2 is already far outside that scope. Sure, porting the codebase might take a month or even three but once you got that porting over Daz models and using them like the pre-renders function now is trivial.
As for being bare bones, you got free tools like yarn spinner which already gives you most of what Renpy provides and there is the asset store after all.

 

[swagfiend]

I mean, yes, but the whole point of this update was to move away from throwing pre-rendered images on screen. And from what I can devise from Vren's Patreon it seems this isn't going particular well.
RenPy does what it's supposed to do well, but LR2 is already far outside that scope. Sure, porting the codebase might take a month or even three but once you got that porting over Daz models and using them like the pre-renders function now is trivial.
As for being bare bones, you got free tools like yarn spinner which already gives you most of what Renpy provides and there is the asset store after all.

This is an amateur programmer, it would take a year not months without an actual professional, an act I am yet to see a dev ever do despite it being the thing that'd solve most of their problems.

 

[lewd_gamer_31415]

The goal was going away from pre-baked images to composited images. It was not to go towards 3d rendering.

 

[wizyy]

The only game I followed (and was supporting on Patreon) that had regular, meaningful updates went without updates for half a year. Completely unnecessarily IMHO. I wasn't looking much at the 3D models anyway.
A pity.

 

[hyfka]

The only game I followed (and was supporting on Patreon) that had regular, meaningful updates went without updates for half a year. Completely unnecessarily IMHO. I wasn't looking much at the 3D models anyway.
A pity.

I'm happy he went for making a fundamental change instead of adding onto a broken system. Makes sense to improve the foundation before building the house taller. That takes courage and shows he's interested in the product long term.
Just seems like it hasn't been working out, or maybe Live2D wasn't the right tool for the job either.

I'm not a subscriber, but I think if things don't move forward because you as a dev overestimated your capabilities, not billing people for a while until you get back on track would be fair.

 

[Strec]

I'm not a subscriber, but I think if things don't move forward because you as a dev overestimated your capabilities, not billing people for a while until you get back on track would be fair.

It's already done, there is no billing for non-suscribers.

 

[Deane9850]

How do I find Rebecca aka aunt?