VN Ren'Py Nothing Is Forever [v0.7.3] [MrSilverLust]

[MrSilverLust]

Of the women in the game, only Jen is presented as an outright sub, against Deb and Kim as outright dommes.

My read on the situation with Kim (which may have been wrong) was that either path involved the MC becoming her toy, whether as her pain slut or her tame cock, leaving her in the driver's seat no matter what.

Kim is definitely a polarizing character, and I can see where you're coming from.

But, as a counter-argument, I'll ask you to go suggest to this guy other games with women that, quoting you, "want an MC to become her toy and tame cock, while being in the driver's seat no matter what". And then we can both see if he likes them, or if, perhaps, Kim is giving him a completely different thing that you can't appreciate. My point here is that, just because you don't like it, doesn't make her a domme, or some other thing that you seem to be identifying as femdom-ish that's still present in her manly path.

On a reverse token, you can also try to explain to this guy (EDIT: link corrected), who clearly enjoys femdom, why he is wrong about Kim not being an outright domme at heart, and how the MC is not topping from the bottom, even in her sensitive path. This is mostly to be used as a conter-argument to you saying that "only Jen is presented as an outright sub, against Deb and Kim as outright dommes", as I think that Jen is a sub, Deb is a domme and everyone else adapts a bit depending on player choices.

Either way, this is a bit of silly argument because of course you're free to feel however you want, to not like characters, to think Kim is too bossy/controlling/whatever for your taste, etc. I'm just trying to say that I think that all LI's can offer something that's completely not femdom related, contrary to what some recent low score reviews say.

Oh, I'm in no way critisizing you or the game. I'm sorry if it felt like I was doing that.

The game is not above criticism and you certainly rise good points, many of which have already been talked here before and I agreed with. I was mostly using your claim:

the more I play this game, the more I realise there are more femdom scenes than not

as an example to try to show that's not true (I can agree with there being more femdom scenes than maledom scenes, and the femdom scenes being kinker, but I don't think there are more femdom scenes than not). And I probably was a bit more "bitchy" than required, because I was salty due to bad reviews that messed with my fake internet points. claiming similar things as what you wrote, or even worse like: "all of the 'good options' and content are locked off unless you pick soy-boy options 90% of the time" - 2 starts review.

"Ehy, player ! This game is full of hidden kinks and hot moments, but you can't play them because the gameplay is too complicated, UAH UAH UAH UAH"

I can see how it can be too complicated to some people, my bad.

 

[EndlessNights]

Emma: Familiarity, common interests, feelings (not vocalized), Keeps the MC on his toes (has the most appeal 'feelings-wise')

Deb: Does not share a lot about herself (fair enough). Not sure what she wants. Was in a relationship for over 2 years, and had a guy who (against his nature) accommodated her kinks (just not all the time). The way she verbally destroys Carl when he does not do exactly what she wants......Then booty calls her 'friend' soon after her long relationship ends..... IMO, all of this just screams 'You will only get affection IF you please me...It's all about ME ME ME!' No thanks!

I feel like there's a bit of a recency bias going on with how people are looking at Emma and Deb in particular. Emma is flying really high after a couple of strong updates for her in a row. Deb is getting more criticism as her relationship with Carl has been gradually (and then suddenly) falling apart. Hardly anyone comes out looking great during a breakup -- that's all the more true when there are two good people (neither are villains in my view) involved who still love each other but are fundamentally incompatible.

My favorite Deb moments definitely happen earlier in the game. I feel like she recognized the MC's mental struggles earlier and more keenly than most of the other characters including people who theoretically knew him better. I loved how she gently pushed him away from wallowing in despair and towards healthier activities like working out and opening up to people (even if they happened to be patients). Despite her usual directness and tough exterior, I think she comes across as really caring and warm in their beach conversation to give one example.

I'm with you in that I definitely didn't like how Deb treats Carl during certain moments, particularly the bull scene. I see them as two people who genuinely love each other but never quite manage to understand one another and often ending up hurting each other despite their best efforts. Remember, it's not just Carl who makes a sacrifice for the relationship by trying to be more submissive. Deb prefers monogamy, but she still tries to indulge Carl's cuck fetish to please him. True, her resentment boils over in the bull scene with the MC...but I think that's understandable given the circumstances. I imagine there were probably times Carl showed he wasn't entirely happy when Deb was trying to get him to act more submissively as well. I respect them both for trying so damn hard.

Of course, you're not wrong to view Deb's treatment of Carl as a red flag. That's reasonable. I just don't think it's a given that a MC-Deb relationship would necessarily follow the same path if they start out more or less on the same page and can learn to clearly communicate their needs and desires.

 

[Mister_M]

suggest to this guy

explain to this guy

It's the same guy and it seems like you meant to link 2 different guys.

 

[osanaiko]

I was salty due to bad reviews that messed with my fake internet points

I get this same reaction!! Like, I sometimes desperately wish there was a reply button on the reviews so I can argue with them and explain why they clearly just don't understand!!!!

I guess that's a risk that goes with the territory: if you create a game with complex characters and genuine conversations, you get drive-by low score review shootings from people with poor reading comprehension skills, or complaints that somehow the game didn't match their specific juvenile wish-fullfilment desires (i.e. why is MC not yet another gormless nobody who somehow gets all the girls throwing themselves onto his dick?).

I think the entire category of comments in this game thread is a far better indicator of the type of game this is: for example, you don't see in-depth character analysis in the summertime saga thread.

 

[bolondro2]

I'm sorry, I think I was unfairly lumping your suggestion in the same bag with others more drastic. Deb's scene already has an option to put the cage or not. To anyone choosing to not wear a cage, it'd be pretty trivial to give the option to make the mc also cum with a little buttjob after Deb is finished. That's actually a very "cheap" and easy change. It's similar to adding the option to not give the nipple clamps to Jen in the manly path.

This small change would be really nice in my opinion. It´s obvious that Deb path it´s all about "she taking control", but taking control it´s different to put the marker to zero, and in my path Deb goes to 4-0 (I choose the spanking scene). A bit the same that the "ruined orgasm". I would enjoyed more the path with a standard one. She controls when, where and how much, but she delivers...

Deb, throw me a bone, here an there, dam it!!

Talking about different topics, in general the update keep the really high level of quality of the former´s ones. I have enjoyed a lot the Monika detour. Not all in the story goes around the MC getting laid. And nice to see that in the chess department there are lot of draws, and you have not fallen in one of the mistakes of Queens Gambit.

A bit disappointed with the lack of content about Bea and Olivia, but I can perfectly understand that days have only 24 hours and that the amount of content that you can for an update it´s not unlimited. Or just that not all the girls are going to have the same impact in the story. We just need to wait for futures updates, I guess.

I´m surprised about that, in Jen "both subs" path, the MC goes for searching online. Yes, makes more sense storywise, but I would bet something that you would beeline to Deb, kudos for this

Had someone be brave enough to use the "suicide option"? I´m talking about telling Kim about the true abut your past in order to make her stop cheating. I have expend some time on the screen, but knowing how the mind of our hot psycho works. I have not a death wish nor my MC it´s a moron...

 

[dolfe67]

There is not a lot of femdom games, and even less "gentle" ones. Contrary to the abundance of maledom games. So when a game is good in that regard, it attracts that audience and they discuss it. This can skew your point of view on the game even though there is as much maledom in it.

 

[Sennistrasz]

I stopped playing when I got to the part asking me which girl I liked, and then reading here to find that there’s no harem route. What’s the points of collecting these points and unlocking these traits when they’re with girls you won’t have content with? It locks the paths to rejecting every other girl in a massive cast and then missing out on 80% of the content, or going down a specific route of cheating to get to even another 10% of the scenes. It’s already bad enough that at least 2 of the potential relationships are not allowed, with no indication of how those problems will be resolved at the point of choosing. This becomes the kind of game where there is a first run to scout which girl you like, then restarting to pick the correct options and get the correct traits (or hoarding points and getting them when the scene asks for something), rejecting everyone else and skipping all the other scenes, while being spoiled of the actual story. It’s impossible to play this game organically.

 

[osanaiko]

I stopped playing when I got to the part asking me which girl I liked, and then reading here to find that there’s no harem route. What’s the points of collecting these points and unlocking these traits when they’re with girls you won’t have content with? It locks the paths to rejecting every other girl in a massive cast and then missing out on 80% of the content, or going down a specific route of cheating to get to even another 10% of the scenes. It’s already bad enough that at least 2 of the potential relationships are not allowed, with no indication of how those problems will be resolved at the point of choosing. This becomes the kind of game where there is a first run to scout which girl you like, then restarting to pick the correct options and get the correct traits (or hoarding points and getting them when the scene asks for something), rejecting everyone else and skipping all the other scenes, while being spoiled of the actual story. It’s impossible to play this game organically.

So, hypothetically, if someone was in a group of friends and tried to simultaneously have a sexual relationship with 4 or more of them at the same time, some explicitly FWB, some secretly cheating, some with exclusivity not even discussed, and at least one where there was an exclusive relationship promised... how many of these people would still be talking to each other after the inevitable explosion, organically?

If you want a harem game, you might need to look elsewhere.

if you want to get 80%+ of the sex scene content in one playthrough, you might need to look elsewhere.

Nothing if Forever is simply not that sort of game.

 

[selberdreher]

I stopped playing when I got to the part asking me which girl I liked, and then reading here to find that there’s no harem route.

Well, you probably *could* have guessed this already from the missing 'harem' tag.
It's a bit like watching House of cards and then blaming Netflix they didn't include an alien invasion, since it fucking plays in Washington DC and everybody knows that DC is always invaded by aliens.
Other than that, there are indeed players who like meaningful choices and replayability, so your assessment may only hold water to yourself and fellow players with preferences similar to yours.
For my part i can assure you, i played this game organically and was excited of the innovative playstyle which was provided by the use of those kink points.
Like always not every genre or game has to appeal to all audiences, so probably it's for the best if you don't continue to play a game which you don't like.

 

[Sennistrasz]

So, hypothetically, if someone was in a group of friends and tried to simultaneously have a sexual relationship with 4 or more of them at the same time, some explicitly FWB, some secretly cheating, some with exclusivity not even discussed, and at least one where there was an exclusive relationship promised... how many of these people would still be talking to each other after the inevitable explosion, organically?

If you want a harem game, you might need to look elsewhere.

if you want to get 80%+ of the sex scene content in one playthrough, you might need to look elsewhere.

Nothing if Forever is simply not that sort of game.

The harem part itself is not the issue, it's the points system and skill tree for specific scenes where the game doesn't say who those are for, having to hoard points until they're needed, unknown consequences for choosing certain routes that hint at game overs (sacked or relationship ended due to married LI), the disconnect between who I want MC to be vs choosing a girl and getting whatever kinks that go with her vs choosing a kink and seeing whichever girl goes with it, and because there's no system to respec, the possibility of having to start over so that I can get the appropriate girl-kink combos as the story reveals them. In one of the choices, the game hints at dom/cuck the whole time, then suddenly an option appears for the other direction to happen, so that's a whole different strategy to collect the appropriate points, which would mean rolling back or starting again.

Added to some choices where I don't want either of the points (or going against the points system because of story appropriateness), it leads me to believe that they're needed somewhere, but they're not really, if the specific girl I choose won't have them.

 

[Mister_M]

The harem part itself is not the issue, it's the points system and skill tree for specific scenes where the game doesn't say who those are for, having to hoard points until they're needed

You can turn off the pts system if it's not to your liking. Go to "Skills" -> "Options" (bottom) -> "Cheat: get all skills now" (green letters at the left top); with it you don't need to care about any pts and can just enjoy the story and role play without looking at the colors of the anwers (you can also turn off the colors/hints of the dialogue options by turning on the blind mode btw).

 

[Sennistrasz]

You can turn off the pts system if it's not to your liking. Go to "Skills" -> "Options" (bottom) -> "Cheat: get all skills now" (green letters at the left top); with it you don't need to care about any pts and can just enjoy the story and role play without looking at the colors of the anwers (you can also turn off the colors/hints of the dialogue options by turning on the blind mode btw).

I may have remembered this wrongly, but aren't there a few choices based on having a certain score rather than having something unlocked?

 

[SoulSwipre]

Kim is definitely a polarizing character, and I can see where you're coming from.

But, as a counter-argument, I'll ask you to go suggest to this guy other games with women that, quoting you, "want an MC to become her toy and tame cock, while being in the driver's seat no matter what". And then we can both see if he likes them, or if, perhaps, Kim is giving him a completely different thing that you can't appreciate. My point here is that, just because you don't like it, doesn't make her a domme, or some other thing that you seem to be identifying as femdom-ish that's still present in her manly path.

On a reverse token, you can also try to explain to this guy (EDIT: link corrected), who clearly enjoys femdom, why he is wrong about Kim not being an outright domme at heart, and how the MC is not topping from the bottom, even in her sensitive path. This is mostly to be used as a conter-argument to you saying that "only Jen is presented as an outright sub, against Deb and Kim as outright dommes", as I think that Jen is a sub, Deb is a domme and everyone else adapts a bit depending on player choices.

Either way, this is a bit of silly argument because of course you're free to feel however you want, to not like characters, to think Kim is too bossy/controlling/whatever for your taste, etc. I'm just trying to say that I think that all LI's can offer something that's completely not femdom related, contrary to what some recent low score reviews say.



The game is not above criticism and you certainly rise good points, many of which have already been talked here before and I agreed with. I was mostly using your claim:



as an example to try to show that's not true (I can agree with there being more femdom scenes than maledom scenes, and the femdom scenes being kinker, but I don't think there are more femdom scenes than not). And I probably was a bit more "bitchy" than required, because I was salty due to bad reviews that messed with my fake internet points. claiming similar things as what you wrote, or even worse like: "all of the 'good options' and content are locked off unless you pick soy-boy options 90% of the time" - 2 starts review.



I can see how it can be too complicated to some people, my bad.

Yea, I can understand where you're coming from. I guess at the moment when I wrote it, I felt that alot of the Dom scenes didn't really felt like Dom scenes to me, even though they are clearly supposed to be. The Sub scenes had more consistency and you could really tell they were Sub scenes, thus making them the better scenes. Now that I saw the 2 star review, I agree with some of his/her points, but their failure to see the game as what it is and judged it solely on the their likes and wants can definitely be disappointing.

I did however, progress abit more in the game and saw how a few of my points were moot as more personality and interactions came out. It's my first time playing the game and I didn't read all the past posts on the forum, so I'm glad you're already improving the game based on past recommendations and comments.

 

[Mister_M]

I may have remembered this wrongly, but aren't there a few choices based on having a certain score rather than having something unlocked?

I think there's only one such instance in the game (with Kim), but it's based on the general sensitive/manly score, so if you're not into senstitive/submissive stuff I don't think you'll choose sensitive answers even without color markings (and tbh I never used the cheat, so maybe it also opens up this particular choice for the player, I don't know). The rest of the general score IIRC only influences some of MC's responses during various conversations adding additional flavor, making him more coherent and closer to who the player is role playing as, but not influencing what content is available.

Also, for now the choice of who MC likes is not extremely important. While the player must choose between versions of the relationships and sex scenes (dom or sub or switch or vanilla) s/he is not punished for romancing and sleeping with all available girls (I have romances with 4 of them in progress, and only cause I consciously decided to close romantic routes with the other LIs). Though it's certain that at some point the player will have to choose one and only LI (maybe on some routes more than one jugding by the bull and cuckquean kinks).

 

[brianzzz]

Walkthrough mod?

 

[osanaiko]

Walkthrough mod?

It's not a game where there is a "one true path" or any way to get all of the content in one play-through. There's several Love Interests and each of those have different quite different variations withing their paths. Some LIs and paths are mutually exclusive.

Additionally, while there are points in four different areas earned by different choices, if you make "natural" choices for the type of MC personality you want then it is very likely you will have enough points to buy the correct "kinks" when the time comes.

If you don't want to worry about choices, there are already built in various "cheat" modes which give you double or unlimited points, and even one that removes the point category distinctions. So you can tune the game to your preferred play style.

Anyway, all of that is to try and explain why a walk-through is not really going to be feasible to create, at least not without a crap-tonne of work, and as far as I know, so far no-one has tried.

 

[PrinceRV]

Kim is definitely a polarizing character, and I can see where you're coming from.

But, as a counter-argument, I'll ask you to go suggest to this guy other games with women that, quoting you, "want an MC to become her toy and tame cock, while being in the driver's seat no matter what". And then we can both see if he likes them, or if, perhaps, Kim is giving him a completely different thing that you can't appreciate. My point here is that, just because you don't like it, doesn't make her a domme, or some other thing that you seem to be identifying as femdom-ish that's still present in her manly path.

On a reverse token, you can also try to explain to this guy (EDIT: link corrected), who clearly enjoys femdom, why he is wrong about Kim not being an outright domme at heart, and how the MC is not topping from the bottom, even in her sensitive path. This is mostly to be used as a conter-argument to you saying that "only Jen is presented as an outright sub, against Deb and Kim as outright dommes", as I think that Jen is a sub, Deb is a domme and everyone else adapts a bit depending on player choices.

Either way, this is a bit of silly argument because of course you're free to feel however you want, to not like characters, to think Kim is too bossy/controlling/whatever for your taste, etc. I'm just trying to say that I think that all LI's can offer something that's completely not femdom related, contrary to what some recent low score reviews say.



The game is not above criticism and you certainly rise good points, many of which have already been talked here before and I agreed with. I was mostly using your claim:



as an example to try to show that's not true (I can agree with there being more femdom scenes than maledom scenes, and the femdom scenes being kinker, but I don't think there are more femdom scenes than not). And I probably was a bit more "bitchy" than required, because I was salty due to bad reviews that messed with my fake internet points. claiming similar things as what you wrote, or even worse like: "all of the 'good options' and content are locked off unless you pick soy-boy options 90% of the time" - 2 starts review.



I can see how it can be too complicated to some people, my bad.

Hey there! Dude, I have no words to describe how good and impressive I find your game. Thank you for giving us such a great content, the game has amazing characters, believeble relationships and wild chemistry. Speaking of polorizing characters, I'm really curious, if Deb on "Dominant" route is going to be just a meaningless fling or a LI. You can choose her as your crush at the first time (First chapters), but she's locked as an option to have feelings for later (charpter 4), if you're not on "Submissive" route. But at the same time we got a scene with her at the chapter 5, so I really hope that being a dominant guy and dating Deb will be possible in future chapters (fingers crossed). Have a good day!

 

[robrize2169]

just finished my first playthrough of this. fucking awesome game. i played the dom route for the MC so didn't see much content with Deb or Emma who are 2 of my fav girls. i also like the other girls but played as a non commital type of guy. Initially i wasn't a fan of Kim either and considered telling her to fuck off. but i decided to see what her story would be about and she turns out to be more interesting as the game goes on. game was really fun and the story is interesting enough to keep me playing further updates. only minor issue is no animated sex scenes which would definately make those scenes alot hotter. love the points system as well. hope other devs see this game and incorporate something simliar into their games.

 

[Leobbb]

It's a pretty interesting game, I have to admit. The system is unique and well thought out. It's a bit sad though that the visual quality is subpar, unfortunately as much as I like the variety of personalities and kinks I can't find a girl that I could call stunning or beautiful. They all look bland to me and their expressions fake. I really wish a bit more work was put into making the game look better.

 

[osanaiko]

It's a pretty interesting game, I have to admit. The system is unique and well thought out. It's a bit sad though that the visual quality is subpar, unfortunately as much as I like the variety of personalities and kinks I can't find a girl that I could call stunning or beautiful. They all look bland to me and their expressions fake. I really wish a bit more work was put into making the game look better.

Dev has made it clear that the visuals of the game are constrained by two things:

1. he does all the work on a laptop without a highend GPU so renderspeed and especially VRAM limits prevent him from using DAZ with complex scenes or high quality skins.

2. he spends more time on dialogue and scripting than visuals (partly due to dimishing returns of what he can create due to issue 1)

Separate to that, it seems pretty clear that MrSL has a specific character look that he prefers: slim to the point of being skinny (except Bri, who *really* brings the cake) and facial features with very high cheekbones. Not necessarily going to be everyone's cup of tea, but it certainly is quite distinctive within the sea of stock-daz-models that many games use.