VN Ren'Py Abandoned Oath of Loyalty [Ch. 10] [Silk Ari/REV]

[rev_01]

Ahh another game that plays like it's a harem and then fucks you in the end. Guess that's a new one off the list.

The game will have a focus on the consequences of cheating so it doesn't make much sense to have a harem. Additionally, a lot of characters have conflicting interests and won't really mesh to be in a harem and due to their personalities won't accept. It's not really fucking you in the end either though if it's known from the start. Similar to real life, in the majority of cases, your SO and yourself are monogamous and the game is doing that too. While you are able to have sex with multiple girls, it will have implications just like real life since they don't know about it and you are going behind their back. I wouldn't really say it plays like a harem from that context.

 

[MrFriendly]

Listen, Im not saying that the game is anything other than what it is, a Adult VN/porn game. The premise is to have sex scenes with a somewhat coherent story. I'm trying to find a balance between the two where it's not just a porn game without a story. Im not indifferent to your criticism or how it can be misinterpreted as a harem game when, you are gods gift to women when certain characters first meet you. Is it lazy? Possibly but then we'd go through a bunch of chapters with 0 sex scenes. And who wants to play a porn game where you have to wait until chapter 6 to have some sex scenes? Are some of them rushed. Of course. Are some of them unrealistic. Of course. You just cant win either way. People will complain either way it's too slow or its too easy or its too fast or its too hard... I do understand all the criticism though, but it's quite easy to sit back and just criticize after the fact. I'm doing what I think is right and what I think is going to make a good game while trying to listen to helpful criticism... It's all I can do really.

**Also, Im trying to make it entertaining.

I would (and do) play porn games that have zero sex until later chapters, perhaps even later than the 6th chapter, if the story is compelling and well written. I know I sound like a cliche but I’m here (on F95) because I want to play games with character development, relationships, good stories (I’m not expecting Pulitzer caliber), and some lewdness. If I wanted to watch porn I am sure that I could navigate to Google, smash some random keys on my keyboard, and find porn.

I’ve said before, in various threads, there are more ways to entertain people besides cheap sex scenes. The sex in this game comes without any real effort on the players part, early on almost every one of them is required for the plot and is unavoidable: Jane or Angela, Danielle, Jane again. The player is not given an option as to who the MC’s girlfriend is, Jane is thrust upon the MC as the default, even if the player had no interest in her. Thus, if the player wants the MC to be with someone else they are required to cheat on the default girlfriend. In addition, because there are sex scenes that are unavoidable (Danielle) that means the MC automatically cheats on his girlfriend.

I understand you are not making a harem game but I also can see where someone playing this game and having unavoidable sex scenes with multiple different partners (including a threesome) could develop an expectation for that type of ending. As I’ve seen that you have repeatedly said that wouldn’t happen I’m well aware (and I prefer romance) but the current state of the game makes it seem that the MC can fuck everyone with little to no consequences.

 

[rev_01]

Someone should put a warning at the beginning to NOT do both crime routes because it blocks out the best girl Marcy scene. That auto pullout almost ruined how hot the scene was tho.

There will be other events that cannot be seen except on only one path. Yes, while Marcy seen can only come from the gambling route there might be a scene with a girl in the future that only happens on say the drug route or something so it really depends how you want to play.

 

[rev_01]

I would (and do) play porn games that have zero sex until later chapters, perhaps even later than the 6th chapter, if the story is compelling and well written. I know I sound like a cliche but I’m here (on F95) because I want to play games with character development, relationships, good stories (I’m not expecting Pulitzer caliber), and some lewdness. If I wanted to watch porn I am sure that I could navigate to Google, smash some random keys on my keyboard, and find porn.

I’ve said before, in various threads, there are more ways to entertain people besides cheap sex scenes. The sex in this game comes without any real effort on the players part, early on almost every one of them is required for the plot and is unavoidable: Jane or Angela, Danielle, Jane again. The player is not given an option as to who the MC’s girlfriend is, Jane is thrust upon the MC as the default, even if the player had no interest in her. Thus, if the player wants the MC to be with someone else they are required to cheat on the default girlfriend. In addition, because there are sex scenes that are unavoidable (Danielle) that means the MC automatically cheats on his girlfriend.

I understand you are not making a harem game but I also can see where someone playing this game and having unavoidable sex scenes with multiple different partners (including a threesome) could develop an expectation for that type of ending. As I’ve seen that you have repeatedly said that wouldn’t happen I’m well aware (and I prefer romance) but the current state of the game makes it seem that the MC can fuck everyone with little to no consequences.

Yeah. I'm the exact same as you. I actually prefer not having sex in the early chapters. I love a game with a strong story, good character development and great dialogue with romance. Personally, I consider sex an extension of romance, not the other way around so I'd prefer to be going on dates and enjoying my time with the girls and then that can lead to sex. A perfect example of what I like is Melody. I think that nails it extremely well.

I do agree that people seemingly forget they're playing a Visual Novel, which, key word is "novel", there seems to be a default for these novels that they need to include sex straight away, which is actually done by the players and not the developers because for many games I have seen the players complaining that the story is taking too long and it's had like two releases

I also agree with your points raised as well about the characters. It does seem too easy and some characters are forced upon you which I guess does set a precedence that you might be able to have whoever you want in the game. That is definitely something which needs to be considered going forward because I know I definitely don't want to cheat but I don't particularly want Jane either so I guess we'll have to see how it all plays out.

 

[TiffanyMonroe]

So far all the +leadership points are things that I agree with the MC doing, while the +Ruth are things I think only an ignorant rage monkey would do.

Are you calling me a ignorant rage monkey for rejecting those two whores Bella and the aunt? I believe both of those choices give ruth.

There will be other events that cannot be seen except on only one path. Yes, while Marcy seen can only come from the gambling route there might be a scene with a girl in the future that only happens on say the drug route or something so it really depends how you want to play.

Didn't wanna tag you twice so I'm answering multiple comments in one. The only consequences I care about is the impregnation checks. Also I can't see how in the hell a LI would have a problem with you not selling drugs lol But seeing how Jane telepathically knew you got a bj, nothing will surprise me.
Also also I'm calling it now Marcy is best girl. Sorry Jane.

 

[Silk_Ari]

What we're trying to do is a happy balance of both. Can't please everyone. But can try to please a maximum number of people.

 

[rev_01]

Are you calling me a ignorant rage monkey for rejecting those two whores Bella and the aunt? I believe both of those choices give ruth.

Didn't wanna tag you twice so I'm answering multiple comments in one. The only consequences I care about is the impregnation checks. Also I can't see how in the hell a LI would have a problem with you not selling drugs lol But seeing how Jane telepathically knew you got a bj, nothing will surprise me.
Also also I'm calling it now Marcy is best girl. Sorry Jane.

Marcy doesn't like the selling of drugs due to the previous experiences she has had with them and the people using them from my understanding. You'll probably learn more about it as the story progresses.

 

[LordSinner]

I would (and do) play porn games that have zero sex until later chapters, perhaps even later than the 6th chapter, if the story is compelling and well written. I know I sound like a cliche but I’m here (on F95) because I want to play games with character development, relationships, good stories (I’m not expecting Pulitzer caliber), and some lewdness. If I wanted to watch porn I am sure that I could navigate to Google, smash some random keys on my keyboard, and find porn.

I’ve said before, in various threads, there are more ways to entertain people besides cheap sex scenes. The sex in this game comes without any real effort on the players part, early on almost every one of them is required for the plot and is unavoidable: Jane or Angela, Danielle, Jane again. The player is not given an option as to who the MC’s girlfriend is, Jane is thrust upon the MC as the default, even if the player had no interest in her. Thus, if the player wants the MC to be with someone else they are required to cheat on the default girlfriend. In addition, because there are sex scenes that are unavoidable (Danielle) that means the MC automatically cheats on his girlfriend.

I understand you are not making a harem game but I also can see where someone playing this game and having unavoidable sex scenes with multiple different partners (including a threesome) could develop an expectation for that type of ending. As I’ve seen that you have repeatedly said that wouldn’t happen I’m well aware (and I prefer romance) but the current state of the game makes it seem that the MC can fuck everyone with little to no consequences.

Just to add my two cents to this. I have to say this doesn't really feel like a romance game at all, we are forced into a relationship in a game where the DEV has said repeatedly that there will be consequences for cheating but then we are forced to cheat and we the player are suffering for choices we never had. I fail to see how forcing the player to be a cheating douche in a romance game is even remotely romantic.

 

[Avaron1974]

A game without a harem and I don't have to remind people.





Someone stole my job, bitch.

 

[rev_01]

A game without a harem and I don't have to remind people.





Someone stole my job, bitch.

I'm sure if you really wanted to you could still help to remind people

 

[Silk_Ari]

Just to add my two cents to this. I have to say this doesn't really feel like a romance game at all, we are forced into a relationship in a game where the DEV has said repeatedly that there will be consequences for cheating but then we are forced to cheat and we the player are suffering for choices we never had. I fail to see how forcing the player to be a cheating douche in a romance game is even remotely romantic.

When we're you forced to cheat?

Do you mean with Marcy?I dont consider that a force as your ruthless decisions are governing that. Dont be a dick and you wont cheat

 

[catcut]

Got a few requests for this one and I like the game as well. Enjoy the Walkthrough!

Edit: Updated to v0.4

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thanks a lot

 

[LaraWolfe]

You know I get that this whole harem/not harem argument came about due to a number of factors, starting with the -4 question. So I have a few takes on this, from my playthroughs I can see that as of right now there is in fact a way to not cheat on Jane, if you so choose. At the same time I personally don't care for the fact that Jane is forced upon MC as a girlfriend, but as already stated I still like this game enough to have played it multiple times.

A way to explain the -4 thing, correct Jane might never find out, however MC knows he cheated. MC feels guilty. That cold emotion gets noticed by Jane, who thinks she did something wrong and starts to worry. Creating a small rift between the two, should it remain a secret. A boom, now you have a minus four.

For those wondering the non-cheating route would be... Drugs or both (or keep your ruthlessness below 5), Angela for intro date (which makes MC fully single when with Danielle), and then just don't cheat through choices.

Honestly though, I personally like the take that Alexandra uses. "You can sleep with other women, just don't ever let me find out about them."

I still love this game hell it's still at number 11 on my list, but no game is ever going to be tailor made to me unless I make it myself. And that goes for everyone else. I think the biggest issue that we here (F95) face is we play these games these stories while they are being developed. Think of it just like any other form of media, you don't get half a movie to watch while the next half is being made, or levels in video games released on a monthly basis during the development of the future levels. You don't buy chapters of a novel while it's being written. This is a different thing we have here, mainly because nearly every game on this site is crowd funded in some way and that funding is what furthers the development.

So please do voice concerns, give your opinions, add constructive criticisms as it goes along, but please don't argue with the developer because it's not tailored to you, or you have disagreements. That's how you get developers who just give up because all they hear is negativity and hate. Most people find it hard to write good things about these games, usually not knowing what to say. However, those same people find it equally as difficult to not spout negativity when things aren't to their liking.

 

[ZTex]

A way to explain the -4 thing, correct Jane might never find out, however MC knows he cheated. MC feels guilty. That cold emotion gets noticed by Jane, who thinks she did something wrong and starts to worry. Creating a small rift between the two, should it remain a secret. A boom, now you have a minus four.

Does he feel guilty though ?
Nothing has shown us that he does and he's even had a threesome by this point with Danielle and Jane. There's a contradiction at play here where Jane has already seen and been an active participant in the MC's non-monogamous ways.

For those wondering the non-cheating route would be... Drugs or both (or keep your ruthlessness below 5), Angela for intro date (which makes MC fully single when with Danielle), and then just don't cheat through choices.

Except you're excusing that the MC is forced to have sex with Danielle after starting a romantic relationship with someone. This is where people are saying you're forced into cheating.

There is probably quite a few ways all of these continuity issues could be addressed and changed so it feels less harem like and plays more into the standard romance game if that's what the dev wants to do. The story being a mob story allows for there to be eyes and ears literally everywhere working against you and your ascension through the ranks.

 

[Avaron1974]

Be sure to undestanding before downloading. This is NOT A GAME. It's a VN and the story may NOT be liked.

If only a system was introduced that onvolved putting letters in the title to let the viewer know what they are downloading.

I think for VN they could add, maybe, a big VN with a red highlight to show it's a visual novel.

Then, to stop further confusion, they could include something like an overview to let people know something of the contents of the story they are downloading.

Now imagine a world where people had different tastes.



Sometimes I can't help it. Sometimes a post appears that makes it hard to walk away from. If I hadn't done it, it would have kept me up at night. The sarcasm that should have been.

 

[Aristos]

For me, one of the best 2-3 devs in this genre is PhillyGames.

In Philly's debut game, Depraved Awakening, the MC has sex literally in the first scene of the game with Carli, who would then go on to become arguably the most relevant female character in the story. It wasn't a harem game.
In CoBD's first episode you can have sex with 2 main LI's, Chandra and Ellen, as well as with a secondary character named Kleo.
Both games have amazing stories, amazing writing, and are by no means a fuckfest. You have to make choices that do matter later on.

What I'm getting at is the fact that a game can allow you to have sex very early into the story without it meaning that you're destined to have a harem. IRL people can have casual sex which may then lead to a long-term relationship. Also, people make choices, but later they can change their minds and decide that someone else is better for them.
What matters is the evolution and the coherence in our MC's behaviour. I play several routes. In the route where I have sex with Angela in ep 1 I have sex with her again in ep 3. On the contrary, in the route where I don't have sex with her in ep 1 we only remain friends and I'm more focused on Jane. Also, if I cum inside Jane I'm definitely not doing it inside any other chick.

Like others said, I'm not here for the porn but for the story. However, I want some porn too. No matter how good the story is, if I play something from this site I want it to have a certain amount of lewdness.
There's another game here with a mafia setting that has built a really faithful fanbase despite having gone 2 years without a single sex scene with any LI yet, if I'm not mistaken. From my humble point of view, that's absolutely incomprehensible. I don't mean to offend anyone, but I have a feeling that people who justify such things just want to feel special, like they belong to the select group of followers who enjoy such a cult game. A game that is above the others, a game that's soooo different and worth the wait. That's nonsense for me.

Finally, one last consideration.
A guy who will be the goddamn Don of a mafia family can fuck whoever he wants, whenever he wants!
And build a harem if he so wants! The dev better watch his back if he thinks our MC will accept that meekly

 

[Avaron1974]

In Philly's debut game, Depraved Awakening, the MC has sex literally in the first scene of the game with Carli, who would then go on to become arguably the most relevant female character in the story. It wasn't a harem game.

I have a feeling if certain people had played DA during it's development, they would have complained it wasn't a harem game.

Then complained about the photo's of Stella fucking those guys. Then complained about one of the main LI's working as a prostitute and still seeing clients when she starts dating the MC, then complained about Mi Do's rape scenes.

Then shit would hit the fan when Stella had her throat shot out.

Point is, a lot of games over the last few years had early sex scenes and the option to fuck multiple women but they weren't harem games. You would lose out in the end.

When I first joined ULMF and places like that it didn't have anything like this. People never assumed a harem unless the dev stated it was. When I first joined here I don't recall much of that popping up. First time I saw people complain about a game not being a harem was No More Secrets, then Retrieving the Past, then Where the Heart Is and now here.

The fact that it doesn't have a harem tag should give it away.

It does make me chuckle though. Dev says it isn't a harem and a few people complain like they expect him to say "you know what, fuck this story i've spent all my time writing and now transferring into a game, you are right and I shall do things your way".

 

[Aristos]

I have a feeling if certain people had played DA during it's development, they would have complained it wasn't a harem game.

Then complained about the photo's of Stella fucking those guys. Then complained about one of the main LI's working as a prostitute and still seeing clients when she starts dating the MC, then complained about Mi Do's rape scenes.

Then shit would hit the fan when Stella had her throat shot out.

I don't have a feeling, I'm absolutely positive it would've happened as you describe it.

It does make me chuckle though. Dev says it isn't a harem and a few people complain like they expect him to say "you know what, fuck this story i've spent all my time writing and now transferring into a game, you are right and I shall do things your way".

You know why that is, right? Because many of them are used to getting away with it. Certain devs do give in for fear of their games going to waste, while others wholeheartedly decide to use their supporters suggestions or demands to devise their stories in the first place.
I've even seen a guy on this site redo his game from scratch because people started whining right after its release since it had a black MC and black female characters. That guy put up a poll if my memory serves me correctly, and ended up making everybody white.

 

[MrFriendly]

Spoiler: Philly's cool

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I don't remember DA very well so I won't speak to that. I can say that the key difference between COBD and Oath is the optional nature of the sex scenes in COBD versus Oath. The MC in Oath will fuck Jane or Angela and Danielle, you have no control over that. As I recall in COBD you can decline Chandra, Ellen, and Kleo... In fact most, if not all, of the sex is either optional or has prerequisite behavior/choices for it to happen. Oath, for story reasons, has a few scenes happen and requires that the MC be in a committed relationship with Jane (another decision that the player isn't allowed to make and means that the MC is a cheater if he pursues anyone else).

I prefer games to not have harems if they want the story to be taken seriously, I just don't care to play a ton of games where the MC's magical dick attracts all who perceive it no matter the familial relationship (I'm also not a giant fan of incest games but that seems to be everywhere). I can see why people had the idea that a harem would be possible just because of the required sex scenes. However, if anyone bothered to read the thread they would know that it won't be and should either move on or deal with it. I sympathize with Silk as it seems there are constant calls for the game to have a harem ending.

 

[Meushi]

Anyone who thought this was a harem game just because there are a few easy fucks is delusional. Almost every non-harem, story driven VN I play lets you screw all and sundry at the start and narrows your choices later, which is presumably what will happen in OoL.

Actual full harem games with a story are practically impossible to pull off within the bounds of reason, so why anyone would have such expectations of any VN which doesn't explicitly state it's harem is a mystery.

There's another game here with a mafia setting that has built a really faithful fanbase despite having gone 2 years without a single sex scene with any LI yet, if I'm not mistaken. From my humble point of view, that's absolutely incomprehensible. I don't mean to offend anyone, but I have a feeling that people who justify such things just want to feel special, like they belong to the select group of followers who enjoy such a cult game. A game that is above the others, a game that's soooo different and worth the wait. That's nonsense for me.

You better believe I'm special! I'm mostly in it for the dragons.

To be frank I would have expected proper lewd scenes by now, but the characters and story are engaging enough to maintain my interest. Fortunately I'm a very patient fellow...