VN Ren'Py Pale Carnations [Ch. 4 Up 4 Public] [Mutt & Jeff]

[ename144]

Since I had a somewhat busy schedule this week, I cheated and downloaded the leaked version of Chapter 3 Update 2 ahead of the official release (sorry, TD!). Which is good, because it's taken me quite a while to sum up my feelings. Overall I definitely enjoyed it. There are a number of great moments, and it does a good job of advancing the game via progress in the individual stories for Rosalind, Veronica and Hana. The artwork was, unsurprisingly, lovely (and I haven't gone back to watch the updated animations yet, so it could be even better).

That said, I feel like this update was a step backwards compared to Update 1. A lot of that probably comes down to my relative disinterest in the Exhibition itself: Update 1 was all dominated by the MC and his friends in their normal life, while Update 2 is almost all club business. On top of that, the aspects of Mina and Hana (and even Kathleen) that were explored in Update 1 where the ones I was most interested in exploring. This time, I felt like a lot of the things that I was most interested in exploring were put on hold for later. The ending in particular left me a little unsatisfied, even though on paper it seems like it should be a fun cliffhanger.

The rest of my thoughts will have to delve into spoilers. Unfortunately, I don't have time to edit this into a more manageable length, so you'll have to settle for the long-winded version. But I have tried to organize things into three main areas: the sex scenes, the girls, and the story.

Spoiler: Sex Scenes

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Spoiler: The Girls

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Spoiler: The Story

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Okay, I think that covers everything, and wow was it a lot! Sorry for the length, but that's what you get for making such an interesting game!

tl;dr This was a very good update with a lot of great scenes, but I didn't find it quite as satisfying as the last one.

 

[madman11122]

This is hands down the best adult game I've played. I'm not even into these kinds of fetishes but this game is done sooo damn well. I can't wait for more. Hats off to the devs, I hope this keeps climbing to No.1.

 

[mcmng]

Since I had a somewhat busy schedule this week, I cheated and downloaded the leaked version of Update 3 Chapter 2 ahead of the official release (sorry, TD!). Which is good, because it's taken me quite a while to sum up my feelings. Overall I definitely enjoyed it. There are a number of great moments, and it does a good job of advancing the game via progress in the individual stories for Rosalind, Veronica and Hana. The artwork was, unsurprisingly, lovely (and I haven't gone back to watch the updated animations yet, so it could be even better).

That said, I feel like this update was a step backwards compared to Update 1. A lot of that probably comes down to my relative disinterest in the Exhibition itself: Update 1 was all dominated by the MC and his friends in their normal life, while Update 2 is almost all club business. On top of that, the aspects of Mina and Hana (and even Kathleen) that were explored in Update 1 where the ones I was most interested in exploring. This time, I felt like a lot of the things that I was most interested in exploring were put on hold for later. The ending in particular left me a little unsatisfied, even though on paper it seems like it should be a fun cliffhanger.

The rest of my thoughts will have to delve into spoilers. Unfortunately, I don't have time to edit this into a more manageable length, so you'll have to settle for the long-winded version. But I have tried to organize things into three main areas: the sex scenes, the girls, and the story.

Spoiler: Sex Scenes

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Spoiler: The Girls

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Spoiler: The Story

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Okay, I think that covers everything, and wow was it a lot! Sorry for the length, but that's what you get for making such an interesting game!

tl;dr This was a very good update with a lot of great scenes, but I didn't find it quite as satisfying as the last one.

Spoiler

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[TD1900]

Since I had a somewhat busy schedule this week, I cheated and downloaded the leaked version of Update 3 Chapter 2 ahead of the official release (sorry, TD!). Which is good, because it's taken me quite a while to sum up my feelings. Overall I definitely enjoyed it. There are a number of great moments, and it does a good job of advancing the game via progress in the individual stories for Rosalind, Veronica and Hana. The artwork was, unsurprisingly, lovely (and I haven't gone back to watch the updated animations yet, so it could be even better).

That said, I feel like this update was a step backwards compared to Update 1. A lot of that probably comes down to my relative disinterest in the Exhibition itself: Update 1 was all dominated by the MC and his friends in their normal life, while Update 2 is almost all club business. On top of that, the aspects of Mina and Hana (and even Kathleen) that were explored in Update 1 where the ones I was most interested in exploring. This time, I felt like a lot of the things that I was most interested in exploring were put on hold for later. The ending in particular left me a little unsatisfied, even though on paper it seems like it should be a fun cliffhanger.

The rest of my thoughts will have to delve into spoilers. Unfortunately, I don't have time to edit this into a more manageable length, so you'll have to settle for the long-winded version. But I have tried to organize things into three main areas: the sex scenes, the girls, and the story.

Spoiler: Sex Scenes

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Spoiler: The Girls

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Spoiler: The Story

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Okay, I think that covers everything, and wow was it a lot! Sorry for the length, but that's what you get for making such an interesting game!

tl;dr This was a very good update with a lot of great scenes, but I didn't find it quite as satisfying as the last one.

First of all, thanks for the feedback gold. It's a lot to take in, I've read it twice and I'm still processing it, but that sort of nitty gritty analysis is extremely invaluable. I'll no doubt read it a few more times.

I did want to ask what you meant by:

AFAICT, the game doesn't explicitly track whether the MC took Veronica up on her offer, which is a shame.

Do you mean them trading sexual favors? That is indeed tracked.
I feel like I might be missing something obvious.

 

[bacienvu88]

The new update should put to bed the notion that the Carnations were "forced" to be in the competition. Rosalind HATES when the MC brings it up. It's almost as if she's a grown ass woman and made her own choices and wants to be treated like that.

I'd like to remind you that Rosalind and her daughter are under the threat of physical violence unless she can pay off the debt they inherited from her asshole husband. I'm pretty sure that what she hates is that she unfairly got loaded with her husbands debt. And what she is proud of is that she will do anything to give her daughter a chance at a bright future.
No, she is not forced to do this precise thing. But she is sure as hell forced to do something. And Kathleen makes damned sure Rosalind knows this way is her only option.

Veronica is a very different matter though. She would arguably be much better off just letting go of the gym.

 

[bacienvu88]

I seriously hope we could actually romance mina at some point in the game Ian doesn't deserve her anyway.

And MC is somehow better than Ian? Remember what job MC has.

 

[Mograx]

And MC is somehow better than Ian? Remember what job MC has.

Edwin's no saint, but at least he hasn't straight up full-blown cheated on an established love interest/girlfriend, unlike Ian. I'd say yes, even the most asshole of Edwins is better than Ian.

 

[bacienvu88]

Edwin's no saint, but at least he hasn't straight up full-blown cheated on an established love interest/girlfriend, unlike Ian. I'd say yes, even the most asshole of Edwins is better than Ian.

The scenario was a romance with Mina and at the same time Edwin keeps his current job. That can't be accomplished without Edwin cheating on Mina.

Also, I don't know how Hana sees her relationship with Edwin, but I don't think she would approve of Edwin accepting Kathleen's birthday gift, even if it isn't technically cheating.

Besides that, the question was what Mina deserves. Which I think is someone far better than both Edwin and Ian.

 

[RC-1138 Boss]

Veronica is a very different matter though. She would arguably be much better off just letting go of the gym.

Not true. Veronica's name is on the (shady) leasing contract for some of the equipments used on the gym. She can't simply let it go.

And MC is somehow better than Ian? Remember what job MC has.

Ian is supposed to be on a monogamic relationship with Mina but he cheats on her left and right while he clearly isn't very fond of her other than for sex and social status. There is also his treatment of Felicia if she ends up in third place during the first exhibition, someone he is supposedly on friendly terms.

That being said the most scumbag of Edwins do come close pending player's choices. Not the case for me, in my game Edwin is struggling with his inner darkness.

 

[fea876]

The scenario was a romance with Mina and at the same time Edwin keeps his current job. That can't be accomplished without Edwin cheating on Mina.

Also, I don't know how Hana sees her relationship with Edwin, but I don't think she would approve of Edwin accepting Kathleen's birthday gift, even if it isn't technically cheating.

Besides that, the question was what Mina deserves. Which I think is someone far better than both Edwin and Ian.

If MC is honest about his job with Mina and her being fine with it, that will not be cheating. Since the dev gave us a wide range of interaction, I'm pretty sure that going to be a choice.

The worst MC is pretty much a psychopath in construction, the more we will advance and the more that's going to be the case. You can already pass a deal with Rosaline to have sex in exchange of helping her, but you are not force to help her. You can make her loose her Carnation on the second week and do the same for the photo-shoot too.

 

[bacienvu88]

If MC is honest about his job with Mina and her being fine with it, that will not be cheating. Since the dev gave us a wide range of interaction, I'm pretty sure that going to be a choice.

It's not like MC has been honest about his job so far. And it is a very big if that Mina would be fine with that. But considering the ending of the current update, the path Mina will take is very much up in the air.

The worst MC is pretty much a psychopath in construction, the more we will advance and the more that's going to be the case. You can already pass a deal with Rosaline to have sex in exchange of helping her, but you are not force to help her. You can make her loose her Carnation on the second week and do the same for the photo-shoot too.

Sure. But even the best MC is dishonest and manipulative. And he doesn't show much regret of his actions, so I don't think that is going to change anytime soon.[

 

[kirkkis]

And this update shows why this game is probably the best VN on this site. Incredible job.

 

[AwsHen]

Spoiler: Dressing up for next update - Mina here I come

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Spoiler

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[gregonzole]

So Hana and Mina are twins that got separated right?

 

[Hisakatana]

Spoiler: Thoughts on the update

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Spoiler: General thoughts

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Spoiler: Typos

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[Turret]

And MC is somehow better than Ian? Remember what job MC has.

Edwin's no saint, but at least he hasn't straight up full-blown cheated on an established love interest/girlfriend, unlike Ian. I'd say yes, even the most asshole of Edwins is better than Ian.

The scenario was a romance with Mina and at the same time Edwin keeps his current job. That can't be accomplished without Edwin cheating on Mina.

Also, I don't know how Hana sees her relationship with Edwin, but I don't think she would approve of Edwin accepting Kathleen's birthday gift, even if it isn't technically cheating.

Besides that, the question was what Mina deserves. Which I think is someone far better than both Edwin and Ian.

It's not like MC has been honest about his job so far. And it is a very big if that Mina would be fine with that. But considering the ending of the current update, the path Mina will take is very much up in the air.

Sure. But even the best MC is dishonest and manipulative. And he doesn't show much regret of his actions, so I don't think that is going to change anytime soon.[

I find this discussion interesting, seeing the various points of view from the members here.

I think that the question "Who is better for Mina - Ian or the MC?" hinges much on how we play Edwin/whatever name we give him and even in the case of a good MC there is a sliding scale when it comes to Mina.

A good, pragmatic or mischievious MC is one thing, the hard, overly tough MC is a bastard in the making. The becomes clear without spoilering anything, the foundations for this set before the new update already.
Ian´s biggest failings are very much connected, considering what we know of his nice younger self in the flashbacks, to the botched upbringing he had. While his upbringing was not the sole reason he turned out how Killian is now, the MC might be able to help Killian battling his baser impulses over the run of the game or "improving" them if the MC is on the darker paths.

Killian rarely acknowledges that Mina is special, the best kind of girlfriend for him, because he is too jaded to really look. Here the MC comes in how we treat their bromance, if we help him or worsen his existing bad traits. If we play the MC as a real friend and wingman, trying to brace their romance, Killian and Mina have a chance to survive as a couple.

Spoiler

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As for the lighter love routes and cheating, there is a distinct division between Mina and the rest of the main cast. Mina knows few details about the PC club, so just with working there, the MC would be cheating on Mina.
The others would be partly different. In my main playthrough I am only trying to help Rosi and Roni, so I did not care too much about them being LIs, so I shelf that topic regarding them.
Feli knows his job and is a loose cannon in the bedroom herself, so the MC would have to do some pretty out there things to be considered cheating by her.
Hana would depend on how pure we play the game. She knows what the MC does and seems to be okay with it. I doubt even Kath birthday gift would be considered cheating by Hana, since at that time, Hana/MC were friends with benefits at most. If on the Hana path

Spoiler

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[hanabusa1991]

Spoiler

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True, but I meant it as the "it's time to be a gentleman" kinda way, next update need to get those cupcake points before glazing it.

 

[dolfe67]

Great update.

I was expecting it to be more about spending time with my new large-chested goth gf, but both photoshots were great too (both visually and story-wise).
The cliffhanger at the ending was pretty cool as well.

Overall it was a bit short though.
It only took me 2-3 hours to play through it.
I guess most of the added file size is from the animations this time.

Looking forward to the next update ...which will probably take months to release again

2-3 hours is a real good amount for an update for that kind of games. Some other devs take longer and provide less content.

Furthermore the next update will come faster (my guess is by the end of september or early october) though with less content, containing Felicia's shoot and Mina's event (and probably some short transition scenes)

 

[Poser_Voyeur]

The scenario was a romance with Mina and at the same time Edwin keeps his current job. That can't be accomplished without Edwin cheating on Mina.

Also, I don't know how Hana sees her relationship with Edwin, but I don't think she would approve of Edwin accepting Kathleen's birthday gift, even if it isn't technically cheating.

Besides that, the question was what Mina deserves. Which I think is someone far better than both Edwin and Ian.

If you separate what goes on in their personal lives and what goes on in their professional lives, Killian has been shown to continually neglect Mina in personal live, standing her up when they arrange dates, outright flirting with other girls, and from memory at least implied that Killian cheated on Mina in personal life.

So far Edwin is not dating anybody so he cant be cheating so far. The key for Edwin is that if he in the future starts a relationship with Mina, how much does he then tell her about the club and how much does he keep a secret?

 

[Vrijgeest]

I really enjoyed it. Plenty of reading and intrigue. I dont bother about paths as I just go where my logic takes me. People worry too much.