Ren'Py Lessons in Love [v0.42.0] [Selebus]

[LessonsInDissonance]

It's not mental gymnastics. You can't cheat on someone with whom you are not in a relationship with. What Akira does isn't cheating, but grooming/manipulation. If both sides are adults, then either can have the maturity to say "well, I wish for a monogamous relationship, and if you don't, that's a dealbreaker for me". However, Akira, by engaging with teenagers, is purposefully taking advantage of their lack of maturity by putting them in a position where it's clear they want to be exclusive, but don't have the maturity to stop seeing him either. That's one of the million issues of an adult engaging with teenagers, the other part simply doesn't have the maturity to be in that relationship in the first place.

Sara (an adult) calls Akira her boyfriend, is he cheating on her? That's preposterous. He isn't her boyfriend - and has told her, and people close to her that, multiple times. However, with adults it's a clear-cut situation because they choose to be in that situation, while having the minimum maturity to get out of it, so it's on them. What you call "forgiveness" is misguided, forgiveness could only be applied in the situation of Chika discovering Akira's cheating on her, and forgiving him for it. The other girls can't forgive Akira for anything, because he hasn't agreed to anything in the first place, so what's there to forgive?

I suppose "I forgive you for not correcting me in thinking I was the only one" is possible in some cases, but even then that wouldn't be cheating, just manipulation again. Important to note that Akira's a piece of shit regardless, just for different reasons than cheating (most of the time).

As for real life, that's basically what happens everywhere all the time. People don't usually start seeing eachother and automatically are boyfriend and girlfriend, during that stage it isn't uncommon for them to be getting to know multiple people at the same time until settling on one, and that is doubly true if they're younger. In fact, a reasonable amount of times the need to "define the relationship" comes from the relationship having advanced enough that someone feels like they wouldn't be okay with the other person seeing someone else, and calls for a meeting so that becomes a pact between them.

Just because you haven't initiated a relationship officially, doesn't mean that there isn't some sort of bond formed and expectation created as soon as you start being intimate.
I still consider it as betrayment because they expected exclusivity and you were aware of it, and you knew they would be hurt when they discovered it wasn't.
If all of these girls knew that you would go on to fuck the rest after doing it with them, would they have agreed to do it with you in the first place? bar some people like Kirin or Ayane, most of them wouldn't
Saying that you never agreed to be exclusive is an excuse, at the very least it needs to be mentioned before or after you do it to avoid the other catching unwanted feelings, you can forgive a teenager for lacking the maturity to do it, but not Akira.
In this case it's even worse because Akira outright says that he loves them which creates for them the image that "They are the one"
Sara is the only girl so far with whom Akira has been honest from the beginning and who has no right to complain if her feelings aren't reciprocated.

 

[fdsasdf_p]

I just want to say if Akira is not in this scene then it is practically confirmed that this Sekai is not a being in Akira's head and that she really is the Sekai that came back from the dead.

The existence of a free roaming Sekai was confirmed after Shelter back in Ch3, where Yasu couldn't see her (but can see the rabbit doll lifted by her as if it was floating) but can presumably hear her. At that moment Sensei was on the limo to his new apartment.

 

[DeSkel15]

Do you see the smiles on Ami and Niki's faces? Cause I see no smile here.

Spoiler: sekai

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What Pedro said about Sekai being a real thing already, but also that she's a sort of liar because she said she only haunts Akira. I guess we could give her a pass because she's at his house, so it counts as haunting him still.

You know, we give Sekai a lot of shit (deserved), but if she's truly sad here, I can empathize to some degree. She seemed to love Ami, and despite everything she was, as a mom I guess she really would wish to be able to be there for her daughter and so that Ami hadn't had to go through all the shit she did.

On the other hand, if she really loved Akira (highly debatable) then this can be doubly upsetting for her. Because Niki was the healthy relationship in Akira's life, a love that never had to be tainted (they were the same age) and survived her. Niki achieved tremendous success, Ami admires and loves her (to some extent), she sort of accepts her relationship with Akira and should be on the way to take her as a mom.

Sekai died physically, but never died on an emotional level for them. If Niki takes her place however, she'd do a better job of creating a healthy life for them and truly kill Sekai/occupy her place in their dynamic.

Niki: "You may have cucked me Sekai, but guess who they are calling mommy, now."
Niki played the long game, lmao.

That does remind me though, this Sekai (White Dress), in particular, implied that she is only around because of Sensei:

Spoiler

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She did suggest she hung around Ami as well:

Spoiler

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But the point seemed to be that Sensei (and maybe Ami) are what allows her to exist.

So, if Niki does end up replacing her in their minds, it may as well be a second death.

Frankly, that might even be why Sekai hated Maya Prime so much. She may have fucked Sensei's mind up to the point he forgot about Sekai and only recalled her as "Teacher".

In other words: Sekai's existence may be at stake now, due to Niki.

I also have to wonder if Maya Prime may be in a similar situation. Only kept "alive" due to the memories of her that Ayane, Noriko, and Sensei have. Maybe even Ami, although she seems to prefer New Maya.

This also makes Sekai calling Maya "whatshername" and Pareidolia calling her "Mayo" etc, possibly an attempt at killing Maya Prime off, permanently. Even the recent Io stuff may be an attempt at this:

Spoiler

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Perhaps New Maya is another attempt of sorts.

 

[Comiies]

Niki: "You may have cucked me Sekai, but guess who they are calling mommy, now."
Niki played the long game, lmao.

That does remind me though, this Sekai (White Dress), in particular, implied that she is only around because of Sensei:

Spoiler

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She did suggest she hung around Ami as well:

Spoiler

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But the point seemed to be that Sensei (and maybe Ami) are what allows her to exist.

So, if Niki does end up replacing her in their minds, it may as well be a second death.

Frankly, that might even be why Sekai hated Maya Prime so much. She may have fucked Sensei's mind up to the point he forgot about Sekai and only recalled her as "Teacher".

In other words: Sekai's existence may be at stake now, due to Niki.

I also have to wonder if Maya Prime may be in a similar situation. Only kept "alive" due to the memories of her that Ayane, Noriko, and Sensei have. Maybe even Ami, although she seems to prefer New Maya.

This also makes Sekai calling Maya "whatshername" and Pareidolia calling her "Mayo" etc, possibly an attempt at killing Maya Prime off, permanently. Even the recent Io stuff may be an attempt at this:

Spoiler

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Perhaps New Maya is another attempt of sorts.

Well thats interesting.Sekai being able to exist only because Akira remembers her can technically work since she only started to appear when we were slowly regaining our memories.In the beginning she wasnt there,hell there was BARELY any mention of her.And the very little off hand comments about her werent even that direct.Just "Oh Amis mom" or "Someone with a name thats starts from the letter T" or whatever.So if we do follow that theory that means that Sekai will do whatever it takes to A)Have Akira remember her since her existance basically relies on that and B)Do everything she can to descend into the real world(possibly through possesing Kaori as weve seen happen already) in order to once more be closer to the ones she loves.

 

[Moonflare]

Just because you haven't initiated a relationship officially, doesn't mean that there isn't some sort of bond formed and expectation created as soon as you start being intimate.
I still consider it as betrayment because they expected exclusivity and you were aware of it, and you knew they would be hurt when they discovered it wasn't.
If all of these girls knew that you would go on to fuck the rest after doing it with them, would they have agreed to do it with you in the first place? bar some people like Kirin or Ayane, most of them wouldn't
Saying that you never agreed to be exclusive is an excuse, at the very least it needs to be mentioned before or after you do it to avoid the other catching unwanted feelings, you can forgive a teenager for lacking the maturity to do it, but not Akira.
In this case it's even worse because Akira outright says that he loves them which creates for them the image that "They are the one"
Sara is the only girl so far with whom Akira has been honest from the beginning and who has no right to complain if her feelings aren't reciprocated.

I mean, sure, but acting in bad faith towards someone's expectations is not the same as cheating. "this person is seeing me on the supposition that we can't have a relationship because she's my student, when in actual fact it's because I want to whore around" is definitely acting in bad faith, but it isn't cheating, because they don't have a relationship.

Spoiler: further reasoning

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Tbh imo what he's doing is much worse than cheating on them, because if he was, at the very least he'd be giving them a reason to hate him, and a kickstart for them to get away from him. Since he cleverly leaves it all undefined, then there's no real target to pin the blame of their hurting on but themselves and their unrealistic expectations. That he tried to give both Karin and Uta (to a lesser extent) the tools to never see him again really shows some growth.

 

[Moonflare]

Well thats interesting.Sekai being able to exist only because Akira remembers her can technically work since she only started to appear when we were slowly regaining our memories.In the beginning she wasnt there,hell there was BARELY any mention of her.And the very little off hand comments about her werent even that direct.Just "Oh Amis mom" or "Someone with a name thats starts from the letter T" or whatever.So if we do follow that theory that means that Sekai will do whatever it takes to A)Have Akira remember her since her existance basically relies on that and B)Do everything she can to descend into the real world(possibly through possesing Kaori as weve seen happen already) in order to once more be closer to the ones she loves.

The Sekai situation is very complicated. There is some evidence that Sekai was the one that had her hands on Akira's shoulders, and that is present throughout most of the game in various events. There are also multiple characters and narrators that say that Akira has the weight of the world (Sekai) on his shoulders. Then AmIOkay even calls Akira Sekai. The same "Huh?" that Yasu says to Sekai in "Shelter", that fdsasdf_p pointed out, can be seen on an early Sana event, where Yasu says that there is someone with Akira that he can't see, and looks to his side and says "Huh?". Yasu also says in "frankincense" that she can reveal the voice of the one that follows him, and if that is also Sekai (high likehood) then she's even more present. So, basically, Sekai can be the most present character in the story, we just couldn't see her/currently still lack confirmation it was her.

If everything I said turns out to be true, then it also adds complications for the "Sekai wars" (multiple sekais theory), since it would point out to many Sekais existing as of Chapter 4. If white dress Sekai can only haunt Akira and Ami, then how come a Sekai left them during that one cemetery scene saying she had stuff to do? If Sekai is the one following Akira, then how come he runs to Kaori for help against it and is helped by another Sekai inside of her? As always:

Spoiler

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[Bingoogus]

Sensei was on the limo

That's a funny image, ala Mr Bean on his mini.

 

[PhiloPhilo]

Since he cleverly leaves it all undefined, then there's no real target to pin the blame of their hurting on but themselves and their unrealistic expectations.

So Akira isn't a cheater, he's a based sigma playing 4D chess

If everything I said turns out to be true, then it also adds complications for the "Sekai wars" (multiple sekais theory), since it would point out to many Sekais existing as of Chapter 4. If white dress Sekai can only haunt Akira and Ami, then how come a Sekai left them during that one cemetery scene saying she had stuff to do? If Sekai is the one following Akira, then how come he runs to Kaori for help against it and is helped by another Sekai inside of her?

(possibly through possesing Kaori as weve seen happen already)

Sekai is a mess. There could easily be multiple Sekais, or at least an 'actual' Sekai and a fake Sekai created/used by someone(s). There's too much room for argumentation for now, in the sense that you could argue one way or another at least, even if one side wins out. Run Rabbit Run (Kaori event) is also weird. Akira was just driven by a 'feeling' that Kaori could help, which may not even be his own feelings, and seemingly he lacks information. Kaori/Sekai doesn't even really help him. Kaori gets possessed and makes out with him and that just makes him feel a little better because it's pleasant and it takes his mind off Sekai, and he seems to block out the more overt possession signs. The same Sekai could be the one popping up in his mind and also the one that took over Kaori. Being brought into close proximity to Kaori by Akira might even be what made that possible. And he just decided to go with the kiss because at least it's not "seeing her" and again, he seems to not perceive or ignore the part where she starts barfing MS Paint. Interesting side note, Kaori screams "月月月月月月月月月月月月月月月" here, which is the Kanji for moon (and month, I guess.) Not 100% sure what that means. But I don't actually see Run Rabbit Run as confirmation of two Sekais fighting each other, more like Sekai hunting Akira who goes to Kaori, and then Sekai is like oh shit I'd like to get inside her.

And that's not even getting into the potentially crackpot theory that Kaori isn't (by default) possessed by Sekai, but more like her 'spirit' or energy (not her soul, at least not more than a piece of it,) because she (probably) received her organs in a transplant — And Kaori is either possessed by a lingering piece of her soul or her evil aura juices or something. Similar to the Shirikodama which a lot of people know about (thanks, Elden Ring.) In which case it's Sekai vs Sekai's spirit(?)

 

[aramaug]

That does remind me though, this Sekai (White Dress), in particular, implied that she is only around because of Sensei:

Spoiler

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She did suggest she hung around Ami as well:

Spoiler

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But the point seemed to be that Sensei (and maybe Ami) are what allows her to exist.

We already know to some extent there is a Sekai in Ami's mind even when Akira is not present. Ami talks to her (and hears a response) in "Every Day Birds" after Akira leaves the room.

Spoiler

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I'm pretty sure Sekai has been able to talk through Ami as well. In "Worry Not, the Mason Jar" Ami acts kind of crazy (and not in the usual way) while the frame is zoomed in on her mouth, hiding her eyes. The same thing is done when Sekai talks through Kaori or Yasu.

Spoiler

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Ami's voice is also replaced with (probably) Sekai's in "Not the Nightingale", though this one could just be in Akira's head.

Spoiler

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It would definitely be interesting if this Sekai proves to be the same as the white dress Sekai that's haunting Akira. As Moonflare said, white dress Sekai tells Akira she's haunting only him, but I guess lying to Akira is on brand for Sekai/Pareidolia.

I personally think 0.41 points to all of the Sekais being the same entity, with all of the connections between Pareidolia, Kaori, the Sekai inside Yasu, and the Sekai haunting Akira. The Sekai that's able to physically carry one of Yasu's rabbits is still confusing, though.

If everything I said turns out to be true, then it also adds complications for the "Sekai wars" (multiple sekais theory), since it would point out to many Sekais existing as of Chapter 4. If white dress Sekai can only haunt Akira and Ami, then how come a Sekai left them during that one cemetery scene saying she had stuff to do? If Sekai is the one following Akira, then how come he runs to Kaori for help against it and is helped by another Sekai inside of her? As always:

Spoiler

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Why do you say SeKaori helped Akira? My take on "Run, Rabbit, Run" was that Sekai was only able to possess Kaori because Akira brought SekaiDolia to her apartment. Akira claims he feels better afterwards, but that's because he's returning to his old numbness, which is not a good thing. In the next event he says that was a lie as well, and feelings are good.

Also, random thought: in "Run, Rabbit, Run" Sekai possesses Kaori, but as Moonflare suggested before, she might be forced out when Nao shows up. This event is immediately followed by "Worry Not, the Mason Jar" where Sekai speaks to Akira directly in his mind, "LET ME OUT" flashes on screen, and then Sekai seems to speak through Ami as well. That event is then immediately followed by "All for You", where the narrator talks about the thing that "sings in its sleep". If Apollo259 is right about that referring to Sekai, maybe she's emerging from her old hiding place of Kaori and finding a new one in Ami. It doesn't fit perfectly since Sekai still possesses Kaori in the future, but maybe there's something there.

 

[crustlord12]

Spoiler: 0.42 Previews

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Hell yeah, ass. Also I'm hoping Rin does confront Otoha about the pic swap with Akira, I'm curious if Otoha tells her who she got back in return.

Spoiler: 0.42 Previews

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$20 says one of these two has an "incest" card and are unsure how to go about it.

Spoiler: 0.42 Preview

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I don't see this going well at all, there's no way Sekai will take to being replaced as a mother figure well at all.

Definitely excited for the next update now

 

[Dc345]

Spoiler: 0.42 Preview

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[Fire Lord Zuko]

Holy hell that’s like 7 previews today.

…Not that I’m complaining at all. Gotta make up for lost time due to the power outage I suppose.

 

[LessonsInDissonance]

I mean, sure, but acting in bad faith towards someone's expectations is not the same as cheating. "this person is seeing me on the supposition that we can't have a relationship because she's my student, when in actual fact it's because I want to whore around" is definitely acting in bad faith, but it isn't cheating, because they don't have a relationship.

Spoiler: further reasoning

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Tbh imo what he's doing is much worse than cheating on them, because if he was, at the very least he'd be giving them a reason to hate him, and a kickstart for them to get away from him. Since he cleverly leaves it all undefined, then there's no real target to pin the blame of their hurting on but themselves and their unrealistic expectations. That he tried to give both Karin and Uta (to a lesser extent) the tools to never see him again really shows some growth.

I understand your point, he's a scumbag no matter how you look at it, we are just arguing about technicalities here

 

[Bingoogus]

Spoiler: 0.42 Preview

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Spoiler

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[somepersonoutofnowhere]

Spoiler: 0.42 Preview

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Damn, I probably didn't notice it before but Yasu is pretty taller than Molly, I wonder how tall she'll be in the future, I seriously wanna see Adult Yasu's height.

But I hope more than that to see more of Wholesome/Cute Yasu she's ABSOLUTELY adorable when she's like that.

Spoiler: I NEED MORE!

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[PhiloPhilo]

Damn, I probably didn't notice it before but Yasu is pretty taller than Molly, I wonder how tall she'll be in the future, I seriously wanna see Adult Yasu's height.

But I hope more than that to see more of Wholesome/Cute Yasu she's ABSOLUTELY adorable when she's like that.

Spoiler: I NEED MORE!

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Yasu is an adorable, misunderstood little angel. Favorite scene in the game is getting to see Yasu sing and be a normal girl in The Color White. If she ever gets brain murdered or sausaged I'm going to punch someone in the fucking face, with my foot. Possibly my hand.

 

[Moonflare]

Spoiler: 0.42 Preview

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Last Yasu event was:

Spoiler: the art of drowning

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I see what you're doing here Selebus. Is it time for Yasu's baptism?

 

[XHunterz]

What is name of girls died on this game just curious?

 

[Moonflare]

Why do you say SeKaori helped Akira? My take on "Run, Rabbit, Run" was that Sekai was only able to possess Kaori because Akira brought SekaiDolia to her apartment. Akira claims he feels better afterwards, but that's because he's returning to his old numbness, which is not a good thing. In the next event he says that was a lie as well, and feelings are good.

Just that Akira went there looking for help. He mentions that since Kaori was sort of neutral ground to the whole Sekai thing he could distract himself there.

From this point is a bunch of random observations from rewatching, maybe one of them helps:

Since you mentioned the chain of events though, when Ami is on top of Akira's shoulders, he compares the two and how both of them served as barriers (which makes sense since both of them are sort of Sekai's body parts). Another point of interest is how Sekai says (between the Kaori scene and the Ami scene) that she's going back to her pool of darkness.

Spoiler: worry not

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This is followed later by the Ninth God saying it resides in the nothing. And we see that Pareidolia's home is the abyss (seen in "Abyss") - of course, from the disengage sequence of the auto-pilot, we had already learned that the Ninth God is in league with Pareidolia. But I thought I'd point this out anyway. Of course, Sekai could simply be lying there, but if she was not lying, then it would serve as evidence that they're different Sekais - since the memory Sekai went back to the darkness, while another is inside Ami.

What's inside Ami seems to also be related to Somnambula, so it could have always been there as well.

Spoiler: worrynot

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Spoiler: somnambula

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Also, since whatever that is is inside Ami at the time "all for you" happens, it still remains a mystery to who's saying that. Himawari would be the obvious guess, but all for you narrator can rhyme better than Himawari's previous attempts. There is some likehood that what's inside Ami is USER4. When the scene goes blue after their confrontation, whoever that was asked Akira for a favor, and the screen says that there is only one god, and that you shouldn't listen to who says otherwise.

My last observation from rewatching is that in "all for you" it clearly stated that whatever comes out of the hole in the wall is unconscious, and its eyes are closed. It is disconnected from the orb meant to move it.

Spoiler: all for you

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That it is unconscious would be an evidence against it being the Sekai we know. Some other things that may relate to this are:

Spoiler: priestess of fallen snow

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at the end of fruits of torment, there is some possible reference to "the orb meant to move it"

Spoiler: fruits of torment

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[Kitty Hawk]

Damn, I probably didn't notice it before but Yasu is pretty taller than Molly, I wonder how tall she'll be in the future, I seriously wanna see Adult Yasu's height.

But I hope more than that to see more of Wholesome/Cute Yasu she's ABSOLUTELY adorable when she's like that.

Spoiler: I NEED MORE!

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Spoiler: Older Yasu

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